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Wanted: Non-Nano Typhoon build and Non-Sniper Tempest Build.

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Orakkus	Posted - 2008.02.15 16:22:00 - [1] In about a month, I'll have what I consider the minimum amount necessary to use a Minmatar Battleship for PVP (i.e. At least level four in Navigation, Mechanic, Engineering, Gunnery, Spaceship Command, everything relating to Battleships). Generally, I operate in small roaming gangs (three to ten) so I would like some build suggestions that ARE NOT "nanos" or "sniper" definitions. Likely combat will be from less than 10km to 50km, against nano gangs and gate campers. Figure in that sometimes Gate Sentry Guns will need to be tanked as well.
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.02.15 16:25:00 - [2] I'd take the tempest. 6x 800mm, 2x medium neut web, scram, mwd, injector, sensorbooster 2x LAR, 2x eanm, 2x gyro if any, rep rigs
vr0p Gallente Hatori Mining Services DAMAGE INC...	Posted - 2008.02.15 16:39:00 - [3] Sokratesz' setup if pretty much spot on, you don't really need a huge tank for sentries as long as everyone in the gang takes aggression. Only thing I'd change is the neuts in the highs, remote rep/shield transfers there in a gang.
Arazel Chainfire	Posted - 2008.02.15 17:14:00 - [4] dunno about the gatecampers, they tend to vary quite a bit. However, to counter nano gangs i would take the phoon Highs 4 cruise launchers 4 other (your choice on autocannons or neuts/nos, maybe even remote reps...) Meds 1 mwd 1 webber 1 point 1 cap booster lows 2 LAR 2 eanm 1 dcu 2 bcu rigs optional... dunno what would help the most here. Maybe something that reduces cap cost of neuts? Use precision cruise to deal with nano's and regular/rage to deal with everything else. Drones, have 2 flights of warrior 2's, and one of either heavy drones of choice or sentry drones (dunno which would be better) -Arazel
El Dracula	Posted - 2008.02.15 20:02:00 - [5] Plate phoon lovin' : 4x Arby Siege 4x Dual 650mm AC IIs 1x 100mn MWD II 1x Stasis Web II 1x Warp Disruptor II 1x PWNAGE 2x 1600mm RT Plates 2x EANM II 1x DCU II 1x BCU II 1x Gyro II 3x Trimarks 5x Ogre/Berserker IIs 1000 DPS+ and lots of armor...
Gort Storm Guard Elite	Posted - 2008.02.15 20:31:00 - [6] That's an onan Phoon.... G -- When in doubt, empty the magazine.
Terianna Eri Amarr	Posted - 2008.02.15 20:37:00 - [7] Originally by: Sokratesz I'd take the tempest. 6x 800mm, 2x medium neut web, scram, mwd, injector, sensorbooster 2x LAR, 2x eanm, 2x gyro if any, rep rigs I'm curious - why a 2nd EANM over a DC? You won't active tank quite much but you'll have a lot more EHP, and since it doesn't look like this setup is going for all-out armor tank (esp. if no rigs) then I'd think the extra EHP would be most welcome...? __________________________________
Ariel Dawn Beets and Gravy Syndicate	Posted - 2008.02.15 21:30:00 - [8] 6x Dual 650mm AC II 2x Heavy Unstable Neutralizer 1x 100mn MWD II 1x Warp Disruptor II 1x Stasis Webifier II 2x Medium Electrochemical Booster 2x LAR II 2x EANM II 1x DC II 1x Gyro II 2x Egress Port Maximizer From another forum; the DPS is nowhere near other BSes, but they're not shooting/tanking without any capacitor, it can run it's full tank and neuts for 6 minutes or so with an occasional MWD boost. Ruins the day of nano-ships as well.
Orakkus	Posted - 2008.02.15 22:57:00 - [9] I'm rather curious.. why aren't plates used in the tank builds for the Tempests? Do the added resists make that much of a difference?
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.02.16 00:57:00 - [10] Originally by: Orakkus I'm rather curious.. why aren't plates used in the tank builds for the Tempests? Do the added resists make that much of a difference? Plates are not a tank. Reppers + resists are a tank. Plates only postone things. Also, damage mods on a phoon meant for tanking are bad. If you wanna dps it, fit all dmg mods, if you wanna tank it, use all 7 slots, it has sufficient dps anyway.
Mila Prestoc	Posted - 2008.02.16 01:24:00 - [11] Originally by: Sokratesz Originally by: Orakkus I'm rather curious.. why aren't plates used in the tank builds for the Tempests? Do the added resists make that much of a difference? Plates are not a tank. Reppers + resists are a tank. Plates only postone things. Also, damage mods on a phoon meant for tanking are bad. If you wanna dps it, fit all dmg mods, if you wanna tank it, use all 7 slots, it has sufficient dps anyway. And reps+res only postpone things to if you take more damage than you can rep... Plates are a tank. ------------------------- Originally by: "Lord Violent" EvE is slowly becoming a game for the stupid, catered to by devs as they lack ability to kill/survive anything.
Wrayeth Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.02.16 01:28:00 - [12] Variation on the standard tempest setups: 6 dual 425 II 1 heavy unstable neutralizer 1 large 'solace' remote armor rep 1 100MWD II (or quad lif, if you prefer the lower cap use and don't mind losing a bit of speed) 1 warp disruptor II 1 fleeting web 1 sensor booster II, tracking disruptor II, or tracking computer II 1 heavy cap booster II 2 LAR II 2 EANM II 1 DCU II 1 gyrostab II 1 projectile damage rig 1 projectile RoF rig 3 berserker SW-900 web drones This setup basically exists to destroy anything smaller than itself (aside from fully passive shield tanks, which you need more DPS to break) and is quite good at it. I've used this setup (and variations on it) for a long time now, and even had excellent success against pre-nos-nerf curses with it (though I was using a heavy nos and a medium nos instead of neut and remote rep at the time). Note: combat drones may be more useful in some situations. -Wrayeth n00b Extraordinaire "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
Wrayeth Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.02.16 01:29:00 - [13] Edited by: Wrayeth on 16/02/2008 01:32:24 Originally by: Mila Prestoc And reps+res only postpone things to if you take more damage than you can rep... Plates are a tank. Plates are a buffer, not a tank. They're viable but often limited. And, when you're taking massive incoming fire, they only postpone your death by a little bit. -Wrayeth n00b Extraordinaire "Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr	Posted - 2008.02.16 06:42:00 - [14] Now that tracking disruptors has an effect on falloff as well, wouldn't a tempest with MWD/Scram/Web/Injector/TD be viable? ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Gamesguy Amarr D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.02.16 08:41:00 - [15] Originally by: Wrayeth Edited by: Wrayeth on 16/02/2008 01:32:24 Originally by: Mila Prestoc And reps+res only postpone things to if you take more damage than you can rep... Plates are a tank. Plates are a buffer, not a tank. They're viable but often limited. And, when you're taking massive incoming fire, they only postpone your death by a little bit. Buffer tanks are far superior to active tanks as gang sizes increase.
El Dracula	Posted - 2008.02.16 08:47:00 - [16] Originally by: Gort That's an onan Phoon.... Opposite of nano?
ry ry StateCorp Insurgency	Posted - 2008.02.16 10:10:00 - [17] Edited by: ry ry on 16/02/2008 10:11:39 Originally by: El Dracula 1x BCU II 1x Gyro II i use that, but drop the gyro for another BCU imo. you'll get more DPS that way. you've already got a painter, and anything smaller than a BC is going to get chewed up (if they can hit!) by large ACs regardless. edit: although that's the sort of ship i'd jump into the middle of an enemy fleet, rather than take on a roam. Signature removed. Too large and flashing signatures are not really permitted. Navigator
Sokratesz Rionnag Alba Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.02.16 10:39:00 - [18] A tank is defined as repping incoming damage. Buffer tank is an oxymoron.
Vanessa Vale	Posted - 2008.02.16 12:19:00 - [19] A repping tank lasts as long as you have cap boosters, usually. So, like the buffer tank, it is limited in time.
Kagura Nikon Minmatar Infinity Enterprises Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2008.02.16 12:20:00 - [20] Originally by: Sokratesz Originally by: Orakkus I'm rather curious.. why aren't plates used in the tank builds for the Tempests? Do the added resists make that much of a difference? Plates are not a tank. Reppers + resists are a tank. Plates only postone things. Also, damage mods on a phoon meant for tanking are bad. If you wanna dps it, fit all dmg mods, if you wanna tank it, use all 7 slots, it has sufficient dps anyway. As far as i Know not a single Armor combat vehicle a.k.a. TANKS can repair their armor. They ahve huge plates of armor. Since the word tank is clearly borrowed fromt hem, I would dare to say PLATE are a tank! ------------------------------------------------- If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
Melme Rahka Minmatar Vulcan Foundry	Posted - 2008.02.16 13:49:00 - [21] Originally by: Kagura Nikon As far as i Know not a single Armor combat vehicle a.k.a. TANKS can repair their armor. They ahve huge plates of armor. Since the word tank is clearly borrowed fromt hem, I would dare to say PLATE are a tank! AFAIK not a single Armor combat vehicle has shields, so shield tanking doesn't exist :)? :)?
voidvim Minmatar Genco Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2008.02.16 14:55:00 - [22] Originally by: Melme Rahka Originally by: Kagura Nikon As far as i Know not a single Armor combat vehicle a.k.a. TANKS can repair their armor. They ahve huge plates of armor. Since the word tank is clearly borrowed fromt hem, I would dare to say PLATE are a tank! AFAIK not a single Armor combat vehicle has shields, so shield tanking doesn't exist :)? :)? lol ok ok lets get back on top, as long as the person knows what your talking about it does not really matter what words ones uses. Salvaging guide:moon materials guide
Mila Prestoc	Posted - 2008.02.16 15:53:00 - [23] Edited by: Mila Prestoc on 16/02/2008 15:54:14 Sorry, i'm pedantic about people saying hp tanking isn't tanking because you don't repair. My definition of "tank" is to survive as long as possible, be it repairing the damage taken or soaking it up, either way that damage source has to be removed before you run out of HP (or cap boosters to rep). Tank has as many meanings as ROF or DPS. Back on topic anyway, as you don't mention drones, missiles or shields in your skills i'll suggest a Tempest. 6x Dual 650mm T2 (RF EMP or Barrage), 2x Heavy Neut's. MWD, Heavy Cap Booster, WD T2, Web, TD. LAR T2, 2x 1600 RT, 2x EANM T2, DC T2. 3x HP or rep rigs (or combination). Might need to mix 650s and 425s depending on your AWU skill. Smaller the gang the better rep tank is, the larger the gang the better hp tank is. Your damage isn't very good but dual neuts will help shut down mwd's of nano's or active tanks of ships so you help your gang more than just in dps. Over 90k EHP and 200 EHP/S repaired (without rigs), with rigs you can up that to either 120k EHP or 330 EHP/S. Personally i'd prefer a Maelstrom or Typhoon but unless you have more skills than you said then Tempest is probably the best option available to you, just don't try and be some uber DPS/Tanker like other races or it will just be a poor version of them. ------------------------- Originally by: "Lord Violent" EvE is slowly becoming a game for the stupid, catered to by devs as they lack ability to kill/survive anything.
AstroPhobic Minmatar Port Royal Independent Kontractors Atrum Tempestas Foedus	Posted - 2008.02.16 16:05:00 - [24] AC Pest... 6x 650 II, 2x Pref MWD, 24km, Web, Heavy Electrochem, pref 2x LAR, 3x specific, EANM Aux Nano, Aux Nano, That other repair rig. Not a bad tank, plus good damage from ACs and drones. As for the phoon, I wouldn't honestly fly one without excellent skills (I'm at about 22m SP, and won't touch one for a while). That said, if you're not nanoing, get some gank. [Typhoon, Hypo pew pew] Large Armor Repairer II Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Co-Processor II Gyrostabilizer II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II 100MN MicroWarpdrive II Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Warp Disruptor II Heavy Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 800 Siege Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Mjolnir Torpedo Dual 425mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP L Dual 425mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP L Dual 425mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP L Dual 425mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP L Ancillary Current Router I Auxiliary Nano Pump I Auxiliary Nano Pump I Ogre II x5 Does about 1150 DPS with maxed skills, but will be significantly lower without them. I was kind of lost with what rigs to use, so change them per needed. I would have used a plate, but this fit is stupidly tight. Co-Pro needed to fit in the damage mods etc, you might be able to fit some named/faction stuff instead to free up that slot. Astro

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