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Hawk Firestorm
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Posted - 2004.06.11 00:30:00 -
[61]
Edited by: Hawk Firestorm on 11/06/2004 00:33:09
I can't agree to any of this.
Crus launchers have a 6 sec SLOWER rate of fire than standard siege.
And after alot of testing with them anyone fittin them is at at severe disadvantage if they use too many of them trying to save on pwr.
Which is about their only advantage to using them.
Especially when ships start equiping masses of Relay 2's, they simply don't shoot fast enough, in fact I would say at the moment that ravens are somewhat underpwred as there is no mod for cal ships to increase ROF on launcher bays unlike all other weps.
In fact I'd say that my scorpy is a far tougher, and it's only a lev 1 bs.
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Mechkilla
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Posted - 2004.06.11 01:13:00 -
[62]
Ballistic Control System I .. that is the new damage mod for missiles and launchers. Its bonuses are +7% to damage and 7,5% to rate of fire. It's already on chaos and will be introduced with the upcoming patch hopefully next week.
____________________________________________
CEO of Asgard Schiffswerften
*** Proud member of [G] ***
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Grey Area
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Posted - 2004.06.11 12:04:00 -
[63]
Edited by: Grey Area on 11/06/2004 12:06:44
 Originally by: Turyleon Caddarn
please descirbe the defense against turrets to me... cus there really isnt any, only to evade them, which is the same option you still have with missiles.
Turrets miss, missiles don't. That difference alone is sufficient that you don't need a specific turret defence. Add to that, wrecking shots aside, missiles do more damage than any turret. Tot up the damage per second that a missile-equipped ship does against a turret equipped ship and I bet the missile boat wins every time. In this game it's not damage that kills you, it's rate of damage.
If we step away from the thread a second and look at Cruisers, no weapon that a cruiser can fit comes any where near to the guaranteed 350 points every hit that a Cruise Missile can deliver.
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* I'm ALLOWED to cheat. I'm a STARSHIP. *
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Jazz Bo
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Posted - 2004.06.11 22:50:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Grey Area
Edited by: Grey Area on 11/06/2004 12:06:44
Originally by: Turyleon Caddarn
please descirbe the defense against turrets to me... cus there really isnt any, only to evade them, which is the same option you still have with missiles.
Turrets miss, missiles don't. That difference alone is sufficient that you don't need a specific turret defence. Add to that, wrecking shots aside, missiles do more damage than any turret. Tot up the damage per second that a missile-equipped ship does against a turret equipped ship and I bet the missile boat wins every time. In this game it's not damage that kills you, it's rate of damage.
If we step away from the thread a second and look at Cruisers, no weapon that a cruiser can fit comes any where near to the guaranteed 350 points every hit that a Cruise Missile can deliver.
What have Cruisers got to do with this? They won't be able to use cruise missiles after the patch either.
The reasons you have stated there are the reason we have smartmobs and defenders, only they don't work all the time and shoot down every incoming missile. Just like guns don't miss all the time.
Originally by: DB Preacher
Celestial Apocalypse - Brave souls fighting the endless smak.
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Hamatitio
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Posted - 2004.06.12 07:34:00 -
[65]
If you learn to use defenders they will work
They dont work when your moving away
they work when you approach them
Get it straight :)
--
Director of Ganking:
Death Row Inc. |
Grey Area
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Posted - 2004.06.14 15:35:00 -
[66]
So if my tactics are to sit with long range weaponry, defenders are pointless, as I have to run towards my target for them to work? If that's not a bug I don't know what is.
I withdraw the comment about cruisers, as you're right it's not pertinent to this thread.
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* I'm ALLOWED to cheat. I'm a STARSHIP. *
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Jazz Bo
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Posted - 2004.06.14 19:30:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Grey Area
So if my tactics are to sit with long range weaponry, defenders are pointless, as I have to run towards my target for them to work? If that's not a bug I don't know what is.
I withdraw the comment about cruisers, as you're right it's not pertinent to this thread.
I think what he means is that Defenders will fire in the direction you're facing, so if you're facing the "wrong" way, it takes them longer to intercept incoming missiles as they have to turn around, and since it's only useful to fire them one at a time, you'll end up getting hit by more missiles.
You don't have to be moving, just facing the direction of the enemy ships. Although with the missile bouncing you'll eventually end up facing some another direction for sure 
Originally by: DB Preacher
Celestial Apocalypse - Brave souls fighting the endless smak.
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Mongo Peck
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Posted - 2004.06.14 21:52:00 -
[68]
The Tempest, Raven, Mega and Apoc are as good as each other .... stop getting out of your prams ...
The devs can't help that you haven't got a clue how to setup your ships ...
Lets nerf all the ships so we are either flying Armour Tanked Apocs or Blaster Mega's.
Mongo speaks !!
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Torment
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Posted - 2004.06.15 00:32:00 -
[69]
Mongo stop being a **** and get enough skills to see the difference between the ships.
The Raven is overpowered,simple as that.
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Veneth
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Posted - 2004.06.15 02:00:00 -
[70]
Edited by: Veneth on 15/06/2004 02:03:53
Stop crying about missiles. I've flown Ravens, Tempests and Apocs. the tempest fires it's 1400's waaaay faster than cruise missiles. I hit for far more dmg than torps (usually 600 - 1000+) and frankly the misses don't annoy me as much as watching cruise missiles hitting for a weak 150 dmg against tanking. I see you all crying about how at 80+ km you can't take a Raven. well you really shouldn't be able to in the first place. Cruise missiles are long range bombardment weapons. Megathrons run blasters for a reason. it's a knife fighter get close and shred the raven to pieces. I've had my Raven torn open from Typhoons mounting 800mm cannons and torps not proud of it but it's happened. Apocs and geddons have great tracking speeds on turrets with very quick rof. it's not our fault they only do thermal and EM dmg. so mix them with some rails. diversify the Raven isn't some juggernaut from hell like you all make it out to be. ever take into account the other pilot can be much more skilled than you? I know I run a lot and I'm cranking 10 million in points..
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Darkwolf
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Posted - 2004.06.15 03:09:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Veneth
ever take into account the other pilot can be much more skilled than you? I know I run a lot and I'm cranking 10 million in points..
Combat skills needed to be good with missiles:
Missile Launcher Operations 5
Standard Missiles 4
Heavy Missiles 3
Cruise Missiles 4
Combat skills needed to be good with turrets (1400's):
Gunnery 5
Rapid Fire 4
Motion Prediction 4
Surgical Strike 4
Small Projectile Turret 3
Medium Projectile Turret 3
Large Projectile Turret 4
Trajectory Analysis 4
Sharpshooter 4
Seeing a bit of disparity there, are you? You don't need as many skills to be 'good' in a missile boat as you do in a gunboat. This is totally ignoring the 'standard' fitting and shielding skills which everyone should have anyway.
Now, please go and play with cruise missiles on a Raven on Chaos, please. You will see that you can get the RoF much lower than the RoF of a 1400 on a Tempest, and they are so damn fast they always hit. In addition, you have a totally flat damage profile all the way out to the maximum weapon range, which makes them very effective as point-blank weapons, just as much as for long-range bombardment. Oh, and the damage bonus given by the Raven and the skill bonuses stacking up mean you do a lot of damage in each hit. Guaranteed. And they bounce your foe around so he can't warp off. And they're still effective over 100km away. Doing the same damage.
Guaranteed damage. Flat damage profile. Short-range punch. Long-range power. Zero cap use. High damage potential. Auto warp scrambling. Cruises in a Raven have a LOT going for them, hence the whinging.
Oh, and a Raven can kick the tar out of a Megathron at close range, if it's fitted right :)
Just for the record, I can fly (and have flown) every battleship in the game, and can shoot every gun in the game. I've tried them ALL in combat, so I know what I'm talking about.
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Altai Saker
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Posted - 2004.06.15 05:39:00 -
[72]
I give up, I'm just gonna learn how to fly a Raven. Why can't ccp see that this ship is so seriously overpowered?
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Kildarin Farushna
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Posted - 2004.06.15 08:02:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Torment
Mongo stop being a **** and get enough skills to see the difference between the ships.
The Raven is overpowered,simple as that.
The Raven isn't overpowered, it's a strong ship but isn't that why it's a battleship? Isn't that why there four different races to choose the best ship that fits your skills? Maybe you should try some other ammo setups? u i'll see the difference. Those slots on a ship are there to mod your ship to your needs. Try other tactics to take it on equipe some EW it really helped when up against a raven and don't start "but I need those slots for otherthings". If you don't want to feel the missiles the spam, then prevent it from launching missiles. that's why there is EW in the game to weaken your enemy.
____
->Lawless<-
>>>New Formula<<<
>>In your local 0.4 system soon<<
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Proteuz
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Posted - 2004.06.15 08:23:00 -
[74]
Edited by: Proteuz on 15/06/2004 09:22:44
Originally by: Rod Blaine
Lallante and XpoHoc (sp) are arguably two of the best known pvp specialists in the game. If they say the Raven is overpowered and give arguments supporting that, I for one believe it immediately, and i'm no n00b either.
Hehehe, thats just funny.. but guess they have managed to make a name for themselves..
ohhh, fear the name.. best pilots my ***
but, my point.. err. hmm.. do we all ust roam around in a battleship doing 1v1 ?
noo... i seldome or never see lone pilots enymore so..
who cares, adapt or die..
______________________________________
|-Rubber and Glue, RUBBER AND GLUE BABY-|
______________________________________
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Black Lotus
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Posted - 2004.06.15 10:38:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Turyleon Caddarn
please descirbe the defense against turrets to me... cus there really isnt any, only to evade them, which is the same option you still have with missiles.
the missiles are fast, but they havent changed the agility yet. meaning when they do, bigger missiles wont be able to hit fast cruisers/frigs very well.
to the guy who said blasters dont hit: fit a webber. if you are going to adapt your setup and just want to have an easy game playing with one hand, go elsewhere. i enjoy a challenging fight, slaughters are fun yes, but having to WORK for the kill by changing setup and evading damage is the part of PvP i find really fun.
im sorry but two battleships sitting still firing each other doesnt really require much (real life) skill, which is the situation in which you are PvP'ing the raven, and the situation your are moaning about.
lol.. u answered ur own question in ur post...
please descirbe the defense against turrets to me... cus there really isnt any
only to evade them, which is the same option you still have with missiles.
Secondly. this Post is about BS vs BS and that raven is overpowered, not about BS vs cruisers and frigs.
bigger missiles wont be able to hit fast cruisers/frigs very well.
With that said, a BS can easily offset the tracking of turrets with a mwd. A bs with mwd cannot EVADE the new missile speeds ( or old missiles....)
to the guy who said blasters dont hit: fit a webber.
This is correct, however... ALL bs use blasters. And i have 40-100km webs... For the ships far out evading my tracking speeds.
just want to have an easy game playing with one hand, go elsewhere.
I suggest u go elsewhere, u answer ur own questions in ur own post. U look silly.
Also think about what u r saying next time. kk?
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Veneth
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Posted - 2004.06.15 15:19:00 -
[76]
Edited by: Veneth on 15/06/2004 15:23:30
Ok Dark so what's your point? missiles are quick to learn and do good damage. but your pointing out that if you take the time to learn the gunnery skills you'll be a far better fighter. you say flat damage is a good thing meanwhile I think it sucks, you don't have to worry about getting stuck in a ships optimal range and torn to shreds or wrecking hits. a volley off my temp will rip the shielding off a Raven and my guns fire once per 12 seconds which last I checked is faster than any cruise or siege launcher could hope for.
Yes I do have
Gunnery 5
Rapid Firing 5
Motion Prediction 5
Min Battleship 4
large Projectile 4
and Surgical strike 4.
Yes it took me some time to learn it all but when it comes down to it a Raven just can't handle the force of all the blows when I'm at range. and this missile bouncing you to keep you from warping? I tried it out with a friend in a Raven I warped away fine while taking a stream of torps. dunno what your talking about :) the only problems I have are the tracking changes. they seem a little off
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