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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Herping yourDerp
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
413
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Posted - 2012.03.20 00:45:00 -
[31] - Quote
idk, but please if its a small laser don't put medium in the name like it is now. |
JoeBear770
Faster Muffins
0
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Posted - 2012.03.20 01:25:00 -
[32] - Quote
+1 to wattage ratings..... for simplicity sake; 75 watt small pulse laser/100 watt small pulse laser , 75 watt small beam laser/100 watt small beam laser etc. , etc. You get the idea. |
Fredfredbug4
Kings of Kill EVE Animal Control
107
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Posted - 2012.03.20 01:50:00 -
[33] - Quote
Change the icons for pulse lasers. They are so phallic they look like they were designed by the 13 year old son of someone at CCP. |
Caladan Rake
Redemptions Manifesto
14
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Posted - 2012.03.20 01:56:00 -
[34] - Quote
War Kitten wrote:Acac Sunflyier wrote:Yeah I do think they need to be renamed and organized better. I look at lasers and then say to myself, "Maybe later!" It's honestly something that holds me back from getting into amarr. The minmitar and gallente have very easy to understand weapons. The bigger the number in front of the mm, the bigger the hit. Why does the small market group have medium guns listed under it for lasers? Can't you fix that? Especially since there is a medium laser section of the market. This has simplicity written all over it... Give lasers a megawatt, gigawatt, something-awatt power rating that increases logically. Simple. Elegant. Effective. /thread
Love it.
Also Gatling sucks. Don't use it, please. |
Galega Ori
Assero Argentum
15
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Posted - 2012.03.20 02:28:00 -
[35] - Quote
JamesCLK wrote:Large Lasers:Not much to comment about, it's pretty straight forward ( read: people will rage if you touch their Tachyons ).
Please point out on the doll for the court where CCP touched you. |
Alain Kinsella
97
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Posted - 2012.03.20 07:41:00 -
[36] - Quote
Another Amarr player (not this char), and agree on
-> Removal of 'gatling' (if needed just change the one or two models so they don't spin) -> Structured naming schema (size/caliber/meta/etc) -> Numbers for caliber (even better, have them increase across the entire line of Small to Capital)
The current name types make me standardize fits on one gun type per size/type class, just for sanity's sake (or just sort by fitting stats in HQ Fitter). Your proposed schema does not help much in that regard.
Alternative: Specialized names like the Tachyon could also be used to retrofit the caliber names, instead of numbers. That way the 'Large Tach' folks can still have their cake but us small/med types get some as well.
I may have come here from Myst Online, but that does not make me any less bloodthirsty than the average Eve player.
Just more subtle.
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COMM4NDER
Umbrella Holding Inc Umbrella Chemical Inc
73
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Posted - 2012.03.20 11:05:00 -
[37] - Quote
Sturmwolke wrote:SMALL BEAM LASERS Beam lasers SHOULD NOT hold the "Gatling" term (it's pulse lasers specific), please don't screw around trying to homogenize everything with the term "Gatling". The original term is fine. See:
Dual Light Beam Laser I Dual Modulated Light Energy Beam I
Light Beam Laser I Light Modulated Energy Beam I
SMALL PULSE LASERS Simple continuity from the beam version. "Gatling Light" inserted for improved clarity. See:
Gatling Light Pulse Laser I Gatling Modulated Light Pulse Energy Beam I
Dual Light Pulse Laser I Dual Modulated Light Pulse Energy Beam I
Light Pulse Laser I Light Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I
MEDIUM BEAM LASERS Again, remove the term "Gatling" from the beam laser family. The quad laser is probably the most confounding due to its name. It just needs a small and simple touch. "Solid-state" is an ungraceful name, some better alternates are "Positron/Antiproton" (the reasoning for this is to aim for a loose association with the next level tachyon beams), but I'm in more favor just sticking in "Medium". There may be some initial confusion (with the current Medium Beam), however in the long run, it should work out fine. See:
Quad Medium Beam Laser I Quad Modulated Medium Energy Beam I
Focused Medium Beam Laser I Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I
Medium Beam Laser I Medium Modulated Medium Energy Beam I
Edit: Striked the extraneous "Medium"
MEDIUM PULSE LASERS Simple continuity from the beam version.
Focused Medium Pulse Laser I Focused Modulated Medium Pulse Energy Beam I
Medium Pulse Laser I Medium Modulated Pulse Energy Beam I
LARGE BEAM LASERS There's nothing wrong with the current scheme. It should be preserved. When you omit "Dual", you screw the actual turret art. "Heavy" inserted for improved clarity. See:
Dual Heavy Beam Laser I Dual Modulated Heavy Energy Beam I
Mega Beam Laser I Mega Modulated Heavy Energy Beam I
Tachyon Beam Laser I Tachyon Modulated Heavy Beam Laser I
LARGE PULSE LASERS Simple continuity from the beam version.
Dual Heavy Pulse Laser I Dual Modulated Heavy Pulse Energy Beam I
Mega Pulse Laser I Mega Modulated Heavy Pulse Energy Beam I
This makes sense, also having some kind of a number like mega or gigawatt or something would make life more pleasant. Features & Ideas Tag shortcuts - Make an FC enjoy his position more! Overview - Show fleet members only! |
J3ssica Alba
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
152
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Posted - 2012.03.20 11:16:00 -
[38] - Quote
Galega Ori wrote:JamesCLK wrote:Large Lasers:Not much to comment about, it's pretty straight forward ( read: people will rage if you touch their Tachyons ). Please point out on the doll for the court where CCP touched you.
They made both my tachyons big and hard .. To the whiners :-áCCP Soundwave "Incursions are not a big issue in terms of isk globally" CCP Recurve "However, Incursions are not the biggest ISK faucet, bounties are"
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DarkAegix
Acetech Systems
978
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Posted - 2012.03.20 11:34:00 -
[39] - Quote
I can confirm that 'Solid-State' sounds cool.
If you are definitely considering a naming system as suggested by the above posters, where bigger numbers are better, watts may not be a suitable name component for lasers. They're the unit used in powergrid, and it would be odd for, say, a 300MW laser to use 200MW of powergrid.
Some other physicsy units to look into may be the volt (V), ampere (A), ohm (+¬)*, lumen (lm), coulomb (C), lux (lx), weber (Wb), or tesla (T). *FREAKIN' OMEGA SYMBOL FTW. AMARR VICTOR.
From there, the prefixes of M (mega), G (giga), T (tera), etc can be added.
I can only dream of a "500T+¬ Tachyon Modulated Energy Beam I", though. I imagine the omega symbol would be a pain to search for in the market.
Many players would pronounce it as "500 Tera-Omega Tachyon Modulated Energy Beam I", which sounds EXCELLENT, however. |
Caladan Rake
Redemptions Manifesto
14
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Posted - 2012.03.20 12:52:00 -
[40] - Quote
CCP Gnauton wrote:Hi everyone,
Also, please note that as the meta level 1-4 scheme is currently undergoing revision and redesign, the examples below do not take meta changes into account and therefore are not final.
Already said my piece on the lasers bit (wattage, joules, both work for me). But I wanted to revisit this. While I'm all for a naming scheme that makes sense, and identifies the meta levels, the one currently in-game is boring. Does this mean its not necessarily set in stone? That would awesome, just fyi. |
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Tobiaz
Spacerats
28
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Posted - 2012.03.20 13:06:00 -
[41] - Quote
[bittervet]
Was there a topic like this before CCP changed the missiles too? Because I would LOVE to read all the comments of the community about it being a bad idea, not making it more clearer AT ALL. Complaints about ret-conning stuff in EVE that's had perfectly functioning names for over eight years without anyone playing longer then a month complaining about it.
Which CCP would then have totally ignored and turned it into generic garble of discriptions anyway.
I suggest CCP also start renaming all ammo. 'Antimatter Charge S' can become 'Very Short-Range Small Hybrid Charge', and Plutonium 'Short-Range Small Hybrid Charge' and Lead 'Average-Range Small Hybrid Charge'. Becomes lot more clear doesn't it? I bet you can do even better with those horribly confusing projectile ammo. I mean 'EMP M'? That's waaaaay to short and non-descript for utter newbies and stupid devs to remember what it is.
I'll admit I don't know the exact meta naming for lasers, but that's because I never really used them. I know meta 4, and the rest goes into the recycle bin anyway. And if I really wanted to know the meta, I WOULD SIMPLY LOOK IT UP. It's not that hard, FFS!
Perhaps if CCP was honest about trying to make the stuff a bit more transparent, instead of getting a boner out of some OCD-driven urge to turn all names into generic bland description, they could just put little chevrons on the icons for meta 0 to meta 4.
[/bittervet] http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif
How about fixing image-linking on the forums, CCP? I want to see signatures! |
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
494
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Posted - 2012.03.20 13:09:00 -
[42] - Quote
My god, that is soooo confusing right now, the slight difference to tell the varibles of a different caliber of gun. Its not like everybody already learned the meta types, so now we still need to relearn it again. Aside from calling missiles and hardeners by damage type....why does everything else have to be changed? I just took a look at armor tank mods last week since I wasn't playing EVE so much in recent months....thanks CCP...I new the difference between an N-type and a Radiosopte because you gave armor like 8 types of category, then 4 meta types in each category...yet shields only had like 8 total meta mods total! (non faction, non-T2). And I learned them....but now....yeah thanks for the ******* head ache |
Fidelium Mortis
Quantum Cats Syndicate Villore Accords
66
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Posted - 2012.03.20 13:38:00 -
[43] - Quote
Tobiaz wrote:[bittervet] Was there a topic like this before CCP changed the missiles too? Because I would LOVE to read all the comments of the community about it being a bad idea, not making it more clearer AT ALL. Complaints about ret-conning stuff in EVE that's had perfectly functioning names for over eight years without anyone playing longer then a month complaining about it. Which CCP would then have totally ignored and turned it into generic garble of discriptions anyway.I suggest CCP also start renaming all ammo. 'Antimatter Charge S' can become 'Very Short-Range Small Hybrid Charge', and Plutonium 'Short-Range Small Hybrid Charge' and Lead Change M into 'Average-Range Medium Hybrid Charge'. I bet you can do even better with those horribly confusing projectile ammo. I mean 'EMP M'? That's waaaaay to short and non-descript for utter newbies and stupid devs to remember what it is. Becomes lot more clear doesn't it? Now I want the read to look back into that block of text and quickly pick the types of ammo I just named. Which ones do you find the easiest? Not the names fitting CCP's 'new and improved'. I'll admit I don't know the exact meta naming for lazorz, but that's because I never really used them. I'm Caldari, I could name every single missile before CCP stamped on them. I do know the meta 4 lasers, they be good sellin', the rest goes into the recycle bin anyway. If I really wanted to know the meta, I WOULD SIMPLY LOOK IT UP. It's not that hard, FFS! Perhaps if CCP was honest about trying to make the stuff a bit more transparent, instead of getting a boner out of some OCD-driven urge to turn all names into generic bland descriptions, they should just put little chevrons on the icons for meta 0 to meta 4. There I fixed it for you Gnauton! Get some graphics flunky to draw them up and go do something more useful with your time. [/bittervet]
Actually the hybrid and projectile ammo types tend to be pretty good on the description end.
For hybrids - the range of ammo is determined by the density of the ammo material. Projectiles - EMP seems pretty straight forward since it does primarily EM damage, Phased Plasma does heat etc. Some of the mid range/long range ammo can be confusing but how often do people use the T1 versions anyway?
ICRS - Intergalactic Certified Rocket Surgeon |
Tobiaz
Spacerats
28
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Posted - 2012.03.20 14:01:00 -
[44] - Quote
Fidelium Mortis wrote:
Actually the hybrid and projectile ammo types tend to be pretty good on the description end.
For hybrids - the range of ammo is determined by the density of the ammo material. Projectiles - EMP seems pretty straight forward since it does primarily EM damage, Phased Plasma does heat etc. Some of the mid range/long range ammo can be confusing but how often do people use the T1 versions anyway?
I think you missed the sarcasm. Anyway, the missiles were pretty good on the description end. CCP didn't care.
http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif
How about fixing image-linking on the forums, CCP? I want to see signatures! |
Mona X
Missions Mining and Mayhem Northern Coalition.
64
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Posted - 2012.03.20 14:59:00 -
[45] - Quote
Don't forget to change Heavy Missile Lauchers into Medium Missile Lauchers, otherwise your homogenization will fail, and poor noobies will have to think or something. I need new signature. |
Andski
GoonWaffe
3243
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Posted - 2012.03.20 15:01:00 -
[46] - Quote
Mona X wrote:Don't forget to change Heavy Missile Lauchers into Medium Missile Lauchers, otherwise your homogenization will fail, and poor noobies will have to think or something.
shut up idiot "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
SokoleOko
Death Wish. Ineluctable.
3
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Posted - 2012.03.20 16:01:00 -
[47] - Quote
Change what you want, but DO IT ONCE!
Make a list of changes, gather feedback, anounce final list of new names, publish it BEFORE releasing the patch, then do all in ONE patch and be done with it.
Reason is simple - now every patch breaks up killboards. All I care in this game is PvP, so this is ruining my gameplay since I have problem with posting mails.
DO IT ONCE
Not every week, ffs! |
Andski
GoonWaffe
3243
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Posted - 2012.03.20 16:09:00 -
[48] - Quote
MY KILLBOARD STATS "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012 |
Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
465
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Posted - 2012.03.20 16:25:00 -
[49] - Quote
CCP Gnauton wrote: MEDIUM BEAM LASERS: Heavy becomes Solid-State Medium
MEDIUM PULSE LASERS: Heavy becomes Medium
That's all you really needed to change tbh. this is a signature |
SokoleOko
Death Wish. Ineluctable.
3
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Posted - 2012.03.20 16:33:00 -
[50] - Quote
Andski wrote:MY KILLBOARD STATS
Well, when I kill someone I want be able to post that kill on killboard - too much to ask? |
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JamesCLK
Lone Star Exploration Lone Star Partners
75
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Posted - 2012.03.20 18:59:00 -
[51] - Quote
SokoleOko wrote:Andski wrote:MY KILLBOARD STATS Well, when I kill someone I want be able to post that kill on killboard - too much to ask?
Creating an API for module names is a solution too. |
Alice Katsuko
Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing
84
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Posted - 2012.03.20 20:35:00 -
[52] - Quote
Changes look good. Only suggestion is that you remove "gatling" from small beam lasers, for two reasons. (1) The in-game turret model does not look like a gatling gun. (2) "Gatling" is currently used for names of short-range guns like pulse lasers and autocannons, which helps distinguish them from their long-range counterparts, and makes sense conceptually.
That said, I do not understand how anyone could be confused by the current names as a practical matter. Small guns are filed under a separate category from medium guns, which are filed under a different category from large guns in the market. It is quite literally impossible for a player to buy the wrong size of gun unless he is a complete idiot. |
james1122
Aperture Harmonics K162
23
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Posted - 2012.03.21 00:09:00 -
[53] - Quote
In terms of naming conventions on guns i honestly believe the best thing you can do is standarise the names of the meta modules.
I remember when i first started playing and getting extremely confused around the fact that prototype was good meta 4 for gear fr hybrids yet it was crappy meta 2 (i think) gear for projectiles. Combine this with a separate 4 meta names for lasers as well and you've got over 12 different names that people need to learn and memorise across all the 3 main weapon systems.
Standardising this would make the lives of all new people a hell of a lot easier. I would argue the actually naming of the guns takes secondary importance to the meta names. Two Step for CSM |
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Corporation RONA Directorate
789
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Posted - 2012.03.21 04:20:00 -
[54] - Quote
One thing people should try to remember, by changing some of the names, -- CCP is making it easier to translate their game into other languages, more languages means more subs, more subs mean more targets.
ANYWAY i digress.
I dong like gattling, on somethings. Quads seem pretty intuitive as is. |
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
3449
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Posted - 2012.03.21 05:13:00 -
[55] - Quote
May I suggest Strobe over Gatling.
Gatling sounds like projectile stuff but Strobe is something you can only apply to a laser.
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DarkAegix
Acetech Systems
978
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Posted - 2012.03.21 06:50:00 -
[56] - Quote
Nova Fox wrote:May I suggest Strobe over Gatling. This springs to mind: http://bigamarrianraveparty.ytmnd.com/ |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
245
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Posted - 2012.03.21 07:11:00 -
[57] - Quote
Mona X wrote:Don't forget to change Heavy Missile Lauchers into Medium Missile Lauchers, otherwise your homogenization will fail, and poor noobies will have to think or something. So standard missile launchers would be light missile launchers? There are alread light missiles, uh..
And rockets would be hahaha missile launchers.
The current laser names though could get confusing unless you had some sense when buying and looked at the categories (or slot size if it was in inventory). Take all the tech Build all the titans Drop all the POSes
Bees incoming, nerf ERRYTHING ERRYDAY |
Spc One
The Chodak Void Alliance
16
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Posted - 2012.03.21 11:42:00 -
[58] - Quote
Again you're trying to change something that isn't broken. Current names are ok.
If you change names it will be very difficult for me as an old player to find what i am looking for in lasers. Mega Pulse Laser II sound very good for me and please don't change it.
I don't see any reason but still you changed the name of invulnerability field to adaptive invulnerability field.
Why ? why adaptive ? just to confuse us with something that's not important. |
Malamber
Lightning Squad
3
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Posted - 2012.03.21 16:30:00 -
[59] - Quote
Spc One wrote:Again you're trying to change something that isn't broken. Current names are ok.
If you change names it will be very difficult for me as an old player to find what i am looking for in lasers. Mega Pulse Laser II sound very good for me and please don't change it.
I don't see any reason but still you changed the name of invulnerability field to adaptive invulnerability field.
Why ? why adaptive ? just to confuse us with something that's not important.
"Heavy becomes Solid-State Medium" Now that is very confusing. I think the "adaptive" part is superfluous - both it, and "invulnerability" both infer what they were trying to get across: this module protects against various damage types.
For the rest of your post... I disagree that the names are ok. At the very least they need to change the SIZE of the lasers to reflect the fitting size. |
Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
183
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Posted - 2012.03.21 20:53:00 -
[60] - Quote
I'm in favor of the wattage as caliber idea, as put forth previously W < kW < MW < GW = Small < Medium < Large < Capitol sized lasers, also breaking it down into number of Watts also gives some idea as to the hitting power. (larger number means more damage being dealt) [wattage][meta name][size][type] is a pretty straight forward naming schema, without much room for confusion.
Examples:
Small Dual Modulated Light Energy Beam I becomes 400 W Modulated Light Energy Beam Laser I Medium Modulated Energy Beam I becomes 600 W Modulated Light Energy Beam Laser I Medium Modal Pulse Laser I becomes 550 W Modal Light Pulse Laser I
Medium Quad Anode Light Particle Stream I becomes Quad 150 kW Anode Medium Beam Laser Heavy Modulated Energy Beam I becomes 550 kW Modulated Medium Beam Laser Heavy Afocal Pulse Maser I becomes 500 kW Afocal Medium Pulse Maser
Large Dual Heavy Beam Laser II becomes 150 MW Heavy Beam Laser II Mega Modulated Beam Laser I becomes 250 MW Modulated Heavy Beam Laser I Dual Heavy Afocal Pulse Maser I becomes 200 MW Afocal Heavy Pulse Maser I
This also makes Capital guns fall into the Gigawatt range IE Giga Beam laser and Giga pulse laser.
Please rethink naming any Beam laser "Gatling", it will just confuse everybody. When I think of something named Gatling, I think of a weapon with a high rate of fire, like a pulse laser, which Beams do not have. You've got to remember that these are just simple miners. These are people of the land. The common clay of New Eden. You know... morons. |
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