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Karn Mithralia Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.10 23:56:00 - [1] We of the Ushra'Khan are honored and humbled by the massive support shown to us by the people of the Minmatar Republic. Thank you. It was a pleasure to fight for you and we are deeply moved by how much it meant to you all. With regard to the riots ... well ... it wouldn't be the first time people have rioted in our name and we're sure it wont be the last. While we enjoy a good ruck as much as the next Brutor, perhaps all that riotous energy would be better spent collecting the heads of slavers! For our people! -----------------------------------------
Daziel Iaar Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.03.11 00:06:00 - [2] Another example of the minmatar not being able to look after themselves. "His Will Be Done"
Vlad Cetes Caldari Wreckless Abandon Un-Natural Selection	Posted - 2008.03.11 00:16:00 - [3] If your government cannot even control simple rioters how could it expect to hold off the Amarrians if they decided to invade? If there were ever riots I a place I governed: the people there would not be rioting again. You cant riot from the grave.
Evanda Char Minmatar Re-Awakened Technologies Inc Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.03.11 00:17:00 - [4] Originally by: Daziel Iaar Another example of the minmatar not being able to look after themselves. Then it's just as well we're so good at looking after each other, Mr. Iaar. -Eva- Electus Matari - taking it one bad guy at a time
Grr Amarr Epitoth Fleetyards Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.03.11 00:27:00 - [5] I had ignored the news thinking it was just everyday life on Pator. Epitoth Fleetyards is Recruiting
Daziel Iaar Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.03.11 00:29:00 - [6] Originally by: Evanda Char Originally by: Daziel Iaar Another example of the minmatar not being able to look after themselves. Then it's just as well we're so good at looking after each other, Mr. Iaar. If your definition of looking after each other is to riot because a team got knocked out of a tournament, then injure over a thousand fellow citizens and killing 7 more. Then yes you are good at looking after each other. "His Will Be Done"
Ewyx	Posted - 2008.03.11 00:43:00 - [7] Originally by: Vlad Cetes If your government cannot even control simple rioters how could it expect to hold off the Amarrians if they decided to invade? If there were ever riots I a place I governed: the people there would not be rioting again. You cant riot from the grave. Uhh... I don't really think it's my place to speak, but killing the rioters really doesn't solve anything to be honest... But then again, probably your people probably are a bit more civilized and wouldn't resolve to such behavior.
Merdaneth Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.03.11 01:03:00 - [8] I am saddened by the unproductive loss of life caused by the riots. Please submit to Amarrian lordship, and let us prevent such senseless destruction. Rioting because the team you favoured lost is immature. The Matari have some moral growing up to do. ____ The Illusion of Freedom \| The Truth about Slavery
Becq Starforged Minmatar Ship Construction Services Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.11 01:47:00 - [9] Originally by: Karn Mithralia We of the Ushra'Khan are honored and humbled by the massive support shown to us by the people of the Minmatar Republic. Thank you. It was a pleasure to fight for you and we are deeply moved by how much it meant to you all. With regard to the riots ... well ... it wouldn't be the first time people have rioted in our name and we're sure it wont be the last. While we enjoy a good ruck as much as the next Brutor, perhaps all that riotous energy would be better spent collecting the heads of slavers! For our people! For freedom! -- Becq Starforged proprietor of Starforge Industries, a subsidiary of Minmatar Ship Construction Services At Starforge Industries, the world of tomorrow is being blown apart today!
Andreus Ixiris Gallente Heretic Logistics DeStInY.	Posted - 2008.03.11 01:52:00 - [10] Originally by: Merdaneth I am saddened by the unproductive loss of life caused by this religion. Please submit to Gallentean democracy, and let us prevent such senseless destruction. Praying to nonexistant beings because you have no independant sense of self-worth is immature. The Amarr have some moral growing up to do. Fixed. ----- "I am prepared to meet my maker; whether my maker is prepared for the great ordeal of meeting me is another matter."
Ikasu Gallente Scrutari The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2008.03.11 02:18:00 - [11] Originally by: Andreus Ixiris Originally by: Merdaneth I am saddened by the unproductive loss of life caused by this religion. Please submit to Gallentean democracy, and let us prevent such senseless destruction. Praying to nonexistant beings because you have no independant sense of self-worth is immature. The Amarr have some moral growing up to do. Fixed. This. -------------------------------------------------- My post does not represent views of my Alliance. Eve is different, in Eve there are actual Heroes and Villains. Build your Legacy!
Feng Zhehao Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2008.03.11 05:13:00 - [12] We are the Students For Our People! The official propaganda is wrong! Do not believe the lies of the government! Spontaneous and peaceful victory parties were held throughout Pator, Ammold, Hulm, and Teonsunude on 8/3/109 in celebration of the great victories of the Ushra'Khan. The celebrations were attacked by Amarr sympathizers and traitors to our people including agents provocateurs within the ranks of the Republic Police. The Students For Our People stand against the abhorrent violence perpetuated by the illegitimate state upon Our People. We denounce the use of violence against peaceful celebrators! We demand the release of The Kulheim Thirteen! The Thirteen were arrested in their homes many hours after the police initiated violence had ended. They are innocent bystanders being framed! We demand truth and justice! The Students For Our People are actively collecting eye witness accounts from the violence! Step forward and tell the truth! Stand against the lies of the Republic! There were no riots! There were police attacks upon innocent partiers, students, citizens and Minmatar! The Students For Our People are calling for peaceful, nonviolent street protests in front of all Republic office building in all Republic systems at 00:00 11/03/109! Demand the release of The Kulheim Thirteen! Demand The Truth! These protests will continue around the clock until The Thirteen are released and the true perpetrators of violence are brought to justice! We come for our people! We come for The Thirteen! FREE THE THIRTEEN!
zoolkhan Minmatar Mirkur Draug'Tyr	Posted - 2008.03.11 05:49:00 - [13] Originally by: Karn Mithralia For our people! <o. i was ushra'khan - and we came for our people
Becq Starforged Minmatar Ship Construction Services Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.11 07:19:00 - [14] Originally by: Feng Zhehao We are the Students For Our People! The official propaganda is wrong! Do not believe the lies of the government! Spontaneous and peaceful victory parties were held throughout Pator, Ammold, Hulm, and Teonsunude on 8/3/109 in celebration of the great victories of the Ushra'Khan. The celebrations were attacked by Amarr sympathizers and traitors to our people including agents provocateurs within the ranks of the Republic Police. The Students For Our People stand against the abhorrent violence perpetuated by the illegitimate state upon Our People. We denounce the use of violence against peaceful celebrators! We demand the release of The Kulheim Thirteen! The Thirteen were arrested in their homes many hours after the police initiated violence had ended. They are innocent bystanders being framed! We demand truth and justice! The Students For Our People are actively collecting eye witness accounts from the violence! Step forward and tell the truth! Stand against the lies of the Republic! There were no riots! There were police attacks upon innocent partiers, students, citizens and Minmatar! The Students For Our People are calling for peaceful, nonviolent street protests in front of all Republic office building in all Republic systems at 00:00 11/03/109! Demand the release of The Kulheim Thirteen! Demand The Truth! These protests will continue around the clock until The Thirteen are released and the true perpetrators of violence are brought to justice! We come for our people! We come for The Thirteen! FREE THE THIRTEEN! What?! If only I could bring myself to doubt this. What can I do to aid your cause, brother, given that the time for your gathering had past before your post? -- Becq Starforged proprietor of Starforge Industries, a subsidiary of Minmatar Ship Construction Services At Starforge Industries, the world of tomorrow is being blown apart today!
Cipher7	Posted - 2008.03.11 11:11:00 - [15] Originally by: Merdaneth I am saddened by the unproductive loss of life caused by the wasting of Amarrian people's lives in subservience to a dogma. Please submit to Matari lordship, and let us prevent such senseless destruction. Trying to enslave the universe just because the Amarrian holders think they're so special is immature. The Amarr have some moral growing up to do. fixed it for ya
Mr Reeth Aegis Militia	Posted - 2008.03.11 12:03:00 - [16] This has actually gotten pretty funny. Horrible Matari on Matari violence over a UK sporting event and the whole thread is an Amarr bash! There's even an accusation that Amarrian sympathizers on Pator (well known haven of Amarrian sympathizers) are the cause! Is there anything in the universe that you can't blame on us? Is your cat missing? It must have been taken by those evil Amarrian slavers!! Way to deflect your anger guys! It must be nice to live in a world where nothing is your fault.
Kainda Gordo Kinda'Shujaa	Posted - 2008.03.11 12:36:00 - [17] Please Mr Reeth, by all means continue to generate ill will towards the Empire. When your putting out the fire on your childrens backs remember this day. Continue to talk here. You are doing us a favour. PVP/RP Corp -- Now Recruiting
Darius Shakor Minmatar Mirkur Draug'Tyr	Posted - 2008.03.11 12:41:00 - [18] And again, here come the Amarrians, a people who's own Emperor was killed in his own royal palace or whatever you want to call it, who found no trace of the killer, who have no clue who killed him and who follow an obviously power hungry chamberlain who seems to be gripping to his position for many years now, all claiming we cannot 'look after ourselves'. Pay less attention to the affairs in our homes and more to your own back garden slavers. You might actually sort your own problems out in the process. ------ Mirkur Draug'Tyr :: Recruitment
Kyoko Sakoda Caldari Ghost Festival	Posted - 2008.03.11 13:23:00 - [19] Originally by: Ikasu Originally by: Andreus Ixiris Originally by: Merdaneth I am saddened by the unproductive loss of life caused by this religion. Please submit to Gallentean democracy, and let us prevent such senseless destruction. Praying to nonexistant beings because you have no independant sense of self-worth is immature. The Amarr have some moral growing up to do. Fixed. This. You know that two perspectives are mindlessly at odds when IGS rebuttals fail to be interesting.
Mr Reeth Aegis Militia	Posted - 2008.03.11 14:36:00 - [20] Originally by: Kainda Gordo Please Mr Reeth, by all means continue to generate ill will towards the Empire. When your putting out the fire on your childrens backs remember this day. Continue to talk here. You are doing us a favour. I'm not worried about fire. My family doesn't live on Pator. Or are you talking about some imagined future rather than what's going on RIGHT NOW!
Kainda Gordo Kinda'Shujaa	Posted - 2008.03.11 16:27:00 - [21] Keep it up. PVP/RP Corp -- Now Recruiting
Reiker Struvian Caldari Phoenix Aeronautics	Posted - 2008.03.11 16:33:00 - [22] From Mr Mithralia, this is the message I see. 'We're happy that you caused personal and property damage to show how much you care, please continue hurting each other'
Kainda Gordo Kinda'Shujaa	Posted - 2008.03.11 16:38:00 - [23] Originally by: Reiker Struvian From Mr Mithralia, this is the message I see. 'We're happy that you caused personal and property damage to show how much you care, please continue hurting each other' Read it again. Quote: We're happy that you enjoyed the tournement and we are glad that you care about our sucsess so much. Please refrain from hurting each other and chop some amarrians up instead. It actually countains this message. PVP/RP Corp -- Now Recruiting
Deleanora Silverleaf Foundation	Posted - 2008.03.11 18:55:00 - [24] It was good to see at least someone willing to fight in the name of Minmatar in the tournament. Some convincing victories, some unfortunate defeats... but such tends to be the way of things. --------
Mr Reeth	Posted - 2008.03.13 03:52:00 - [25] Originally by: Kainda Gordo Keep it up. Okay, since you asked so nicely IÆll post again sweet cheeks. -More than one million reported fights -Five full blow riots -More than 1000 ôinjuredö (this could mean broken bones or a lifetime in a wheelchair) -7 dead -Millions of isk in property damage (How many does this leave homeless?) This seems like a pretty bad day for the Republic. But where is the support for those who are suffering RIGHT NOW? Has one Matari pod pilot come forth and offered to build new homes for riot refugees? Has one Matari pod pilot offered condolences to the families of the dead and crippled? No. All weÆve seen is everyone come out with the same rhetoric they post in every other thread. We even see someone blaming the riots on the Amarrians, as if there were any pro-Amarr sympathizers on Pator. And when I point out the utter absurdity of all this you threaten to light my children on fire. I find it really sad the person who seems most concerned with this isà meà a Khanid, Empire loyalist. In fact were I not KOS to the Republic fleet I probably would have flown a Bestower full of construction blocks to Pator to aid with their rebuilding.
Jacinda Molanth Republic Military School	Posted - 2008.03.14 11:41:00 - [26] Originally by: Mr Reeth Originally by: Kainda Gordo Keep it up. Okay, since you asked so nicely IÆll post again sweet cheeks. -More than one million reported fights -Five full blow riots -More than 1000 ôinjuredö (this could mean broken bones or a lifetime in a wheelchair) -7 dead -Millions of isk in property damage (How many does this leave homeless?) This seems like a pretty bad day for the Republic. But where is the support for those who are suffering RIGHT NOW? Has one Matari pod pilot come forth and offered to build new homes for riot refugees? Has one Matari pod pilot offered condolences to the families of the dead and crippled? No. All weÆve seen is everyone come out with the same rhetoric they post in every other thread. We even see someone blaming the riots on the Amarrians, as if there were any pro-Amarr sympathizers on Pator. And when I point out the utter absurdity of all this you threaten to light my children on fire. I find it really sad the person who seems most concerned with this isà meà a Khanid, Empire loyalist. In fact were I not KOS to the Republic fleet I probably would have flown a Bestower full of construction blocks to Pator to aid with their rebuilding. Mr. Reeth; Perhaps there are those helping out with contributions of time and ISK, but some have no need to tell the universe of every action they do. Rest assured that we Minmatar do take care of our own. As a matter of history and fact, we Minmatar also aid others in need. I recall vividly the Ushra'Khan coming to the aid of the people of Mabden following the Insorum bomb the Blood Raiders dropped.
128th ABC123 Eve Liberation Force Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.19 08:58:00 - [27] Brings to mind the recent destruction of two of your starbases as repurcusion for your constant acts of piracy and not abiding to the rules in our space. How many of your brethren showed up to defend the 1000's of people that died in the siege of these 2 stations? I recollect it was only the last of the desillusioned rabble that call themselves the Ushra-Khan...
Lord Murkon SPCS	Posted - 2008.03.19 09:56:00 - [28] The SPCS can offer free housing, food and medical care to any Minmatar riot refugee who finds themselves out on the street. No Minmatar should suffer because of the irresponsible acts of others in support of terrorists. Lord Murkon SPCS CEO SPCS - Serving the pathetic Minmatar and lessor races by the grace of God
Telemicus Thrace Thrace Inc Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 09:57:00 - [29] You must mean those two small industrial platforms that it took the combined fleet of three alliances to take down. They were of course evacuated while the shield was reinforced. You lost a substantial amount of ships in the attack, far surpassing the financial or strategic value of your target. I could of course mirror your mock concern and raise the question of all those thousands of crewmen who died for a couple of mining arrays. But they, like you, are our enemy and I rejoice in their deaths.
Sapphrine Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 10:16:00 - [30] Originally by: 128th ABC123 Brings to mind the recent destruction of two of your starbases as repurcusion for your constant acts of piracy and not abiding to the rules in our space. How many of your brethren showed up to defend the 1000's of people that died in the siege of these 2 stations? I recollect it was only the last of the desillusioned rabble that call themselves the Ushra-Khan... You see bringing up your own losses is just not smart. You successfully destroyed a research structure that had already been evacuated and then had to take two swipes to take out the second tower. On top of that you had to bring in multiple allies, took 10x longer than is smart to drop it and lost countless crews and vessels yourself due to incompetence. I think more than enough of the Ushra-Khan turned up to make Sylph pay in blood for that tower. I just hope they court marshalled your fleet commander for that debacle.
Karn Mithralia Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 11:06:00 - [31] Don't let the yapping of the slave dog derail this message of thanks brothers. The slaughter of their fleet speaks far louder than any words. -----------------------------------------
Mr Reeth The Aegis Militia Aegis Militia	Posted - 2008.03.19 12:24:00 - [32] Do you mean the stations formerly know as MuratorÆs Defiance and Unity?
Karn Mithralia Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 12:38:00 - [33] No, the Sylph slave dog refers to recent warring between us in Assah. -----------------------------------------
128th ABC123 Eve Liberation Force Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.19 14:58:00 - [34] All said and well... I hope you enjoy living on the fringes of outlaw space. You have outstayed your welcome and recent events have been caused by your own doing. Constant harrasement of UK forces of peacefull citizens and pilots in our space has led to this offensive, which is far from over. The Sylph Captains and crews that gave their lives for the destruction of presumably the last inhabitated U'K structures in the conflict area did this knowning they would leave behind a safer area, ridden of the Terrorist Scum known as Ushra'Khan.
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 15:28:00 - [35] Originally by: 128th ABC123 All said and well... I hope you enjoy living on the fringes of outlaw space. You have outstayed your welcome and recent events have been caused by your own doing. Constant harrasement of UK forces of peacefull citizens and pilots in our space has led to this offensive, which is far from over. The Sylph Captains and crews that gave their lives for the destruction of presumably the last inhabitated U'K structures in the conflict area did this knowning they would leave behind a safer area, ridden of the Terrorist Scum known as Ushra'Khan. I,m sorry but your attack on one small station and one medium took more than a week , as said before both evacuated . The medium it took 3 attempts to take it out , on the 3rd attempt you had to call in CVA , who if it wasnt for them took charge of the fiasco you had created . The system of assah was astrewn with wrecks of your fleet and I dare say you were at a point where your capitals were in grave danger if CVA hadnt arrived . You mock us for the loss of the stations , I,m baffled as is many other plots who partook in the slaughter of your ships why you found them so strategically important . We feel no loss for those stations they did a job far outstanding than any capital fleet we couldve, wouldve mustered against you . We have recorded your losses at 31 ships to our 5 , that my friend if you see as a victory you are clearly deranged . Oh by the way we the Terrorist scum of Ushra'Khan have no intention of stopping our attacks on slaver scum space , it would take a lot more than 2 wee substations to deny us our fun And fun we had in Assah . On behalf of the Ushra'Khan pilots and allies who attended that glorious day we thankyou from the*****les of our hearts
128th ABC123 Eve Liberation Force Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.19 15:42:00 - [36] You must be past yourself that U'K is not with their back agains the wall (empire space). You where not able to defend those stations. The losses we incurred where minimal. We brought the 2 towers into reinforced in one strike. The small tower came out during a convenient time for our fleet and was dispatched swiftly. The second tower was less convenient and we proceeded to bring it into reinforced a second time with a more convenient time for the final blow. Our allies showing up only shows the bad blood the Terrorist Uhsra Khan have set in the region and also shows that the citizens of Providence are fed up with the hysteria of Ushra Khan.
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 15:57:00 - [37] Originally by: 128th ABC123 You must be past yourself that U'K is not with their back agains the wall (empire space). You where not able to defend those stations. The losses we incurred where minimal. We brought the 2 towers into reinforced in one strike. The small tower came out during a convenient time for our fleet and was dispatched swiftly. The second tower was less convenient and we proceeded to bring it into reinforced a second time with a more convenient time for the final blow. Our allies showing up only shows the bad blood the Terrorist Uhsra Khan have set in the region and also shows that the citizens of Providence are fed up with the hysteria of Ushra Khan. Turning a loss into a victory at the cost of your pilots to make yourself look better my deranged friend smells of desperation . Losses minimal you say ?. We lost 4 bombers and a tempest , you lost b/cruisers and b/ships and some small support to us , not including what the AAA gang took you for . We picked you off at the stations , planets and belts you consistently kept warping to showing lack of communication on your part . You even warped cruisers and a hauler to the medium pos at the start of the engagement ? , pray tell us why ?. Your allies showing up only shows the bad blood centred towards us . Strange description becoming of you there , CVA , BoTS , Severance have never been friends of ours so why wouldnt they . Backs against the wall is it ? . Never underestimate your foe , here endeth the lesson .
Sapphrine Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 16:00:00 - [38] Originally by: 128th ABC123 You must be past yourself that U'K is not with their back agains the wall (empire space). You where not able to defend those stations. The losses we incurred where minimal. We brought the 2 towers into reinforced in one strike. The small tower came out during a convenient time for our fleet and was dispatched swiftly. The second tower was less convenient and we proceeded to bring it into reinforced a second time with a more convenient time for the final blow. Our allies showing up only shows the bad blood the Terrorist Uhsra Khan have set in the region and also shows that the citizens of Providence are fed up with the hysteria of Ushra Khan. Can someone from Sylph command please start educating your guys in history? :) Also, speak with your allies about minimal losses. They may be Amarr scum but they know how to fight at least! As a hint, when you lose more than you kill, thats called a loss :P
Kebabski coracao ardente Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.03.19 16:13:00 - [39] Edited by: Kebabski on 19/03/2008 16:13:26 It was well over 2bil ISK lost for you easilly. 8 bs's lost, HAC, Recon, 3x cruisers, a BC, AF, 2 Stealths, 2 inties, 4 frigs and a transport ship, that for a 600mil tower total+some smaller ships
Garreck Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.19 16:27:00 - [40] Odd. I do wonder when "tactical efficiency" became a term of victory superceding "strategic objectives achieved." Apparently, for Sylph, it was worth 2 billion isk to see two towers destroyed and that strategic tool removed from Ushra'Khan's toolbox. Efficiency is a means to an end, not the end itself. That's a basic combat concept that is lost on the current generation of pod-pilots. A proper strategic cost analysis, though, should take into account who held the field of battle, how much costs were recouped through insurance, and how much cost was recouped through recovered weapons and materiel at the very least. It might also be interesting to see the long term effects of the loss of these strategic assets to Ushra'Khan operations in the area. But to grasp so desperately to up-front efficiency? CVA's conquest of 9uy was anything but efficient, particularly after the first week of that campaign...
Sapphrine Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 16:34:00 - [41] Originally by: Garreck Odd. I do wonder when "tactical efficiency" became a term of victory superceding "strategic objectives achieved." Apparently, for Sylph, it was worth 2 billion isk to see two towers destroyed and that strategic tool removed from Ushra'Khan's toolbox. Efficiency is a means to an end, not the end itself. That's a basic combat concept that is lost on the current generation of pod-pilots. A proper strategic cost analysis, though, should take into account who held the field of battle, how much costs were recouped through insurance, and how much cost was recouped through recovered weapons and materiel at the very least. It might also be interesting to see the long term effects of the loss of these strategic assets to Ushra'Khan operations in the area. But to grasp so desperately to up-front efficiency? CVA's conquest of 9uy was anything but efficient, particularly after the first week of that campaign... if there was a strategic gain from killing the towers you might have a point... as it is, i must say i don't really feel deeply hurt or as though anything is going to be any more difficult to achieve. A full cost analysis would indeed add additional factors so we'll add in the failure of sylph to hold the field after the tower went down and thus their inability to rescue potential survivors or salvage components / modules from the battlefield. In short, if there had been some sort of strategic objective achieved then i'd say you had a point but knocking over two small towers leaving U'K with... no noticeable loss to infrastructure / forward bases of operations... I guess in one way we should thank sylph, means we have two towers that were largely doing nothing that we don't have to fuel anymore.
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 16:46:00 - [42] Originally by: Garreck Odd. I do wonder when "tactical efficiency" became a term of victory superceding "strategic objectives achieved." Apparently, for Sylph, it was worth 2 billion isk to see two towers destroyed and that strategic tool removed from Ushra'Khan's toolbox. Efficiency is a means to an end, not the end itself. That's a basic combat concept that is lost on the current generation of pod-pilots. A proper strategic cost analysis, though, should take into account who held the field of battle, how much costs were recouped through insurance, and how much cost was recouped through recovered weapons and materiel at the very least. It might also be interesting to see the long term effects of the loss of these strategic assets to Ushra'Khan operations in the area. But to grasp so desperately to up-front efficiency? CVA's conquest of 9uy was anything but efficient, particularly after the first week of that campaign... A far better summary I warrant , but easily Ushra'Khan held the field of battle , why do I say this ? , basically it is he who holds fast and fights at the end of the engagement . We rescued the batteries and even caught several of the enemy at the destroyed substation attemptin to steal certain items from the field of battle . To achieve strategic objectives one must first decide if the losses are worth the outcome . So lets look at the outcome shall we , ok we lost a small research and a medium research substation with modules removed before annihilation . We held the field at the end . We maintain the Burn Providence campaign that sylph decided removing our pos,s would be our punishment to maintain there space safe and hopefully remove us . I can assure you Garreck those two assets can easily be replaced again & again . All in all if we were discussing the losses of a Death Star or several then the end justified the means , but were discussing about 2 research pos,s . Whilst in reinforced we could have easily left the medium to its demise as it wasnt overly defended to start with , but we chose to increase its weaponry to gain a fight knowing it was lost , knowing eventually we would lose it . So only one summary can be concluded here , tactical efficiency was abhorrent on there part with strategic objectives a complete failure Were going nowhere !!!
Vox Thaal Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 17:27:00 - [43] I wholeheartedly encourage Sylph to pursue more strategic triumphs such as this one. Marching forward at this swift pace, and under such visionary leadership, it is only a matter of time before they achieve a victory of epic proportions and are no longer able to field a fleet at all.
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 18:41:00 - [44] I have a final question for ABC 128th , according to your respective corp title you are in fact Fleet Commander . Would you be the one responsible for the sheer confusion & massacre of your force in the first hour of engagement ?.
Elsebeth Rhiannon Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.03.19 19:33:00 - [45] Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon on 19/03/2008 19:33:28 Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon on 19/03/2008 19:33:14 It's nice the Amarr worry, is not not... cause, you know, Minmatar people do not die in the Empire, right, so they have the time? EDITed to add: now taking bets that U'K will quote that out of context and without the sarcasm inside the next six months. -- Help us defend the Republic; join Gradient today.
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 19:59:00 - [46] Originally by: Elsebeth Rhiannon Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon on 19/03/2008 19:36:40 It's nice the Amarr worry, is not not... cause, you know, Minmatar people do not die in the Empire, right, so they have the time? EDITed to add: now taking bets that U'K will quote that out of context and without the sarcasm inside the next six months. You overrate yourself
Elsebeth Rhiannon Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.03.19 20:42:00 - [47] Edited by: Elsebeth Rhiannon on 19/03/2008 20:42:57 I wish I did. But truth is, I only bet on things I know from experience are very likely odds in my favor. -- Help us defend the Republic; join Gradient today.
Mr Reeth The Aegis Militia Aegis Militia	Posted - 2008.03.19 20:45:00 - [48] What was this thread about again?
Garreck Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.19 20:46:00 - [49] There seems to be a lot of chest beating for an organization who makes grand claims of numbers of kills in Providence to simply have destroyed 20 vessels in the process of losing two control towers. That aside, what I get from this is that Sylph set out to remove Ushra'Khan towers from Assah, succeeding in doing so, and the warriors of Ushra'Khan (whose determination the pilots of the CVA can attest to and whose strong showing in the recent alliance tournament was witnessed by all) made 'em pay as best they could. I did wonder the other day as I participated in a patrol of various low security systems in the Mandate, what the heck was going on in Assah...
Conlin Sarz'na Khumatari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.03.19 21:01:00 - [50] Originally by: Garreck There seems to be a lot of chest beating for an organization who makes grand claims of numbers of kills in Providence to simply have destroyed 20 vessels in the process of losing two control towers. That aside, what I get from this is that Sylph set out to remove Ushra'Khan towers from Assah, succeeding in doing so, and the warriors of Ushra'Khan (whose determination the pilots of the CVA can attest to and whose strong showing in the recent alliance tournament was witnessed by all) made 'em pay as best they could. I did wonder the other day as I participated in a patrol of various low security systems in the Mandate, what the heck was going on in Assah... I,m sorry Garreck but you cant save him from his fate , he dug the hole he,s now in , a valiant attempt on your behalf , but one that is far from rescuable . We had decided not to mention the incident or chest beat until of course Mr ABC started the chest beating .Please refer to the first page . We are merely here to correct him on a few statistics he sadly forgot to mention and if we wanted we could spam Assah with more pos,s , but thats a road we both know well . One path we no longer wish to take . And truthfully , I hated that bloody pos . Bloody whining all the time when it wanted fed . Worse than being married
Elsebeth Rhiannon Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.03.20 07:57:00 - [51] Originally by: Deleanora It was good to see at least someone willing to fight in the name of Minmatar in the tournament. Actually there were more parties willing to, but the stupid registration process filled up the positions in the tournament too fast. Maybe next time. Yes, I am purposefully ignoring the death by statistics parts of this thread and trying to concentrate on the sports. Elsebeth -- Help us defend the Republic; join Gradient today.
Ogoel Marek The House of Marek	Posted - 2008.03.20 12:53:00 - [52] The tribals lend credence to our claim over them with their words and actions. As part of their future ruling class it pains me and the Elders of House Marek to see them fall decade after decade into such a lamentable state. Ushra Kahn, Midular there is no difference. Only Ammatar dominion will bring stability to Terra Irridente. We should go forward and take the peace talks one step further. We should begin the process of assimilating the lands of Terra Irridente, with the government of Terra Irridente. Its about time that tribal lands become part of The Mandate. For God, Empire, and the reclaiming of tribal lands. Ogoel Marek Ammatar terminal<-- --> The House of Marek
128th ABC123 Eve Liberation Force Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2008.03.21 08:04:00 - [53] Originally by: Conlin Were going nowhere !!! You got that right! :P
128th ABC123	Posted - 2008.03.21 08:18:00 - [54] Originally by: Conlin Originally by: Garreck Odd. I do wonder when "tactical efficiency" became a term of victory superceding "strategic objectives achieved." Apparently, for Sylph, it was worth 2 billion isk to see two towers destroyed and that strategic tool removed from Ushra'Khan's toolbox. Efficiency is a means to an end, not the end itself. That's a basic combat concept that is lost on the current generation of pod-pilots. A proper strategic cost analysis, though, should take into account who held the field of battle, how much costs were recouped through insurance, and how much cost was recouped through recovered weapons and materiel at the very least. It might also be interesting to see the long term effects of the loss of these strategic assets to Ushra'Khan operations in the area. But to grasp so desperately to up-front efficiency? CVA's conquest of 9uy was anything but efficient, particularly after the first week of that campaign... A far better summary I warrant , but easily Ushra'Khan held the field of battle , why do I say this ? , basically it is he who holds fast and fights at the end of the engagement . We rescued the batteries and even caught several of the enemy at the destroyed substation attemptin to steal certain items from the field of battle . To achieve strategic objectives one must first decide if the losses are worth the outcome . So lets look at the outcome shall we , ok we lost a small research and a medium research substation with modules removed before annihilation . We held the field at the end . We maintain the Burn Providence campaign that sylph decided removing our pos,s would be our punishment to maintain there space safe and hopefully remove us . I can assure you Garreck those two assets can easily be replaced again & again . All in all if we were discussing the losses of a Death Star or several then the end justified the means , but were discussing about 2 research pos,s . Whilst in reinforced we could have easily left the medium to its demise as it wasnt overly defended to start with , but we chose to increase its weaponry to gain a fight knowing it was lost , knowing eventually we would lose it . So only one summary can be concluded here , tactical efficiency was abhorrent on there part with strategic objectives a complete failure Were going nowhere !!! If U'K had any deathstars left it in the area we would make it priority to take them down. Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
128th ABC123	Posted - 2008.03.21 08:25:00 - [55] Originally by: Conlin I have a final question for ABC 128th , according to your respective corp title you are in fact Fleet Commander . Would you be the one responsible for the sheer confusion & massacre of your force in the first hour of engagement ?. Just to respond to your question, I was involved in commanding the conventional fleet in the first attack only (bringing the 2 towers into reinforced) and during the takedown of the small POS. I was not able to attend the destruction of the 2nd terrorist base at which U'K finally managed to get up some defences. The location and the tactics deployed by U'K where high risk in losing ships and I see no reason to blame the FC for it. I think he did a commendable job. You either have the choice to blame our FC for our losses or your own battleprowess, hmm which would YOU want to pick? Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Conlin	Posted - 2008.03.21 15:19:00 - [56] 3 attempts at replying to my posts and 3 attempts to destroy research pos,s , I guess 3 aint your lucky number . I would put our success down to 3 things ABC ;) 1. Your poor strategy leading to our high kill ratio . 2. Our FC choosing not to engage you head on at the pos knowing full well you,d call in CVA to help you . 3. Karn Mithralia at the wheel and no sign of any alcohol , none that we know of . Next time ABC if your going to blow your own trumpet , try doing it without the help of 4 other alliances , after all we the Ushra'Khan have our backs against the wall , and I wouldve thought an alliance such as the size of Sylph could easily deal with us , No ?.
Kintaki Khan Aliastra	Posted - 2008.03.23 10:13:00 - [57] Originally by: Vox Thaal I wholeheartedly encourage Sylph to pursue more strategic triumphs such as this one. Marching forward at this swift pace, and under such visionary leadership, it is only a matter of time before they achieve a victory of epic proportions and are no longer able to field a fleet at all. if they go on like this they will achieve your victory, and will not be able to field a lfeet at all, but there is no requirement for it then anymore. Its all good. Proceed! giggles too bad CVA is not equally stupid ;)

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