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Demonic Noble
Amarr
Star Caliber
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Posted - 2008.07.23 12:13:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Demonic Noble on 23/07/2008 12:13:51
it would be nice to get a X-large Armor repairer... you know like how the Shield tanks have there x-large shield booster... as it stands shield tanks have a major advantage over armor tanks for several reasons
1)Shield tanks have a x-large shield booster which repairs nearly 3x the Large Repairers this only takes up one slot.. Armor tanks have to use 2 large reppers to keep up (thats a sacrifice to our tank/damnage/tracking..
2)Shield tanks have a Recharge and its possible to get the recharge so high its better then using a x-large shield booster (armor tanks dont have a recharge)
I dont think it would be to bad to impliment a x-large armor repper even if it has a 20 sec duration if its able to repair 3x the large then it would still be usefull
This is what i think it should be like...
X-large Armor Repairer
1600 Cap
20 sec duration
1800 Armor repaired
==================================================
3 out of 10 encounters survived..
7 out of 10 encounters refused to pay up...
Cant you see my guns are bigger then your... Yet you still fight |
Zikka
Hematite Rose
Bionic Dawn
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Posted - 2008.07.23 12:28:00 -
[2]
Shield != Armour
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Astria Tiphareth
Caldari
24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2008.07.23 12:31:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Astria Tiphareth on 23/07/2008 12:32:12
The tingling in my forum feelers suggests this has probably come up before, but I'm actually struggling to think of a good reason why not to have one as an option. For that matter, shield boosters get shield boost amps and armour tankers don't.
However, I'm not sure it's quite that straightforward to make a comparison between shield tanking and armour tanking, because they operate quite differently.
There used to be the cry that 'everyone always armour tanks, lets not make shield tanking even less effective' but somehow I suspect that was based on the now ancient and obsolete 'everyone flies gallente' and 'PvP can be done solo' memes. Besides that, most PvP fits don't fit a repairer or booster anyway because it doesn't make a blind bit of difference in a fight with more than 10 participants.
 Originally by: Zikka
Shield != Armour
That's such a helpful post. Really.
___
My views may not represent those of my corporation or alliance, which is why I never get invited to those diplomatic parties... |
Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr
Imperial Servants
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Posted - 2008.07.23 12:38:00 -
[4]
Take a look at the shield booster. See the duration and cap use? Now compare it to an armor repper and you will see armor reppers are way more effective. Shield boosters are meant for quick bursts where armor reppers are meant for the long haul.
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Sir Substance
Minmatar
Sunspot Requisitions
Worlds End Consortium
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Posted - 2008.07.23 12:40:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Sir Substance on 23/07/2008 12:40:23
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
Take a look at the shield booster. See the duration and cap use? Now compare it to an armor repper and you will see armor reppers are way more effective. Shield boosters are meant for quick bursts where armor reppers are meant for the long haul.
*******s. if that were the case, noone would shield tank. as it stands, i ee no reason why there shouldn't be an x-large repper. as long as its inline with everything else, its fine.
b.o.l.l.o.c.k.s is a swearword?
:S
Originally by: Ekrid
because trying to fit medium beam lasers is like trying to shove a cow in your mailbox. doable, but it gets messy.
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Lamonadetomare
Minmatar
Pator Tech School
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Posted - 2008.07.23 12:50:00 -
[6]
look at the plates and look at the shield extenders
than think about diversity
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FarosWarrior
Amarr
Sonnema
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Posted - 2008.07.23 12:57:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
Take a look at the shield booster. See the duration and cap use? Now compare it to an armor repper and you will see armor reppers are way more effective. Shield boosters are meant for quick bursts where armor reppers are meant for the long haul.
no
shield boosters do require alot of cap, armor reppers are not exactly more effective, depends on your skills, you can indeed make shield boosters run perma but at alot more cap use, armor reps need less cap
Fly safe,
FarosWarrior
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Goti Evans
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Posted - 2008.07.23 13:01:00 -
[8]
attuly not quite - my Caldari ship can tank a fair bit of damage but beacuse of the amount of cap power per Hit point repaired the Cap tends to bleed out in one big hurry. I also cant quite match up with say a gallente ship in terms of DPS (although the ability to chose damage helps greatly with this). This effectivly means that whilst my ship can tank better then yours - especialy when its 2 on 1. I need to last that bit longer if ive got any hope of taking you out with my more medioka DPS. ( I know theres not a huge amount in it especialy if your using torps)
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Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr
Imperial Servants
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Posted - 2008.07.23 13:05:00 -
[9]
Originally by: FarosWarrior
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
Take a look at the shield booster. See the duration and cap use? Now compare it to an armor repper and you will see armor reppers are way more effective. Shield boosters are meant for quick bursts where armor reppers are meant for the long haul.
no
shield boosters do require alot of cap, armor reppers are not exactly more effective, depends on your skills, you can indeed make shield boosters run perma but at alot more cap use, armor reps need less cap
Sorry, the armor repper effectivenes I was reffering to, is cap effectiveness. Should have been a bit more clear on that. The cap/sec is a lot lower on armor repairers then shield boosters. The cap/shield or cap/armor is aproximate the same in the end, iirc.
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Hugh Ruka
Exploratio et Industria Morispatia
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Posted - 2008.07.23 13:18:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Hugh Ruka on 23/07/2008 13:19:25
oh God ... not this again ... I was hot in the debate about these things like 2 years ago and did not bother since.
take a look at hp/cap, hp/sec and % fitting of the apropriate ships. Then you will see a different picture. Also there are other differences.
And you do not want a 1600cap/cycle single module anything, trust me.
Nice thing is, you forgot the fitting of the future XL armor rep. How nice you forget the unpleasant things in your post.
P.S.: it's the SBA that makes XL boosters equal in terms of hp/cap and hp/sec to dual LARs, so again 2 slots for 2 slots.
--- SIG ---
CSM: your support is needed ! |
Reatu Krentor
Minmatar
Void Spiders
Fate Weavers
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Posted - 2008.07.23 14:04:00 -
[11]
You should look at the full package using 2 slots for both.
X-large shield booster with shield boost amp vs. 2 large armor repairers.
450 * 1.3 = 585 / 5 = 117hp/s @ 400 / 5 = 80 cap/s (1.4625 hp/cap)
600 * 1.36 = 816 / 5 = 163.2hp/s @ 400 / 5 = 80 cap/s (2.04 hp/cap)
1200 / 11.25 = 106.67hp/s @ 800 / 11.25 = 71.11 cap/s (1.5 hp/cap)
1600 / 11.25 = 142.22hp/s @ 800 / 11.25 = 71.11 cap/s (2 hp/cap)
Both use 2 slots and end up quite close together in efficiency and defensive output. The shield boosters boosts a bit more but consumes more cap as well.
I don't believe there to be a need for a bigger repper.
The passive shield recharge is negligible when you are actively tanking a ship, to have a noticeable effect requires a lot of slots dedicated to that specifically, which can't be combined with an active tank.
-- stuff -- |
WAuter
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.07.23 15:30:00 -
[12]
i want the invulnerability field for armor too...
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Straight Chillen
Gallente
Solar Wind
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
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Posted - 2008.07.23 15:49:00 -
[13]
Personally I think instead of an X-Large Armor repper, it would be more interesting and usefull for there to be a module that increases the Armor Rep'd Amount, but then again we have rigs for this.
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Takashi X2
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Posted - 2008.07.23 16:12:00 -
[14]
also show me a shield tanking non capital ship that can top 250k effective health can you? i doubt it. Armor not only can top that but more than double that
use implants rigs and complex loot to figure it :)
Amarr command FTW lolzorz
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procurement specialist
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Posted - 2008.07.23 16:13:00 -
[15]
i made a post about missing modules.
x-l armor rep.
x-l shield extender
capital shield extender
armor invuln field
shield eamn
x-l or capital cap boosters
i think capital nos
others
and bascially it was decided that shield != armor and the difference were on purpose.
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Straight Chillen
Gallente
Solar Wind
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
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Posted - 2008.07.23 16:42:00 -
[16]
if all else fails u could always just fit like this guy
http://killboard.pewpew-labs.com/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=2830
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Galia Bonaventure
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Posted - 2008.07.23 17:39:00 -
[17]
Like Hugh said, it is a slot thing. If you had XL Armor Reps, you would be giving armor repping ships with the grid to fit a dual LAR setup an extra low slot, which would be a huge advantage. Roughly speaking, 2x LAR = XL Boost + Amp. 2 slots for 2 slots.
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Arvald
Caldari
Ninjas N Pirates
Pirate Coalition
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Posted - 2008.07.23 17:54:00 -
[18]
armor tanking = huge ammounts of dammage over time, very good for prolonged fights
shield tanking = medium to large ammounts of burst dammage, very good for getting in blowing it the **** up and geting the hell out
Originally by: Reem Fairchild
The fact that people who post stupid things get instant and honest feedback letting them know how stupid they are, is one of the best qualities of the Eve forums.
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FlameGlow
Caldari
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.07.23 19:13:00 -
[19]
Originally by: WAuter
i want the invulnerability field for armor too...
You already have two - EANM and DC 
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Hitachi Morimoto
Gallente
Synthetic Light Mining Corps.
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Posted - 2008.07.23 19:21:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Hitachi Morimoto on 23/07/2008 19:24:52
Originally by: Zikka
Shield != Armour
for those who don't program, != means not equal to.
IE: Shield is not equal to Armor
:):):):):):):):):):):)
Newsflash! The eve gate is made of delicious cheese! |
Dasfry
Caldari
Demio's Corporation
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Posted - 2008.07.23 20:10:00 -
[21]
The opposite argument would be why not X-Large Shield Extenders?
To be on par with 1600mm plates?
***********
Dasfry, CEO
Demios Corporation
Military Tactics |
Danjira Ryuujin
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.07.24 17:48:00 -
[22]
Also consider the costs of actually using a shield tank, ie tank or tackle or ewar.
Amarr - Annoying the Eve Community since 2005 |
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