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War... What Is It Good For?

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JazWan Qoi	Posted - 2004.05.17 15:34:00 - [1] Edited by: JazWan Qoi on 17/05/2004 16:15:12 * FIRST OF ALL * too many people are reading just the title of this thread and not getting the real purpose. I WANT WAR!!! but... there needs to be standards! I don't know about you people, but I feel this war nonsense has got way out of hand. To the point where CCP has to look at it as being an expolit. War should not be about killing people, just so you can get free shots at players in Empire space. I get the feeling to many pks are tired of the low sec troubles and have now exploited war as an alternative. How can a 2 man corp star a war with a giant mega corp? This is stupid. All they want to accomplish is promote fear and perhaps wipe out a few indy ships. I now hear some corps hire these smaller corps to do their dirty business. I'm not talking about taking away war, and it's very hard to monitor and pull out the "legit" wars, but I feel there needs to be standards to start war. Why should any average Joe be able to declare war on anyone? Perhaps there should be a CEO skill? Or maybe a ratio of members to members that needs to be a certain percentage for war. Its stupid when about 99.9% of wars started in Eve have never been surrendered or ended. There should also be a peaceful end to war when the two sides never bother to attack eachother in a month. And... here's the best part... there should be ways to capture players and hold them as prisoners of war. Imagine that... not being able to play Eve until your corp ends the war and frees you. I'm sure there are some problems with that one, but nothing that cant be worked out. I'd love to hear all your thoughts on this.
Miso	Posted - 2004.05.17 15:43:00 - [2] My first thought on this, and this is not a flame, is that your an idiot. My second thought merely confirmed the first. -------------------------------------------- Dead
JazWan Qoi	Posted - 2004.05.17 15:47:00 - [3] Thanks for the "non-flame", but you obviously don't understand my thread, so please move on... perhaps to another game. I think Donkey Kong would suit your intelligence.
Rodge	Posted - 2004.05.17 15:47:00 - [4] Originally by: JazWan Qoi And... here's the best part... there should be ways to capture players and hold them as prisoners of war. Imagine that... not being able to play Eve until your corp ends the war and frees you. I'm sure there are some problems with that one, but nothing that cant be worked out. That idea is not going to work in any form. Why would anyone keep paying to play a game where they're locked in a jail and can't do anything? Alt wars are lame, certainly, but as long as it's in the game mechanics and the devs don't say it's an exploit, then it will go on happening. My solution to avoid alt-war abuse is to ban all alts. But that's not going to happen either anytime soon. [ 2005.04.17 00:34:30 ] Nagilam > u better leave Rodge, u will not gank any1 else 2nite......
Miso	Posted - 2004.05.17 15:49:00 - [5] Originally by: JazWan Qoi Thanks for the "non-flame", but you obviously don't understand my thread, so please move on... perhaps to another game. I think Donkey Kong would suit your intelligence. I think you need to move on. What you said was idiotic. Eve is a game with PvP. That means wars. If you don't like it, play something else. -------------------------------------------- Dead
Jarjar	Posted - 2004.05.17 15:50:00 - [6] Originally by: JazWan Qoi Thanks for the "non-flame", but you obviously don't understand my thread, so please move on... perhaps to another game. I think Donkey Kong would suit your intelligence. No offence, but I think that comments suits you better. Please move on to another game where you need to pay to NOT play. Also I see no problems with wars atm.
JazWan Qoi	Posted - 2004.05.17 15:50:00 - [7] Originally by: Rodge Originally by: JazWan Qoi And... here's the best part... there should be ways to capture players and hold them as prisoners of war. Imagine that... not being able to play Eve until your corp ends the war and frees you. I'm sure there are some problems with that one, but nothing that cant be worked out. That idea is not going to work in any form. Why would anyone keep paying to play a game where they're locked in a jail and can't do anything? Alt wars are lame, certainly, but as long as it's in the game mechanics and the devs don't say it's an exploit, then it will go on happening. My solution to avoid alt-war abuse is to ban all alts. But that's not going to happen either anytime soon. I understand the POW has some kinks in it, but I'm sure they can be wroked out... pehaps a time limit of a week? Anyway, they are just ideas to control what I feel is pure non-sense.
JazWan Qoi	Posted - 2004.05.17 15:51:00 - [8] Originally by: Miso Originally by: JazWan Qoi Thanks for the "non-flame", but you obviously don't understand my thread, so please move on... perhaps to another game. I think Donkey Kong would suit your intelligence. I think you need to move on. What you said was idiotic. Eve is a game with PvP. That means wars. If you don't like it, play something else. Are you in like 3rd grade... I want war, but there are wars out there that are complete idiotic. There needs to be standards Oh, btw... you dont need a war to PvP... that shows how much you really know. LOL
DeathBunny	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:00:00 - [9] Edited by: DeathBunny on 17/05/2004 16:02:10 EVE is war. War is EVE. You need the 2 to operate. Yes alt wars are lame but it happens. People hire others to kill of people that might of **ed them off. That happens. Yes half the wars you see are there and have been for ages and might never change (yes some very old wars still exist). Every war has an escuse, could be bored, saw you and aah yes theres someone to shoot easy kill for me in my free time. If they bug you enough move when you don't see them. Simple as that, not just next door talkin about half way across empire. Watch map learn map and check for systems not highly traveld during your playing time. BTW taking prisoners is well stupid. If the corp doesn't give a crap about you, you'd be stuck there for quiet a while unless you quit the corp to get away from the war. You can't do anything is a waste of money which CCP doesn't want people leaving because they are stuck in some prison cell. Agree with Miso on this your an idiot. Learn the ways or die like many have. Fear The Bunny**
Bohr	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:04:00 - [10] Edited by: Bohr on 17/05/2004 16:08:18 Originally by: Miso Eve is a game with PvP. That means wars. If you don't like it, play something else. PvP = Player vs. player. Now.. that is a whole lot more than just WAR!!!!(insert smiley banging his head against a wall). He actually has a good point about the way of exploiting war declarations. Try to comment on that instead of the neverending; "war is good", "war is fine", "EvE is nothing but war!!" Heavy trolling btw
Nafri	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:07:00 - [11] Originally by: JazWan Qoi Originally by: Miso Originally by: JazWan Qoi Thanks for the "non-flame", but you obviously don't understand my thread, so please move on... perhaps to another game. I think Donkey Kong would suit your intelligence. I think you need to move on. What you said was idiotic. Eve is a game with PvP. That means wars. If you don't like it, play something else. Are you in like 3rd grade... I want war, but there are wars out there that are complete idiotic. There needs to be standards Oh, btw... you dont need a war to PvP... that shows how much you really know. LOL ouch that hurts Wanna fly with me?
JazWan Qoi	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:08:00 - [12] Originally by: DeathBunny Edited by: DeathBunny on 17/05/2004 16:02:10 EVE is war. War is EVE. You need the 2 to operate. Yes alt wars are lame but it happens. People hire others to kill of people that might of ****ed them off. That happens. Yes half the wars you see are there and have been for ages and might never change (yes some very old wars still exist). Every war has an escuse, could be bored, saw you and aah yes theres someone to shoot easy kill for me in my free time. If they bug you enough move when you don't see them. Simple as that, not just next door talkin about half way across empire. Watch map learn map and check for systems not highly traveld during your playing time. BTW taking prisoners is well stupid. If the corp doesn't give a crap about you, you'd be stuck there for quiet a while unless you quit the corp to get away from the war. You can't do anything is a waste of money which CCP doesn't want people leaving because they are stuck in some prison cell. Agree with Miso on this your an idiot. Learn the ways or die like many have. LOL... Can't anyone have any ideas anymore... Thanks for actually spending time to give me a detailed and imformative answer, but ending it with such haste shows you're just as retarted as the rest. I spend time and work had to get new skills, new items, new ships... if it takes you time to aquire a battleship, why not have it take time to acuire a declaration of war skill? Its not that hard to understand... and it'll stop these alt wars, and make the game better. Besides... players have been known to quit when lamers start alt wars... so yes, this is a problem.
Falbala	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:18:00 - [13] JazWan, wars are declared for: -territory or economics reasons (for example if you come sell stuff in the same station than another corp but 1k cheaper so their order vanishes until you sell your stuff), -roleplay reasons (for example PIE against the Minmattars) -Pvp Reasons (friendly corps often declare war just for Pvp fun) -assassination (they want the corpse of one of your corps mate, this is why a small corp attacks a big corp) -others reasons (yes griefing is one) Without wars you would see ore thiefs corps, scammer corps, market griefing corps and a lot of other things you don't even want to know. You would see corps come kill people randomly in 0.0 then go back safely in empire space to mine. Also people don't declare war on small corps. Maybe there are some exceptions but why would someone spend time hunting MrNobody and his 3 members corp? I created my corp after 2 days of game and never had any war declared on me after 5 monthes lol. If you are concerned about this for your corp then you should join an alliance.
Gib Goblin	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:24:00 - [14] Quote: There should also be a peaceful end to war when the two sides never bother to attack eachother in a month. I believe this idea in its simplest form has merit. Simple creating a timer when a war is declared. Reset the count to zero each time one or other corp makes an attack. The timer could be set for say 4 weeks. So that after a month a war become resolved through zero conflict. Gib -- Vice Admiral - Military Command -- -- --- --- ---- ----- ------ I don't 'do' dead. ------ ----- ---- --- --- --
Silverlancer	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:25:00 - [15] In a perfect world, war would be able to be declared for any reason other than griefing. In EVE of course, thats completely impossible. The corp could always claim that "they were paid" or some other excuse. What I think is that there should be a way for a corp to get out of a war that is declared on them. It should be costly, maybe as costly as an actual war. Maybe if not a single ship is killed on a particular side in 2 weeks the war ends. So that would mean that the corp warred upon would have to cease ALL OPERATIONS to avoid being killed. And once the war ends due to this, no war could be declared for a month.
Maud Dib	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:30:00 - [16] Edited by: Maud Dib on 17/05/2004 16:42:19 There are a lot of reasons why people aren't responding to your post. 1. This topic has already been beaten to death several times. 2. You look like an alt and posting with an alt is ghey. 3. Most people suspect you have just been WTFPWNED in a corp war and thats why your here. 4. You say war isn't about killing people but thats exactly what it's about. 5. The idea to capture people is perhaps the worst idea ever posted here and that's saying a lot. 6. There are a good many people in EVE who are worried that slowly many of the ex-EnBer's will complain enough to get PvP mostly destroyed. They may be wrong and you may not be an ex-EnBer but it certainly smells that way. Hope this helps.
Cartiff	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:32:00 - [17] Originally by: Miso My first thought on this, and this is not a flame, is that your an idiot. My second thought merely confirmed the first. LMAO that made me laugh so loud Cartiff, CEO Euphoria Released NBSI 4TW
Lord Frost	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:33:00 - [18] I can see a point here somewhere. A skill to declare war is a good idea. People aquire everything else in EVE, why not aquire a skill to enable a CEO to declare war? Thats a very simple solution in my opinion.
Falbala	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:34:00 - [19] Originally by: Lord Frost I can see a point here somewhere. A skill to declare war is a good idea. People aquire everything else in EVE, why not aquire a skill to enable a CEO to declare war? Thats a very simple solution in my opinion. Sorry, but a solution to what problem?
Lord Frost	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:38:00 - [20] Sorry, but a solution to what problem? You... the above... are an idiot.
Shevaun Ashnirelim	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:38:00 - [21] The problem with trying to "justify" wars, is that 95% of people who have war declared against them will claim that it is because of griefing and try to get it stopped on that reason. This is why CCP will never, ever, in a million years give in to your deranged requests that every war have some sort of reason behind it other than "fun" or "killing you". War will never be declared an exploit. Lie back, relax. Think of England.
Falbala	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:41:00 - [22] Originally by: Lord Frost Sorry, but a solution to what problem? You... the above... are an idiot. Alright I am an idiot. Now would you be kind and explain to me what the problem is that you want to solve?
Bohr	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:45:00 - [23] Originally by: Shevaun Ashnirelim The problem with trying to "justify" wars, is that 95% of people who have war declared against them will claim that it is because of griefing and try to get it stopped on that reason. This is why CCP will never, ever, in a million years give in to your deranged requests that every war have some sort of reason behind it other than "fun" or "killing you". War will never be declared an exploit. Lie back, relax. Think of England. As well as 95% of the combat chars will be for it And yes, war in EvE, given that there is an amount of roleplay in it, can have a reason. And why d i have to think about England?
Istvaan Shogaatsu	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:50:00 - [24] Probably for the best that you don't know the origin of that quote. As for roleplay - I'm probably one of the bigger roleplayers/fiction nerds in the Eve community and I don't feel that wars need RP-justification either. If I want to fight for the pure thrill of hearing people scream obscenities at me as their ship comes apart around them, that is perfectly reasonable justification. Remember - you are no-one to dictate what is "right" and what is "wrong" when it comes to war declarations - if you object, declare a war of your own and take the fight to your enemy.
Miso	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:56:00 - [25] Originally by: Maud Dib Edited by: Maud Dib on 17/05/2004 16:42:19 There are a lot of reasons why people aren't responding to your post. 1. This topic has already been beaten to death several times. 2. You look like an alt and posting with an alt is ghey. 3. Most people suspect you have just been WTFPWNED in a corp war and thats why your here. 4. You say war isn't about killing people but thats exactly what it's about. 5. The idea to capture people is perhaps the worst idea ever posted here and that's saying a lot. 6. There are a good many people in EVE who are worried that slowly many of the ex-EnBer's will complain enough to get PvP mostly destroyed. They may be wrong and you may not be an ex-EnBer but it certainly smells that way. Hope this helps. Exactly. :) -------------------------------------------- Dead
Bohr	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:57:00 - [26] Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu Probably for the best that you don't know the origin of that quote. As for roleplay - I'm probably one of the bigger roleplayers/fiction nerds in the Eve community and I don't feel that wars need RP-justification either. If I want to fight for the pure thrill of hearing people scream obscenities at me as their ship comes apart around them, that is perfectly reasonable justification. Remember - you are no-one to dictate what is "right" and what is "wrong" when it comes to war declarations - if you object, declare a war of your own and take the fight to your enemy. As well as you now are dictating that war is about the only way in EvE People have different ideas of what they want from this game. Don't see why they can't have their part of space (i.e highsec).
Lord Frost	Posted - 2004.05.17 16:57:00 - [27] Originally by: Falbala Originally by: Lord Frost Sorry, but a solution to what problem? You... the above... are an idiot. Alright I am an idiot. Now would you be kind and explain to me what the problem is that you want to solve? There is no problem, I was just pointing out that it makes sense to train a skill to declare war if your CEO has to train for such other things like ethnic relations. Why give a noob the power to declare war? War is the most powerful experience in EVE.
Falbala	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:04:00 - [28] Originally by: Lord Frost Originally by: Falbala Originally by: Lord Frost Sorry, but a solution to what problem? You... the above... are an idiot. Alright I am an idiot. Now would you be kind and explain to me what the problem is that you want to solve? There is no problem, I was just pointing out that it makes sense to train a skill to declare war if your CEO has to train for such other things like ethnic relations. Why give a noob the power to declare war? War is the most powerful experience in EVE. Exactly. There is no problem. You are trying to solve inexistant problems and I am the idiot. And since when newbies can grief experienced players? Do you think megacorps are in danger because a newbie could come tomorrow and declare war on them?
Istvaan Shogaatsu	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:06:00 - [29] Because, Bohr - if you make a part of Eve that wars cannot extend to, you essentially give a home to all people who want to gain resources exponentially without the fear of being attacked. All reward, zero risk. Such an area would rapidly become home to every carebear in Eve, allowing them to wage economic war on those outside without fear of repercussion. Remember that war is not only a way for griefers to cruelly murder innocent doe-eyed carebears - it is also an element in that economic warfare. What happens when one economically oriented corporation hires a band of cutthroat pirates to harass and attack their competition? I know from first-hand experience that this happens. If some corporations are allowed a safe haven, then they are effectively immune from that aspect of the game which helps serve as a check and balance against runaway expansion.
Miso	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:08:00 - [30] Edited by: Miso on 17/05/2004 17:51:43 I think CCP should introduce ammunition that has suckers on the end, so that the round sticks to the targets ship, but doesn't injure anyone... Or maybe a tachyon laser which when you fire it unfurls a banner in space with BANG! on it? -------------------------------------------- Dead
DeathBunny	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:11:00 - [31] Originally by: JazWan Qoi LOL... Can't anyone have any ideas anymore... Thanks for actually spending time to give me a detailed and imformative answer, but ending it with such haste shows you're just as retarted as the rest. I spend time and work had to get new skills, new items, new ships... if it takes you time to aquire a battleship, why not have it take time to acuire a declaration of war skill? Its not that hard to understand... and it'll stop these alt wars, and make the game better. Besides... players have been known to quit when lamers start alt wars... so yes, this is a problem. May be retarted (even though did finish in haste since I'm at work), but my friends my only call me that. If you want a non-alt war keep up the ** you might have one in the near future maybe from us maybe from others. Who knows what the future will bring upon your corp now. Fear The Bunny**
DeathBunny	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:12:00 - [32] Originally by: Miso I think CCP should introduce ammunition that has suckers on the end, so that the round sticks to the targets ship, but doesn't injure anyone... Or maybe a tachyon laser which when you fire it unfurls a banner is space with BANG! on it? LOL you carebare you j/k *Fear The Bunny*
Shevaun Ashnirelim	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:15:00 - [33] Miso gives me space-wood.
Falbala	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:17:00 - [34] Another skill wouldn't solve the alt wars problem since the ceo being an alt, this is just another skill to get, it could slow down the process for a few days but nothing more.
Lord Frost	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:30:00 - [35] Like I said before... it makes sense to aquire a skill to delcare war. I'm not afraid of noobs, nor your little punk behind... but I have an open mind... unlike some people here. You see things one way... try and look at it from both perspectives. Noobs declaring war IS a problem... Alts declaring war IS a problem. Maybe not for me, but for smaller corps just starting. Players in their corps may leave... and may even leave game. If you want PvP... go to low sec... but declaring war on a corp JUST to kill innocent noobs... well, thats a shame you have to sink that low... but hey, if thats your thrill... be my guest. That just proves to me you cant hang with the big boys. So in other words... for me, there is no problem... but yes, there are war issues in EVE. Some are a problem. I can't start playing EVE and right off get a level 3 agent... No, I have to earn him, earn faction respect. A skill to train declaration of war seems to me to be pretty reasonable. Open your mind... open your heart!
plasmadump	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:47:00 - [36] Originally by: Maud Dib Edited by: Maud Dib on 17/05/2004 16:42:19 There are a lot of reasons why people aren't responding to your post. 1. This topic has already been beaten to death several times. 2. You look like an alt and posting with an alt is ghey. 3. Most people suspect you have just been WTFPWNED in a corp war and thats why your here. 4. You say war isn't about killing people but thats exactly what it's about. 5. The idea to capture people is perhaps the worst idea ever posted here and that's saying a lot. 6. There are a good many people in EVE who are worried that slowly many of the ex-EnBer's will complain enough to get PvP mostly destroyed. They may be wrong and you may not be an ex-EnBer but it certainly smells that way. Hope this helps. hey, i am an ex-EnBer, and i actually wanted PvP in enb, of course, if i knew about eve at the time, my born on date would be a lot older. this game and its features blow enb away by far. just like in life, war is a vital part of economy. this game is definitely a reality game, except that in real life, god doesnt add stuff so that "bad people" cant cause trouble in big cities. sigh -- plasmadump hunter - gatherer - Anarchy 99
Falbala	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:49:00 - [37] The best solution to fix the alt corps is to remove the alts. About your skill, it could solve something if it was required to have another corp declare war on you. But then, you would see ore thieves corps, hangar thieves making their own corps too and a lot of other nasty stuff. It won't solve anything if the ceo of the alt corp needs a specific skill. The ceo will learn it, even if it takes 30 days of learning.
Bohr	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:52:00 - [38] Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu Because, Bohr - if you make a part of Eve that wars cannot extend to, you essentially give a home to all people who want to gain resources exponentially without the fear of being attacked. All reward, zero risk. Such an area would rapidly become home to every carebear in Eve, allowing them to wage economic war on those outside without fear of repercussion. Remember that war is not only a way for griefers to cruelly murder innocent doe-eyed carebears - it is also an element in that economic warfare. What happens when one economically oriented corporation hires a band of cutthroat pirates to harass and attack their competition? I know from first-hand experience that this happens. If some corporations are allowed a safe haven, then they are effectively immune from that aspect of the game which helps serve as a check and balance against runaway expansion. I see your point and it's valid. But remember that highsec mining pays nowhere near what you can dig up in 0.0 plus trade and building is low profit compared to selling ammo at a 0.0 outpost, with only "the uber-rich pkers and alliance folks" as your neighbors. I also think some migration to 0.0 eventually will happen as a natural part of the game. I.e the corp of which i'm a member (50 more less active members, 6 months old) consists of mainly 3 month old players. Mostly miners, traders, manufacturers and a couple scientists. People any society is very interested in offering their protection, as they may turn out a profitable investment. However. Lately we have seen ourselves forced to seek membership of a 0.0 alliance. First of all to keep hold of the members who are on their way to be fair fighters or good miners, and second, but also very importantly, if our corp is to have any success in this game. "Experienced" players migrating to the unprotected territories, and what follows in its wake, will happen as a part of EvE. The whole setup of the EvE universe, forces people into it at some point. Another thing is; all these good arguments for combat and corp wars, are mainly by players who have been around for a year and well established as alliance members or ample fighters, and from what i hear, "filthy rich". They would never suffer the same consequences from losing a bs as a 2-3 month old char. Not a lot of them have been in the situation of being "the n00b with no experience compared to all the others", mainly cause they we're in the game from say month one or two. A little further than "my own nose sight" from them would be much appreciated each time this topic arises.
Miso	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:52:00 - [39] Originally by: Shevaun Ashnirelim Miso gives me space-wood. Is that good or bad? -------------------------------------------- Dead
Istvaan Shogaatsu	Posted - 2004.05.17 17:57:00 - [40] I vehemently disagree with your assertion that it is harder to make money in empire space. By means of mining, definitely, but mining is just one of many activities one may undertake - there's also trading, manufacture, and a number of other activities I probably shouldn't mention which have made me pleasantly wealthy without my main character leaving empire space very often at all. A smart player can make billions sitting in the heart of secure space, and lose absolutely nothing if your wish for an oasis becomes true. Thus it will never happen.
Lord Frost	Posted - 2004.05.17 18:01:00 - [41] Let me ask you this? Do you think its a problem that 99% of wars started have yet to end? Or that probably in only 30% of wars declared people actually fight? Or is it a problem when 1 guys declares war and then quits corp, and declares war again in another corp, and then quits again? and so on and so on... leaving corps with wars impossible to fight, impossible to end. These are problems and issues that need attending. Just like gate campers. It wasn't entirely take out of the game, but yet it was attended to, and changed. I dont know about you, but I wont be training an alt 30+ days just so I can declare war. It may slow down the process to some, but it will detur many others. Its a valid option CCP can look at, along with some others. But I think we all agree, there ARE SOME problems with the war scenario. If you cant see that then you're blind.
Falbala	Posted - 2004.05.17 18:12:00 - [42] This would give all the power to the pvp corps and make the problem you are trying to solve even bigger. It could be 30 days I guarantee you that the pvp corps will learn it. And yes, the non pvp corps wouldn't learn it, making them more vulnerable to the others attacks.
Bohr	Posted - 2004.05.17 18:15:00 - [43] Edited by: Bohr on 17/05/2004 18:17:57 Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu I vehemently disagree with your assertion that it is harder to make money in empire space. By means of mining, definitely, but mining is just one of many activities one may undertake - there's also trading, manufacture, and a number of other activities I probably shouldn't mention which have made me pleasantly wealthy without my main character leaving empire space very often at all. A smart player can make billions sitting in the heart of secure space, and lose absolutely nothing if your wish for an oasis becomes true. Thus it will never happen. I would like to know how a 2 month old builder can make billions in empire space? Plus i doubt you'll find a lot of the 10-12 month old players enjoying EvE in highsec.
Lord Frost	Posted - 2004.05.17 18:20:00 - [44] Originally by: Falbala This would give all the power to the pvp corps and make the problem you are trying to solve even bigger. It could be 30 days I guarantee you that the pvp corps will learn it. And yes, the non pvp corps wouldn't learn it, making them more vulnerable to the others attacks. I dont see how not learning the skill would make you more vulnerable... you dont need the skill to be at war... just to DECLARE war. There would be no advantage to PvP corps... especially if CCP would restrict corps to only 1 or 2 wars at a time... (maybe based on skill ofcourse).
McWatt	Posted - 2004.05.17 18:43:00 - [45] Originally by: Miso My first thought on this, and this is not a flame, is that your an idiot. My second thought merely confirmed the first. seconded. we need: * single player wars * something to war over. (lab/factory slots?) * war slot number based on corp size * more punishment for ppl who avoid wars (just keep it active for a couple of weeks) we don t need even more restrictions on the system.
Falbala	Posted - 2004.05.18 01:52:00 - [46] Originally by: Lord Frost Originally by: Falbala This would give all the power to the pvp corps and make the problem you are trying to solve even bigger. It could be 30 days I guarantee you that the pvp corps will learn it. And yes, the non pvp corps wouldn't learn it, making them more vulnerable to the others attacks. I dont see how not learning the skill would make you more vulnerable... you dont need the skill to be at war... just to DECLARE war. There would be no advantage to PvP corps... especially if CCP would restrict corps to only 1 or 2 wars at a time... (maybe based on skill ofcourse). Someone declares war on you and you win. Then they stop the war you can't continue fighting. Someone steals your corp and makes a new corp. Then you can't declare war on the new corp. You and 3 other corps share a station. A pirate corp come and declares war on your corp, then when you are dead the second corp, then the third corp. The 3 ceos wouldn't have time to train fast enough to be able to declare war on the same time on the pirate corp. Do you need more examples?
W1rlW1nd	Posted - 2004.05.18 02:36:00 - [47] Quote: War should not be about killing people OMG... that is my favorite stupidest quote of the year! Quote: How can a 2 man corp star a war with a giant mega corp? This is stupid. All they want to accomplish is promote fear if 2 players can cause fear in an entire mega corp, or cause fear in ANY corp of any size, the CEO of that corp should step down and end himself immediately. even a 2 man corp should not be afraid of another 2 man corp declaring war on them.
PaulAtreides	Posted - 2004.05.18 03:40:00 - [48] Someone once said: Violence has resolved more conflicts than anything else. The contrary opinion that violence doesn't solve anything is mearly wishful thinking at its worst! Want to work for me?
Seleene	Posted - 2004.05.18 05:41:00 - [49] Originally by: PaulAtreides Someone once said: Violence has resolved more conflicts than anything else. The contrary opinion that violence doesn't solve anything is mearly wishful thinking at its worst! Agreed. I also agree with Miso's original post on this thread. I would like to point out that not everyone has a negative reaction to war being declared against them either. There are times when BDCI's targets have weclomed the challange and met us head on. So what if they end up chasing ghosts and getting smacked around, it's still a lot of fun. Oh, do I need to explain that last part in more detail? PvP = FUN. While I understand the point the original poster is trying to make, my opinion obviously differs. - T2 Weapons Testing in progress! Volunteer today!
Geomys Arenarius	Posted - 2004.05.18 07:16:00 - [50] Originally by: W1rlW1nd Quote: War should not be about killing people OMG... that is my favorite stupidest quote of the year! Quote: How can a 2 man corp star a war with a giant mega corp? This is stupid. All they want to accomplish is promote fear if 2 players can cause fear in an entire mega corp, or cause fear in ANY corp of any size, the CEO of that corp should step down and end himself immediately. even a 2 man corp should not be afraid of another 2 man corp declaring war on them. I agree that war shouldn't be about killing people. Wars should be about objectives. I don't agree with the quote about a 2 man war however. Depending on what they are trying to achieve, two man wars can work against large corporations. Attacking lone haulers for example would hit them financially and they could extort money. This war isn't about killing and if they can extort money without any fighting or other expense, it's clearly been very successful. Quote: those skilled in war subdue the enemy's army without battle. They capture his cities without assaulting them and overthrow his state without protracted operations.
F'nog	Posted - 2004.05.18 07:48:00 - [51] I think there should be some changes to the way war is declared. As some I refuse to name posted elsewhere, there should be a a cost to declaring war in ISK, that goes to the winner when it is over, as well as a time limit, so if nothing happens after awhile it ends. My corp has something like 7 wars against us, and we only ever see members from about 2 of those corps in space. The rest we've never seen. How stupid is that? If you're gonna declare war, you should at least be able to attack us. And declaring war from a 2-person corp is just stupid. One 2-man corp declared war on us, and then called it unfair when we destroyed his ship (not his pod). Another 2-man corp declared war on us, and one of our members promptly destroyed his Tempest. He withdrew the war the next day. How stupid is this? If you're gonna declare war, make it count. Don't whine that you're outnumbered, and don't do it not knowing the capabilities of your enemy. At least if there were an ISK cost to declaring wars, there would be some thought to it beforehand. As it is now, it's just rediculous. Anyone can declare war on anyone else, on the remote hopes that they may encounter their enemy in space and get to fight them. I think if there were a time limit, all of our wars would have expired by now. How much fun is that?
Geomys Arenarius	Posted - 2004.05.18 08:25:00 - [52] Originally by: F'nog And declaring war from a 2-person corp is just stupid. One 2-man corp declared war on us, and then called it unfair when we destroyed his ship (not his pod). Another 2-man corp declared war on us, and one of our members promptly destroyed his Tempest. He withdrew the war the next day. How stupid is this? LOL. The 2-man corps in the examples are very stupid, agreed. But it doesn't prove your statement that "declaring war from a 2-person corp is just stupid" of course. Quote: Anyone can declare war on anyone else, on the remote hopes that they may encounter their enemy in space and get to fight them. Yup. I think a lot of players would prefer a war system with more substance.
Bohr	Posted - 2004.05.18 09:47:00 - [53] Originally by: PaulAtreides Someone once said: Violence has resolved more conflicts than anything else. The contrary opinion that violence doesn't solve anything is mearly wishful thinking at its worst! tsk tsk tsk.... What violence often does is postpone, never "solve" In EvE that's a whole other matter.

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