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Buriko Kamakura
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Posted - 2008.05.09 05:19:00 -
[1]
The preponderance of ridiculous wardec tactics, both on the part of privateers as well as carebears, is due entirely to the fact that wardecs are too cheap. A lot of interesting ideas to help "fix" (Or nerf, depending on your POV) wardecs have been proposed, but the bottom line is in the inflated economy, current costs are chumpchange. If you're not willing to increase the flat cost, because you're trying to preserve wars between new corps (laughable idea really), then implement a system were corps "auction" with CONCORD to determine the wardec cost (this idea has already been suggested).
As has been suggested before, I'm seconding 1 billion. The current state of wardecs is ridiculous and needs to be fixed.
-braces for flames-
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Dianeces
Minmatar
The Illuminati.
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Posted - 2008.05.09 05:39:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: Buriko Kamakura
The current state of wardecs is ridiculous and needs to be fixed.
Says who? CCP has made absolutely no indication they are unhappy with the current system.
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Karanth
Gallente
Eve's Brothers of Destiny
FOUNDATI0N
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Posted - 2008.05.09 06:50:00 -
[3]
If CCP changed the system to make it so that it was based on members in a corp/alliance, and that the larger the difference between the two sides in numbers, the more expensive it was, it might stop a number of the more stupid war decs.
f.ex.:
Corp A decs Corp B, with A having 10 people and B having 11. Cost is 10mil (random number.)
Corp A then decs Alliance C, which has 1400 people. Cost will be 600mil (again, random.)
I'd remove the penalty for deccing multiple corps with this system in place, though.
Originally by: Marcus TheMartin
Originally by: CCP Morpheus
+1
reported for spam
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Silvana Kor'ah
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.05.09 07:25:00 -
[4]
yeah, the only nasty thing about wardecs are the really small corps with less than 5 members. Hunting them makes no sense as you will most likely not be able to catch them, but they have all the options to successfully criple your logistics.
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Giggly Eyes
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Posted - 2008.05.09 07:55:00 -
[5]
Indeed....5 people are entirely capably of shutting down an alliance of 2000+.......
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Thargat
Caldari
North Star Networks
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.05.09 08:07:00 -
[6]
Meh... since it's about bribing concord, why not make it "local"?
Connect the cost of the wardec to constellations. The more costellations you want to be able to fight in the more expensive it gets. Different constellations would have different base costs (depending on how corrupt concord is in that area and how "inconvenient" it would be for concord to have a war in that area, think Jita).
If CCP had a really neat system of handling it you could take it all the way down to system level. Pay Xmil per system or something (it would be a nightmare to handle for the players though).
If I don't want a corp operating in a certain area I just wardec them and we'r both informed in what areas the wardec is legit. They can move to an area where the concord bribe does not apply. I in turn can extend the wardec, but it'll cost me more.
But to be quite honest, I don't see any problems with wardeccing in the first place, but ideas are ideas 
There's only one sig that matters... and that's Radius. |
DrDooma
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Posted - 2008.05.09 10:35:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Giggly Eyes
Indeed....5 people are entirely capably of shutting down an alliance of 2000+.......
This is the reason that costs should not go up. It makes small corporations matter.
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Jitabug
Caldari
Salvage Junkies
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Posted - 2008.05.09 10:41:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Thargat
Meh... since it's about bribing concord, why not make it "local"?
Connect the cost of the wardec to constellations. The more costellations you want to be able to fight in the more expensive it gets. Different constellations would have different base costs (depending on how corrupt concord is in that area and how "inconvenient" it would be for concord to have a war in that area, think Jita).
If CCP had a really neat system of handling it you could take it all the way down to system level. Pay Xmil per system or something (it would be a nightmare to handle for the players though).
If I don't want a corp operating in a certain area I just wardec them and we'r both informed in what areas the wardec is legit. They can move to an area where the concord bribe does not apply. I in turn can extend the wardec, but it'll cost me more.
But to be quite honest, I don't see any problems with wardeccing in the first place, but ideas are ideas
War dec costs based on area covered would actually be handy for CCP in terms of load balancing. Market hubs would obviously cost a fortune to operate in and would make all the corps camping gates into Jita consider making their ambush somewhere a bit less high profile.
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Tobias Sjodin
Ore Mongers
Black Hand.
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Posted - 2008.05.09 11:05:00 -
[9]
If five people bother a 2000 man alliance so much, said alliance needs to work more on it's logistics. For instance, how about an escort if you're moving important stuff?
There's already easy ways to avoid gatecamps with capitals jumping items.
Black Hand.
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Sophie Lake
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Posted - 2008.05.09 11:21:00 -
[10]
I have been hearing this war'dec problem since beta... you only have 3 options
1) quit
2) accept the facts
3) war'dec other people, make everyone miserable!!
Sooner or later, people will vote with their money... trust me, CCP will change.
-Please war'dec
-Please continue to sudicide killing
-Please continue to attack noobs!!
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Dianeces
Minmatar
The Illuminati.
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Posted - 2008.05.09 11:33:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Sophie Lake
I have been hearing this war'dec problem since beta... you only have 3 options
1) quit
2) accept the facts
3) war'dec other people, make everyone miserable!!
Sooner or later, people will vote with their money... trust me, CCP will change.
-Please war'dec
-Please continue to sudicide killing
-Please continue to attack noobs!!
Posting in another "Eve is dying." thread.
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Sophie Lake
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Posted - 2008.05.09 11:38:00 -
[12]
hello?? I ve been here since beta. I am just tossing some ideas to this whiner Ops. Nobody freakin care about War'Dec problems.... no body!!
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Vanessa Vale
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Posted - 2008.05.09 12:01:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Buriko Kamakura
The current state of wardecs is ridiculous and needs to be fixed.
Agreed. Corp hopping in wars should be fixed. |
Caleese
New Eden Research And Design School
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Posted - 2008.05.09 12:46:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Sophie Lake
hello?? I ve been here since beta. I am just tossing some ideas to this whiner Ops. Nobody freakin care about War'Dec problems.... no body!!
After this ridiculous thread http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=767626 I don't believe you have any right to call someone a whiner.
Also I'll toss my idea at you... get out
-----------------
Think of someone you consider of average intelligence... now realise this. Half the worlds population is dumber than that person.
How does the world survive such stupidity? |
Zirconium Blade
Ass Pounding Space Monkeys
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Posted - 2008.05.09 16:21:00 -
[15]
Hey why dont we just completely remove wardecs entirely? And then instance all the missions and make concord response time 0 sec and turn 0.0 into .5 sec space. Then instead of shooting each other we can just all go on friendly raids....
Also give everyone a titan but remove all offensive capability from it.
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Nekopyat
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Posted - 2008.05.09 17:01:00 -
[16]
I think what would be ideal is if all wardecs had to go through a GM or some other human arbiter who can then set the price based off looking at the two corps involved and what resources they can bring to bare.
Pretty much any auto-calculated value is going to either put wardecs out of reach of some people or make them too easy to do cheaply for other people.
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Doc Iridium
Amarr
Viziam
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Posted - 2008.05.09 17:15:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Nekopyat
I think what would be ideal is if all wardecs had to go through a GM or some other human arbiter who can then set the price based off looking at the two corps involved and what resources they can bring to bare.
Pretty much any auto-calculated value is going to either put wardecs out of reach of some people or make them too easy to do cheaply for other people.
Erm, putting price fixing controls for wardecs in the hands of live humans is just asking for more accusations of GM improprieties, even if none actually occur. This is _bad_. The logic behind it is extremely flawed as well, as a very large number of players have multiple accounts that feed resources to a PVP account, and these ties are not obvious without giving GM's player-level access to every character.
The GM / code resources that would have to go into a manual determination of real available corporate or alliance resources would be insane :P
Well, I've said my piece - wait, is that Veldspar over there? Woot! |
Nekopyat
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Posted - 2008.05.09 18:04:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Doc Iridium
The logic behind it is extremely flawed as well, as a very large number of players have multiple accounts that feed resources to a PVP account, and these ties are not obvious without giving GM's player-level access to every character.
The GM / code resources that would have to go into a manual determination of real available corporate or alliance resources would be insane :P
Yes, the GM (or equivalent) would need some ability to track alts and other meta-game aspects. But a human would still be more effective then either a one-sized-fits-all cost or an automatically sliding one. The would have to make some type of value judgement concerning the relative capabilities of the two corporations, probably with the ability to track previous war-decs through accounts (not characters) to look for people trying to fake out the system.
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Giggly Eyes
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Posted - 2008.05.09 19:24:00 -
[19]
Originally by: DrDooma
Originally by: Giggly Eyes
Indeed....5 people are entirely capably of shutting down an alliance of 2000+.......
This is the reason that costs should not go up. It makes small corporations matter.
I was being sarcastic.
If any large (or even semi-large) alliance can't handle being wardeced by a small corp, then they should just all quit and give their stuff to me.
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Silvana Kor'ah
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.05.10 11:19:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Giggly Eyes
I was being sarcastic.
If any large (or even semi-large) alliance can't handle being wardeced by a small corp, then they should just all quit and give their stuff to me.
Your sarcasm doesn't help here. As far as i have experienced, empire wars are mostly pretty much unbalanced, all resulting in the fact the the inferior corp will not undock and the superior corp will get bored to hell. What we wanna see are challenging fights, preferable with some RP background. Not a mature corp targeting a newbie corp for ransom or easy kills.
I've experienced a wardec by a 2 man corp. Well, they did not criple our corp, but they were pain in the ass, as you do realize that none of your "safe" empire business like mining and trading is safe anymore. If it was at least a corp with a similar membercount, we could have had fun hunting them as well. But with only 2, you will not get a fight at all with at least even odds. They will just not undock and just pick their easy targets as their wardec was intendent only for this purpose.
The wardoec costs should be calculated on the difference of the average SP of each corp, and the difference in member count. The higher the difference, the more it'll cost. Simple
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Ooook
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Posted - 2008.05.10 11:29:00 -
[21]
I think costs need to go down tbh, each war dec you do should cost a certain % less.
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