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Amanda Eidolo
Drama Factory
Paisti Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.04.11 10:44:00 -
[1]
As for the recent "boost patch" which was delivered to boost Amarr mostly, it clearly didn't work much as I still find Harbinger inferior to Hurricane in 1on1 fight in PvP. Boost Amarr!
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Dheorl
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.04.11 10:57:00 -
[2]
Please tell me this is a troll thread.
If the harb could beat the hurricane by your logic the hurricane would need boosting. This would just eventually result in having 2 great ships that would never be able to kill one another and wheres the fun in that.
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Gneeznow
Minmatar
R.U.S.T.
Phalanx Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.11 10:57:00 -
[3]
Obvious troll is obvious
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Riho
Gallente
Mercenary Forces
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Posted - 2008.04.11 11:03:00 -
[4]
haha.. nice troll :P
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Yes... this is my main.
Extreme Troll Slayer...
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Cpt Branko
Surge.
Night's Dawn
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Posted - 2008.04.11 11:14:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Cpt Branko on 11/04/2008 11:14:14
 Originally by: Dheorl
Please tell me this is a troll thread.
If the harb could beat the hurricane by your logic the hurricane would need boosting. This would just eventually result in having 2 great ships that would never be able to kill one another and wheres the fun in that.
OP is a troll post. But I'll dignify it with a response.
It would be balanced if the Harbringer could kill the Hurricane in 1v1s.... oh, wait 
The Harbringer already outdoes it in gangs thanks to firing in optimal all the time, so no need to move around a lot to maximise damage and no need to sit at 3km off a BS to deal full damage, you can do it out of webrange.
The small advantage a Hurricane might or might not have in a direct 1v1 is definitely offset by the undeniably superior performance of the Harbringer in gangs.
Also, the Harbringer does better vs Caldari ships then the Hurricane does... Minmatar get native armour resists to EM which give them the edge in a direct fight.
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NoNah
Tenth Legion Holdings
Tenth Legion
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Posted - 2008.04.11 11:16:00 -
[6]
Somehow, i'd like to think the drake is the strongest, followed by the harbinger.
Hurricane and myrmid are wildcards that can perform extremely well, or increadibly bad, depending on how well they could predict the situation. Either would easily pop a harbinger if they knew they were going up against it.
Postcount: 839437
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Diomidis
Amarr
Mythos Corp
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.11 11:30:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Diomidis on 11/04/2008 11:31:08
Originally by: NoNah
Somehow, i'd like to think the drake is the strongest, followed by the harbinger.
Hurricane and myrmid are wildcards that can perform extremely well, or increadibly bad, depending on how well they could predict the situation. Either would easily pop a harbinger if they knew they were going up against it.
Which brings it down to fitting and tactics. All Tier 2 BCs seam be quite balanced according to these response, sth I also quote.
Tier 1 BCs need some loving tho - still not just the Prophecy. The only "competent" Tier 1 BC is the Brutix IMHO.
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Riho
Gallente
Mercenary Forces
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Posted - 2008.04.11 11:31:00 -
[8]
as i can fly all t1 bc whit t2 skills i rate them like this:
harbinger
hurricane
brutix
drake
myrmidon
prophecy
ferox
cyclone
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NoNah
Tenth Legion Holdings
Tenth Legion
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Posted - 2008.04.11 11:41:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Riho
as i can fly all t1 bc whit t2 skills i rate them like this:
harbinger
hurricane
brutix
drake
myrmidon
prophecy
ferox
cyclone
Having also flown them all with full fitting and decent support, I'd personally rank them in the following order instead, but as posted above the hurricane and myrmid can do better than all the others if they know what to expect.
Drake
Harbinger
Hurricane
Myrmid
Brutix
Ferox
Cyclone
Prophecy
That said, the bottom two can need a boost, the ferox a rebalancing. But as always, they excel in different aspects and areas of the game.
Postcount: 720144
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Jin Entres
Malevolent Intervention
Reavers.
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Posted - 2008.04.11 11:46:00 -
[10]
Drama!
Ignoring the irony, I wanted to actually look into how cane and harbingeker (note the correct spelling) fare in comparison.
Firstly, same lows and mediums. 'Cane has 2 spare hislots, harbi has one. PG after guns is about the same, cane has more cpu to fit its hislots. This is with 220mm II's and focused med pulse II's.
Now, looking at damage, with two damage mods the cane does 417 dps with barrage at 2.7+15 range and 479 at 1.4+10 with RF EMP while harbi does 368 with scorch at 20+3.8 and 462 at 6.8+3.8 with AN Multifreq. Harbi can fit 5 medium drones as opposed to the cane's 3 which is most likely utilised as ecm drones.
At 10km+ the harbi would have advantage, aswell as 5km+ so the cane really needs to go in for a hug to claim its dps. Cane does have 30% more tracking, though, so maintaining transversal would be to its advantage. Given the big sigs on battlecruisers, it wouldn't make much of a difference in their 1v1 though, but is obviously an advantage in general comparison.
Base EHP is about the same (harbi has 1k more), cane goes about 10% faster. Harbi has a little more cap recharge but its guns consume 8.9 per sec which makes it less viable to fit a dual rep tank on it. Without tanking bonuses both ships get a crappy active tank though, and with plate+single repper w/ injector the harbi's cap disadvantage is negligible. It's of course a vulnerability to neuts, though.
Meh, they're pretty equal. Harbi has a considerable advantage at 10-25km with scorch though since its damage is not reduced by falloff. And em damage is not sucky anymore (besides, you run into drakes more often than you run into other races' ships combined).
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CEO
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Diomidis
Amarr
Mythos Corp
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.11 12:02:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Jin Entres
...Now, looking at damage, with two damage mods the cane does 417 dps with barrage at 2.7+15 range and 479 at 1.4+10 with RF EMP while harbi does 368 with scorch at 20+3.8 and 462 at 6.8+3.8 with AN Multifreq. Harbi can fit 5 medium drones as opposed to the cane's 3 which is most likely utilised as ecm drones...blah...blah
U forget to mention that the "cane" can actually fit 2x HAMs or HML in its 2 empty highs, while the Harbinger uses up all its hardpoints for these 7 turrets, and still not come up as a clear dps winner. 5 mediums make up for it, but the missile + drone dps addition for the Cane is not negligible.
Also, using faction EMP the Cane can actually hurt "more" in more occasions, as there is no other weapon platform shooting both EM and Expl dmg types - tho some ppl seam to "forget" these and make silly threads on why should someone use EMP ammo etc...
The EM resistance reduction hurt Minmatar less than other races (due to inherit resistances against their sworn enemy's racial = amarr = EM), and also booster their high dmg ammo witch now hurts armor tanks much more. |
Jin Entres
Malevolent Intervention
Reavers.
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Posted - 2008.04.11 12:13:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Diomidis
Originally by: Jin Entres
...Now, looking at damage, with two damage mods the cane does 417 dps with barrage at 2.7+15 range and 479 at 1.4+10 with RF EMP while harbi does 368 with scorch at 20+3.8 and 462 at 6.8+3.8 with AN Multifreq. Harbi can fit 5 medium drones as opposed to the cane's 3 which is most likely utilised as ecm drones...blah...blah
U forget to mention that the "cane" can actually fit 2x HAMs or HML in its 2 empty highs, while the Harbinger uses up all its hardpoints for these 7 turrets, and still not come up as a clear dps winner. 5 mediums make up for it, but the missile + drone dps addition for the Cane is not negligible.
Also, using faction EMP the Cane can actually hurt "more" in more occasions, as there is no other weapon platform shooting both EM and Expl dmg types - tho some ppl seam to "forget" these and make silly threads on why should someone use EMP ammo etc...
The EM resistance reduction hurt Minmatar less than other races (due to inherit resistances against their sworn enemy's racial = amarr = EM), and also booster their high dmg ammo witch now hurts armor tanks much more.
Whether it can fit two launchers depends on the whole fitting, though, but assuming it can, max skilled HML II's with navy missiles deal 57 DPS while two hammerhead II's do 63, so that advantage is negated by the bigger drone bay. And harbi also has one utility high which it can fit a nos/neut/cloak in fitting permitting.
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CEO
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no013
Minmatar
Stormwolf Holdings LLC
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Posted - 2008.04.11 19:20:00 -
[13]
I don't know about you but I almost fly hurricane exclusively and every time i encounter a harbinger i always run for my life. I can't break the harbinger's tank and emp always does 50% and pp always does more damage even after the armor nerfs.
Artillery cannons = Worst Dps, tracking, range and ammo cap. No cap... Why do we need cap for anything els if your sniping. |
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