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Captain Plumb
Gallente
Twisted Inc.
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Posted - 2008.07.09 09:17:00 -
[1]
I'm currently training into HIC's for my main and have both Caldari and Gallente Cruiser V. Im specced towards Caldari ships with the majority of my shield skills at V apart from the resistance skills at IV. My question is to those with experience flying HIC's: Which HIC out of the phobos or onyx would you recommend? Training up Armor tanking skills for the phobos is not an issue for me as i have to do those sometime soon anyway.
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Triksterism
Gallente
Image Not Found
Coalition of the Chillin
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Posted - 2008.07.09 09:37:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Triksterism on 09/07/2008 09:38:35
 Originally by: Captain Plumb
I'm currently training into HIC's for my main and have both Caldari and Gallente Cruiser V. Im specced towards Caldari ships with the majority of my shield skills at V apart from the resistance skills at IV. My question is to those with experience flying HIC's: Which HIC out of the phobos or onyx would you recommend? Training up Armor tanking skills for the phobos is not an issue for me as i have to do those sometime soon anyway.
[Phobos[
Great lock time
Worst tank out of the 4 HICs (but still nice)
Cap boosters....
Shit damage if you want to have a decent tank
[Onyx]
No web
2nd best HIC tank
Decent damage
No speed module
I personally fly a Phobos (training Caldari, Minmatar and Amarr Cruisers asap by the way). I have no real complaints about it as long as you know what you're doing. In lowsec you'll need a 300km off gate bookmark if you plan to sit there for a while, or someone to constantly wheel you in cap booster 800s to run your tank OR a Guardian/Oneiros.
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Crellion
Art of War
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Posted - 2008.07.09 10:44:00 -
[3]
Buy an Onyx for 0.0 and a Phobos for low sec.
Arguably my opinions represent to an extent the opinions of my alliance and in particular circumstances give rise to a valid "casus belli" claim. |
Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari
Wreckless Abandon
Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.07.09 12:16:00 -
[4]
Try both - I prefer the Phobos because of the Moa hull.
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GO BLUE!! |
Lagerstars
Caldari
Repo Industries
R.E.P.O.
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Posted - 2008.07.09 14:46:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
Try both - I prefer the Phobos because of the Moa hull.
You mean the Onyx cos of the Moa hull ;)
Ive looked at both and can fly both well but much prefer the Onyx as the missiles have range for damage instead of having to sacrifice cap to burn toward a target and get up close.
The Onyx also has a good passive tank, saving cap for the all important scrambling and with HIC 4 scrams out to 28,800
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NateX
The Movement
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Posted - 2008.07.09 14:54:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Lagerstars
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
Try both - I prefer the Phobos because of the Moa hull.
You mean the Onyx cos of the Moa hull ;)
no i think hes right, the phobos BECAUSE the moa hull is ugly
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ElCoCo
KIA Corp
KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.09 15:01:00 -
[7]
Phobos if you want to go for midslots with mwd/capinjector,web,sensorbooster,eccm.
Onyx for every other application 
Boink! |
Celeritas 5k
Caldari
Initrode
The Core Collective
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Posted - 2008.07.09 15:25:00 -
[8]
The beautiful thing about the onyx is that it bypasses one of the classic caldari dilemmas by moving your warp scram to a high slot. That, plus 6 mids, plus the tanking bonus makes it the hardest tanking ship I've ever flown.
It's really too slow to fit a web; you're never going to be close enough to a nano to use it anyway. I usually just do my bubble thing and let my friends lock them down
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Always be Happy, Never be satisfied. |
Grimpak
Gallente
Trinity Nova
Trinity Nova Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.09 15:39:00 -
[9]
phobos for lo/hi-sec pvp, onyx for 0.0 pvp.
all 4 HIC's are good, but the split is actually the shield tanking ones vs the armor tanking ones.
---
Quote:
The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.
ain't that right. |
BiggestT
Caldari
Fun Inc
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Posted - 2008.07.09 15:49:00 -
[10]
onyx all the way.
capless weapons
its tank is not only strong but it recharges *gasp* making it better allround as its capless
black moa hull = uberness (you gotta love it, i know u do)
it doesnt look secsually explicit 
ppl may say a devoter is superior but i prefer onyx simply coz it can recharge hp without cap, so u dont need a logistics to keep u going/cap stable.
poudly annoying fc's since 2007 |
PK Geheegan
Destructive Influence
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.07.09 21:17:00 -
[11]
Having flown both, they are quite different and as an earlier poster said, the split is between Armour and Shield tanking.
Phobos is nice for fairly static bubbling. Can pump out a lot of damage with blasters but very hard to fit a big plate. Nice resists though. Great for station camping!
The Onyx is like a overcharged Cerb. 6 mids = MWD, web, invul and 3 LSE. You can speed fit in lows giving a superb alround capability. Spped, tank and a bit of damage as well.
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Rajere
No Trademark
The OSS
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Posted - 2008.07.18 18:49:00 -
[12]
Quote:
Buy an Onyx for 0.0 and a Phobos for low sec.
Uh. Reverse those. Onyx for lowsec (buffer tank = passive shield regen), dual 1600 Plated Phobos for 0.0. The only time I'd recommend phobos over the Onyx for low sec is if you are 100% solo since the lack of DPS from the Onyx would limit your targets. Even then the Phobos is a double edged sword.
I've been flying the phobos since the day HICs were released (gallente/Amarr spec'd) and trained Caldari Frigate IV / Caldari Cruiser V from 0 sp in caldari specifically for the Onyx (and ok the Falcon too).
The only advantage the phobos has is that it's the Highest DPS HIC. This may lead you to believe it can solo more things under sentry fire than other HICs, but not really. It has the weakest tank and in low sec you'll need dual MARII / cap 800 setup, meaning you have to warp off the gate after fights to conserve your cap boosters and you won't have room for loot. Also if you're camping a gate you may as well run a standard 24km point in your mids which pretty much nullifies the point of using a HIC to begin with, may as well use a BC. The phobos has decent DPS (gank cruiser level), but only at 3-5km blaster range. Outside of that you're doing nothing. So you're at the center of a gate and your scout alt sees something jumping through. It's going to appear somewhere @ 18km away from you. Now you have to make a judgement call, to burn towards the target and toss on a standard point to hold them till you get in blaster range or immediately apply your big point out of fear they are stabbed. Applying the big point severely hinders your ability to get into blaster range by killing your speed, and if you go ahead with your infipoint and your victim gets a web on you before you close to blaster range, well, he just has to point/web and stay out of range, the sentry guns will finish you off once your 800s are gone.
Not only is the Onyx better in lowsec, it's also great in 0.0 as well. The only way the Phobos can compete is by buffer tanking like mad. This allows a phobos to turn off your bubble (30seconds), deagress (60 seconds) and jump if the situation calls for it. The Onyx's tank let's it do that already, without the agility/speed penalties dual 1600's and trimarks have on a phobos.
NOTR
How to Fail at Eve
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Trojanman190
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.07.18 19:00:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Rajere
Quote:
Buy an Onyx for 0.0 and a Phobos for low sec.
Uh. Reverse those. Onyx for lowsec (buffer tank = passive shield regen), dual 1600 Plated Phobos for 0.0. The only time I'd recommend phobos over the Onyx for low sec is if you are 100% solo since the lack of DPS from the Onyx would limit your targets. Even then the Phobos is a double edged sword.
I've been flying the phobos since the day HICs were released (gallente/Amarr spec'd) and trained Caldari Frigate IV / Caldari Cruiser V from 0 sp in caldari specifically for the Onyx (and ok the Falcon too).
The only advantage the phobos has is that it's the Highest DPS HIC. This may lead you to believe it can solo more things under sentry fire than other HICs, but not really. It has the weakest tank and in low sec you'll need dual MARII / cap 800 setup, meaning you have to warp off the gate after fights to conserve your cap boosters and you won't have room for loot. Also if you're camping a gate you may as well run a standard 24km point in your mids which pretty much nullifies the point of using a HIC to begin with, may as well use a BC. The phobos has decent DPS (gank cruiser level), but only at 3-5km blaster range. Outside of that you're doing nothing. So you're at the center of a gate and your scout alt sees something jumping through. It's going to appear somewhere @ 18km away from you. Now you have to make a judgement call, to burn towards the target and toss on a standard point to hold them till you get in blaster range or immediately apply your big point out of fear they are stabbed. Applying the big point severely hinders your ability to get into blaster range by killing your speed, and if you go ahead with your infipoint and your victim gets a web on you before you close to blaster range, well, he just has to point/web and stay out of range, the sentry guns will finish you off once your 800s are gone.
Not only is the Onyx better in lowsec, it's also great in 0.0 as well. The only way the Phobos can compete is by buffer tanking like mad. This allows a phobos to turn off your bubble (30seconds), deagress (60 seconds) and jump if the situation calls for it. The Onyx's tank let's it do that already, without the agility/speed penalties dual 1600's and trimarks have on a phobos.
Why reverse them? You can't bubble in lowsec so your lock time is important for catching stuff. So at least a sensor booster, maybe two. This would make the phobos the best choice. The onyx can bubble in 0.0 meaning it can use it's full tank out there.
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Katrina Kali
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Posted - 2008.07.18 20:42:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Katrina Kali on 18/07/2008 20:42:21
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Rajere
No Trademark
The OSS
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Posted - 2008.07.18 20:44:00 -
[15]
Quote:
Why reverse them? You can't bubble in lowsec so your lock time is important for catching stuff. So at least a sensor booster, maybe two. This would make the phobos the best choice. The onyx can bubble in 0.0 meaning it can use it's full tank out there.
Because the Onyx (and to a certain extend broadsword) are better suited for it? if your concept of "low sec" means going after every macro courier mission-runner and catching their imicus's and iteron IIs so you can steal their Dolls, then by all means go with the dual sensor boosters. There's nothing stopping you from fitting sensor boosters on an Onyx though. It would weaken its tank, so you'd have to warp to a bm off the gate between fights, but the phobos already has to do that. Difference in that situation is the Onyx tank regens while you wait for the next target to jump in, while the phobos relies on cap 800s to rep up.
If you aren't too concerned about missing tackles on random frigates, then your Onyx can sit on the gates indefinitely permatanking the sentries while also collecting loot from the wrecks and applying their full damage to anything they get they get their big point on without needing to move off of the gate.
NOTR
How to Fail at Eve
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2008.07.18 21:01:00 -
[16]
Err, slight misunderstanding here: the infini-point does NOT kill your speed, only the area bubble does.
As for which to use: Onyx for everything but solo. A proper buffer-tanked Onyx gets only slightly less HP than a dual-1600mm plate Phobos, with all the advantages of a self-regenerating shield tank. The Phobos is only good if you're solo and need the extra dps.
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Rajere
No Trademark
The OSS
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Posted - 2008.07.18 21:16:00 -
[17]
erm durr. /facepalm. low sec/0.0 bubble point it all blends together ya know.
NOTR
How to Fail at Eve
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