Originally by: Arrs Grazznic

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Name me one individual / player corp / alliance that can supply 175 mission running characters running the best paying level 4 missions for 23 hours.

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Originally by: Exlegion

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Originally by: Esmenet

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Originally by: Arrs Grazznic

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Name me one individual / player corp / alliance that can supply 175 mission running characters running the best paying level 4 missions for 23 hours.

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Why would you want to be in a alliance or corp for that?
Its just another example of why missions are completely out of tune with the rest of EVE.

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If you're arguing about the potential on making hundreds of billions of isks in a few hours you're not planning on accomplishing this feat solo, are you?

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Originally by: Venkul Mul

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Limit mission, ok, then what will do the players that for some reason are "cut off" from missions. It can happen because they are in the wrong Time Zone, or because the faction the work for has less agents (Oops, working for Angels I have alienated all the empires, but I have killed to much other race pirates to be accepted there and the X mission for angels for today are all gone), because the next agent available is 20 jumps avay and the player has 1 hour free and so on.

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Originally by: Venkul Mul

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Bottom line:

You think that the number of player should stop growing?

Then you are right and agents should be a limited resource, so that there is no space for a growth in the number of players beyond a specific point.

If the number of player should keep growing, a resource capable of sustaining them should exist.

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Originally by: Lord WarATron

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Originally by: Esmenet

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Limitations and competition needs to be introduced for missions like any other resource in EVE.

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What a bad idea. Whatever limit you make, people will use alts to get around it. People will just use alts. Even 1 mission per day and people will use alts so you acheived nothing.

Also, do you even relise how bad the logic is? You want to get more cloak ravens ratting in 0.0? Oh wait, lets stop that as well by limit rats such as a few spawns a day. Lets nerf traders by limiting who many people can buy from you a day. Lets nerf PvPers by limiting how many people they can kill.

TBH they should nerf people like you from posting without playing the game. The OP has not a clue what he is talking about.

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Originally by: Venkul Mul

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Originally by: Esmenet

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Edited by: Esmenet on 08/08/2008 13:45:10

Originally by: Lord WarATron

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Originally by: Esmenet

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Limitations and competition needs to be introduced for missions like any other resource in EVE.

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What a bad idea. Whatever limit you make, people will use alts to get around it. People will just use alts. Even 1 mission per day and people will use alts so you acheived nothing.

Also, do you even relise how bad the logic is? You want to get more cloak ravens ratting in 0.0? Oh wait, lets stop that as well by limit rats such as a few spawns a day. Lets nerf traders by limiting who many people can buy from you a day. Lets nerf PvPers by limiting how many people they can kill.

TBH they should nerf people like you from posting without playing the game. The OP has not a clue what he is talking about.

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Most players dont have alts (see one of the economy dev blogs i think).
It still will take a lot more effort if you want to keep 5 alts up to do what you could do with one earlier.

Ratting is limited and has plenty of competition.

Trading is limited and has plenty of competition.

PVP is limited and has plenty of competition.

Mining is limited and has plenty of competition.

Exploration is limited and has plenty of competition.

Face it any activity besides missioning has limited available resources and is open to competition from other players.

Cloaking ratters is really another issue completely.

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2,5 characters for account, so plenty of alts.

Ratting is limited and has plenty of competition
Trading is not limited and has plenty of competition
PVP is not limited and is competition
Mining is limited and has plenty of competition
Exploration is not limited and has plenty of competition sites respawn immediatly as completed

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Originally by: Amateratsu

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Why they live in highsec is open for debate, but the fact is they do. therefore ccp must cater to the needs of those players.

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Originally by: Exlegion

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Originally by: Esmenet

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Originally by: Amateratsu

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Why they live in highsec is open for debate, but the fact is they do. therefore ccp must cater to the needs of those players.

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The majority do live there, but that dont mean that they should have to cater to them.

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Who should they be catering to?

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Originally by: Amateratsu

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Originally by: Esmenet

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Originally by: Exlegion

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Originally by: Esmenet

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Originally by: Amateratsu

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Why they live in highsec is open for debate, but the fact is they do. therefore ccp must cater to the needs of those players.

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The majority do live there, but that dont mean that they should have to cater to them.

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Who should they be catering to?

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They should be catering to the game as a whole so that it is balanced in terms with the vision of the game. That used to be a competitive game with a balance of risk/reward.

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Is that not what they are doing with the constant rebalancing? (nerfs if you like)

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Originally by: Ruze

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Personally, I don't think a lot of the devs changes are directed at 'pleasing the playerbase' directly. Specifically those I've seen since coming back, like the upcoming nano nerf and the suicide fix.

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Originally by: Exlegion

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Originally by: Esmenet

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They should be catering to the game as a whole so that it is balanced in terms with the vision of the game. That used to be a competitive game with a balance of risk/reward.

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CCP is balancing the game. And Eve is catering to the game as a whole. But there are still those who insist in CCP not to cater players who decide to play the game in a different style than theirs. There are players that insist in their right to ruin these players' fun because their own fun depends on the misery of others. They insist that is their right to impose their right unto others. And in Eve you can do that; mostly in low sec and 0.0. But that's not enough for them. They want their own views imposed to those living in high sec as well.

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Originally by: Amateratsu

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Maybe their vision has changed? or maybe they dissagree with what you believe to be their vision of the game?

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Originally by: Nogap toosmall

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We all pay our subs, some people prefer the quieter life in highsec, I really dont see why anyone has a problem with that. You want to shoot people with no risk to your sec rating, fine go to 0.0.

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Originally by: Nogap toosmall

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Originally by: Esmenet

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Originally by: Nogap toosmall

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We all pay our subs, some people prefer the quieter life in highsec, I really dont see why anyone has a problem with that. You want to shoot people with no risk to your sec rating, fine go to 0.0.

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This is a competitive game, you dont live in a bubble alone. What you do matters a lot for the rest of the players.

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Yes it is, and you can still attack a player anywhere you like, that has not changed.

All they are doing is reducing the volume of this type of kill and in the process changing the value of these kills to a higher amount.

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Originally by: Nogap toosmall

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Originally by: Esmenet

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Originally by: Nogap toosmall

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Originally by: Esmenet

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Originally by: Nogap toosmall

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We all pay our subs, some people prefer the quieter life in highsec, I really dont see why anyone has a problem with that. You want to shoot people with no risk to your sec rating, fine go to 0.0.

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This is a competitive game, you dont live in a bubble alone. What you do matters a lot for the rest of the players.

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Yes it is, and you can still attack a player anywhere you like, that has not changed.

All they are doing is reducing the volume of this type of kill and in the process changing the value of these kills to a higher amount.

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Sigh it doesnt have to have anything to do with shooting other players.

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Ah so its about balance then, im actually honestly suprised. The fact remains, that in order to experience everything this game offers you have to be in 0.0. Fact.

If you want to nerf the cash available in high sec to make low sec more profitable on a risk / reward basis then you had better get ready for a bunch of threads either crying about that, or demanding that all techs (yes titans too) are available in high sec

after all, its only fair.....

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Originally by: Ruze

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That's the point of misunderstanding between both crowds. Mission runners DO have a massive effect on the economy of all of EvE.

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Originally by: Lord WarATron

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Originally by: Ruze

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Originally by: Lord WarATron

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This is the most ******ed thread I have read in a long time.

Missions are limited by TIME. Currently, mining ice is limited by TIME. Moon mining is limited by TIME. Trading those NPC goods, which are in infinite supply, is limited by TIME. PvPing in noobships is Limited by TIME. Killing rats in belts is limited by TIME.

Competing for resources? Give me a break. The low value resources exist so people can get a foothold. Missions paying out even 25mil/hour is begger money. Missions, NPC trading and a few other things exist in infinite supply because they are of low value. If you think 25mil/hour is high then you are probebly the type of person who thinks making ú1 a hour in RL a mighty sum.

Get over the insurance nerf. I have never seen these forums hit this level of ******edness in a long TIME.

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Wow. I wasn't arguing insurance nerf. Were any of you other gents arguing the insurance nerf?

I disagree on the limit of time. While time has it's effect, there are many other limits in this game, including supply and demand. Take veldspar, for instance. The most common asteroid, but because of current market imbalance, also the most profitable to mine.

It's one thing to disagree. I, personally, think your just trying to insult and get your picture seen by people as someone who can 'finalize' the discussion. And for MANY players, 25mil/hr is very good money.

Please contribute, if you wish. Calling us r*tards, though, is no contribution.

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If you think 25mil/hour is OMG isk and must be nerfed, then you are probebly playing the wrong game .

But ignoring actualy isk values, Whats your Solution? Limit people to 1 mission per day? What will that acheive? How will that stop people using alts.

There needs to be a instantly accessable resource in eve otherwise new players and bankrupted pvpers will be competed out of the game.

E.G newbie wants to pvp. He logs in his noobship keep to make isk to fund his pvp. Oh dear, he cannot ming veld to get a better ship as he was "competed out" of it.

Pvper gets beaten up and is down to his last raven. He does a mission and boom, message pops up to say he his hit daily limit and he made 5mil on that mission. Is that what you want?

Whats you solution? And whats the problem?

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Originally by: Altpause

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I see this statement on the boards all the time, that people make 25 million isk an hour running lvl 4. While this may be true, I tend to doubt it, it's a flawed assumption. The OP stated that he uses an Alt to loot/salvage, so thats 2 accounts doing 1 mission, 2 into 25 million makes it 12.5 million isk an hour.
There is also the fact that he is using a "cheap faction fit CNR" for his model and omits the needed standings and social and other skills for this. I don't know any normal players that can reach this within 6 months without buying accounts.
I get annoyed when I see these inflated figures posted as fact.

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Originally by: Somealt Ofmine

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Null-sec doesn't look underpopulated to me. In fact, looks to me like the "no vacancy" sign is lit fairly brightly. You've got political mega-blocs that are able to field dozens to hundreds of capital ships.

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Originally by: Venkul Mul

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Originally by: Esmenet

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Originally by: Ruze

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Personally, I don't think a lot of the devs changes are directed at 'pleasing the playerbase' directly. Specifically those I've seen since coming back, like the upcoming nano nerf and the suicide fix.

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Well the 2 biggest whinetopics before these changes was announced was suicide ganking and nanos. Primarily started by high sec missioners.

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Failed logic strike again .

You think that high sec mission runners have any interest in nano fit? Those NPC nano ships are terrible, truly.

Ganking, ok, it is a high sec problem as it don't exist in low sec, but again it is mostly a hauler problem, not a mission runner.

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Originally by: McDonALTs

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Thats the whole point. NPC trade goods are also the same. Buy NPCgoods and fill NPC buy orders - boom, the npc sell and buy orders instanly replenish.

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