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Invay
Sirrius Cybernetics
R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2008.03.16 00:25:00 -
[1]
Having a good UI is a fairly basic requirement of a good game since that is the way that the person playing the game interacts with the game. Without a good UI even the best game is nothing more than a turd.
I had thought that perhaps if Eve would allow players to create their own UI's that it would make Eve better. Today I gave up that illusion. The problems with the UI are so basic that they would need to be taken care of before an api could be created for players to create their own.
Today, I have had issues where there is absolutly nothing in the overview and the only way to fix it is to log off and back on, not exactly something that is fun to do in the middle of fleet movements. This confounds me, I went into the overview settings and tried changing things, to no avail. So I guess that really this wasn't a UI issue, the issue was that the servers were not talking to my UI. The UI can't load information into the overview if the servers are not feeding it data. So the only fix was to reset the connection by logging off and logging back on.
Later I ran across something that makes even less sense. I was unable to change the size of the local chat box, mind you I had to change the size of chat boxes acouple times today due to having to reset the UI windows due to targeting and half the overview being knocked off the screen by fleet invites, but I'll get to that one later. Anyway, the local chat box, I could move it around the screen, I could merge it with the main chat boxes, but I could not change its size. There are UI functions that should of course be completely client side, like changing the size of a chat box. Is the reason that I had to log off then back on to change the size of the chat box due to it having to get permission to change its size from the server? Its the only thing I can think of it. Mind you I'm not a programmer, but I'm sure there are plenty playing this game who end up thinking WTF!!! a couple times a day.
Fleet invites, I know that before this patch I had no problems with fleet invites. Today though everytime I got a fleet invite it shoved half my ui off the screen. To fix it without logging off I had to reset my entire UI. All of it, not just reset a box here or a box there, nope don't have that option, its all or nothing. Ain't that fun? Oh boy, nothing I enjoy more than reseting my UI while in a fleet battle. ITS FUN I TELL YOU FUN!!!!
Then of course you have zoning, or jumping or whatever ya want to call it. Click on warp and wait, and wait, and wait some more while in an egg. I'm glad no enemy ships came over to say hello. Nothing saying that the zone is unavailable, just that session change is in progress. Would be nice that if the session change is actually in progress, that perhaps you could be made invulnerable, would make a lot of sense and on top of that it would limit the amount of ships that get destroyed due to lag bugs making for happier customers and your custoemr support staff would get yelled at less.
Another thing, the buggier a game is, the more likely some really messed up hacks can be created for it. The integration between the client and the server are often prime targets for hacks.
Well, time to log back in and see if I can finally jump though the f'n gate. |
Woofsie
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Hedonistic Imperative
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Posted - 2008.03.16 00:32:00 -
[2]
Never had a problem with my UI tbh, I guess it's a semi-rare bug. Though there seem to be a lot of threads popping up about it lately.. coincidence? I think not.
This post is wholly representative of the views of both my corp and my alliance.
Fnord. |
Asestorian
Domination.
Scorched Earth.
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Posted - 2008.03.16 00:35:00 -
[3]
So what you're complaining about is bugs? Ok then. But your opening statement gives the impression that you're displeased with the UI's design.
Secondly, CCP don't want to allow players to create their own UI's through some kind of API like WoW's. They don't want to build something into the game that can give people an advantage beyond their characters abilities and ships.
---
MOZO
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Invay
Sirrius Cybernetics
R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2008.03.16 00:45:00 -
[4]
Bugs should take precedence over visual design which is the reason I stated what I did how I did.
But from what your saying I take it that CCP believes that if you don't have to deal with a f'ed up UI that you'll have an advantage? Well, if that is how they feel I guess they would be technically correct, but stupid. No two random people will agree on a UI design, but offering only one UI CCP gives an advantage to those who their UI works well with while ignoring those it does not. |
Oregon sinful
Black Plague.
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.03.16 00:47:00 -
[5]
no this is stupid :S
POST WITH YOUR MAIN OR STFU - No respect for alts. |
Joe Starbreaker
Starbreaker Spaceways
Nex Eternus
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Posted - 2008.03.16 00:50:00 -
[6]
TL;DNR
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Woofsie
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Hedonistic Imperative
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Posted - 2008.03.16 00:52:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Woofsie on 16/03/2008 00:51:54
 Originally by: Invay
Bugs should take precedence over visual design which is the reason I stated what I did how I did.
Bug fixers != Graphical designers!
This post is wholly representative of the views of both my corp and my alliance.
Fnord. |
Invay
Sirrius Cybernetics
R0ADKILL
|
Posted - 2008.03.16 00:55:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Woofsie
Edited by: Woofsie on 16/03/2008 00:51:54
Originally by: Invay
Bugs should take precedence over visual design which is the reason I stated what I did how I did.
Bug fixers != Graphical designers!
Agreed, but bug fixers are the ones who work on the underlining processes that allows the graphical designers to create the ui's. So the bug fixers would be the ones who would be creating an api for player made ui's, not the graphical designers.
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Woofsie
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Hedonistic Imperative
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Posted - 2008.03.16 01:01:00 -
[9]
But by the statement of yours that I quoted.. fixing the bugs in the current UI ought to take place over designing a customizable UI, no?
This post is wholly representative of the views of both my corp and my alliance.
Fnord. |
Invay
Sirrius Cybernetics
R0ADKILL
|
Posted - 2008.03.16 01:11:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Woofsie
But by the statement of yours that I quoted.. fixing the bugs in the current UI ought to take place over designing a customizable UI, no?
Yes, since the graphic designers are not the ones that create the api's for players to create their own ui's.
Using EQ as an example since its one I'm more familiar with.
Mechanics of a UI.
http://www.eqinterface.com/patches/live_12.12.07/EQUI_Animations.html
The design of a UI.
http://www.eqinterface.com/downloads/preview.php?id=6898&tnow=1205629665
Two totally different things done by different people. Graphic designers do not fix the bugs.
Now that we can agree on that anything to add?
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Woofsie
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Hedonistic Imperative
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Posted - 2008.03.16 01:19:00 -
[11]
Okay, fair enough then. But why would player-made UI's make any difference? From what I understand, you're suffering from bugs in the game mechanics, not in the UI layout.
If I'm wrong don't pick on me too much... it's late. -.-
This post is wholly representative of the views of both my corp and my alliance.
Fnord. |
NightF0x
Chicken Coup Raiders
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Posted - 2008.03.16 01:19:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Oregon sinful
no this is stupid :S
bastard....
------------------------------------
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Garmon
Genos Occidere
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Posted - 2008.03.16 01:21:00 -
[13]
Originally by: NightF0x
Originally by: Oregon sinful
no this is stupid :S
bastard....
__________________________________
Garmonation - Rupture fun video |
Woofsie
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Hedonistic Imperative
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Posted - 2008.03.16 01:23:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Oregon sinful
no this is stupid :S
I hate you.
This post is wholly representative of the views of both my corp and my alliance.
Fnord. |
Brainless Bimbo
Pator Tech School
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Posted - 2008.03.16 01:24:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Invay
Bugs should take precedence over visual design which is the reason I stated what I did how I did.
Ah, have you met my friend Mr Microsoft.
...... continues overleaf. |
Invay
Sirrius Cybernetics
R0ADKILL
|
Posted - 2008.03.16 17:45:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Woofsie
Okay, fair enough then. But why would player-made UI's make any difference? From what I understand, you're suffering from bugs in the game mechanics, not in the UI layout.
If I'm wrong don't pick on me too much... it's late. -.-
Before now I had thought that player made UI's would be a great bonus to the game, less hassle = more enjoyable. Unfortunately though if the underlying mechanics of the game that support the UI are buggy then not only would allowing player made UI's take up resources that should go towards fixing bugs, but it would also most probably open up ways for people to introduce hacks into the game by giving greater access to ways to take advantage of the bugs.
An example of allowing players to create UI's taking advantage of bugs is early on when soe allowed players to create their own ui's for everquest some players created ui's with many additional equipment slots allowing them to wear multiple breastplates and such. It was fixed quickly, but it was a hack that was only possible by allowing players to create ui's for a game that had mechanical design flaws Though honestly unsure if there have been any other UI hacks for eq since that incident. Theoretically though the hack could have been accomplished before the players were given access to the ui api, there had been some impressive reverse engineering of the eq interface prior to that. At this point giving an api for the interface would be like handing the keys of your car to a car thief, yea he could steal it without the keys, but with the keys its much much simpler.
For the most part I was just venting about bull we have to deal with in the game while also giving up hope on something I thought would lessen the bull we have to deal with in the game.
Not picking on ya, I know I can be hard to understand at times. I prefer to inform than pick on also.
I could have chosen a better title for this thread. |
Cheyenne Shadowborn
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.03.16 17:49:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Cheyenne Shadowborn on 16/03/2008 17:56:44
Originally by: Invay
The problems with the UI are so basic that it would need to be thrown away and completely redone from scratch by someone with at least a slight clue of user-friendly and somewhat logical UI design
There. Fixed that for you.
Why?
- overview moving half out of visible screen space (since last patch)
- windows constantly poping up on top of others in non-sensical ways
- contract search being a joke (so easy to confuse, shows all, not selected item all the time)
- chat boxes having 'miss allignments' for lack of a better word, unable to see all ppl in local at times and grey boxes in the chat area
- the LP store search ... bit improved with last patch (doesn't need closing and re-opening of LP store anymore, woot), nevertheless some sort of UI joke.
- eve mail 'focus handling' (getting confused easily, showing wrong mail for right sender or vice versa)
- overview tabs - maybe its me who's too stupid but what are they good for if they all show the same overview scheme and refuse to let me load another into just one tab?
- a few dozen other things I could list, the above is just the result of 30 seconds thinking from top of my head.
--
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Reem Fairchild
Shadow Forces Inc.
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Posted - 2008.03.16 18:07:00 -
[18]
Just because a few of the recent improvements to the UI have a few bugs with them for now, doesn't mean that there is anything fundamentally wrong with the UI itself.
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The macdaddy
Hedion University
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Posted - 2008.03.16 19:28:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Oregon sinful
no this is stupid :S
Ahahahaha, Best RICK Roll ever!!!. Me salutes you 07
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Saint Lazarus
DROW Org
Brotherhood of the Spider
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Posted - 2008.03.16 19:39:00 -
[20]
zOMG RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
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Invay
Sirrius Cybernetics
R0ADKILL
|
Posted - 2008.03.16 19:49:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Reem Fairchild
Just because a few of the recent improvements to the UI have a few bugs with them for now, doesn't mean that there is anything fundamentally wrong with the UI itself.
I would have to say that having only one barely customizable UI is fundamentally wrong.
Another thing that appears fundamentally wrong is that there is no way to save a format of the UI, so if anything messes up you have to completely reset the UI rather than go back to a format that worked.
Also as I stated above there are bugs that pop up that are confounding, like not being able to change the size of a chat box unless you log off then back on. Chat box size should be 100% client side, what is in the chat box would of course be server side with a client side .ini file to save locations. Then theres the bug where there is nothing in the overview, logically changing the overview settings should correct that as your sending a message to the server correcting what you want in your overview which should then repopulate it based on the new parameters. That doesn't work, so instead you have to log off then back on. If there are bugs between the UI communicating with the server, would that not be something which would qualify as fundamentally wrong in a client/server based game?
Oh while I'm on the subject, having a client side log file would be very handy. It helps alot in locating and confirming bugs. Especially since it seems that nothing ever shows up on the server side log file per CCP. |
Invay
Sirrius Cybernetics
R0ADKILL
|
Posted - 2008.03.16 19:51:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Saint Lazarus
zOMG RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
In a nutshell, yea. |
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