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Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1242
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Posted - 2012.03.17 01:11:00 -
[1] - Quote
So looking at the huge number of pro mittens for CSM 7 goon posts I have a serious question. We know why goons support mittens and we can sure expect them to vote for him.
But does anyone expect non-goon aligned or non-pro-goon pilots to be convinced to support him by the pro goon posts?
It seems pretty unlikely to me and in fact the volume of them might have a backlash.
Not an attack, just a pondering about the expectations of the pro mittens brigade and maybe a request from the non-aligned player base as to the affect the pro mittens post had on their voting choice.
Just wondering...
Issler |

Johnny Marzetti
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
313
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Posted - 2012.03.17 01:40:00 -
[2] - Quote
Several of them have posted in his thread, including at least one self-identified hisec carebear. Now, maybe they are goon alts or something but if they are then I don't know of it. Of course, I could be lying also, so it all depends on how well you've wrapped your tinfoil. Also, I believe most of his votes for CSM6 actually came from outside of GSF, since he and Vile Rat split the GSF vote.
The fact is (and almost nobody will even consider this possibility but oh well), he really is there to represent a certain style of gameplay that many people in Eve desire. He is not there to advance his own alliance at the cost of others. His constituents are not his alliance, though most of his alliance are his constituents.
As evidence, I would point to the fact that he has strongly supported a technetium moon nerf of some kind. While GSF does not have the most tech moons, we have more than almost every other sov holding alliance including quite a few that hate us. Tech moons basically make our alliance outrageously wealthy. This is absurdly unbalanced and makes the game less fun for everyone.
People who are open minded about that see him as incredibly effective at getting CCP management to listen to players' needs, particularly the needs of players in null. Effectiveness is more important than just about anything else, because the CSM is not about advancing your cause over other players' causes so much as it is about getting CCP to give the players what they want rather than what CCP management thinks they want. Effectiveness comes from diplomacy, having a clear set of priorities, and knowing who to befriend at CCP (basically the hard working devs who've been giving us a great game when the upper management let them).
There are some people in certain alliances who simply cannot fathom that this is what the CSM is about, and instead believe that Mittens is there forcing CCP to nerf Titans or some other tinfoil pants on head stupidity. It is just hilarious how dumb their posting is, because it shows they have no clear understanding of what the CSM does or even how a business like CCP needs to operate. It's inconceivable to them that Mittens could be doing anything other than advancing the interests of his alliance at the expense of the game as a whole because it's exactly what they would do, nothing less.
Fortunately, some people are smarter than that. You only have to read the CSM minutes or ask the other respected members of CSM6 how well they've gotten along with Mittens to see what I'm talking about.
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Vordak Kallager
Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance
152
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Posted - 2012.03.17 02:14:00 -
[3] - Quote
Johnny Marzetti wrote:Several of them have posted in his thread, including at least one self-identified hisec carebear. Now, maybe they are goon alts or something but if they are then I don't know of it. Of course, I could be lying also, so it all depends on how well you've wrapped your tinfoil. Also, I believe most of his votes for CSM6 actually came from outside of GSF, since he and Vile Rat split the GSF vote.
The fact is (and almost nobody will even consider this possibility but oh well), he really is there to represent a certain style of gameplay that many people in Eve desire. He is not there to advance his own alliance at the cost of others. His constituents are not his alliance, though most of his alliance are his constituents.
As evidence, I would point to the fact that he has strongly supported a technetium moon nerf of some kind. While GSF does not have the most tech moons, we have more than almost every other sov holding alliance including quite a few that hate us. Tech moons basically make our alliance outrageously wealthy. This is absurdly unbalanced and makes the game less fun for everyone.
People who are open minded about that see him as incredibly effective at getting CCP management to listen to players' needs, particularly the needs of players in null. Effectiveness is more important than just about anything else, because the CSM is not about advancing your cause over other players' causes so much as it is about getting CCP to give the players what they want rather than what CCP management thinks they want. Effectiveness comes from diplomacy, having a clear set of priorities, and knowing who to befriend at CCP (basically the hard working devs who've been giving us a great game when the upper management let them).
There are some people in certain alliances who simply cannot fathom that this is what the CSM is about, and instead believe that Mittens is there forcing CCP to nerf Titans or some other tinfoil pants on head stupidity. It is just hilarious how dumb their posting is, because it shows they have no clear understanding of what the CSM does or even how a business like CCP needs to operate. It's inconceivable to them that Mittens could be doing anything other than advancing the interests of his alliance at the expense of the game as a whole because it's exactly what they would do, nothing less.
Fortunately, some people are smarter than that. You only have to read the CSM minutes or ask the other respected members of CSM6 how well they've gotten along with Mittens to see what I'm talking about.
Well said.
There is nothing wrong with The Mittani, and there is nothing wrong with The Goons. EVE wouldn't be the same without them. Every epic space opera needs an ~epic space villain~.
Hans Jagerblitzen for CSM7 |

Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
74
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Posted - 2012.03.17 02:51:00 -
[4] - Quote
I can't wait till Mittens springs the trap and does the biggest heist ever in EVE and clean out his alliance.
Only Goons are stupid enough to believe in honor amongst thieves. As soon as his lust for attention can't be covered anymore by sitting in the CSM he needs an even bigger attention drug. Only thing left is to do the Haargoth thing to Goonswarm. But he needs the coffer to be a lot bigger because else he can't outshine. And that is the only thing Mittens works for.
His moments in the spotlights.
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Ustrello
Mindstar Technology Executive Outcomes
2
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Posted - 2012.03.17 02:57:00 -
[5] - Quote
what a sperglord moar tin foil hat |

Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
19
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Posted - 2012.03.17 03:10:00 -
[6] - Quote
Killer Gandry wrote:I can't wait till Mittens springs the trap and does the biggest heist ever in EVE and clean out his alliance.
Only Goons are stupid enough to believe in honor amongst thieves. As soon as his lust for attention can't be covered anymore by sitting in the CSM he needs an even bigger attention drug. Only thing left is to do the Haargoth thing to Goonswarm. But he needs the coffer to be a lot bigger because else he can't outshine. And that is the only thing Mittens works for.
His moments in the spotlights.
I will admit I believe The Mittani should be applauded he has managed to surround himself with a huge pile of unthinking Goonsheep or sheeple depending of which term you prefer.
He has the ability to throw crap loads of mindless drones at anyone in the game without them complaining and to top it all off he has convinced them that giving him a free plane ride in return for there political freedom is a good idea.
Well Done to the Mittani I salute you o7. Vote Issler Dainze for CSM7! http://community.eveonline.com/council/voting/Vote.asp?c=470
Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |

Johnny Marzetti
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
316
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Posted - 2012.03.17 03:10:00 -
[7] - Quote
never mind
:cripes::fh: |

Sidus Sarmiang
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
42
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Posted - 2012.03.17 03:46:00 -
[8] - Quote
I think a lot of this is a symptom of people not really understanding what these forums are. So far, 50,000 people have voted. Now, I'm betting that most of those people are part of blocs that voted for their candidate beforehand. Other folks are not part of the major nullsec blocs, but have favorite candidates from previous elections. Finally, you have a small group of people who have no idea who they want to vote for. A smaller section of this will read these forums. An even smaller section will read lots of posts on these forums.
So first off, there's an idea that we're posting for Mittani. We're not. The amount of votes that can be shifted by posting on these forums is probably limited to a few thousand, and those will be divided between a dozen different candidates with different objectives and standpoints. Ultimately, what we obtain for Mittani might be a few hundred votes, some of which he'd get anyways, and when he already has around 10,000 votes based on our exit polls that's pretty miniscule.
So what is the goon objective here? I could be all secret about it but it doesn't make a difference because the victims will never catch on and shut up. You see, CSM voting season has a special meaning for every goon girl and boy, because if we've been good that year (scamming, blowing up miners, etc), a lot of hatred builds up and a good number of those people think to themselves that this is the moment where they finally stick it to us. Where will they stick it to us? The CSM of course! So all the seeds we sew reaps us a wonderous crop of sperglords (aspergers sufferers to the common pubbie, look up Chris-chan). Now I'm not referring to Issler here. Xenuria and Riverini were the stars of this year's show. The Riverini and Xenuria interviews/debates were some of the funniest things I've seen in months and really makes it clear our efforts have paid off this year. Issler and Black Thorne pubbies are kind of the aftershow. You're not important enough to be interviewed so there's no real chance for a massive comedy payout, but it's still funny to watch your bad posting. What makes it even funnier is that your shitposting has really picked up now that voting is drawing to a close. About 1500-1600 votes a day average are coming in as the election nears its close. Unless all those voters suddenly go for one person (and remember what I said earlier about a small fraction of people actually reading this forum in great depth), you're effectively fighting for maybe 50-60 votes a day with your sudden anti-goon blitzkrieg on Jita park. The party's over, and you're still dancing. Everyone else is passed out drunk or ******* in a bed that doesn't belong to them. The only people who care enough to keep paying attention are lying on the couch half awake still enjoying the afterglow of Riverini's meltdown wondering who the two idiots are that seem to think something is still going on.
So why am I explaining all this? Because I think it's funny when you explain in great detail why someone is being dumb, and they still don't get it. Or refuse to get it. Same thing really. If you prefer, you can think Mittani is standing behind me with a gun to my head telling me if I don't stop you from claiming the last dozen or so pubbie votes, I'll be commissared. |

Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power. Cascade Imminent
498
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Posted - 2012.03.17 03:48:00 -
[9] - Quote
realpolitik talk |

Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
74
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Posted - 2012.03.17 03:54:00 -
[10] - Quote
Ustrello wrote:what a sperglord moar tin foil hat
You should apply at Goonswarm. Your more than qualified it seems.
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Sidus Sarmiang
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
42
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Posted - 2012.03.17 03:54:00 -
[11] - Quote
Basically, I'm saying that at this point Issler and Frying pan are real life examples of Poe's Law. |

Sverige Pahis
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
864
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Posted - 2012.03.17 03:57:00 -
[12] - Quote
Desperate. |

Andski
GoonWaffe
3179
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Posted - 2012.03.17 04:05:00 -
[13] - Quote
Killer Gandry wrote:I can't wait till Mittens springs the trap and does the biggest heist ever in EVE and clean out his alliance.
Only Goons are stupid enough to believe in honor amongst thieves. As soon as his lust for attention can't be covered anymore by sitting in the CSM he needs an even bigger attention drug. Only thing left is to do the Haargoth thing to Goonswarm. But he needs the coffer to be a lot bigger because else he can't outshine. And that is the only thing Mittens works for.
His moments in the spotlights.
no one person in GSF can do that, fyi "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |

Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
19
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Posted - 2012.03.17 04:11:00 -
[14] - Quote
Sidus Sarmiang wrote:Basically, I'm saying that at this point Issler and Frying pan are real life examples of Poe's Law. Nice reference.
I liked RationalWiki wrote:"For example, some conservatives consider noted homophobe Fred Phelps to be so over-the-top that they argue he's a "deep cover liberal" trying to discredit more mainstream homophobes. " Vote Issler Dainze for CSM7! http://community.eveonline.com/council/voting/Vote.asp?c=470
Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |

Johnny Marzetti
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
320
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Posted - 2012.03.17 04:14:00 -
[15] - Quote
Dude, if you really are actively sabotaging someone's campaign why aren't you doing it to someone who actually matters?
I mean, sorry Issler, I think you're nice and all, but you don't really matter in this race even if by some miracle you do make it to one of the bottom seven spots.
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Frying Doom
Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance
19
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Posted - 2012.03.17 04:18:00 -
[16] - Quote
Johnny Marzetti wrote:Dude, if you really are actively sabotaging someone's campaign why aren't you doing it to someone who actually matters?
I mean, sorry Issler, I think you're nice and all, but you don't really matter in this race even if by some miracle you do make it to one of the bottom seven spots.
I said I liked the comment. And you guys accuse me of membership to a tin foil hat club. But if you feel that way maybe next year I can campaign for The Mittani lol.
But that is another really mean comment by you goons what is it hate mail day? Vote Issler Dainze for CSM7! http://community.eveonline.com/council/voting/Vote.asp?c=470
Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge. |

Killer Gandry
V I R I I Ineluctable.
74
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Posted - 2012.03.17 05:48:00 -
[17] - Quote
Andski wrote: no one person in GSF can do that, fyi
I am reasonably sure you are overconfident in what can and can't in GSF or you are just trolling.
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Tarsus Zateki
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
125
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Posted - 2012.03.17 07:09:00 -
[18] - Quote
They will vote for The Mittani because they realize he the best representative there is for the Eve Online community. Regardless of the actions of his character in game and his own preferred play style he has the intelligence and social skills necessary to direct a CSM that will actually help CCP make Eve Online a better game. |

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
234
|
Posted - 2012.03.17 07:38:00 -
[19] - Quote
Killer Gandry wrote:Andski wrote:no one person in GSF can do that, fyi I am reasonably sure you are overconfident in what can and can't in GSF or you are just trolling. Because no one would take precautions after two big alliances blew up due to someone pushing butan.
Take all the tech Build all the titans Drop all the POSes
Bees incoming, nerf ERRYTHING ERRYDAY |

Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1242
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Posted - 2012.03.17 07:42:00 -
[20] - Quote
Johnny Marzetti wrote:Dude, if you really are actively sabotaging someone's campaign why aren't you doing it to someone who actually matters?
I mean, sorry Issler, I think you're nice and all, but you don't really matter in this race even if by some miracle you do make it to one of the bottom seven spots.
Sigh....
Your earlier post was awesome. A reasoned post from someone associated with a group that is so often associated with lame trolling. I wanted to hug you and state you were my favorite goon of all time and suggest when mittens steps down you should be the next king bee. Your first response was reasoned ans EXACTLY what I posted to see.
But then.... You ruined it......
You could have left it there. But no, you has to turn it into a personal attack. We are days away from the results. Nothing posted here could make any difference in the result of the election, but you had to turn it mean!!
Your responses representing the goons in my thread have been the best of the goons, you never trolled and offered real opportunities for real dialog. You could have let this run its course and I would have totally left this with me thinking of you as the most rational and awesome of the goons, but no, you in the end are just yet another goon lame troll.
I'm genuinely sad. I had hoped there was a goon worthy of serious respect... (besides Mittens)
Issler Dainze The MIner's Friend Dissapointed to not have a future of the goons friend! CSM 7 Candidate |
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
234
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Posted - 2012.03.17 07:45:00 -
[21] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:I'm genuinely sad. I had hoped there was a goon worthy of serious respect... (besides Mittens) We're all mittens, we have no individual will, anyone seem to remember this being mentioned?
I heard it on Jita Park, it must be true.
Take all the tech Build all the titans Drop all the POSes
Bees incoming, nerf ERRYTHING ERRYDAY |

Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1242
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Posted - 2012.03.17 07:49:00 -
[22] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Issler Dainze wrote:I'm genuinely sad. I had hoped there was a goon worthy of serious respect... (besides Mittens) We're all mittens, we have no individual will, anyone seem to remember this being mentioned? I heard it on Jita Park, it must be true.
I was once a bee and it was a fine thing to be!
I will never disagree with someone that chooses the hive over other lives in Eve.
Whatever makes Eve enough fun to pay the subscription is a valid path in Eve!
Issler Dainze Understanding the freedom of joining a hive mind The Not the Hive Mind CSM 7 Candidate! |

Clyde ElectraGlide
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
64
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Posted - 2012.03.17 08:14:00 -
[23] - Quote
I'm from the Center for Advanced Studies and I operate mostly in empire, so Mittens obviously doesn't represent the part of the game I play. I still voted for him though.
I'm willing to put my playstyle aside to vote for someone that produces results and acts in a professional manner as he does. Not to mention bothering to make a Q&A thread where constituent issues can be answered by the man himself, and setting up a Skype channel as a means of direct communication between the CSM and CCP. Can other CSMs claim to be that innovative?
There are other candidates I'd like to see up there, namely Hans, Seleene, Meissa and Two step. But Mittens is the one that really needs to be there. I've read the other serious candidate's threads, and while some of them really do know their stuff, they wouldn't play as much as a vital part in the CSM process that Mittani does. Crucible was a great expansion/release, and we need someone that can see to it that Eve maintains this direction, and I couldn't think of anyone better to do that than Mittens. Fix incursions today! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=60460 |

Berke Negri
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
62
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Posted - 2012.03.17 09:26:00 -
[24] - Quote
mittani is one of few eve players that has considerable out-of-game exposure and subsequent popularity and following among your average internet pilot
like i can't think of anyone else from the game that has been interviewed by RPS
he's a much more sympathetic figure than people who mine ice all day |

Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1243
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Posted - 2012.03.17 09:35:00 -
[25] - Quote
Clyde ElectraGlide wrote:I'm from the Center for Advanced Studies and I operate mostly in empire, so Mittens obviously doesn't represent the part of the game I play. I still voted for him though.
I'm willing to put my playstyle aside to vote for someone that produces results and acts in a professional manner as he does. Not to mention bothering to make a Q&A thread where constituent issues can be answered by the man himself, and setting up a Skype channel as a means of direct communication between the CSM and CCP. Can other CSMs claim to be that innovative?
There are other candidates I'd like to see up there, namely Hans, Seleene, Meissa and Two step. But Mittens is the one that really needs to be there. I've read the other serious candidate's threads, and while some of them really do know their stuff, they wouldn't play as much as a vital part in the CSM process that Mittani does. Crucible was a great expansion/release, and we need someone that can see to it that Eve maintains this direction, and I couldn't think of anyone better to do that than Mittens.
So basically a goon alt,
Gotcha..
Issler
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Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1243
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Posted - 2012.03.17 09:38:00 -
[26] - Quote
Berke Negri wrote:mittani is one of few eve players that has considerable out-of-game exposure and subsequent popularity and following among your average internet pilot
like i can't think of anyone else from the game that has been interviewed by RPS
he's a much more sympathetic figure than people who mine ice all day
RPS, hmmm, Ive presented at major game developer conferences... but sure. thanks for sharing how he got your vote.
Issler
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Grumpy Owly
335
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Posted - 2012.03.17 09:48:00 -
[27] - Quote
Berke Negri wrote:mittani is one of few eve players that has considerable out-of-game exposure and subsequent popularity and following among your average internet pilot
Based on last years votes less than 2.5% of your "average" pilot. Such amazing popularity. 
Bounty Hunting for CSM 7
Stop EvE Apathy |

Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation The Honda Accord
1243
|
Posted - 2012.03.17 09:54:00 -
[28] - Quote
Grumpy Owly wrote:Berke Negri wrote:mittani is one of few eve players that has considerable out-of-game exposure and subsequent popularity and following among your average internet pilot Based on last years votes less than 2.5% of your "average" pilot. Such amazing popularity. 
The candidate strongly preferred by the margin of error! 
Issler Dainze The Miner's Friend Studied Statistics! CSM 7 Candidate
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Berke Negri
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
62
|
Posted - 2012.03.17 10:01:00 -
[29] - Quote
Issler Dainze wrote:Berke Negri wrote:mittani is one of few eve players that has considerable out-of-game exposure and subsequent popularity and following among your average internet pilot
like i can't think of anyone else from the game that has been interviewed by RPS
he's a much more sympathetic figure than people who mine ice all day RPS, hmmm, Ive presented at major game developer conferences... but sure. thanks for sharing how he got your vote. Issler were you asked to present at major game developer conferences to talk about spending all your free time refining minerals in hi-sec |

Kai Tel
State War Academy Caldari State
3
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Posted - 2012.03.17 10:02:00 -
[30] - Quote
If nothing else, the goons are well organized on the official forums and it gives them a political edge both with fellow pilots and Devs that might be swayed reading posts for insight into player desires. Candidates for CSM with agendas not popular with them have taken a bit of a lashing this year. Not enough of the player base respects the CSM in such a way as to care about what happens as they have been a joke in past years. Things are slowly changing. I am trusting CCP to see through the smoke and mirror play where needed and hoping that they have a solid vision for the game's future development in spite of what a minority voice allowed power will clamor for.
My problem in reading you right now, OP, is that your confidence seems to be cracking and maybe you are letting this little internet space ship game bother you too much on a personal level. It's just a crooked player election for a small MMO committee. ItGÇÖs not fair. ItGÇÖs also not a reflection on you or your life in spite of what the attack dogs might say. ItGÇÖs just a mean little game. Keep your perspective
To be honest, I havenGÇÖt let anything the goons do bother me. Our interests do not currently coincide. I play ball in a different part of the game. I was never going to vote for them or a candidate they strongly support anyway. |
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