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Lord Wimbishi
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:17:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Lord Wimbishi on 06/05/2004 10:34:01
Well writing in response of one thing I know I am personally getting tired if is the constant whining by people whom are flying in frigs and getting fragged when they are trying to mess with higher class ships like cruisers and battleships. Are you insane??? Cruisers and battleships in this game universe don't have the firepower point defense systems like their real life counterparts would have and all of the other crap that make them fortresses. Of course your ship should get fragged and properly so when you are trying to peck at a multi million dollar ship. If you don't think this is fun. Go else where and stop trying to pick a fight with a much more powerful ship types especially if they are equipped for war. The idiocy of the pilots if they arenÆt prepared is they in any of the ship types are on them. Yeah some balancing could be made and had. But for creep sake stop trying to measure up smaller ships to a battleship trying to give it some kind of offensive advantage. The only advantage is speed. Run away let other capital ships deal with the threats and work as escorts, scouts, patrol ship, skirmishing duties and raiders like the cruisers and frigates are suppose to be. Not ships of the line meant for heavy combat. The game is becoming more redundant because people are trying to balance the combat system to make ships more useful or less effective then what they are suppose to be. Fix the damn market system make ships more expensive to own and make so there everyone in the galaxy canÆt own a battleship thinking it is some kind of sports car. It is one of the supreme combat ships in the game that takes a very long time to train up to and acquire on a NORMAL basis outside a multi million dollar corp and owning one should be a matter of pride and awe to others like it was in the past. Now days they are not as bad as a dime a dozen but damn near. Want a thrill and not face risk and danger with no threat of having your ship blown up. Then go fight some asteroids. Many cry over having about something working against their favor. Adjust move around it if it is still functional and totally possible to overcome and endeavor.
Want to talk about an unbalance what about cruise missiles on frigates? Hmm many of those that use em sure don't complain about that when they use them against Indies or cruisers laughing when they use an infinite mwd in orbit around those ships.
Plus many of those whom I consider pirates sure whined a lot when they gate camped in the old days blowing up newbs in cruisers or frigates either for laughs or just being a straight donkey's hindquarter because it was sure funny to them. Now when the tables turned police showed up along with those same newbs, formed corps to hunt them down thrashed the sorry lowlifes just complained about it. Boo Hoo. Deal with it and they eventually have. I respect most of the veterans and some of those pirates whom overcame it and still found ways to have fun.
Get real with the game for the game people and quit whining oh how frigates are so neglected and how they are so weak. Cruisers aren't so much in the same boat if you use them as they are SUPPOSED to be used not used in a way you want them to be. Make some money and find a few friends then have a war with a few large corps then you will have fun.
Find ways to overcome the short little drawbacks certain ship types have if they have a perfect function in what they are doing. The progression of the game yes directs people into higher class ships, that is what they are there for a goal and one of the focuses to play the game. The wonder thing about this game is that IS NOT the only focus. If you limit that then you are at fault for not making it fun not anyone else. This game has many opportunities and options in what you can do inside it makes it one of the best and yes most tolerated MMORPG out there having people pay every month with constant mess ups down times patch overhauls and other crap that goes on. I still love the game and will do so you got to make it work for you and your own game play. You make uses of each ship type and for what purpose they have been designed for.
Lord Wimbishi
Bladerunner
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Aelius
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:18:00 -
[2]
Rant is forbiden. In before the lock 
Selling Raven BPC ME20 3M at Yulai 1st Station |
Sphalerite
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:25:00 -
[3]
Don't whine, adapt. Also, there are real threads about all of these things in the ships&mods forum... if you want to actually help, go post something constuctive there.
Oh, and ranting is bad. In before the lock.
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Shadow Raver
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:27:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Aelius
Rant is forbiden. In before the lock
what he said
When The Man Behind The Blade Comes You Will Feel Pain |
Windghost
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:31:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Windghost on 06/05/2004 10:32:50
LOL.
Frigates aren't "noobie ships", and cruisers aren't "ships for those who can't afford battleships." There's a reason why in real life the entire US navy doesn't consist of a bunch of battleships.
5 well-trained frigate pilots can take down the BEST of battleship pilots. And FoF won't work--because FoF only lock on to targets using turrets, not missiles. 4 kestrels and a griffin, thats all you need.
2 cruisers (blackbirds) can take out a battleship any day. And if you add a caracel most battleship pilots will die, not just the noob ones.
In World War II battleships cost billions. Yet the US destroyed one of the biggest in the world, the Yamamato, with a bunch of torpedoes and bombs from a fighter-bomber wing. The wing of fighters cost about 1/100 the price of the ship. Same in EVE. With 2 million in frigates and items you can take out a 150 million battleship. Or about 15 million in cruisers can do the same. Its all in how you do it.
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Lord Wimbishi
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:35:00 -
[6]
Wind. that battle by the way took 8 hours over 200 aircraft 3 air craft carriers 5 cruisers and 8 other support ships. 21 torpedos and around 41 2000 pound bombs just to make the ship capsize
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Arcticblue2
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:40:00 -
[7]
And the ships name was "Yamato" not Yamamato 
Btw a ship that I got a model of (once I start to have more time to do stuff I will build it )
----------------------------------------------
"When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things."
1 cor. 13:11 |
Avon
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:40:00 -
[8]
Quote:
Want to talk about an unbalance what about cruise missiles on frigates?
What about them?
The DOT is poor compared with some small turrets, and they can be defended against. Your point?
______________________________________________
Never argue with idiots.
They will just drag it down to their level, and then beat you through experience. |
Windghost
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:43:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Windghost on 06/05/2004 10:45:14
Originally by: Lord Wimbishi
Wind. that battle by the way took 8 hours over 200 aircraft 3 air craft carriers 5 cruisers and 8 other support ships. 21 torpedos and around 41 2000 pound bombs just to make the ship capsize
21 torpedoes.
41 bombs.
To sink a single ship.
Doesn't 62 cruise missiles to blow up a battleship sound reasonable to you then?
By the way, everything else was just to take care of the rest of the fleet. The actual Yamato was destroyed by a group of fighter bombers and torpedo bombers. (which you sorta just stated by talking about the bombs and torpedoes)
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Lt Red
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:45:00 -
[10]
And the Yam was deliberately sailing to its death. They know this, yet they sailed onward. more info:
The Imperial Japanese Navy was not immune from the US fleet, even though the diminished fleet was but a remnant of its former self. Thus, in April of 1945, the fate of the Yamato task group was sealed in a sacrificial plan to reinforce the defenders of Okinawa.
With only enough fuel to make the voyage from the Inner Sea of Japan to the island, under assault from the combined American and Allied Forces, the world's largest battleship, together with the light cruiser Yahagi and eight escort destroyers, sailed into the South China Sea. They were tracked by U.S. submarines through the Bungo Straits, their positions being relayed to U.S. Task Force 58. There would be no air cover for the Japanese Navy.
At approximately half past noon on April 7, 1945, more than 380 U.S. planes from Task Group 58 attacked the Yamato Task Group in three separate air waves. In the ensuing battle that lasted a little more than three hours, the Imperial Japanese Navy ceased to exist. Sunk was the battleship Yamato, the light cruiser Yahagi, and four of the eight escort destroyers. The remaining destroyers limped home to Kure Harbor with what survivors they could find from the sunken ships.
The sacrifice for the Japanese was staggering. In addition to the Japanese Navy's loss of pride, 4,250 officers and sailors perished. The loss to American forces were 10 planes and 12 aircrew.
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Jay Gatsby
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:46:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Jay Gatsby on 06/05/2004 10:51:03
Surely not, Wimbishi? The version I heard, there was this bunch of maverick yet fundamentally decent and honourable guys just sitting around, *****ing jokes, racing each other on motorcycles, having love affairs with the beautiful nurses nearby (but not letting girls get in the way of their close-but-in-no-way-homosexual bonds as a team of maverick-but-honourable fighting men), who heard that there was this enemy battleship nearby, and who decided that they had to jump in their planes and fly off on a dangerous, probably suicidal, certainly no guarantee of having enough fuel to get home afterwards mission, which was ultimately successful, even though some of the pilots died, but no-one really minded because the ones that died weren't the really popular, good looking ones.
That's the way it happened. FACT!
[edit - I can say homosexual but I can't say c\r\a\c\k\i\n\g? That's just daft. Oh well.]
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Silverlancer
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:46:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Silverlancer on 06/05/2004 10:47:27
Edited by: Silverlancer on 06/05/2004 10:47:13
If you're trying to get rid of all non-battleship combat, ruin all the fun and variety of EVE, and put it back to how it was a few months ago before people realized thats its fun to use cruisers and frigates too, just End YourselfÖ
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Shadow Raver
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:48:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Windghost
Edited by: Windghost on 06/05/2004 10:45:14
Originally by: Lord Wimbishi
Wind. that battle by the way took 8 hours over 200 aircraft 3 air craft carriers 5 cruisers and 8 other support ships. 21 torpedos and around 41 2000 pound bombs just to make the ship capsize
21 torpedoes.
41 bombs.
To sink a single ship.
Doesn't 62 cruise missiles to blow up a battleship sound reasonable to you then?
By the way, everything else was just to take care of the rest of the fleet. The actual Yamato was destroyed by a group of fighter bombers and torpedo bombers. (which you sorta just stated by talking about the bombs and torpedoes)
not in space,with shields and everyting els not for me anyway.. should be more like 160.. anyway frigates shouldnt beable to use cruise missiles so its fine if we take away that ability 
When The Man Behind The Blade Comes You Will Feel Pain |
Darius Octavius
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Posted - 2004.05.06 10:51:00 -
[14]
Sigh...let's find a new one to beat to death and leave this one buried. 
Stellar Products and Quality Resources
ticker: SPQR
established 6-03
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Lucre
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Posted - 2004.05.06 11:25:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Windghost
In World War II battleships cost billions. Yet the US destroyed one of the biggest in the world, the Yamamato, with a bunch of torpedoes and bombs from a fighter-bomber wing.
True. And throw in Pearl Harbor, Taranto, the crippling of the Bismarck and Scharnhorst etc...
*However*, who says this is the paradigm that Eve has to follow? Use a 19th century model instead, and frigates/cruisers would have no 'combat' role whatsoever in line of battle ship engagements. They didn't carry the firepower to hurt a battle ship and so they didn't try. Indeed the 'courtesy rule' was that provided frigates weren't stupid enough to fire on ships of the line, they wouldn't be fired upon by those ships of the line, even if they were engaged in tactically useful activities like scouting or signalling for their fleet.
I'm not saying this model is how Eve should be or that the WW2 model would necessarily be wrong. I'm just making the point that the fact that WW2 worked that way doesn't mean Eve has to too...
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Demangel
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Posted - 2004.05.06 11:27:00 -
[16]
My views are:
A lot of Battleship pilots are overreacting, and I say that with some hesitation only because it all depends on how CCP handles Cruise missiles, and possibly also (but to a lesser extent) MWD's.
The frigate pilots Beef (and to a simlar extent the cruiser pilot), is that bigger ships still have an easy time of hitting them with big MacLargeHuge cannons that are DESIGNED for killing BIG ships.
Nobody here is saying your Battleship should be kilable by a solo frigate, thats just stupidity, and anyone who thinks that way hasn't spoken up anyway...
The good:
Battleships and cruisers will be forced to mount smaller classes of turrets to remain safe when solo.
Frigate and cruiser pilots will in theory find more work (frigate pilots already do find plenty of work now, but it could always be better.).
Battles between evenly classes ships will LAST LONGER THAN 30 SECONDS, providing the fight is an even match of ships.
Why? will they last longer?
Because instead of 8 tachyon moon splitters, you will mount only 3 or 4... and save the rest of your slots for smaller class turrets... OR you'll have backup to protect you from the frigate and cruiser wings.
Sure, it seems like a nerf... Sure it reads like your precious battleship will be unable to hit a frigate no matter what gun it uses... But the math behind these changes does not do that. It just effects turrets.
The only real valid (IE arguments I am willing to conceed) arguments battleship pilots have to ***** and whine as far as I have yet seen (there may be others, but I doubt it) are:
Cruise missiles need a nerfage, or some kind of change, because I agree, it should take more of em to take out a BS, or at least no frigates should be able to use em. I am sick of flavor of the week game tactics in EVE like this one. Flavors of the week will always exist, but must they be so obviously unbalanced? Anyway thats a sepperate rant entirely.
MWD may or may not need a nerfage... As it is I hear it's already very hard to hit a frig unless it's webbed no matter what gun your using.
Battleships could use some more weapon slots, but they should be restricted to medium or smaller turrets. maybe give up one large turret slot, for two medium or smaller turret slots. That way you can still mount a LOT of big toys, and still be capable of defending yourself against frigs and cruisers. Sounds very fair to me :) I'd even be happy with that on a cruiser... Give up one medium turret slot, and get 2 small turret slots in it's place.
Before you jump all over me, CCP IS changing the UI soon, and one of the features of the new UI will be more room for more modules... Now maybe they won't get added onto existing ships, but who knows... at the very least the higher tech ships will get them if anything gets em.
So rant all you want, these changes are going through, how they will end up we don't yet know... it's too early too tell...
But I implore CCP to fix the cruise missiles and any other potential exploits that can and will occur when this new system is implemented... Before we have to hear about it and live with it for six more months...
I don't want battleship pilots to feel inadequate, they spent hundred of millions on thier big toy, they deserve to enjoy it...
But no more of this:
Frigate = newbie (now with more usefullness against Bs's admittedly)
Cruiser = not rich enough for battleship yet. (Being phased out of PVP as we speak, cruisers need the real lovin right now...)
Battleship = god
Essentialy instead of a kind of tactical rock paper siscors kind of thing in regard to ship classes, we have rock (battleship) scissors (frigate) and stick of molten butter with a dead fly in it (cruiser).
Anyway thats my .02 ISK... Rant on...
Galaxion > If you drove a car shaped like a thorax women would call you
Demangel > Dude... I would call..
Demangel > wait that sounded g@y I bet.
Galaxion > Just a bit.
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Ulendar
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Posted - 2004.05.06 11:36:00 -
[17]
-Cruisemissiles on frigates need to go
-small turrets need a boost in tracking (so 1 mwd frig can hit another mwd frig)
-The Raven needs to get FIXED, lately all i ever see on chaos is ravens ravens ravens ravens ravens, want to fight im in a raven, hey cool me two...boom boom boom boom boom boom boom boom...3weeks pass....booom boom boom...'aw im outta missiles'. I'm not stating anything but maybe its possible that perhaps this ship is 'somewhat' and a 'tad' overpowered??
-Tachyons SUCK, give them better damage
-Scorpion needs to get faster and have a smaller signature radius
..thats all i can think of atm...i'm sure there is more
Originally by: cashman
It's time for Eris to get a clue. CCP should make a statement about this.
It's the exact same things as what Zombie did, you may not attack in "safe-areas" (empire/within sentry range) without loosing your ship.
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Iratus Caelestis
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Posted - 2004.05.06 11:48:00 -
[18]
Battleships in WW2 didn't cost Billions. Don't be daft.
The US Loan to the UK at the end of WW2 was only 2 Billion and that was to rebuild the entire country.
We now resume your normal programming (topic)
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Lord Wimbishi
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Posted - 2004.05.06 13:16:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Lord Wimbishi on 06/05/2004 13:36:59
Edited by: Lord Wimbishi on 06/05/2004 13:24:18
Well good now we got some focus on this issue and stimulated a conversation.
Big guns against small targets? WhatÆs the problem with that?
Fast targets moving at xxxx m's maybe some difficulty tracking. Battleships even during War world two could wipe out a small fleet of smaller ships with nothing but its big guns. Would a ship arm up with little guns to clean house? Certainly not. Most combat happened at godly ranges of miles at a time. The ranges here are much closer then just chance encounters at deep sea. Frigates are far from useless and are excellent scouts and raiders. Yes their in game use now is they are very fast little gun boats. It should still be idiocy to in trying to fly up around or by a larger ship. In game dynamics are understandable to use larger guns at longer range to incorporate smaller ships for a closer fleet defense. But letÆs face it we all focus for some reason on Fleet action type stuff when most of the action is happening with squadron or less thus 4 or fewer ships. It should and would take a whole lot of firepower to take down a battleship by multiple ships. One for attrition and presenting a whole bunch of targets so said battleship and is escort couldn't easily track them all.
I agree battleships should mount smaller weapons to defend themselves with and thus in real life where riddled with em. In game there are 6-8 slots and so few turret slots to do that with. In actuality 4 main slots and 8 support slots would require this support. But nope poor battleship in our game has to be relegated to few guns which are slowly being nerfed to engage only other battleships where a few smaller ships could overwhelm and take em out. Wrong answer. This is making people depend on other players for actions dealing in combat other then trying to have fun by themselves and this where the frigates are getting now the most freedom ( as long you don't play with sentry guns and police) freedom is good but the focus of the game isn't in just flying a certain ship type. I my mind it is to utilize em for what you want them to do. A battleship like a tank should only be challenged by overwhelming forces of smaller ships or another battleship. Right now they are just superbly beefed up cruisers. I expect when the dreadnaughts or elite battleships hit the scene they will take up the role of a true battleship and put the fear of god into star systems and corperations alike demanding respect where they are needed or roam. They should and in the future hopefully will be hard to gain through resources and skills in order to fly because it would simply upset the game if everyone and their grandmother can simply buy and ride in one.
I know I focused a lot on the battleship and know the cruisers deserve reconition in turn. They are the most cost effiecent ship in the game and could present a challenge if people would use em in cooridination. They are a perfect middle ground between the ships and am highly anticipation the newer cruisers coming out. The biggest promblem with these smaller ships including frigates are experianced and willing pilots to really put them to the test and make them work as a organised group. 4 or 5 cruisers in game are definatly a threat to a battleship even though most of em would or could get wiped out by a battleship they simply don't have the staying power which is why they are more picket ships then anything. They hold firewpower enough to combine together with others to bring down one of the big ships but like the frigates would be meat to the grinder against even a single battleship. I honestly think they as in CCP needs to overhaul the senor ECCM system of each ship class. right now cruisers are scratching just a few points under a battleships sensor ability which in effect should not be the case but it is in game. the Scorp has the best rating of 16 and the moa has i think 11 or 12. this is bad as the battleship should have 20 if not over a bit to 24. Bad? Nah battleship of all types have superior sensors by far and shouldn't be locked down by a few mere frigates. Which now days puts the fear of battleships abroad. Silly
Most of the old dogs in the game can remember when you saw any battleship it was an awesome thing. The where rare and hard to get to now days. Heh newbs are getting into them with little problem thanks to the current market system. Yeah it makes it a little unplayable for newbs and such to have things cost a whole bunch but it makes one appreciate it more one when they get it and two inspire awe. It isn't a big deal now days but should be. I am sure veterans and newbs alike will flock in a system to see the first of the titans coming out. I am not innocent of this whey the first concord battleships started to hit the scene. Everybody cept the pirates when to look at them where they appeared. Anyways enough for now
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comon
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Posted - 2004.05.06 13:38:00 -
[20]
I say more dmg to Large guns.
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Dianabolic
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Posted - 2004.05.06 13:45:00 -
[21]
Why do people want to take cruise missiles off frigates?
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Dianabolic
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Posted - 2004.05.06 13:45:00 -
[22]
Why do people want to take cruise missiles off frigates?
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Silverlancer
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Posted - 2004.05.06 14:38:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Dianabolic
Why do people want to take cruise missiles off frigates?
Because they fly battleships and don't want anything other than battleships to be able to hurt them.
Its the classic case of carebearing. They want themselves to have all the advantages and everyone else to either die or be forced to use the same stuff that they do.
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Ulendar
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Posted - 2004.05.06 14:44:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Ulendar on 06/05/2004 14:52:37
Edited by: Ulendar on 06/05/2004 14:50:42
Originally by: Silverlancer
Originally by: Dianabolic
Why do people want to take cruise missiles off frigates?
Because they fly battleships and don't want anything other than battleships to be able to hurt them.
Its the classic case of carebearing. They want themselves to have all the advantages and everyone else to either die or be forced to use the same stuff that they do.
Erm no actually its because they fly frigates and want more thrill to a fight then the simple scenerio of whoever webs first wins as then the cruisemissiles catch upto the other frigate...
Right now the least dangerous oponents for a frigate is a battlehship so your point is totally flawed..
heavy missiles and topedos (whcih SHOULD be *****ble on a frigate) can still knock out a bship pretty quick...
Only you wotn be able to take 2 friends with friagtes and go take out some bship anymore..youl have to get more friends, use better tactics.
The problem with friagtes using cruisemissiles is not tha the are to good against bships or cruisers or whatever. The problem is that they are to good against other frigates and that frigate vs frigate combat is totally boring and pointless atm.
Frigates having torpedos would be infinitly better because a torpedo cannot be used against a frigate (as its not agile enough), it can however be used very effectivly against a bship...bships dont move much once they are webbed and the 450 dam hurts like hell...
Cruisemissiles on friagtes sucks, it kills friagte vs frigate combat and it encourages ganking...torps would be much better for a frigate.
Originally by: cashman
It's time for Eris to get a clue. CCP should make a statement about this.
It's the exact same things as what Zombie did, you may not attack in "safe-areas" (empire/within sentry range) without loosing your ship.
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Vangelis
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Posted - 2004.05.06 15:29:00 -
[25]
I dont know if many of you posting have actuly been in some real PvP combat or not but for those that havnt here is how it goes.
Frigates as they are in fleet battles are essential!
Any fleet that does not use frigates is a fleet of Noobs.
Frigates are the ultimate warp scramblers and as i said earlier are ESSENTIAL in PvP and they currently work fine.
Also for all those saying that frigates "need" a boost b/c they are unbalanced ...well obviously u havnt seen the moo videos of 5...yes only 5 frigates costing a total of about 1 mil isk take down arguably the most popular and best PvP battleship in the game the Scorpion costing 60 times the frigate force. This isnt a 1 off either as i have seen the Curse alliance repeat this feat on more then 1 ocassion on a tempest and also an other scorpion.
In fleet engaments friagtes are so feared that interceptor pilots and some battleships in a task force are told to give them priority in focusing there fire on them thats how good they are.
The only change that needs to occur is the change to wrecking hits which at themoment is a chance based on every shot fired rather then calculating a chance AFTER a sucsessful strike.
FRIGATE are already great ships and well balanced and anyone that says any diffrent either has NEVER been in a real fleet engament or is ingorant.
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JardaR G'Kar
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Posted - 2004.05.06 15:53:00 -
[26]
and Dev makes frigates even stronger..:((
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Arcticblue2
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Posted - 2004.05.07 08:06:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Shadow Raver
not in space,with shields and everyting els not for me anyway.. should be more like 160.. anyway frigates shouldnt beable to use cruise missiles so its fine if we take away that ability
Why ? what is the smallest ship you can carry a Cruisemissile now ? I am pretty sure a Torpedoboat (the type Norway use) can carry a cruisemissile, and even 4 of them if they liked.
The boat is smaller than a Cruiser, it is smaller than a Frigate too.
----------------------------------------------
"When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things."
1 cor. 13:11 |
Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.05.07 08:42:00 -
[28]
Real-life comparisons with Eve are so passÚ.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Rod Blaine
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Posted - 2004.05.07 08:55:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Joshua Calvert
Real-life comparisons with Eve are so passÚ.
I disagree.
Neither of them makes sense to me, but when compared i feel more assured that that is ok.
Rod Blaine
Official mascotte of the "new cleansing" project of the Curse Alliance, into researching new ways of communicating ineffectively while at least staying decent. Oh, and we also make weapons of mass destruction
_______________________________________________
Yes yes, blogging is passÚ I know.
Rod's Ramblingz on Eve-Online
Solutions to your issues. |
Grimster
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Posted - 2004.05.07 09:46:00 -
[30]
OK, we had some fun and games in EC for the past couple of nights as one or two may have noticed who have been in that particular system.
Most of us are flying frigs, with the odd cruiser. So far we have killed probably a score of cruisers and a couple of battleships - until the following happened...
Fighting a Scorp, and just took it out, when out of the blue comes a couple of crow interceptors, together with a Raven and another BS.
Crows were into us, webbing and cruising, the BS's dishing nasty too, us scattering or flying eggs.
My point?
On it's own a BS is very vunerable to a fleet of smaller ships, but with support, BS's can't be effectively engaged by smaller ships.
The support ships have to become the major targets, and be defeated before the BS can be engaged.
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