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Current stations vs Shiva stations

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Embrace Death	Posted - 2004.05.15 23:09:00 - [1] What are CCP's plans with the current player owned stations (which are a joke IMO)? Will they be made destroyable? If so, will they turn into normal stations and get the 'attachments' that shiva stations will be able to get?
Tokka Konnair	Posted - 2004.05.15 23:40:00 - [2] you're confused what Shiva contains are deployable structures that have the features of various station based facilities proper player built stations wont arrive until Kali i doubt the current capturable stations will be changed - the point of them was to create 'battlefields' by assigning additional server resources to a system then placing the stations there as an incentive to fight __________________________________________
Embrace Death	Posted - 2004.05.16 00:12:00 - [3] Originally by: Tokka Konnair you're confused what Shiva contains are deployable structures that have the features of various station based facilities proper player built stations wont arrive until Kali i doubt the current capturable stations will be changed - the point of them was to create 'battlefields' by assigning additional server resources to a system then placing the stations there as an incentive to fight Kali? I think you have just confused me more.. From what I have personally seen these stations don't inspire much warfare at all.. Well, in a different sence anyway.. Ive more often seen people 'wait out' the enemy to recapture a staion than actually fight over it.. if it were a looseable station people might be more inclined to fight for em.. ~_~ Index of "How to avoid any risk for Dummies" Chapter 1: Stay in Empire Chapter 2: Log off at safespot if threatened Chapter 3: Watch "players in space" and "local" Chapter 4: Switch corps if war is declared on yours Chapter 5: Equip 2 MWD and 5 warp core stableizers Chapter 6: So you still got destroyed? Things you can do. See chap. 7 "Forum trolling and maintaining your carebear image"
DigitalCommunist	Posted - 2004.05.16 00:13:00 - [4] what the other guy said, deployables are not the same as stations.. its like a station but in pieces, a fully functional station with all the deployable functions dont come till kali so no you will not be able to actually BUILD a fully sized, and functional player owned/constructed STATION for probably another year or more _____________________________________ Perpetually driven, your end is our beginning. "Can I be a consultant for EVE II?" - WhiteDwarf
Tokka Konnair	Posted - 2004.05.16 00:16:00 - [5] Kali is the next developement phase ... as in: Gemini, Castor, Shiva, Kali .... year or more? possible i'm going to be optomistic and say Christmas __________________________________________
Kashre	Posted - 2004.05.16 01:30:00 - [6] Originally by: Tokka Konnair Kali is the next developement phase ... as in: Gemini, Castor, Shiva, Kali .... year or more? possible i'm going to be optomistic and say Christmas The Filefront article said "Q3 this year" for Shiva, thats another 3 or 4 months at least right? There is no way Kali is gonna be a mere 3 months after that. My vote is for Q3 next year. +++ It's called "low security space" for a reason.
Galk	Posted - 2004.05.16 01:35:00 - [7] My opinion has allways been that if a corp has the resources to build, then it has the resources to defend. In short, let um blow i say. Player owned stuctures, in the world of eve, we fight. Nothing more ------------------------ ---- Little wonder why people were, what this person was telling my friends: http://galk.50megs.com/logs/
Tokka Konnair	Posted - 2004.05.16 12:02:00 - [8] Edited by: Tokka Konnair on 16/05/2004 12:05:25 Originally by: Kashre The Filefront article said "Q3 this year" for Shiva, thats another 3 or 4 months at least right? There is no way Kali is gonna be a mere 3 months after that. My vote is for Q3 next year. vote ? optomistic prediction like i said ... anyway .... doesn't Q3 mean third quarter? ie: July - August - September ... in which case we actualy have 1-3 months __________________________________________
Demangel	Posted - 2004.05.16 12:23:00 - [9] Technically 3rd Q could mean within 1 month, which would put it on target for may 25th area. Also a recent post by a DEV (about one week old I think), says internally they are still aiming for 25th of may for Shiva... Plus or minus soon(tm) style mishapps. I would say a conservative but otherwise optimistic estimate for the start of Shiva release would be within 1-2 months tops, and if it takes longer than 4 months, I know I won't be around to see it because I will have given up on EVE again by then without something more immersive to play with... Anyway Good correction on the player owned "Deployables" I too keep calling them stations, and always wondered why, if they are stations are they so different from the current ones... Didn't occur to me that full stations would come in eventually. Even if it is a logical progression since deployables will be sucky compaired to the real deal, and thier main use will be convenience. The current stations, with this correction in mind will likely be unchanged I bet... At best when the full stations come in, we might get to expect maybe an EVENT that transfers complete ownership to a corp or something, but who knows... they may remain contested forever Galaxion > If you drove a car shaped like a thorax women would call you Demangel > Dude... I would call.. Demangel > wait that sounded g@y I bet. Galaxion > Just a bit.
Per'Ardua Ad'Astra	Posted - 2004.05.16 12:39:00 - [10] Does anyone know if these deployable structures can only be used in non-empire space?
Demangel	Posted - 2004.05.16 12:42:00 - [11] Originally by: Per'Ardua Ad'Astra Does anyone know if these deployable structures can only be used in non-empire space? I'd like to know this too, but I suspect they will be usable anywhere. Galaxion > If you drove a car shaped like a thorax women would call you Demangel > Dude... I would call.. Demangel > wait that sounded g@y I bet. Galaxion > Just a bit.
Tokka Konnair	Posted - 2004.05.16 12:42:00 - [12] Originally by: Per'Ardua Ad'Astra Does anyone know if these deployable structures can only be used in non-empire space? possibly .... the description of the Field Assembly Array suggests they can only be anchored outside empire ... __________________________________________
belzebub1	Posted - 2004.05.16 12:54:00 - [13] I recon they will only be usable in .4 sec and below Also I remember hearing that they need to be setup around a planet or a moon so you cant just put the station in the middle of nowhere. This means no hiding the facility from your enemies this will make them nice and vulnearble Dont forget to visit Magma Index at the below Link. http://www.magmaindex.uni.cc/
YuuKnow	Posted - 2004.05.16 13:05:00 - [14] Edited by: YuuKnow on 16/05/2004 13:07:08 What I'm wondering is how easy will it be to destroy the structures once their built. We all saw how hard it was to defend the player-owed-stations. No corp had enough people on 23/7 to protect against possilbe attacked. You could guard it most of the day, but eventually there's going to be a time where you going have 3-4 battleship captains on and the enemy is coming to kill you. I wonder how good the turrets and shield will be. Hopefully darn good.
Tokka Konnair	Posted - 2004.05.16 13:11:00 - [15] Originally by: YuuKnow What I'm wondering is how easy will it be to destroy the structures once their built. We all saw how hard it was to defend the player-owed-stations. No corp had enough people on 23/7 to protect against possilbe attacked. You could guard it most of the day, but eventually there's going to be a time where you going have 3-4 battleship captains on and the enemy is coming to kill you. I wonder how good the turrets and shield will be. Hopefully darn good. ....or how easy are they to transport? will it be feasable at the end of a long day of mining/manufacturing to pack everything up again and bring it all back to empire? __________________________________________
Zubenelgenubi	Posted - 2004.05.16 13:11:00 - [16] Well if the DEVS have any sense they'll realise its almost impossible for the vast majority of corps in EVE to protect these structures 24/7. They need to have some automated defences (like sentry guns etc) that will be effective against all but the most determined attack.
Zubenelgenubi	Posted - 2004.05.16 13:13:00 - [17] Originally by: Tokka Konnair Originally by: YuuKnow What I'm wondering is how easy will it be to destroy the structures once their built. We all saw how hard it was to defend the player-owed-stations. No corp had enough people on 23/7 to protect against possilbe attacked. You could guard it most of the day, but eventually there's going to be a time where you going have 3-4 battleship captains on and the enemy is coming to kill you. I wonder how good the turrets and shield will be. Hopefully darn good. ....or how easy are they to transport? will it be feasable at the end of a long day of mining/manufacturing to pack everything up again and bring it all back to empire? Yeah, I'd like to know that too. Hopefully someone in the know will give us some detailed info on what to expect.
ZeeWolf	Posted - 2004.05.16 13:16:00 - [18] Isnt it 24/7?
Del Tarrant	Posted - 2004.05.16 13:18:00 - [19] Please, please, please CCP don't make these deployable structures un-feasible for smaller corps to use! Almost everything in this game favours the larger alliances, but there are LOTS of players in EVE who prefer playing in smaller corps. Give us the chance to enjoy these new features too!
Tassadar Beta	Posted - 2004.05.16 13:24:00 - [20] Downtime = 23/7 :P
Zipoldy	Posted - 2004.05.16 13:27:00 - [21] To make it easy.... 1 Tech level/year... when this game started they said they had 5 Tech levels... a tech level/year will make this game 5 years old at the most with what they have so we must concider that a MMORG should be online for 7-9 years so don't expect anything soon[TM] Zip
Demangel	Posted - 2004.05.16 13:36:00 - [22] I know this probably wouldn't happen... But some of us used to debate this issue for days on end... and my point of view was: give corps/players/whatever the ability to: 1: Setup various defensive modules, IE make the station like a immobile ship complete with various offensive and defensive modules you can buy and install. 2: Hirable NPC defense forces. The more ISK you spend the better thier quality, and the faster they respawn. 3: Requires Battleships to be taken down... period. 4: On, and offline alerts, to email, and EVE mail and Concord message when a station belonging to your corp, or to you gets attacked. The offline alerts wouldn't be all that useful, but an ingame alert would help. 5: Stations should ONLY be attackable durring corp/alliance war situations, unless it is shown to require an enourmous force to take them down. Otherwise it can lead too WAY too many cases (even 2 cases is too many) of grief station killing. 6: Insurance, if stations can't be insured forget it... I will never condone building one... Too risky. 7: Players in space/station part of map needs to be REMOVED COMPLETELY! Otherwise a corp or alliance could just have someone watching the map till they spot a low number of players online around the station area, and start the attack. in other words, you should have to at LEAST send in a scout to determine if the system, is empty or low populated. This way it would discourage people from planning an attack for non peak hours when the enemy is sleeping, as they will have a harder time figuring out when that is. There are probably some other good suggesttions. I can live without suggestion #5, it kinda feels too arbitrary, but you gotta admit it's got some merrit what with all the grief play that one must admit DOES go on now and then . Loosing a 100 million BS to this crap is barely tolerable, but losing a station potentialy costing billions due to some pack of lamers you never even met in EVE, who decided it would be funny to hear your whines on the forums? Fuggeddaboudit... Even one or two such whine threads will put a nail in the coffin for Shiva/EVE... Maybe not bury it... but it will HURT. Also keep in mind, that for one, don't want stations to be care bear paradises... If they want thier station to be secure, they are gonna have to keep it in high sec... Tough *****. If a station can't be taken over or at least destroyed, then half the point of having a navy will be lost... I know CCP isn't thinking that they should be undamageable ETC, so I'm not worried, just wanna make my position clear :) Galaxion > If you drove a car shaped like a thorax women would call you Demangel > Dude... I would call.. Demangel > wait that sounded g@y I bet. Galaxion > Just a bit.
Jenna Stannis	Posted - 2004.05.16 14:40:00 - [23] Edited by: Jenna Stannis on 16/05/2004 14:41:51 Originally by: Demangel 7: Players in space/station part of map needs to be REMOVED COMPLETELY! Otherwise a corp or alliance could just have someone watching the map till they spot a low number of players online around the station area, and start the attack. in other words, you should have to at LEAST send in a scout to determine if the system, is empty or low populated. This way it would discourage people from planning an attack for non peak hours when the enemy is sleeping, as they will have a harder time figuring out when that is I think this is fundamentally the most important thing CCP should consider when they finally impliment deployable structures. Also, if corps can't 'hide' their installations from the map, then I see no way in he11 anyone that isn't in a large alliance will be able to own them. Enemies should have to scout systems one by one to locate enemy installations and not simply click on the map and have a big arrow saying "there it is".
Embrace Death	Posted - 2004.05.16 14:49:00 - [24] very good post Demangel pats on back I love people who make suggestions when they complain or talk, it is just how all players should be My post wasn't really concerned at all about the difference between stations and deployable stations.. I was just wondering if the current stations would become looseable. To elaborate more on why I ask: You pay a billion or so for these deployables to have your own sort of "station" that can be destroyed, yet someone else has got this indestructible station that costs very little and as long as they have a regional presence they never will really suffer a loss when they loose the rights to the stations compared to the loss suffered by those who build their own stations. I just don't see it as being very fair, thats all. Ohh, and the map fuctions for 0.0 realllllllyyyy need to take a hike before shiva hits.. if not the map will tell you: When your enemies are offline, how many are online, how many are docked, and if there has been fighting there recently. >_< I just hope CCP doesnt take the same route with protecting against offtime killers as wolfpack took in the game shadowbane.. SB had a bane system, when a bane was put up you had a day to prepare and couldnt attack the bane put on your city(which is like a station). After a day the bane went up and both the bane and your city became vulnerable to damage. The system REALLY sucked the big one because: It cause massive lagfests, hundreds of players in 1 spot fighting over a city, bane easily destroyed, city took forever to die, and all possible elements of suprise attack were removed because you had to defend that bane. CCP, dont take that path ;) ~_~ Index of "How to avoid any risk for Dummies" Chapter 1: Stay in Empire Chapter 2: Log off at safespot if threatened Chapter 3: Watch "players in space" and "local" Chapter 4: Switch corps if war is declared on yours Chapter 5: Equip 2 MWD and 5 warp core stableizers Chapter 6: So you still got destroyed? Things you can do. See chap. 7 "Forum trolling and maintaining your carebear image"
YuuKnow	Posted - 2004.05.16 15:01:00 - [25] Originally by: Del Tarrant Please, please, please CCP don't make these deployable structures un-feasible for smaller corps to use! Almost everything in this game favours the larger alliances, but there are LOTS of players in EVE who prefer playing in smaller corps. Give us the chance to enjoy these new features too! I don't really see how that's likely. A small corp is not going to have the resources to invest, maintain, or protect these types of installations, no more that John Doe's Barber Shop could build and maintain a sky scraper or pivate island. These operations centers will almost undoubtedlly be TARGETS for pirates and rival corps. Protecting it will be expensive.
Deadflip2	Posted - 2004.05.16 15:13:00 - [26] Edited by: Deadflip2 on 16/05/2004 15:18:13 wanna know the truth about shiva? ccp will be havign a vacation till Q3 this year, then theyll come back, say its gonna be january, take another vacation till we all left eve shiva was to be released in feb, then it was may, the may/june, now Q3?! --- "this song reminds me of the girl i met on a schooltrip, she was really nice, and she really liked me. I forgot to ask her her phone number" - Nelix trist OMG im a pretzel!!!
digitalwanderer	Posted - 2004.05.16 15:40:00 - [27] Personally,i'd like to see the current conquerable station becoming as fully featured in terms of services offered,as those that you find in empire space...I'd bet you'd see a lot more fighting over them than what's currently the case.. Deployable stations are nice,but i'd be willing to bet that most will be setup in empire space,in 0.1 to 0.4 systems, which still has half decent ores to mine out of,especially if the corp in question doesn't have the resources to defend it at all times and for the most part,all they have to worry is having enough protection against NPC spawns,assuming they start spawning around planets and such...
YuuKnow	Posted - 2004.05.16 16:31:00 - [28] Originally by: digitalwanderer Personally,i'd like to see the current conquerable station becoming as fully featured in terms of services offered,as those that you find in empire space...I'd bet you'd see a lot more fighting over them than what's currently the case.. Deployable stations are nice,but i'd be willing to bet that most will be setup in empire space,in 0.1 to 0.4 systems, which still has half decent ores to mine out of,especially if the corp in question doesn't have the resources to defend it at all times and for the most part,all they have to worry is having enough protection against NPC spawns,assuming they start spawning around planets and such... If corps setup deployables in empire space there should be a tax or something.
Murple	Posted - 2004.05.16 16:32:00 - [29] Originally by: Demangel I know this probably wouldn't happen... But some of us used to debate this issue for days on end... and my point of view was: give corps/players/whatever the ability to: 1: Setup various defensive modules, IE make the station like a immobile ship complete with various offensive and defensive modules you can buy and install. 2: Hirable NPC defense forces. The more ISK you spend the better thier quality, and the faster they respawn. 3: Requires Battleships to be taken down... period. 4: On, and offline alerts, to email, and EVE mail and Concord message when a station belonging to your corp, or to you gets attacked. The offline alerts wouldn't be all that useful, but an ingame alert would help. 5: Stations should ONLY be attackable durring corp/alliance war situations, unless it is shown to require an enourmous force to take them down. Otherwise it can lead too WAY too many cases (even 2 cases is too many) of grief station killing. 6: Insurance, if stations can't be insured forget it... I will never condone building one... Too risky. 7: Players in space/station part of map needs to be REMOVED COMPLETELY! Otherwise a corp or alliance could just have someone watching the map till they spot a low number of players online around the station area, and start the attack. in other words, you should have to at LEAST send in a scout to determine if the system, is empty or low populated. This way it would discourage people from planning an attack for non peak hours when the enemy is sleeping, as they will have a harder time figuring out when that is. There are probably some other good suggesttions. I can live without suggestion #5, it kinda feels too arbitrary, but you gotta admit it's got some merrit what with all the grief play that one must admit DOES go on now and then . Loosing a 100 million BS to this crap is barely tolerable, but losing a station potentialy costing billions due to some pack of lamers you never even met in EVE, who decided it would be funny to hear your whines on the forums? Fuggeddaboudit... Even one or two such whine threads will put a nail in the coffin for Shiva/EVE... Maybe not bury it... but it will HURT. Also keep in mind, that for one, don't want stations to be care bear paradises... If they want thier station to be secure, they are gonna have to keep it in high sec... Tough ****. If a station can't be taken over or at least destroyed, then half the point of having a navy will be lost... I know CCP isn't thinking that they should be undamageable ETC, so I'm not worried, just wanna make my position clear :) How about a lock down feature. Once everyone is done using their base, they can lock it down which will cause everything to be unusable, yet divert all the power to sentry guns which will cause them to function like the sentry guns in empire space. This will make it impossible to destroy in lock down mode. This will force suprise attacks only when the base is in use and someone is guarding it. There will be a 20-60 minute lockdown timer of course to avoid exploitation of this feature. Gotta love my city-sized roid vacuum cleaner!*
Nikolai Reidar	Posted - 2004.05.16 16:47:00 - [30] I think the idea of hireable NPC mercenaries would be the coolest feature possible :D I also think that there should be the option of making publicly open stations, e.g. "freeports" so that for example you have a station in 0.0 space to visit which has been set up as a rare loot shop by a few enterprising freelancers. I think allowing the market option when docked on these deployables (and ESPECIALLY the existing conquerables) makes a lot of sense and allows these structures to be used more creatively (and gives a shot in the arm to those players who are less war-mongering.) :. http://eve.lividandgifted.com (In-game) :. ph33r my HORNETS OF D00M!!!!111

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