Originally by: Barbelo Valentinian

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There have been some fascinating discussions on the topic of griefing recently. I would like to just wrap up one thing that's become obvious to me in the course of these discussions.

There are two general classes of arguments flying across the battlements here both of which I think miss the point. On the one hand you have people who do think PvP per se is griefing. They're wrong. But on the other hand, you have people who accept that definition, but argue, "PvP is part of EVE, therefore griefing is part of EVE". They're wrong too.

PvP is part of EVE, but PvP is not in and of itself griefing, no matter how "brutal" that PvP may be, how hard the loss is to bear; but at the same time, griefing is not, and should not, be part of EVE. Or, if it is now, that's probably an unintended consequence of the game mechanic (or, maybe, it was slyly intended at one point by the devs, perhaps in an effort to look cool, perhaps in an effort to be clever and corner a neglected market niche of griefer subscribers). Griefing is a different thing from PvP per se - it's defined by it's aim and intent, not the mechanism by which it's delivered (in the case of EVE, "harsh" game mechanics); the aim and intent being simply to entertain oneself at someone else's expense, and for no in-game purpose.

Griefing being so defined, it's important not to exaggerate the problem, and to bear in mind that it's not necesarily a real-world morally wrong action (it is after all usually just a bit of fun - although it can shade into a morally wrong real-world action, in which case it becomes petitionable harrassment). The only actual problem with common or garden griefing, and the reason why most developers try to minimise it, is because it tends to kill newbies' immersion - i.e. because it's directed at them personally (or perhaps generically as a newbie) it pulls them out of the game a bit, so to speak, makes them self conscious rather than immersed in the game, and therefore makes them less likely to keep subscribing; also it's annoying for devs because it nullifies and (metaphorically speaking) spits on all the work they put in to making the game world immersive.

This means it's a problem for the game - but only IF the game is a roleplaying game in which immersion plays an important part, IF the intention of the developers is to gradually increase subscriber figures, and IF they're proud of the immmersiveness of the game world they created.

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