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Tarminic
Forsaken Resistance The Last Stand
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Posted - 2008.03.11 17:48:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist You do realize this applies to all ships as angle's are the only one that do all types of damage? Tanking these Rats already requires a 5 slot tank what do they want a 6 slot?
I guess that means we have to move to huge mother armor brick abbadons for plexes and more guardians.
Moving to an Abaddon for running complexes, with its additional 25% resistances, would cancel out the resistance change and give you an additional 25% resistance to your other resistances. Why didn't you do this to begin with?
Perhaps you should keep in mind that tanking a 10/10 complex isn't something that should be possible with a single ship. ---------------- Tarminic - 33 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.79.1 |
Aprudena Gist
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 17:49:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Alora Venoda
Originally by: CCP Atropos All ships will have lower Explosive resistance on their shields and lower EM resistance on their armour.
does this include NPC rats?
No NPC's never get affect by player changes. As you can see a rat and still lop torps from 100 km away or any of the other crap they never bother to change.
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Aprudena Gist
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 17:50:00 -
[33]
Edited by: Aprudena Gist on 11/03/2008 17:51:00
Originally by: Tarminic
Originally by: Aprudena Gist You do realize this applies to all ships as angle's are the only one that do all types of damage? Tanking these Rats already requires a 5 slot tank what do they want a 6 slot?
I guess that means we have to move to huge mother armor brick abbadons for plexes and more guardians.
Moving to an Abaddon for running complexes, with its additional 25% resistances, would cancel out the resistance change and give you an additional 25% resistance to your other resistances. Why didn't you do this to begin with?
Perhaps you should keep in mind that tanking a 10/10 complex isn't something that should be possible with a single ship.
Because a Raven can run a much better local tank then an Abbadon and getting Caldari Pilots is easier not to mention a raven is significily cheaper then an abbadon.
we have never run plexes solo we always use at-least 1 logistics ship and a logistics style battleship plex's can't be done solo unless your crazy and there happens to be no gates and you use a mothership/carrier.
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Ehronn
Caldari Eve University Ivy League
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Posted - 2008.03.11 17:51:00 -
[34]
i wish rats would be affected by the changes.
hehe nerf rat torps and resists also :)
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My Blog Dysfunctional Playground |
Aprudena Gist
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 17:52:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Marcus TheMartin HOW WILL WE RUN MISSIONS NOW!?
ALL IS LOST
who care's about mission runners?
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Tarminic
Forsaken Resistance The Last Stand
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Posted - 2008.03.11 17:54:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist Because a Raven can run a much better local tank then an Abbadon and getting Caldari Pilots is easier not to mention a raven is significily cheaper then an abbadon.
So you should probably factor all of those things into your decision regarding which ships to bring into a complex and then, based on local availability, make the correct decision. If you can get a Raven + an extra repping ship more easily than an Abaddon, do that. If not, use the Abaddon. I really don't get what the problem here except that you're more interested in whining than adapting to a %6.75 to %12.5 increase in NPC DPS. ---------------- Tarminic - 33 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.79.1 |
Zeba
Minmatar Pator Tech School
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Posted - 2008.03.11 17:58:00 -
[37]
Wow. People *****ed and whined over the hp buffs and now that CCP take a bit of it back with a small resist nerf they howl all the more. No satisfiying some people I swear. --------------------- Q: WTF! Why?! A: Because I can. --------------------- |
Aprudena Gist
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 17:59:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Tarminic
Originally by: Aprudena Gist Because a Raven can run a much better local tank then an Abbadon and getting Caldari Pilots is easier not to mention a raven is significily cheaper then an abbadon.
So you should probably factor all of those things into your decision regarding which ships to bring into a complex and then, based on local availability, make the correct decision. If you can get a Raven + an extra repping ship more easily than an Abaddon, do that. If not, use the Abaddon. I really don't get what the problem here except that you're more interested in whining than adapting to a %6.75 to %12.5 increase in NPC DPS.
No from what they have said this change was made to stop omi-tanking in pvp combat and its going to significantly affect many more ships far beyond the reaches of pvp combat to the point where some lose viability for pve content. Developers in the past have always over-looked too many things while making sweeping changes including ones made in this patch that are much more game balance changing then this one.
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Tarminic
Forsaken Resistance The Last Stand
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Posted - 2008.03.11 18:07:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist No from what they have said this change was made to stop omi-tanking in pvp combat and its going to significantly affect many more ships far beyond the reaches of pvp combat to the point where some lose viability for pve content.
The Raven is %6.75 to %12.5 less effective against Angel NPCs. Given the Raven's absolute dominance of almost every form of PvE, do you honestly believe that this is a big enough issue to complain about? Would you prefer that every ship except the Raven receive this change so you can avoid the thirty seconds of synapse firing needed to adapt your PvE tactics?
Quote: Developers in the past have always over-looked too many things while making sweeping changes including ones made in this patch that are much more game balance changing then this one.
Or maybe they just considered that an improvement to Amarr's viability in PvP was much more important than the continued use of Ravens in PvE? Because I'm pretty sure that's how most of us feel. ---------------- Tarminic - 33 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.79.1 |
Marcus TheMartin
Gallente Deadly Addiction Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.03.11 18:23:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist
Originally by: Marcus TheMartin HOW WILL WE RUN MISSIONS NOW!?
ALL IS LOST
who care's about mission runners?
no one cares about mission runners as a whole individual mission runners emit a sphere of care when mission runners cluster the sphere will merge into a giant care bubble therein making mission runners care about mission runners
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Aprudena Gist
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 18:33:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Tarminic
Originally by: Aprudena Gist No from what they have said this change was made to stop omi-tanking in pvp combat and its going to significantly affect many more ships far beyond the reaches of pvp combat to the point where some lose viability for pve content.
The Raven is %6.75 to %12.5 less effective against Angel NPCs. Given the Raven's absolute dominance of almost every form of PvE, do you honestly believe that this is a big enough issue to complain about? Would you prefer that every ship except the Raven receive this change so you can avoid the thirty seconds of synapse firing needed to adapt your PvE tactics?
Quote: Developers in the past have always over-looked too many things while making sweeping changes including ones made in this patch that are much more game balance changing then this one.
Or maybe they just considered that an improvement to Amarr's viability in PvP was much more important than the continued use of Ravens in PvE? Because I'm pretty sure that's how most of us feel.
I could care less about the raven itself i dont really use it but running running plex's using a shield tank ship was the norm and because of this change they are going to go by the way side. This is more about making a sweeping change to all the ships of the game , being heavy handed about it and its going to make more then a few ships less then desirable in combat and for making money.
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Tarminic
Forsaken Resistance The Last Stand
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Posted - 2008.03.11 18:41:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist I could care less about the raven itself i dont really use it but running running plex's using a shield tank ship was the norm and because of this change they are going to go by the way side. This is more about making a sweeping change to all the ships of the game , being heavy handed about it and its going to make more then a few ships less then desirable in combat and for making money.
I repeat, a shield tanking ship fighting an enemy with 25% explosive damage will be 6.75% less effective. I believe that most of those concerned by that margin are min-maxers, and I have no sympathy for them. In addition, I think a greater variety among PvE ships is a good thing.
If that is really disconcerting, I suspect that you simply dislike any change that negatively affects your ability to make money, directly or otherwise. ---------------- Tarminic - 33 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.79.1 |
Aprudena Gist
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 18:43:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Tarminic
Originally by: Aprudena Gist I could care less about the raven itself i dont really use it but running running plex's using a shield tank ship was the norm and because of this change they are going to go by the way side. This is more about making a sweeping change to all the ships of the game , being heavy handed about it and its going to make more then a few ships less then desirable in combat and for making money.
I repeat, a shield tanking ship fighting an enemy with 25% explosive damage will be 6.75% less effective. I believe that most of those concerned by that margin are min-maxers, and I have no sympathy for them. In addition, I think a greater variety among PvE ships is a good thing.
If that is really disconcerting, I suspect that you simply dislike any change that negatively affects your ability to make money, directly or otherwise.
no i dislike change when it happens on a broad-scale with no in-depth review or discussion on it. Who really knows how much this is going to affect.
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Tarminic
Forsaken Resistance The Last Stand
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:01:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist no i dislike change when it happens on a broad-scale with no in-depth review or discussion on it. Who really knows how much this is going to affect.
You don't think that there's been an in-depth review or discussion. Unless you're a CCP employee you can't know how thoroughly this has been discussed internally. Have you considered that CCP may be planning other changes to keep things in line? Or that maybe this helps achieve several different goals at once? Currently it seems like your reasoning is that since this affects the Raven negatively, CCP didn't think through it enough. How do you know that they don't want shield tanks to be less prevalent in PvE? ---------------- Tarminic - 33 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.79.1 |
Aprudena Gist
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:14:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Tarminic
Originally by: Aprudena Gist no i dislike change when it happens on a broad-scale with no in-depth review or discussion on it. Who really knows how much this is going to affect.
You don't think that there's been an in-depth review or discussion. Unless you're a CCP employee you can't know how thoroughly this has been discussed internally. Have you considered that CCP may be planning other changes to keep things in line? Or that maybe this helps achieve several different goals at once? Currently it seems like your reasoning is that since this affects the Raven negatively, CCP didn't think through it enough. How do you know that they don't want shield tanks to be less prevalent in PvE?
Like i said dont give two ****s about the raven makes em easier to gank those ratters in scalding pass thou.
Yes there really hasn't been a long in-depth look into these changes.
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Tarminic
Forsaken Resistance The Last Stand
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:17:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist Yes there really hasn't been a long in-depth look into these changes.
And how do you know this? ---------------- Tarminic - 33 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.79.1 |
Cpt Fina
Mutually Assured Distraction
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:31:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist
You do realize this applies to all ships as angel's are the only one that do all types of damage? Tanking these Rats already requires a 5 slot tank what do they want a 6 slot?
No, they want you to run level 4s in gangs. Like it was intended.
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sesanti
Minmatar Universal Exports FOUNDATI0N
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:40:00 -
[48]
Edited by: sesanti on 11/03/2008 19:40:32
Originally by: Tarminic
Originally by: Aprudena Gist Yes there really hasn't been a long in-depth look into these changes.
And how do you know this?
Leave him alone ... He is a Goon ... He *KNOWS*
/End of sarcasm _______________________________________________ The ShadowMaster -
<I am a guy... don't mind the portrait> |
Aprudena Gist
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:41:00 -
[49]
Edited by: Aprudena Gist on 11/03/2008 19:42:05
Originally by: Cpt Fina
Originally by: Aprudena Gist
You do realize this applies to all ships as angel's are the only one that do all types of damage? Tanking these Rats already requires a 5 slot tank what do they want a 6 slot?
No, they want you to run level 4s in gangs. Like it was intended.
who runs l4s? i sure as hell dont. Almost everything i do in this game involves a gang and a 10/10 angel plex is already blood hard.
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SinBin
Gallente HARDC0RE
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:47:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist
who runs l4s? i sure as hell dont. Almost everything i do in this game involves a gang and a 10/10 angel plex is already blood hard.
Can I post in your tread for a sec, ta.
Lvl4 mission = pve plex = pve
Im lost about the diffence you seem to see.
Also in your 5k allince do you let everyone come do this plex & share the spoils ? or do you think the odd 1 might run missions to make some isk ?.
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Kahrek Laume
Gallente Atropos Asylum
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:48:00 -
[51]
Edited by: Kahrek Laume on 11/03/2008 19:48:25 Every last one of you whinner forget one tiny little detail, the reason for this modification, i could sugar coat it but basicly it ungimps the amarr a tiny tad when it comes to dealing damage to armor tankers, something they needed desperatlty.
Now of course you all mighty all knowing shield tanking gods had nothing to say when the nerfbat hit the sensor damps so hard they are now practicaly non existant but heaven forbid we actualy require you to you know... think of your setup just a tad.. oh noes...
I for one support this change wholeheatedly as a well thought out solution to somewhat alleviate the amarr problem, a problem that has been around for a very long time already.
Take your heads out of the sand and look around.
Kahrek Laume.
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Aprudena Gist
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:50:00 -
[52]
Originally by: SinBin
Originally by: Aprudena Gist
who runs l4s? i sure as hell dont. Almost everything i do in this game involves a gang and a 10/10 angel plex is already blood hard.
Can I post in your tread for a sec, ta.
Lvl4 mission = pve plex = pve
Im lost about the diffence you seem to see.
Also in your 5k allince do you let everyone come do this plex & share the spoils ? or do you think the odd 1 might run missions to make some isk ?.
These are probed out plexes . Yes you need a gang to enter then and complete them so people do come. There are no more static plexes in 0.0 as far as i know.
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Last Wolf
Templars of Space
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:51:00 -
[53]
Why do people keep complaining about "Now the ONLY viable option is an OMNI tank"
....
Do you even read the setups in S&M? I've never seen anything but a PvE or Capital setup that used anything other than EM hardener + invulns for shields or an explosive hardener + ENAMs + DC for armor tanks in PvP.
99% of people already used an omni tank for PvP, this makes them less effective on shield/armor's highest native resists (explosive/EM) Which is EXACTLY what they were trying to do with this change.
Originally by: Liang Nuren wrong forum isroy i am vjery drunm
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Aprudena Gist
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:51:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Kahrek Laume Edited by: Kahrek Laume on 11/03/2008 19:48:25 Every last one of you whinner forget one tiny little detail, the reason for this modification, i could sugar coat it but basicly it ungimps the amarr a tiny tad when it comes to dealing damage to armor tankers, something they needed desperatlty.
Now of course you all mighty all knowing shield tanking gods had nothing to say when the nerfbat hit the sensor damps so hard they are now practicaly non existant but heaven forbid we actualy require you to you know... think of your setup just a tad.. oh noes...
I for one support this change wholeheatedly as a well thought out solution to somewhat alleviate the amarr problem, a problem that has been around for a very long time already.
Take your heads out of the sand and look around.
Kahrek Laume.
It also makes titans more powerful as its almost impossible to double tank a doomsday now.
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Aprudena Gist
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:52:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Last Wolf Why do people keep complaining about "Now the ONLY viable option is an OMNI tank"
....
Do you even read the setups in S&M? I've never seen anything but a PvE or Capital setup that used anything other than EM hardener + invulns for shields or an explosive hardener + ENAMs + DC for armor tanks in PvP.
99% of people already used an omni tank for PvP, this makes them less effective on shield/armor's highest native resists (explosive/EM) Which is EXACTLY what they were trying to do with this change.
Have you ever done pvp? Have you ever flow into combat knowing that there are mutliple titans that can drop on your head when ever they feel like it? this is why you have to omni tank.
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Tarminic
Forsaken Resistance The Last Stand
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:55:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist It also makes titans more powerful as its almost impossible to double tank a doomsday now.
Yes, this is clearly a stealth buff for Titans.
You still haven't answered my question. ---------------- Tarminic - 33 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.79.1 |
SinBin
Gallente HARDC0RE
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Posted - 2008.03.11 19:59:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist
These are probed out plexes . Yes you need a gang to enter then and complete them so people do come. There are no more static plexes in 0.0 as far as i know.
There always room for a probing but thats irrelvent to damage resistance or a diffence between the 2 forms of pve & player doing them ?.
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Marcus TheMartin
Gallente Deadly Addiction Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.03.11 20:02:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Last Wolf
99%
number pulled out of ass
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Zorlag
Minmatar GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.03.11 20:05:00 -
[59]
Aprudena you're sounding pretty dumb in this thread fyi I'm not sure if you're trolling but just letting you know :)
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Cpt Fina
Mutually Assured Distraction
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Posted - 2008.03.11 20:06:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Aprudena Gist Edited by: Aprudena Gist on 11/03/2008 19:42:05
Originally by: Cpt Fina
Originally by: Aprudena Gist
You do realize this applies to all ships as angel's are the only one that do all types of damage? Tanking these Rats already requires a 5 slot tank what do they want a 6 slot?
No, they want you to run level 4s in gangs. Like it was intended.
who runs l4s? i sure as hell dont.
Yeah, noone really runs level 4... eherm. lol goon.
Originally by: Aprudena Gist
Almost everything i do in this game involves a gang and a 10/10 angel plex is already blood hard.
Maybe they were intended to be hard. I hope they make NPCing even harder in the future tbh.
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