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isnt it time for Insurance to get a nerf?

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FireAnt Caldari Wings of the Storm	Posted - 2008.02.10 02:18:00 - [1] there is no loss anymore. people seem to be making money on insurance. it should be based like real insurance, if you are a dangerous driver you rate should be higher or maybe even be uninsurable. concord kills should be not insured. basic insurance should be dropped all around, make it a insure it or nothing plan.
Zeba Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2008.02.10 02:23:00 - [2] No. Originally by: Nice Guy This means that the writer epicaly fails at english. Irony. So delicious.
Wet Ferret	Posted - 2008.02.10 02:24:00 - [3] Insurance is about the only thing that keeps people from being griefed out of the game, so how about no. Of course this doesn't apply to players who fund themselves with GTC, but screw them TBH. (And you really think basic insurance needs nerfed? What?)
Lyria Skydancer Amarr Dark-Rising The Dawn of Darkness	Posted - 2008.02.10 02:29:00 - [4] Make T1 insurance as crappy as T2, signed. -------------------------------------- The Inquisition III - Relentless Retaliation
Willow Whisp Sadist Faction	Posted - 2008.02.10 02:31:00 - [5] Edited by: Willow Whisp on 10/02/2008 02:32:30 Originally by: FireAnt there is no loss anymore. people seem to be making money on insurance. it should be based like real insurance, if you are a dangerous driver you rate should be higher or maybe even be uninsurable. concord kills should be not insured. basic insurance should be dropped all around, make it a insure it or nothing plan. I agree actually. Since insurance should be lowered for at-risk or dangerous drivers, i propose the following: if you've had 0 ship losses, your insurance payout is 100% after 5 ship losses, you are a marginal at-risk pilot, and your 100% rate goes up by 10% for every ship loss afterward, your insurance rate goes up by 5%. Industrial and Freighters should carry a 50% insurance penalty, since they are at-risk ships. There should be no difference between PvP and PvE losses in terms of the insurability of your ship. If you are killed in an industrial ship in high security space and CONCORD responds, your insurance is voided. You have shown that you are an irresponsible driver that did not take appropriate measures to secure your ship and cargo. Furthermore, CONCORD will bill you for their Ammo usage. -- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes ^^ Woo hoo! Yellow Text!... wait... :(
Niccolado Starwalker Shadow Templars	Posted - 2008.02.10 03:17:00 - [6] Edited by: Niccolado Starwalker on 10/02/2008 03:17:41 Originally by: FireAnt there is no loss anymore. people seem to be making money on insurance. it should be based like real insurance, if you are a dangerous driver you rate should be higher or maybe even be uninsurable. concord kills should be not insured. basic insurance should be dropped all around, make it a insure it or nothing plan. No adjusts please! If people are making money on the innsurances its not the fault of CCP but the players who sets the price on the merchandice. And what when the players decide to upp the price tenfold+ Should then CCP again adjust the innsurance? We have made the world how it is today. And if theres no risk anymore because we can earn money on the innsurances, we have only ourselves to blame. Originally by: CCP Whisper I got your ambulation right here... <walks off to get more wine>
Reem Fairchild Minmatar Military Industrial Research	Posted - 2008.02.10 03:21:00 - [7] Originally by: Lyria Skydancer Make T1 insurance as crappy as T2, signed. They're allready the exact same. (It's just that tech ships are overpriced on the market.)
Kata Dakini An Eye For An Eye Rule of Three	Posted - 2008.02.10 03:35:00 - [8] It's gotta have a fairly significant impact on inflation. I personally am against inflation, but it's pretty tough to control. Instead, they could make it based on how many SP you have. For more enjoyment and greater efficiency, consumption is being standardized.
Stakhanov Metafarmers	Posted - 2008.02.10 04:05:00 - [9] Lower the default payout to 20% , increase insurance cost a little bit. Make it worthwhile to ransom insured T1 ships (for cheap) Originally by: ivan draco we didnt want your post anyway
Illyrinia Caldari Friendly Hostility	Posted - 2008.02.10 07:43:00 - [10] care bears should be restricted to posts not pertaining to combat. You are trying to post to a locked thread CONCORD has been notified
Stormaar Caldari	Posted - 2008.02.10 07:57:00 - [11] kek... raven = 80kk insurance = 32kk payout = 108kk yes, looks like very profitable. how about fully fited raven? I dont wonna work in EVE as Angola slave, i come to play. ----- Customizable UI / internal API for mods/addons
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2008.02.10 09:14:00 - [12] Originally by: Stormaar kek... raven = 80kk insurance = 32kk payout = 108kk yes, looks like very profitable. how about fully fited raven? I dont wonna work in EVE as Angola slave, i come to play. Try looking what your insurance give back to you if you crash your car. It is never near insurance cost + new car cost. It is new car cost - wear.
Ursula LeGuinn Versus Gloria Omnis	Posted - 2008.02.10 09:19:00 - [13] Originally by: Venkul Mul It is new car cost - wear. Ships in EVE don't get wear and tear. Provided they aren't destroyed, and since they can be repaired for free with modules, they keep the exact same value as any other ship of the same type on the market. Yet another example of why comparing EVE to real life is fail. ________________
Jenny Spitfire Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.02.10 09:20:00 - [14] No. Insurance is there for a reason. It is to maek the game less levelling whenever you loose your ships. But I totaly agree with you on killed by Concord will not be insure. --------- Technica impendi Caldari generis. Pax Caldaria! Recruitment -KB-
Gorefacer Caldari Resurrection	Posted - 2008.02.10 09:34:00 - [15] Originally by: Venkul Mul Originally by: Stormaar kek... raven = 80kk insurance = 32kk payout = 108kk yes, looks like very profitable. how about fully fited raven? I dont wonna work in EVE as Angola slave, i come to play. Try looking what your insurance give back to you if you crash your car. It is never near insurance cost + new car cost. It is new car cost - wear. I don't play video games to simulate real life. I think it's alright the way it is, you can always fly more expensive ships if you feel that loss doesn't affect you much. I vary the ships I fly based on how much ISK I have, this is because you must risk more ISK to fly more effective ships. Seems alright to me, people avoid risk like it's the plague in this game enough already. Just my opinion on the matter, if insurance was changed I would just adjust what ships I fly and when. "You can't reason someone out of a belief they haven't reasoned themselves into" - Prometheus
Roxanna Kell FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.02.10 09:47:00 - [16] Originally by: Jenny Spitfire No. Insurance is there for a reason. It is to maek the game less levelling whenever you loose your ships. But I totaly agree with you on killed by Concord will not be insure. than whats the point killing other ships if it doesn't hurt. Insurance premiums never go up. EVE used to pride it self on being like real life, people used to get scamed on escrow, money was hard to make, and GTC selling wasnt there. you change all that, you get wow. which is what eve has become now, just no one got the balls to admit it.
Jenny Spitfire Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.02.10 09:48:00 - [17] Edited by: Jenny Spitfire on 10/02/2008 09:49:55 The pont is it is for fun. I try to kill you and you try to kill me. Soemone dies then get insurance and buy new ship. And play again. What is wrong with having fun? Removing insurance is liek removing fun ... And Eve is not warcarft because with all change there are no multipel servers. --------- Technica impendi Caldari generis. Pax Caldaria! Recruitment -KB-
Chuck Skull BBK Corp	Posted - 2008.02.10 10:23:00 - [18] No. There is still a loss, insurance isn't designed to pay out the exact amount it costs to buy a ship. It's supposed to help you out when the proverbial hits the fan. For a lot of people insuring a T1 ship a 100mil BS goes boom it is a big loss and the insurance saves them days trying to replace it. Even the Raven insurance which is pretty generous(sheer number of ravens in the game pushes the price down a bit), you're not making a profit especially when you consider modules. If you don't like it go buy a T2 ship, Golem(continuing the raven example) going rate right now is about 7-800mil insurance payout is about 150, enjoy. --- The BIG Lottery
Ranger802004 Caldari Knights Of the Black Sun Brotherhood Of Steel	Posted - 2008.02.10 10:27:00 - [19] you fail at Eve
Ioci Gallente Ioci Exploration	Posted - 2008.02.10 10:54:00 - [20] Why would you suggest something like that? If you have too much money, send some my way, will you? By the time you pay for your fittings, any riggings you have and start to earn money with a ship, it's booked for a ganking. If they degrade the insurance value, people won't insure. Unless it's a BS, I don't waste my time now.
Wet Ferret	Posted - 2008.02.10 11:03:00 - [21] Originally by: Ioci Unless it's a BS, I don't waste my time now. You too? Well, I'll insure a BC... but anything smaller, forget it!
Conrad Rock Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.02.10 11:06:00 - [22] Edited by: Conrad Rock on 10/02/2008 11:06:44 Delete all T2 BPO's and reset all wallets, then I will accept a removal of insurance. Just to make it fair for everyone.
Shintai Gallente IonTech Corporation	Posted - 2008.02.10 11:09:00 - [23] Originally by: Willow Whisp Edited by: Willow Whisp on 10/02/2008 02:32:30 Originally by: FireAnt there is no loss anymore. people seem to be making money on insurance. it should be based like real insurance, if you are a dangerous driver you rate should be higher or maybe even be uninsurable. concord kills should be not insured. basic insurance should be dropped all around, make it a insure it or nothing plan. I agree actually. Since insurance should be lowered for at-risk or dangerous drivers, i propose the following: if you've had 0 ship losses, your insurance payout is 100% after 5 ship losses, you are a marginal at-risk pilot, and your 100% rate goes up by 10% for every ship loss afterward, your insurance rate goes up by 5%. Industrial and Freighters should carry a 50% insurance penalty, since they are at-risk ships. There should be no difference between PvP and PvE losses in terms of the insurability of your ship. If you are killed in an industrial ship in high security space and CONCORD responds, your insurance is voided. You have shown that you are an irresponsible driver that did not take appropriate measures to secure your ship and cargo. Furthermore, CONCORD will bill you for their Ammo usage. 50% on industrialists? LoL, ye sure, then a 5000% penalty for PvPers and 1000% on mission runners You win the darwin award! The only nerf that is needed is for people that get killed by concord. Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry
Pride NL Slacker Industries	Posted - 2008.02.10 11:17:00 - [24] Originally by: FireAnt there is no loss anymore. people seem to be making money on insurance. it should be based like real insurance, if you are a dangerous driver you rate should be higher or maybe even be uninsurable. concord kills should be not insured. basic insurance should be dropped all around, make it a insure it or nothing plan. Its nerfed since the T2 erra began. It doesnt cover T2 ships and without T2 ships you arent as effective. So the nerf is just right, from the beginning. Arrive. Raise Hell. Leave.
Adunh Slavy Ammatar Trade Syndicate	Posted - 2008.02.10 11:21:00 - [25] Get rid of insurance and get rid of all warp jamming, but block anyone with aggro from docking, jumping or cyno for 15 minutes. Let loss hurt, but have loss have meaning other than gank.
Stormaar Caldari	Posted - 2008.02.10 11:39:00 - [26] Originally by: Venkul Mul Originally by: Stormaar kek... raven = 80kk insurance = 32kk payout = 108kk yes, looks like very profitable. how about fully fited raven? I dont wonna work in EVE as Angola slave, i come to play. Try looking what your insurance give back to you if you crash your car. It is never near insurance cost + new car cost. It is new car cost - wear. read again ----- Customizable UI / internal API for mods/addons
Roxanna Kell FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.02.10 14:10:00 - [27] Originally by: Jenny Spitfire Edited by: Jenny Spitfire on 10/02/2008 09:49:55 The pont is it is for fun. I try to kill you and you try to kill me. Soemone dies then get insurance and buy new ship. And play again. What is wrong with having fun? Removing insurance is liek removing fun ... And Eve is not warcarft because with all change there are no multipel servers. Because in the first 2 years, EVE was more rl like than fun. and now its gone from Realistic mode, to very easy mode. all you gotta do is kill few rats, adn there you can afford your hole t2 set up again. Ratting is not fun, and now players are just like rat, unlimited. EVE is too conquest based now,
Elmicker The Phoenix Rising FreeFall Securities	Posted - 2008.02.10 14:15:00 - [28] Originally by: Pride NL Its nerfed since the T2 erra began. It doesnt cover T2 ships and without T2 ships you arent as effective. So the nerf is just right, from the beginning. Those with the skills to fly T2 ships should not be reliant on insurance in any case. Insurance is designed to be a buffer for those with lower cash flow, to allow them to fly larger ships. Removing it simply damages them, and damages the game.
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.02.10 14:42:00 - [29] The only nerf i can see is only basic payout in case of concord or sentries.
Dargaro Inozowa Gallente InoTech Productions	Posted - 2008.02.10 15:15:00 - [30] What it sounds like is he got owned by someone that kept coming back because they were smart enough to insure their under priced ship. Hey the markets are low lately. The base value of the ships don't change because we value ships lower now. Yes insurance may cover the under priced ship. But now you face refitting, which can and usually does go over the coverage. Stop complaining about it and go insure your ship.
Jesnen Amarr D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.02.10 16:26:00 - [31] Originally by: Willow Whisp Edited by: Willow Whisp on 10/02/2008 02:32:30 Originally by: FireAnt there is no loss anymore. people seem to be making money on insurance. it should be based like real insurance, if you are a dangerous driver you rate should be higher or maybe even be uninsurable. concord kills should be not insured. basic insurance should be dropped all around, make it a insure it or nothing plan. I agree actually. Since insurance should be lowered for at-risk or dangerous drivers, i propose the following: if you've had 0 ship losses, your insurance payout is 100% after 5 ship losses, you are a marginal at-risk pilot, and your 100% rate goes up by 10% for every ship loss afterward, your insurance rate goes up by 5%. Industrial and Freighters should carry a 50% insurance penalty, since they are at-risk ships. There should be no difference between PvP and PvE losses in terms of the insurability of your ship. If you are killed in an industrial ship in high security space and CONCORD responds, your insurance is voided. You have shown that you are an irresponsible driver that did not take appropriate measures to secure your ship and cargo. Furthermore, CONCORD will bill you for their Ammo usage. Lack of smily faces makes me think that perhaps you are serious, PVP much?
Cpt Branko Surge. Night's Dawn	Posted - 2008.02.10 16:54:00 - [32] Originally by: FireAnt there is no loss anymore. people seem to be making money on insurance. (a) There is loss on T1 ships. You do fit modules, right? (b) People are NOT making money on insurance. Let me illustrate. Market price of Hurricane = 32M roughly. Insurance payout of Hurricane = 36M Insurance cost = 10.9M That means market price of Hurricane + insurance = 42.9M, insurance covers 36M, meaning Hurricane costs 6.9M to lose for the base hull. Fit it reasonably well (but not rigged), load with ammo and drones and it's about 30M to lose total. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Andrymeda	Posted - 2008.02.10 17:10:00 - [33] The only love insurance needs (not a nerf) is that premiums should be tied to the regional average price (whatever it is currently) not the base price. Otherwise, it really is not worth it. The net result is that you recoup about 2/3rds of the cost, which only defrays the cost of replacement. When Cerbs were 225M a few months back, you'd only get something silly back and that is with the maximum insurance policy. Today, insurance is nearly viable for those ships. Also, the insurance policy should also reflect whatever modules are installed in the ship at the time. Insurance really is only good for old T1 ships. Just. ----------- Lame sig
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Deadly Addiction	Posted - 2008.02.10 17:16:00 - [34] Originally by: Wet Ferret Insurance is about the only thing that keeps people from being griefed out of the game, so how about no. Of course this doesn't apply to players who fund themselves with GTC, but screw them TBH. (And you really think basic insurance needs nerfed? What?) Explain your reasoning personally I think removing insurance as a whole you solve a few problems
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out	Posted - 2008.02.10 17:18:00 - [35] Originally by: Conrad Rock Edited by: Conrad Rock on 10/02/2008 11:06:44 Delete all T2 BPO's and reset all wallets, then I will accept a removal of insurance. Just to make it fair for everyone. Don't forget to randomise moons and true-secs as well. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Willow Whisp Sadist Faction	Posted - 2008.02.10 17:36:00 - [36] Originally by: Shintai 50% on industrialists? LoL, ye sure, then a 5000% penalty for PvPers and 1000% on mission runners Why? PvPers are using their ships for their intended purpose. For the most part PvPers kill more than they loose, they should get a discount from the insurance companies. Mission runners tend to be lower risk once they figure out how to keep their ships alive, again, not as high of a risk. The only ships that have no way of defending themselves, and tend to carry high-value cargo in easily destroyable vessels is industrials. Quote: The only nerf that is needed is for people that get killed by concord. If you can't prove that your goods weren't secured properly, RL insurance won't cover you either. If you left 5million dollars in diamonds in your back seat, visible, and someone broke your window and took the diamonds, the insurance will consider you negligent. By the same measure, if you are carrying 2bil worth of loot in a paper-thin industrial, you have invited disaster by failing to secure cargo. Hence the premium on insurance. Originally by: Jesnen Lack of smily faces makes me think that perhaps you are serious I always wonder how long it takes people to realize i'm not serious in this suggestions . The lack of smileys was on purpose. -- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes ^^ Woo hoo! Yellow Text!... wait... :(
Kiki Arnolds Caldari	Posted - 2008.02.10 17:49:00 - [37] Insurance is actually very important for the economy, it serves to prop up mineral prices... IF insurance caused inflation, ship prices would rise, but then insurance would no longer cover the cost of the ship... stopping insurance from causing further inflation... If it wasn't for insurance ships would be LESS EXPENSIVE... ç¦
Kiki Arnolds Caldari	Posted - 2008.02.10 17:51:00 - [38] Originally by: Willow Whisp If you can't prove that your goods weren't secured properly, RL insurance won't cover you either. If you left 5million dollars in diamonds in your back seat, visible, and someone broke your window and took the diamonds, the insurance will consider you negligent. By the same measure, if you are carrying 2bil worth of loot in a paper-thin industrial, you have invited disaster by failing to secure cargo. Hence the premium on insurance. Yeah, but if someone suicide bombs your car to steal the diamonds, your car will still be covered, even if the diamonds aren't... Last I checked in eve you insure SHIPS not CARGO ç¦
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2008.02.10 17:54:00 - [39] I can understand the insurance thing on smaller ships so that the noobs suffer not that much and that pvp is encouraged. But currently the insurance on some BS are obscene. Please CCP, have a look at this.
Willow Whisp Sadist Faction	Posted - 2008.02.10 17:56:00 - [40] Originally by: Gnulpie I can understand the insurance thing on smaller ships so that the noobs suffer not that much and that pvp is encouraged. But currently the insurance on some BS are obscene. Please CCP, have a look at this. No, the insurance on some BS are accurate. It's the producers selling BSes for under mineral cost that are obscene. -- Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] - Cortes ^^ Woo hoo! Yellow Text!... wait... :(
Conrad Rock Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.02.13 14:58:00 - [41] Originally by: Willow Whisp Originally by: Gnulpie I can understand the insurance thing on smaller ships so that the noobs suffer not that much and that pvp is encouraged. But currently the insurance on some BS are obscene. Please CCP, have a look at this. No, the insurance on some BS are accurate. It's the producers selling BSes for under mineral cost that are obscene. People value their time less and less, or enough farmers are mining to have brought this change. I say enjoy the prosperity while it lasts. I still remember 110m ravens in Jita.
Janu Hull Caldari Terra Incognita The Reckoning.	Posted - 2008.02.13 15:13:00 - [42] Originally by: Roxanna Kell EVE used to pride it self on being like real life. If EVE bore even a passing resemblence to real life, people who abused the system at the expense of the population would be banned (imprisoned) for it. EVE isn't like real life, EVE is not fair to anyone. Its not fair to people who get scammed, its not fair to carebears who do stupid things with their ships, its not fair to PvP e-peen strokers who want to inflict total misery on their victims. See? We're all equal. Now go get fcked. In the event of an emergency, my ego may be used as a floatation device.*
Tania Raukova	Posted - 2008.02.13 15:56:00 - [43] I wonder what the insurance system would look like if it was a part of the player-driven economy. I'm sure someone would like to set up an insurance company, and they would certainly find ways to penalize players that lost a lot of ships. The insurance rates could be horribly high I imagine. Would be interesting to see that happen. However, with my so far 10 days of playtime, I've come to love the current CCP-sponsored system. It takes the most bitter edge of the losses I suffer while learning the basics of the game.
Letouk Mernel	Posted - 2008.02.13 15:59:00 - [44] They could always get rid of the insurance interface and having to buy insurance, and just make the default payout on all ships 77% instead of 40%...
Matalino Gallente Ki Tech Industries	Posted - 2008.02.13 16:11:00 - [45] Originally by: Andrymeda The only love insurance needs (not a nerf) is that premiums should be tied to the regional average price (whatever it is currently) not the base price. Oh yes, please do this. I want an unlimited ISK printing machine: 1) Build lots of crappy under-used ships 2) Super-inflate average price for that ship by selling them to myself at obsurdly high prices 3) Destroy ships to collect obsurdly high insurance payouts 4) ??? 5) Profit! Originally by: Willow Whisp No, the insurance on some BS are accurate. It's the producers selling BSes for under mineral cost that are obscene. This is the real issue. Don't worry about it. The market will correct itself naturally. If mineral prices are far enough out of wack, people will just self-destruct ship until they use up the over-supplied minerals.
Aldelphius Carbide Industries	Posted - 2008.02.13 16:22:00 - [46] only changes needed have been stated. Insurance should be invalidated by Concord kills. Self explanitory. You can petetion if its a bug. Default insuarnce needs to be removed. You want insurance, you pay for it. Free insurance only benifits carebears who dont think about what they are doing and get smacked up by rats, pirates, or stupidity. The only PvP'ers that could be hurt by it are people who stockpile ships at remote PoS's.

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