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Captator Blue. Blue Federation	Posted - 2008.03.31 15:05:00 - [31] Originally by: Terianna Eri Originally by: Captator Originally by: Cpt Cosmic Originally by: Captator myrm - 750-800ish dps depending on skills, same EHP as a 1600mm plate FMP harb, without rigs, suuure thats not very good damage :P (ignoring overload, which brings dps up to nearly 900) lie first max is ~725 with t2 ammo and max skills without implants and then with such a fitting it will be paper thin cause fitting biggest guns eats all your pg ^^ someone doesn't know enough about myrm fits ;), and that fit is without implants other than a 3% cpu implant and this is better than the brutix cos it has over double the EHP for 70ish dps less, and that is assuming you are insane enough to not use EW drones on a neutron brutx, and are using damage drones If I had to guess... [Myrmidon, test] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Internal Force Field Array I Beta Reactor Control: Diagnostic System I Beta Reactor Control: Diagnostic System I Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Invulnerability Field II Faint Warp Prohibitor I Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M [empty rig slot] [empty rig slot] [empty rig slot] Ogre II x2 Hammerhead II x2 Hobgoblin II x1 ???? ~780 dps, 53k EHP close but not quite ;) as to Cpt Cosmic: My setup has similar EHP to a hurricane plated gank setup/harbinger plated setup, so how is this an insignificant buffer? It has significantly more dps, and my setup doesn't suffer for certain lacks that the one above does. Also, I fly brutixes more than I fly myrms, mainly because they are cheaper to lose, but this has much more HP than any gang orientated brutix, however you fit it, so would survive longer as primary. Thirdly the second half of what you have said 'dont see anything useful in this setup, until your ogres arrive to target you are about to die cause being primary, get a brutix ~~' makes no sense whatsoever
Cpt Cosmic Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering	Posted - 2008.03.31 15:24:00 - [32] I makes more sense then you think, as it looks like you never fought @decent gang sized. 20vs20 you die in 5 seconds = you did no dmg, a harb/ham drake e.g. does not need to travel into very low range to deal some pain.
Raivi	Posted - 2008.03.31 15:44:00 - [33] Edited by: Raivi on 31/03/2008 15:43:59 Originally by: Qvaaa Edited by: Qvaaa on 31/03/2008 11:39:21 1.st: Get into 0m from the Harbinger, and it will harm no-one anymore (bed optimal/fallof relation). The other errors in your post notwithstanding, you obviously have no idea what falloff is. As for the best BCs, overall the Harby and the Hurricane are great boats, both able to dish out a lot of pain and sometimes tank decently as well. I fly a lot of hurricanes, usually either double plated with trimarks and double webs or (my personal favorite gang BC setup) with a buffer shieldtank and lots of gank. Fun ships. --------------------------------------------- Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. Red vs. Blue!
Arazel Chainfire	Posted - 2008.03.31 17:38:00 - [34] Originally by: Cpt Cosmic I makes more sense then you think, as it looks like you never fought @decent gang sized. 20vs20 you die in 5 seconds = you did no dmg, a harb/ham drake e.g. does not need to travel into very low range to deal some pain. It looks like a great setup to me. However, I don't fight 20v20 in lowsec - largest lowsec gang i've ever been in was 12, and that was only because we were trying to gank a station hugging capship. Most have been more along the lines of 5 man gangs. 0.0 is a totally different story though -Arazel Originally by: Tsanse Kinske Mutual Incomprehension is one of the Four Horsemen of most internet arguments, I guess, along with Unfettered Hostility, Overwhelming Vagueness, and Lack of Evidence.
Cpt Cosmic Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering	Posted - 2008.03.31 18:01:00 - [35] Edited by: Cpt Cosmic on 31/03/2008 18:01:30 it doenst matter where you fight (empire wars, lowsec, .0). I think when you reach a point of incoming dps the above setup is useless cause it has to come very close where it can be webbed and killed very fast, thats why I would take a either a brutix cause it is cheaper to loose or a drake/harb because they can hit outside webby ranges.
Rawr Cristina	Posted - 2008.03.31 18:40:00 - [36] Originally by: MalVortex HAM Drake This Would take a properly-fit HAMDrake over a Harbinger, Hurricane or Myrm any day tbh. ... Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Captator	Posted - 2008.03.31 18:54:00 - [37] as in the 600ish dps buffer HAM drake with an MWD and a point? :D that is truly godly @ Cpt Cosmic, the problem with range is equal to the problem the brutix has, so that is a non-issue the way you have presented it, and I fly amarr/gallente BCs fully t2 fit, so I can agree that in terms of getting the dps applied fastest, the harb wins hands down. If you are primary in a gang in a BC with a gang size of 20, you need more BS piloting friends, and having nearly 800 dps coming out of something that looks like a support ship is not to be sneezed at. LOL at you saying I haven't flown in large gangs, look at my corp history I have flown in 230man fleets, down to soloing, and a pretty good range of sizes in-between. I have never, ever had a problem getting in range of something to hurt in a gang fight in a blaster cruiser or bigger, and there is always null ammo
Cpt Cosmic	Posted - 2008.03.31 19:28:00 - [38] Originally by: Captator as in the 600ish dps buffer HAM drake with an MWD and a point? :D that is truly godly @ Cpt Cosmic, the problem with range is equal to the problem the brutix has, so that is a non-issue the way you have presented it, and I fly amarr/gallente BCs fully t2 fit, so I can agree that in terms of getting the dps applied fastest, the harb wins hands down. If you are primary in a gang in a BC with a gang size of 20, you need more BS piloting friends, and having nearly 800 dps coming out of something that looks like a support ship is not to be sneezed at. yeah but the brutix is cheaper if you loose it :) Originally by: Captator LOL at you saying I haven't flown in large gangs, look at my corp history I have flown in 230man fleets, down to soloing, and a pretty good range of sizes in-between. I have never, ever had a problem getting in range of something to hurt in a gang fight in a blaster cruiser or bigger, and there is always null ammo that was a joke ;)
Rawr Cristina Naqam	Posted - 2008.03.31 19:48:00 - [39] Originally by: Captator as in the 600ish dps buffer HAM drake with an MWD and a point? :D that is truly godly MWD, Point, Web, 600 DPS AND a 19k hp shield buffer w/ 70-75% average resists. drools ...
Captator Blue. Blue Federation	Posted - 2008.03.31 20:14:00 - [40] @ rawr, you read my mind @ Cpt, agreed it is cheaper to lose brutix :), do you fly a neutron fit or an ion fit in gang? Also I didn't pick up on the joke, so got mildly disgruntled without cause, for which I apologise.
Cpt Cosmic Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering	Posted - 2008.03.31 20:32:00 - [41] Originally by: Captator @ rawr, you read my mind @ Cpt, agreed it is cheaper to lose brutix :), do you fly a neutron fit or an ion fit in gang? Also I didn't pick up on the joke, so got mildly disgruntled without cause, for which I apologise. hmm well I dont fly brutix anymore now because I discovered the ham drake :) (used neutrons most of the time) and dont worry it was a bad joke
Eardianm	Posted - 2008.03.31 20:39:00 - [42] Originally by: Rawr Cristina Originally by: Captator as in the 600ish dps buffer HAM drake with an MWD and a point? :D that is truly godly MWD, Point, Web, 600 DPS AND a 19k hp shield buffer w/ 70-75% average resists. drools Yeah, this one. --------------
Captator	Posted - 2008.03.31 20:43:00 - [43] having got that all out of the way, who reckons the gankprophecy is the way to go?
Tallon	Posted - 2008.03.31 21:45:00 - [44] Originally by: Rawr Cristina Originally by: Captator as in the 600ish dps buffer HAM drake with an MWD and a point? :D that is truly godly MWD, Point, Web, 600 DPS AND a 19k hp shield buffer w/ 70-75% average resists. drools How is this possible. I have tried several fittings and dont come close.
Wardeneo	Posted - 2008.04.01 00:43:00 - [45] Edited by: Wardeneo on 01/04/2008 00:44:11 Originally by: Deschenus Maximus Solo: Myrm, followed by Cane Small gangs: Cane, followed by Myrm Large gangs: Binger, followed by Cane hmmm id say cane for solo --> more flexibily, myrm lacks dps since bandwidth and drone boats are c.r.a.p for pirating coz damn sentryes insta pop drones ^^ adn sentries swap targets so no smart coments on "pull agro first" :) wardeneo If brute force doesn't work..... your not using enough :)
Deschenus Maximus Digital Fury Corporation Digital Renegades	Posted - 2008.04.01 00:51:00 - [46] Originally by: Wardeneo hmmm id say cane for solo --> more flexibily, myrm lacks dps since bandwidth and drone boats are c.r.a.p for pirating coz damn sentryes insta pop drones ^^ adn sentries swap targets so no smart coments on "pull agro first" :) wardeneo Well, I did belt pirating with my Myrm, so sentries weren't an issue. I got to admit though that this was before the nos, damp and bandwith nerfs... maybe the Cane is indeed now better for soloing.
d3vo Airborne Assassins Order of the Black Cross	Posted - 2008.04.01 01:27:00 - [47] Originally by: Riho Edited by: Riho on 31/03/2008 11:52:36 as i can fly all the t1 BC whit t2 gear i say its in this order: Harbinger Hurricane Drake Brutix Myrmidon Prophecy Cyclone Ferox harbinger out DPSs any t1 BC easy :) and unlike the brutix you can acctually get a decent fit whit heavy pulse... brutix has a hard time fitting anything besides neutrons. neutrons on a brutix...wtf?
d3vo Airborne Assassins Order of the Black Cross	Posted - 2008.04.01 01:32:00 - [48] Originally by: Tallon Originally by: Rawr Cristina Originally by: Captator as in the 600ish dps buffer HAM drake with an MWD and a point? :D that is truly godly MWD, Point, Web, 600 DPS AND a 19k hp shield buffer w/ 70-75% average resists. drools How is this possible. I have tried several fittings and dont come close. they are day dreaming
d3vo Airborne Assassins Order of the Black Cross	Posted - 2008.04.01 01:35:00 - [49] harb brutix cane drake myrm prophecy ferox cyclone
Wardeneo BLL Wise Guys Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2008.04.01 01:51:00 - [50] Originally by: d3vo harb brutix cane drake myrm prophecy ferox cyclone shud go cane --> good flexibility harb --> good dmge adn tank combo drake --> good for gatecamps adn bait brutix --> 750dps - nuff said :p cyclone --> Majorly underestimated, this ship has a lot of potential for a t1 BC --> again good flexibilty prophesy --> good tank but id rather a harb anyday tbh ferox --> totally usless (unless u want 2 snipe from 100+km (not my style) ps. blaster ferox sucks - be a man / women (dont want 2 be sexist ) and geta brutix :) wardeneo If brute force doesn't work..... your not using enough :)
d3vo	Posted - 2008.04.01 02:08:00 - [51] Originally by: Wardeneo shud go cane --> good flexibility harb --> good dmge adn tank combo drake --> good for gatecamps adn bait brutix --> 750dps - nuff said :p cyclone --> Majorly underestimated, this ship has a lot of potential for a t1 BC --> again good flexibilty prophesy --> good tank but id rather a harb anyday tbh ferox --> totally usless (unless u want 2 snipe from 100+km (not my style) ps. blaster ferox sucks - be a man / women (dont want 2 be sexist ) and geta brutix :) wardeneo the cane is like a paper plane...yep flexible in flying even though the brutix is tier1...the bonuses just makes it almost perfect. a rep bonus and a dmg bonus
Rawr Cristina	Posted - 2008.04.01 02:49:00 - [52] Originally by: Tallon Originally by: Rawr Cristina Originally by: Captator as in the 600ish dps buffer HAM drake with an MWD and a point? :D that is truly godly MWD, Point, Web, 600 DPS AND a 19k hp shield buffer w/ 70-75% average resists. drools How is this possible. I have tried several fittings and dont come close. the 600 DPS is with perfect skills, mind you, the shield hp I'll admit was an exaguration though unless you used T2 rigs (lol?) - 17.5K hp being the actual amount. Rage Drake: HAM II x7, <utility> MWD, Web, Disruptor, 2x Invul II, Extender II 2x BCU II, 2x PDS II 3x shield extender rigs (with AWU 5 you can swap out one of the PDS for a DCU, even) ... Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Yoko Lee	Posted - 2008.04.01 02:56:00 - [53] Originally by: Rawr Cristina Originally by: Tallon Originally by: Rawr Cristina Originally by: Captator as in the 600ish dps buffer HAM drake with an MWD and a point? :D that is truly godly MWD, Point, Web, 600 DPS AND a 19k hp shield buffer w/ 70-75% average resists. drools How is this possible. I have tried several fittings and dont come close. the 600 DPS is with perfect skills, mind you, the shield hp I'll admit was an exaguration though unless you used T2 rigs (lol?) - 17.5K hp being the actual amount. Rage Drake: HAM II x7, <utility> MWD, Web, Disruptor, 2x Invul II, Extender II 2x BCU II, 2x PDS II 3x shield extender rigs (with AWU 5 you can swap out one of the PDS for a DCU, even) I have the same fit just 2x bcs II + 1x DC II + 1x pds II (no hardwiring pg) and i have awu 4.
d3vo	Posted - 2008.04.01 02:56:00 - [54] Originally by: Rawr Cristina Originally by: Tallon Originally by: Rawr Cristina Originally by: Captator as in the 600ish dps buffer HAM drake with an MWD and a point? :D that is truly godly MWD, Point, Web, 600 DPS AND a 19k hp shield buffer w/ 70-75% average resists. drools How is this possible. I have tried several fittings and dont come close. the 600 DPS is with perfect skills, mind you, the shield hp I'll admit was an exaguration though unless you used T2 rigs (lol?) - 17.5K hp being the actual amount. Rage Drake: HAM II x7, <utility> MWD, Web, Disruptor, 2x Invul II, Extender II 2x BCU II, 2x PDS II 3x shield extender rigs (with AWU 5 you can swap out one of the PDS for a DCU, even) using eft... 321 dps 1151 volley where is 600? besides, using rage, then you will be cap less in a passive tanked ship lol
Yoko Lee	Posted - 2008.04.01 02:59:00 - [55] no passiv tank with spr then no capa problem
d3vo Airborne Assassins Order of the Black Cross	Posted - 2008.04.01 03:06:00 - [56] Originally by: Yoko Lee no passiv tank with spr then no capa problem
Rawr Cristina Naqam	Posted - 2008.04.01 04:08:00 - [57] Originally by: d3vo using eft... 321 dps 1151 volley where is 600? besides, using rage, then you will be cap less in a passive tanked ship lol + 5 T2 Drones + Terror Rage (cap isn't a huge issue tbh unless you get neuted) ...
d3vo Airborne Assassins Order of the Black Cross	Posted - 2008.04.01 04:22:00 - [58] Originally by: Rawr Cristina Originally by: d3vo using eft... 321 dps 1151 volley where is 600? besides, using rage, then you will be cap less in a passive tanked ship lol + 5 T2 Drones + Terror Rage (cap isn't a huge issue tbh unless you get neuted) 5 t2 hobs only put out less than 100 dps
MalVortex Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.04.01 05:00:00 - [59] For those who can't figure it out [Drake, HAMs Theoretical] Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Damage Control II Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Fleeting Warp Scrambler I Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Large Shield Extender II Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile [empty high slot] Core Defence Field Extender I Core Defence Field Extender I Core Defence Field Extender I Hobgoblin II x5 Implant: PG4 (3% grid). AWU IV is all thats needed. 589DPS out to 20.3km (610DPS w/ Rage out to 16.9km), 1082m/s, Runs everything for 3 minutes (perma w/o MWD running), 153DPS omni-tank, 85,405 EHP CPU becomes an issue with the TII LSE (hence the fleeting dis). Either get a CPU implant or drop the LSE down to Regolith if you want a TII Disruptor.
Cpt Cosmic	Posted - 2008.04.01 07:20:00 - [60] Edited by: Cpt Cosmic on 01/04/2008 07:21:15 actually the dps is 620dps with max skills and CN Missiles ;)

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