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Belzavior
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Posted - 2004.04.20 17:15:00 -
[1]
Alot of players might have a harsh reaction to this, but hear me out.
When characters reach 1 month in age, they should be kicked out of the corp and given a free lancer status. For example John Doe just got booted after 1 month from a npc corp, his corp now reads John Doe Freelancer. As a freelancer you can't invite others into your corp, nor to you experiance the benefits of being in a corp (ie being able to buy offices, multiple hangers....) But can be declared war on if they step on the wrong person's toes.
The reason of course for this is that players won't be able to hide behind the protection of NPC corps. For example, there is a large manufacturer in my area, rather than continuosly price war the individual I would rather declare war to settle our differences. But I can't because they are in noob corp.
Same could be said for other proffessions.
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Harisdrop
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Posted - 2004.04.20 17:28:00 -
[2]
This is easy. No more noob corps. You get a degree from your noob school corp on day one and now are uncorped. There will be no way to join a noob corp.
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Garsh ma it soo cool killing people in there space thingies |
Aynen
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Posted - 2004.04.20 19:44:00 -
[3]
why not just let them be?
I mean whatever have they done to you?
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Burga Galti
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Posted - 2004.04.20 20:35:00 -
[4]
I must disagree with this view stongly.
Many people choose to stay with their noob corp in order to help the new players to EVE. In my case it was over 2 months plus before I ventured out to join a corp. In this time me and my fellows who stayed there helped to train many new players who have since gone on to become solid members of their corporations. Without our initial guidance though, many may have simply left due to the complexity of things. The amount of time I answered the question "The agent told me I'd have tritanium waiting for me at the station, where is it?" I couldn't say.
The noob corps also provide a great sense of community, which would not be available if people were forced to leave. How many of you got addicted to eve because of the sense of a universe? And how much of this was created by your noob corpmates? I was very sorry to leave my corp (University of Caille), but I left because I decided I want to adventure and explore more of the game. But it was my choice to leave. If you take away this choice you are depriving people of their rights.
Also, if players were staying with a corp for the security then it is not only the noob corps that should be disbanded but all NPC corps. But on the issue of survivability, if you forced a player to leave then they would in effect be a one person corp. Poor John Doe mayb be forced to join a larger corp just to avoid the war declerations from the other large trading corps whom he is outbidding. If John Doe just wanted to freelance then you are in fact depriving him of the way he wanted to play the game. This would be akin to forcing all the empire miners to become 0.0 pirates or vice-versa. Not a very popular decision I'm sure.
I'm sorry your being driven out of the market by a 'noob' but putting a time limit on membership of noob corps is not the answer. Better marketing skills are.
Tales from the EVE Cluster |
Atansa
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Posted - 2004.04.20 21:19:00 -
[5]
I would ike the noobs to be kicked out of the noob corp for then more of them would be willing to tansfer to other corperations.
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foster
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Posted - 2004.04.20 21:20:00 -
[6]
1 upside to this is it would reduce the amount of ore thiefs that hid in nOOb corps.
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Haratu
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Posted - 2004.04.21 00:39:00 -
[7]
Every corp was once a noob corp... if someone wants to start a noob corp then let them.
Consider it a cornerstore starting up when there are shopping malls down the road. It is a tough job, but it can be done.
I roleplay... there is this computer game called "Earth - The First Genesis" where i play a character in the early 21st century. |
meowcat
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Posted - 2004.04.21 10:28:00 -
[8]
excellent idea.
i dont want to be in any corp atm
a freelancer status is needed
~~~~)\~~~~~\o/~~~~
yeah but no but yeah but no but |
Belzavior
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Posted - 2004.04.21 22:20:00 -
[9]
 Originally by: Burga Galti
I must disagree with this view stongly.
Many people choose to stay with their noob corp in order to help the new players to EVE. In my case it was over 2 months plus before I ventured out to join a corp. In this time me and my fellows who stayed there helped to train many new players who have since gone on to become solid members of their corporations. Without our initial guidance though, many may have simply left due to the complexity of things. The amount of time I answered the question "The agent told me I'd have tritanium waiting for me at the station, where is it?" I couldn't say.
The noob corps also provide a great sense of community, which would not be available if people were forced to leave. How many of you got addicted to eve because of the sense of a universe? And how much of this was created by your noob corpmates? I was very sorry to leave my corp (University of Caille), but I left because I decided I want to adventure and explore more of the game. But it was my choice to leave. If you take away this choice you are depriving people of their rights.
Also, if players were staying with a corp for the security then it is not only the noob corps that should be disbanded but all NPC corps. But on the issue of survivability, if you forced a player to leave then they would in effect be a one person corp. Poor John Doe mayb be forced to join a larger corp just to avoid the war declerations from the other large trading corps whom he is outbidding. If John Doe just wanted to freelance then you are in fact depriving him of the way he wanted to play the game. This would be akin to forcing all the empire miners to become 0.0 pirates or vice-versa. Not a very popular decision I'm sure.
I'm sorry your being driven out of the market by a 'noob' but putting a time limit on membership of noob corps is not the answer. Better marketing skills are.
People can create noob PC corps, in order to help and instruct newcomers to the game, what I'm proposing is limiting the time people can stay in NPC corps. Alot of people hide in NPC corps and its impossible to go after those people.
Take the Miner IIs when they got released for example. The people whom got the bps, created alts to manufacture them while remaining in noob corps. This protects those individuals from people whom may wish to go against them as you CAN NOT declare war on NPC corps, as such anyone whom takes action against said players whom are almost always in empire space get a swift trip to the pod.
NPC corps also harbor alot of griefers and CM wielding kestrel alts whom kill in 1.0 space. If they were forced to join either a PC corp or go freelancer then they could be declared war on. So that players could police themselves.
I understand the community aspect of a noob corp but there is channels that you can goto and still form that sense of community. The chatting IS the only sense of community that you get from a noob corp btw.
When I said noob corps I meant ALL NPC corps btw.
As for the marketing thing I was only giving one example, but there is competition in all proffessions by people whom are in NPC corps, that are protected by their NPC corp status.
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2004.04.22 06:51:00 -
[10]
A better solution would be to only let NPC corporation people rent labs and factorys in low secure systems.
Convert Stations
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Russo
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Posted - 2004.04.22 06:55:00 -
[11]
Erase the newb corps, throw them all into help channels instead.
Russo - CEO Amarria Auxilia
Your friendly neighborhood badass
'Peace is our profession. Mass murder is just a hobby.' |
Belzavior
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Posted - 2004.04.22 18:10:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Danton Marcellus
A better solution would be to only let NPC corporation people rent labs and factorys in low secure systems.
There's still the problem of not being able to declare war. People would still get a sec hit if they wanted to attack in anything higher than 0.0
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2004.04.22 19:09:00 -
[13]
That's where hiring pirates and mercs come in.
Convert Stations
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Miriel Arkonis
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Posted - 2004.04.22 20:08:00 -
[14]
Sounds like a great idea. Grief all the newbs into quiting. Pretty soon, no more EVE. Excellent!
[/sarcasm]
Lukily the existance of security status, Concord and sentry guns shows that CCP knows this and your suggestion will never be implmented.
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Inquisitus
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Posted - 2004.04.22 20:51:00 -
[15]
I agree that something has to be done about people hiding in noob corps, but forcing players out is not the way. Maybe you could let them stay in the corp but give them a freelancer status within that corp, which would let you declare war on them... just a thought 
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Belzavior
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Posted - 2004.04.22 23:49:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Miriel Arkonis
Sounds like a great idea. Grief all the newbs into quiting. Pretty soon, no more EVE. Excellent!
[/sarcasm]
Lukily the existance of security status, Concord and sentry guns shows that CCP knows this and your suggestion will never be implmented.
You're joking right? How is this griefing people? A full month you could be in one of these NPC corps while you learn the ropes and are "protected" by NPC corp status. MOST GAMES DON'T EVEN HAVE SUCH A THING.
And why do you bring in Concord, Sentry Guns into the discussion? This is nothing to do with to with going around killing noobs left and right. I'm definately not asking for that. Did you ever see me say anything about griefing noobs until they quit? Seeing how most corps are limited to several wars apiece I don't see how anyone could greif all these noobs after they get out of their NPC corp.
This is about being able to claim territory and declair war on those whom cause you grief. Thier is no consequences to your actions when you are in a NPC corp. Their is no accountability. You can place absurd market orders, scam on escrow, ore steal, kill noobs at yulai with your kestrel, etc etc WITHOUT A SINGLE THING THAT OTHERS CAN DO ABOUT IT! All because people can hide in NPC corps.
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Keriann
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Posted - 2004.04.23 01:30:00 -
[17]
hmm sincerely seeing how a group of mercs completely annihilated a poor corporation that some newbies put on, and how those mercs refused the newbies surrender ending up killing all their ships and reducing them to really bad position... I am going to remain in my noob corp forever ^^ I am NOT for pvp and I definitely do not like to step on anyone toes either... I like the tutelage of the SATI and I've got many friends in it, I doubt I will ever leave to start some pretty war or get harassed by people who plays by 6 months with their super skills and so ^^; I stay safely in my little 0.5 or above sectors and mine happyly that's fun for me, the day I will be ready for the harsh world of eve (in 8-10 months when I will have enough resources skills and friends to take out any strong pvpers group around) I will leave my newbie corp and live a peaceful life making a 'kitty entperises' corporation or something like that whithout worrying being slaughtered by some unlawful corporation just because somebody had a bad day in real life work.
and if you wonder why my peacefulness and so.... well guys, I play quake 3 when I wanna kill someone, 98% skill 1% equipment 1% luck game, not some 50% time 45% equipment 5% strategy game.
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Burga Galti
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Posted - 2004.04.23 02:39:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Belzavior
People can create noob PC corps, in order to help and instruct newcomers to the game, what I'm proposing is limiting the time people can stay in NPC corps. Alot of people hide in NPC corps and its impossible to go after those people.
Take the Miner IIs when they got released for example. The people whom got the bps, created alts to manufacture them while remaining in noob corps. This protects those individuals from people whom may wish to go against them as you CAN NOT declare war on NPC corps, as such anyone whom takes action against said players whom are almost always in empire space get a swift trip to the pod.
NPC corps also harbor alot of griefers and CM wielding kestrel alts whom kill in 1.0 space. If they were forced to join either a PC corp or go freelancer then they could be declared war on. So that players could police themselves.
I understand the community aspect of a noob corp but there is channels that you can goto and still form that sense of community. The chatting IS the only sense of community that you get from a noob corp btw.
When I said noob corps I meant ALL NPC corps btw.
As for the marketing thing I was only giving one example, but there is competition in all proffessions by people whom are in NPC corps, that are protected by their NPC corp status.
I'm afraid I can't comment on the Miner II's as I had just joined when they came out and hadn't got a real grasp of the game.
I can see the problems and I understand your reasoning, i just think it's flawed logic. Unfortunaly a lot of scamming and alt abuse would still occur unless you severly restricted the number of days you could stay in a noob corp. You'd be effectively strading the new players in an alien world as you kill off these scammers. Hopefully with the upcoming criminal flagging system the suicide kestrel tactic and ore theifing (which I've never had much of a problem with anyway) will be limited.
Chatting isn't the ONLY sense of community you get in a noob corp. For instance in Caille we would round up new players and take them on mining sessions. Some people sold ships at marked down prices to help the noobs through the ranks. Although it could be argued that chatting is the only sense of community in the game, not just the noob corps. It all depends on what you want in a community I suppose.
And so we come to the issue of waring. I can understand that you may be annoyed that you can't declare war on a player in a noob corp. Many of these who do stay in the noob corps simply don't want to join a player run corp, many of which are badly organised. And bad organisation is,in my opinion, worse than no organisation.
Imagine the scenario of one these freelancers forced out of the noob corp, minding their own buisness when a 10 strong corp decides that they don't like him/her. This freelancer is then fighting a 10-1 war. No freelancer is going to be able to win that.
In short, I understand that there are problems but I simply think there must be better ways to deal with it than this rather extreme solution. I may be proved wrong but I hope not. It would be a sad day for EVE if this was implemented.
PS Yes, I do appreciate the irony of my signature in relevance to this topic. 
Tales from the EVE Cluster |
Cracken
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Posted - 2004.04.23 03:19:00 -
[19]
LOl it doesn't matter if you attack someone whos friendly with a nOOb corp your still gonna lose status with that corp its the way the chips fall laddie
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Charla
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Posted - 2004.05.06 20:37:00 -
[20]
Many less then honourable denizens hide out in the Noob corps - such as ore thieves. Placing a time limit on your stay in a noob corp would help to adress some inconsistencies in the game where characters engagedin in activities that would normaly be construed as law breaking actually get protection from the authorities adn corp benefits.
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D3vastator
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Posted - 2004.05.06 21:07:00 -
[21]
There is absolutely no good reason for new players to be in a NPC Corp. There are many good reasons for them not to be. All of the help that they need can be acquired in the recently created New Player Help Channel.
-This has been another (PLEASE VOTE: Good Idea, Pointless Brainstorm or Brainfart) from D3.
"Why put off 'til tomorrow what you can put off 'til next week?" |
Dupree
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Posted - 2004.05.07 01:05:00 -
[22]
Quote:
But can be declared war on if they step on the wrong person's toes.
you do know that would mean they will be at war with all the sissy rats out there who want to display their manhood by blowing up ibis's.
The things we do in life echo in eternity. "Maximus Decimus Murideus" |
Seska Fuzen
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Posted - 2004.05.09 15:50:00 -
[23]
I think the only reason for the noob corp is for the easy grouping people inot corp channel. If someone start off without a corp where do they go for help? help channel would be flooded by every noobie from all 4 empires 12 universities?
Why would you want to declaire war on 1 lone person anyway? so you can kill him as much as you want without penalties?
If its a price war so be it thats economy you don't see microsoft declairing war and sending kill squads to kill their competitors.
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Garric Vor'g
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Posted - 2004.05.09 16:31:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Dupree
Quote:
But can be declared war on if they step on the wrong person's toes.
you do know that would mean they will be at war with all the sissy rats out there who want to display their manhood by blowing up ibis's.
I think a better idea would be to allow you to buy a "hunting liscence", for a certain amount of money for a certain person, depending on the persons security status and their status with the empire they are in, you can hunt them for a limited amount of time with no penalties at all.
General of Escape Pod Testing |
DeFood
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Posted - 2004.05.09 17:07:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Garric Vor'g
I think a better idea would be to allow you to buy a "hunting liscence", for a certain amount of money for a certain person, depending on the persons security status and their status with the empire they are in, you can hunt them for a limited amount of time with no penalties at all.
Horrible abuse potential. Some rich player/corp would then funnel money to an alt that could buy their way to constant "legal" griefing. The money source cant be tracked down.
I do think its a (potential) problem than players in NPC corps can compete with PC corps - perhaps though the solution should be economic - NPC corps might institute a set of policies and taxes that would give players in NPC corps a distinct economic disadvantage when compared to PC corp players. Think of a tax on all market transactions by NPC corp players. Nothing too serious - 10% perhaps.
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Pehma Hess
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Posted - 2004.05.09 17:25:00 -
[26]
Hmm, a way for corporations and alliances to declare war on one person! I vote NO! Freelancers need to be afforded some protection as well. Granted there are those that abuse the system, but that's going to happen no matter what system you have in place. How many major corps are willing to say they don't have a mole in their ranks? Yep, there are ore thieves out there, but there are also secure containers. Yes, Concord comes to the defense of the freelancer, but also comes to yours as well in empire space.
The freelancer lifestyle is already EXTREMELY limited, why must you try to muck it up further? Can't mine rare ore, the NPC rats see to that now. Can't own our stations, corps take them over all the time. Can't compete for new technology, the buying power and resources available to the large corps are unbeatable. As the game is now, you MUST be part of a larger corp unless you're content with doing missions or mining Veldspar. Perhaps if you open the game up more for the freelancer, you wouldn't have so many ore thieves?
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deadlyblade
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Posted - 2004.05.09 19:21:00 -
[27]
hard topic man i like the fact that ore thives wouldn't have a corp to hide behide and that loud month newbs wouldn't have 100 corp mates with them if they ever get in trouble
lol can't think of a reson to defend them newb corps lol here i was trying to defend them lol ... hmm thats a hmm dinger lol can't think of any reson to keep them. perhaps they can get training their and learn stuff before they join a corp like mine and bug us to teach them lol but learning the game takes what like 2 weeks max lol so after that if they haven't figured out the game they to dumb to stay >:)
Quote:
If life gives u lemonds... use them to blind your enemy and mate with his wife >:)
Want power want cool people want a big organized corp. join ( EVE GLOBAL ALLIANCE ) NOW ACCESS TO 0.0 SPACE 96+ members ( FADE alliance >:D) |
Paw Sandberg
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Posted - 2004.05.10 05:13:00 -
[28]
there is a alternative to Noob Corps when the tutorial missions end you get the choice between some corps (many player owned corps are alway seeking members)
these Corp's need to be run by either (prefereble) Players that have been playing for a while or Polaris (or a Polaris type corp)
that way if a Noob (or a ore thief or a Griefer) harresses someone you could tell the CEO however these corps need to be corps that we CANNOT declare war upon so that these Noob corps will not be griefed against
whats the point you ask if a member causes grief in any way gather the evidence and eve mail the CEO and the CEO can then expell that member of the corp the expelled members need's to be free for all to attack imho also members that regular corps expell (or that leave their corps) need to be place in the free for all catagory (corp called it freelancer (sticker free)) now the peoble that dont cause grief have a "real" noob corp they can stay in forever if they want and the grieffers badmouths and ore thieves gets to be free for all
also we need a Alias butten that shows the Alt's names and creation dates
Thank You
Paw Sandberg
for all your BPC needs see
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=55706&page=1
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DeFood
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Posted - 2004.05.10 07:42:00 -
[29]
"newbie" corps could rent an office at the newbie stations. Newbies then, instead of being placed straight into a default NPC corp could be offered a list of all the corps registered in the station.
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