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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
JoCool
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Posted - 2004.04.07 22:25:00 -
[31]
Bleh, I'd rather have the highways removed.
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Myko
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Posted - 2004.04.07 22:32:00 -
[32]
the worst thing is the ammarian sentry guns the other side of the pator highway gate  ...
unfortunately the dev's will never remove the highways, it'd force them to admit they were a mistake 
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Rob Tahlon
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Posted - 2004.04.07 22:53:00 -
[33]
yes remove pilots in space, remove the highways, force local to take 1 minute to update, give pc stations the ability to monitor the whole region including what ships players are flying and make it mandatory for any miner,trader, npc hunter to stop by your local pirate alliance once a week to make an offering of defenseless battleships and industrials full of ore.
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Siddy
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Posted - 2004.04.07 23:31:00 -
[34]
 Quote:
the worst thing is the ammarian sentry guns the other side of the pator highway gate ...
unfortunately the dev's will never remove the highways, it'd force them to admit they were a mistake
and Gods dont do mistakes - do they? 
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DaniB
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Posted - 2004.04.08 00:04:00 -
[35]
Edited by: DaniB on 08/04/2004 00:19:43
If there was no more gate camping, there would be far more players in 0.0.
The reason which prevents the empire players from travelling/mining/hunting (and finally beeing huntable/pirateable) in 0.0 space is the lame tactic of beeing ganked by 8 BS sitting all day at a gate.
The solution is so simply but hell of flamable by those lazy Gatecampers:
Sentry Guns on every gate!
More players will definatly come into the 3000+ nearly empty systems, do there business there, dream of ark and 500k bounty rats and the pirate players can do what all pirates in human history did.... guerilla tactics and skilled piloting/maneuvering!
The gain for pirates and those empire bound players would be so much higher.
But gate camping?
No, really, that needs no skills and destroyes the possibility to ever see those *cough* 5000 *cough* systems of eve... loosing a BS in fight is honorable and absolutly legit, but through ganking on the other side of a gate where you didnt get a chance of knowing what is behind/ or even load your client to do something... thats russian roulette and not enjoyable
Okay, alliances will say how can we defend our territory? Damn, there is no chance to block a 3d Solar System with even a hundred million players...
CCP should look into the station issue, yeah, put stations in every 0,0 system where the alliances can organize patrols from -> but NO more locking of gates!
+ solve of this local chat/star map issue... make it delayed, so surprise is a legit tactic (and no surprise of 8 BS sitting on the other side gank you away before your client catched the informations)
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The Monk
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Posted - 2004.04.08 00:23:00 -
[36]
To me the game is pretty boring now.. I cant see how CCP can make it more fun at this point in the development. We will have to see what they come up with.
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Ichabod Dirange
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Posted - 2004.04.08 00:35:00 -
[37]
Claim a constellation for Shinra alone and I bet it gets interesting.
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Professor Smith
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Posted - 2004.04.08 00:56:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Professor Smith on 08/04/2004 01:06:00
The whole arguement boils down to this ... Some people don't want to PvP and some do.
The solution to this is PKers can go Pvp in 0.0 and NoN Pkers can live happily in Empire space.
Problem solved.
I just doesn't get any simpler than that.
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Amox
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Posted - 2004.04.08 01:06:00 -
[39]
Quote:
Just a side note........Piracy had its nerfs already........ Nerf the carebears
Ideas
Make all ships carrying over 40 mil in loot be able to only equip 1 mwd and 1 warp core stab at most.
Make all ships with mining lasers have 80% less agility and not be able to equip a mwd or a warp core stab.
Make all indies 50% faster but with 100% less acceleration. (This will allow time for pirates to grab ahold of indies but not slow travel) It will stop the warp-aways etc.
Get rid of insta-jumps they are BS (there was once talk of haveing a 15km drop out ring where no ship could ever warp to around the gate--Devs then realised this would help pirates and was not implemented.)
Auto insureance is BS we all know that.
Want more ?
And remove all shielding and give indys 1 hit point of armor too.
Your Tachyon Beam Laser I perfectly strikes Blood Oracle, wrecking for 722.3 damage. |
Kakalot
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Posted - 2004.04.08 01:13:00 -
[40]
People must be aware that although some ideas are sound but they are too difficult to implement/program to fit what is already running fairly smoothly.
Do you want to make your life easier or harder? Anyway, time will tell. For now, down with piracy pfft!!!1
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http://users.pandora.be/zebras/Kakalot.jpg |
Sara Kerrigan
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Posted - 2004.04.08 01:15:00 -
[41]
Quote:
Edited by: Professor Smith on 08/04/2004 01:06:00
The whole arguement boils down to this ... Some people don't want to PvP and some do.
The solution to this is PKers can go Pvp in 0.0 and NoN Pkers can live happily in Empire space.
Problem solved.
I just doesn't get any simpler than that.
TBH that's way too many systems for non-pvpers. It should be 0.5+ for non-pvp, 0.4 and under for small-scale warfare (pirates, bounty hunters, and anti-pirates in a flowing cycle with the mining and production corps in the area), and 0.0 for large-scale warfare (alliances).
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The Kerrigan Chronicles |
Morkt Drakt
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Posted - 2004.04.08 01:41:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Morkt Drak on 08/04/2004 01:50:41
Remove map features for non-sovereign space. Its a start.
oh and, yeah, remove the cross-empire highways (I think they ARE going to go when the story line gets to that point anyway but...)
The entire concept of knowing "everything" that goes on outside of empire or sovereign space has always irked me. Especially so when one considers regions such as Stain - these are enemies of CONCORD and the mepires, please explain why those enemies know eveything thats going on there?
*Not knowing* whats going on in there gives far more opportunity to those who want to sneak in to do their doings *secretly* than it does for those trying to keep you out. It thus supports venturing into 0.0 space.
I dont agree at all that it will encourage people to go around in big fleets, i think it will encourage the opposite.
And I totally agree that the "border zones" between the empirs should be like border zones and the main croos-empire point sof interaction.
All good ideas.
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Ishkur
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Posted - 2004.04.08 02:51:00 -
[43]
Well, I already know that the old-timers in EVE hate the highways. So far nobody has given a coherent reason why they are so bad. It is always a long litany of bad things, then, "oh yeah, and get rid of the highways too."
I can tell you that I talk to trial players and new people to EVE every day, and I don't know any of them (myself included) who would be paying for this game if it took 2 hours to get from their newbie station to a corp office. They complain about 9 jumps now...
If you have some new player with 0isk, and they have to pay Hellmar's idiotic tolls, well, that's just not going to work.
You have a trial system because you want people to get a feel for EVE and want to keep playing.
Making them spend that 10 days warping through 0.0 space to make some pirates happy is NOT the way to increase subscribers.
You talk about 15k people, blah blah blah. That's never gonna happen if you make the game a boring warpfest, or if noobs get ganked by alliance folks because you have to warp through Stain to get from Yulai to Amarr, or some other silly idea.
It simply won't happen.
I've seen what happens when Devs listen to the higher-end players, and it isn't a pretty sight. The subscriber base falls off. There will always be natural attrition, and you have to replace the people who get bored/quit with new blood.
The minute you stop listening to new players, and start catering to the high-end folks, the game starts to die.
As a famous businessman once said, "When you're green, you're growing. When you're ripe, you rot."
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ProphetGuru
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Posted - 2004.04.08 03:57:00 -
[44]
Make hiway on/off ramps 0.0
Evolution..... Just when you thought you were winning.
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PaulAtreides
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Posted - 2004.04.08 04:57:00 -
[45]
Let me get this strait...your complaining because there are too many people in empire space?
Want to work for me? |
Myko
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Posted - 2004.04.08 07:06:00 -
[46]
if new players are complaining about 9 jumps...maybe they shouldnt be playing this game. The reason us 'old-timers' arent bothered about long journeys is that when we started there: were no mwd's, no highway gates and gate-jump-ins were further away.
What removing the highway gates does is give people a reason for staying in an area and creating regional demand. It used to be that to buy a gallente ship you had to travel to gallente space (or pay through the nose), which was around 14 jumps away (from Hulm). This meant a trip through a 0.4 system (back when no system was safe from pirates).
The problem with gankings is purely player based. Its a shame we didnt deal with the pirate meanace early on by actually standing up to them, instead of some people complaining to CCP. This is the reason we now have NPC-controlled response rather than player response (of course the advantageous nature of camping, where the camper has a lag advantage also had a large effect).
The current state of piracy is perhaps due 25% to CCP and 75% the playerbase. Every single pirate 'nerf' has forced them to use more and more outrageous techniques which lead to more and more gankings. The players affected by this complain to CCP which continues the viscious circle. 0.4 should be space Corps guard but the rewards arent great enough for them to do that.
Final suggestion: make the only ore available in 1.0-0.5 veldspar.
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Decilius
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Posted - 2004.04.08 09:12:00 -
[47]
Quote:
Also did I mention this would create a new profession? The dedicated scout, someone just flying around collecting info on who is where and what they're doing.
Thats exactly why I set up I.P.X.
So does any one want any scouting doing?
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Marabeth
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Posted - 2004.04.08 09:13:00 -
[48]
Quote:
Want something cool to happen and piracy to come back in some form. Remove the sentries in all 0.1-0.4 leading to 0.0 I know you guys want them on all the gates in the game but it is boring now isn't it. See this will allow pirates to take sec hits and be able to close off routes. Then the pirate hunters/allainces that want that route open will come and run off the pirates and might even get a fight. (Probably no fight with the 30Vs8 odds but hey its better than nothing). Pirateing areas need seperation from 0.0 allainces and closeness to empire. No pirate wants to go and sit 2 jumps outside the main base of any 0.0 allaince just to get ran off by 30 ships. That is stupid.
Make your border zones or whatever but allow pirates to close off the routes between empire and 0.0. Or most of us will continue to quit and become bored then you guys can mine all day in your allainces and fly 40-100 jumps to attack another allaince just to fly back cause they all logged cause you looked at the map and brought 2x their numbers just so you can circle jerk in their home system.
Damn what is it with slaughter monkeys and camping gates.
The reason you have trouble killing people is that they don't come to you unable to fight back, what a pity I suggest you quit. Also I really feel your pain at being unable to camp gates in alliance space because they chase you off, what a shame.
Does it occure to you that you are suggesting people should be able to close down systems claimed by big empires. What do you think would happen if you closed a road in America and slaughtered everyone going down that road? What you are suggesting is an act of war on the empire for goodness sake.
The real problem with piracy is gate camping, and poor minerals in 0.1-0.4 that make it not really worth mining there. That said there are still quite a few pirates doing quite well, and the nerfs have only really harmed the slaughter monkeys.
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Jelerak
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Posted - 2004.04.08 09:34:00 -
[49]
I found more interesting comment on this topic here:
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=70540
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DREAMWORKS
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Posted - 2004.04.08 09:35:00 -
[50]
Edited by: DREAMWORKS on 08/04/2004 09:44:48
Piracy is dead because most people who pirates joined an alliance, this resulted in people not killing everyone and they denounce their pirate activities. Still the used tactics are the same: Camping gates, roaming around, taking out enemies.
The tactics adjusted somewhat because the pvp'ers are now looking for killing the other side instead of earning money. However a pirate can still make some money if he goes to the right region. However people rather selfdestruct or get destructed and give the enemy no money. In either case the pirates evolved, and moved on seeking friendship and protection from a alliance by getting acces of ores and stuff and still get pvp. Still some saying they get more targets by leaving an alliance i doubt, most alliances have several warfronts.
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http://www.nin.com/visuals/thtf_hi.html |
Dev Larren
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Posted - 2004.04.08 09:50:00 -
[51]
Quote:
Piracy is dead........... CCP nerfed it cause carebears whined. Only way to get it back is to get the carebears to whine to ccp to let us pirate........which will never happen so WTS 1 Bil isk any offers ?
Hmmm, so far I have read more wining by would-be pirates.
Hey do I need to have an eye-patch for that or can I just put on the funny accent?
Commanding Officer
Channel: CAINCOM |
Bogenhagen
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Posted - 2004.04.08 10:00:00 -
[52]
Quote:
However people rather selfdestruct or get destructed and give the enemy no money.
Damn skippy. I'd rather feel the cold of space than line a scumbags wallet with isk. 
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Xhanserbal
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Posted - 2004.04.08 10:32:00 -
[53]
I think eve needs major changes to the map. At the moment its a all seeing eye which is just plain wrong.
I think have a fog of war effect would be a good idea where you can only get information about systems maybe 1 to 5 jumps ahead of you depending on your skill. Or maybe only give information on systems that you have actually visited and have this information fade out if you have not visited for a few hours or days.
I beleive this would create more roles in eve for people like scouts and explorers as well as spys because they would be needed as methods to gain information about what is going on in the other systems.
As for the highways the have both good and bad points,. i personally wish they would fail now and then maybe for a few days. Before they were in game I used to make alot of money moving goods from caldari space to minmatar space, but the highways killed these trade routes, i think having them fail now and then would create some interesting changes in the way people travel and live within eve.
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Nerhtal Al'Thali
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Posted - 2004.04.08 10:39:00 -
[54]
Why is it that getting ganked at gates by lots of ships is even considered PvP is beyond me...
The times of pvp that i enjoyed were mostly down in aridia fighting off PAK (although i hated the station camping... which is as bad as gate camping really)
Now sentry gun range increases have killed off most things in 0.1-0.4
The ore is crap - the npc rats are crap - and its plain boring. Good for a manufacturing and mining of low end minerals in reasonable safety
You are still subject to being "pirated" at belts... but youre too safe at stations and stargates... how CCP will solve it is a tough one - dont think it is easy in tohse situations
But a start is to remove the map searching features for 0.0 space... that seams like a reasonable idea - maybe a feature where you can see ships/pilots in space for say the 5 surrounding systems? if that is too much/little lower/raise it respectively?
It could even be a skill? from Level 1 being 1 system away to level 5? (something for those dedicated scouter ideas of DC)
Implementing most of these ideas will need lots of testing though - if CCP even consider them that is
"Game Experience And Dev Opinions May Change With The Time Of Day During Online Play"
Oveur
"First in, last out"
Bridgeburner Motto |
Red girl
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Posted - 2004.04.08 10:46:00 -
[55]
OK, simple solution that keeps to the moiddle as far as show pilots in space is concerned.
Why not limit it to show only the surrounding 5 systems (5 jumps any direction) and only list the amount of pilots in space rounded off to ten.
So for example:
CVY-UC : <5 plliots is space
B-VIP: <15 pilots in space
A2: <35 pilots in space
?
This way you gtet a decent idea of the amount of people there, but not to early on in your trip.
So say you and a team of 10 people are looking for a fight somwhere between pator and hlw (curse), total of about 20 jumps away.
You'd head out and after for example 11 jumps notice the map telling you:
system : B-VIP, <15 pilots in space.
Knowing this is a likely ratcamp, and not having info to whom it is, this gives you the option of attacking, knowing that the amount there can be either 6 or maybe up to 14 pilots there.
alternatively, the lone traveller option:
You got a 20 jumps trip to do to get some stuff down to Curse, and depart at Pator again.
This time you notice after 11 jumps a <5 blob in BVIP.
Knowing this to be a hotspot you will still know there might be a camp, but you now dont know wether it's just 1 or 4 people camping. This might tempt you to take a risk and got through, more so after already doing 11 jumps to get where you are.
Add the new value of scouting, adding a timer to people showing up in local maybe, and somehow removing the effectiveness of instajumps (i never use em and still get thru nearly all camps if i really really need to).
Might this come near to a solution acceptable to most of us ?
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Red girl
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Posted - 2004.04.08 10:48:00 -
[56]
Quote:
Wow, removing local names (but not count imo) and 'Pilots in space' from 0.0 space is a BRILLIANT idea.
On top of this, how about owning a station in a region allows you (and all your corp/alliance) to see number of players in space for a 5 jump radius around the station! Finally: a use for the crappy things: Forward watch posts. This would also give scouts more use, and Is SOO easily roleplayable!
Do this at the same time as releasing mobile refinerys and wow you open up so many possibilities. Remove Highways as well and you FORCE change! This is SUCH a good idea
Oh, and i like the idea of destroyable scanner sentries as deployable object too.
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Miso
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Posted - 2004.04.08 10:51:00 -
[57]
Edited by: Miso on 08/04/2004 10:52:43
Quote:
Re: DigitalCommunist
It will probably lead to people not taking risks and blobbing up even more, and travelling in 40 pilot blobs.
Having a reasonably good idea what you're up against reduces the need to bring in an overwhelming force.
Couldn't disagree more on this. I'm all for eliminating completely the number of pilots in space option on the map. Would make travel in Eve far more fun and seat of the pants. Blob wars are the lamest thing in this game, and the dullest. Listening to two fat blobs of BS idiots lamely goading each other to jump in first for 3 hours in local before all logging off, is the dullest, most boring thing ever invented, and I've listened to a Linkin Park CD.
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Dead
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The Monk
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Posted - 2004.04.08 10:53:00 -
[58]
Quote:
I think eve needs major changes to the map. At the moment its a all seeing eye which is just plain wrong.
I think have a fog of war effect would be a good idea where you can only get information about systems maybe 1 to 5 jumps ahead of you depending on your skill. Or maybe only give information on systems that you have actually visited and have this information fade out if you have not visited for a few hours or days.
I beleive this would create more roles in eve for people like scouts and explorers as well as spys because they would be needed as methods to gain information about what is going on in the other systems.
As for the highways the have both good and bad points,. i personally wish they would fail now and then maybe for a few days. Before they were in game I used to make alot of money moving goods from caldari space to minmatar space, but the highways killed these trade routes, i think having them fail now and then would create some interesting changes in the way people travel and live within eve.
Such a great suggestion devs should really listen to this idea and impliment it would make the game way more intresting in 0.0
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hatchette
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Posted - 2004.04.08 11:44:00 -
[59]
I agree on removing map features.. it's good for pirates as well as miners.. we'll all have to change gamestyle a bit.
I agree on removal of the highways.. but there have to be added more jumpgates within each regions.. and missions should be all within a single region. 5 jumps from one side of region to other side sounds about right... But when travelling from lets say Tash-Murkon to Lonetrek.. you'd have to go through 5 different regions and that means you'd have to make 25+ jumps.
I definitely disagree on nerfing warp stabs and other defense equipment. We're mining in 0.0 regurarly, but if they nerf our defenses we simply wouldn't go there anymore.
What is wrong with small 3-people corps mining in 0.0? We should encourage even more small corps to go to 0.0!!
Pirates should realize that pirating is more like fishing.. if you don't let small/young fishes go, they will eventually die out. What do pirates have from killing a cruiser miner in 0.0? Equipment worth 300k isk.. and cruiser pilot who will never come back there even when he has a battleship... not to mention that he'll tell his friends/corpmates not to go there anymore.
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Bran Hale
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Posted - 2004.04.08 11:54:00 -
[60]
Edited by: Bran Hale on 08/04/2004 11:56:36
I'm a care-bear. I play a couple of hours a night, maybe more on a weekend. I'm not that bothered about PvP as I haven't got the time, or inclination. I mine low-grade ore in high sec to supply the guy two systems away with his Trit and Pye. I don't want to join a corporation as I'm happy being self-employed, so I'm pretty limited to doing just that. I'd like to maybe produce something. However, the mega-corporations with the infinite resources can make anything they like, more efficiently and better than I could. I have no problem with that, it's called economy of scale. However, they can reach the entire market pretty easiliy.
In the real world you don't have megacorporations that can make everything well and supply it everywhere quickly and cheaply. You have huge corporations that make one or maybe a few things. e.g. Ford=Cars, Glaxo=Pharmaceuticals. This is due to economy of specialisation. It's better to make a few things really well. We don't have transportation which can carry huge amounts of material quickly and cheaply. You can have small, high-value items carried quickly by plane (e.g. watches). You can have bulky, low-value commodities carried slowly by ship (iron ore). So, if I want a low value widget now, it's maybe easier and cheaper to get it from the guy in the next town than wait weeks for it to arrive from Japan or pay 10 x it's value to get it tomorrow.
So, I'm a carebear. I want to stay being a carebear and make widgets which people in my area may just want to buy. What do I want to allow me to do this?
1. Kill the highways. (yep, that's a carebear saying that)
2. Increasing levels of Tech forcing corporations to specialise more and more. (which I hope is happening anyway)
If you want a Tech 1 item then you may as well pay a little more and buy it from the guy in the next system than get a cheap one and pay 10 x its value to get it shipped to you.
If you want that Tech 2 item that's made all the way over in Amarr then the shipping cost may be worth it.
There's probably some flaws in their and there usually is when trying to use a real world analogy. But, I don't think it sounds to bad.
What does this all do? It gives carebears something to do other than mine. It forces the transport of high-value goods through low-sec space, leading to all sorts of PvP encounters and happy pirates.
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