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Frank Horrigan
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Posted - 2004.06.05 22:39:00 -
[1]
ok my m8 says he is going to mine for corp .. me sitting in station bored i say "can i come"
well anyway we go over mine for a bit.... hauler gettin stuck on roids so we got about a full can sitting in belt
then this corp comes in frigs crusiers and haulers to steal our ore... o what joy
screenshots of the crime
Linkage 1
Linkage 2
 Originally by: Oveur
Originally by: Bhaal
What has turned out better than expected?
Everything. Remember, we're from Iceland.
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <) This i |
Camaro
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Posted - 2004.06.05 23:31:00 -
[2]
hmm. a 0.5. wont ask why u dident use a secure, but hey, all do bloopers sometimes
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tomw
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Posted - 2004.06.05 23:31:00 -
[3]
1. there is no such thing as stealing ore from a jet can. ccp has stated this several times, use them at your own risk. as lame as it is just have to deal with it and keep a list of people who take what they have not earned.
2. in the screen you posted you state that YOU are a ore thief when board so that makes any moaning and groaning from you rather pointless.
_______________________________________________
any and all statements above this line may be influanced by alcohol and/or cheetos.
Dragons united is now recruiting, contact me, slidw, or marcusal |
Arc Enemy
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Posted - 2004.06.06 00:29:00 -
[4]
Ore thieves? How can anything in a jetcan belong to someone?
Hard work? What hard work? It's a game! If you find the game hard work, it's time to give up
Use the f**kin secure cans provided. They dont get ore 'stolen' from them
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Xendie
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Posted - 2004.06.06 00:59:00 -
[5]
lol isnt it pathetic when a ore thief corp whines about getting their ore stolen?
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Kildarin Farushna
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Posted - 2004.06.06 01:01:00 -
[6]
Its just a game boys
____
->Lawless<-
>>>New Formula<<<
>>In your local 0.4 system soon<<
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MooKids
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Posted - 2004.06.06 06:18:00 -
[7]
Either he is hypocritical or sarcastic. I am betting on sarcasm.
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CCP can patch away bugs, but they can't patch away stupidity. |
Frank Horrigan
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Posted - 2004.06.06 06:42:00 -
[8]
1. I am an ore theif.
2. stealing ore to get revenge is STILL stealing ore...
3. just warning other ore theifs before they get there ore stolen too 
Originally by: Oveur
Originally by: Bhaal
What has turned out better than expected?
Everything. Remember, we're from Iceland.
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <) This i |
Frank Horrigan
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Posted - 2004.06.06 06:43:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Camaro
hmm. a 0.5. wont ask why u dident use a secure, but hey, all do bloopers sometimes
ive been stealing ore for about 5 days now and i have yet to see anyone using a secure can.. ranging from 0.9 to 0.5
Originally by: Oveur
Originally by: Bhaal
What has turned out better than expected?
Everything. Remember, we're from Iceland.
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <) This i |
Lipid
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Posted - 2004.06.06 18:12:00 -
[10]
Karma's a b!tch eh frank?
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Kel Shek
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Posted - 2004.06.06 19:40:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Kel Shek on 06/06/2004 19:43:13
yall really aren't so mindlessly immoral to think that its really not stealing just because its possible, are you?
I mean seriously. yes, it IS stealing. stealing isn't wrong because you can get in trouble for it, or because theres a law against it, or police and security cameras stopping you.
its wrong because its taking something from someone else, that you didn't earn, and weren't given. yes, it IS stealing. yes, TECHNICALLY downloading copywrited mp3's IS stealing. (though, I would agree that its not nearly as solidly into the "stealing" category... in a technical sense it still really is).
in my opinion, in this game, its really almost MORE of a crime to ore steal from someone in secure space, than it is to blow someone up in 0.0. simply because in 0.0, its expected, the areas dangerous, its not allegedly safe. in high sec areas, its supposed to be safe from negative player interaction, yes, thats a care-bear approach. but guess what? some people feel that way, and have NO interest in PvP interaction in any way. and it should NOT be forced on them.
that aside, lol, I find the idea of a known ore stealer being stolen from, to be quite funny. karma and all that.
I find it interesting though how people complain about it, and so on... yet still use jettison cans in space that they could use secure cans.
I don't get that part... I invested and got a set of full size secure cans... yes, its a big investment, and when you mine in .8+ space they won't be used in that way anyway... but they still signifigantly increase your cargo capacity in the indy, for when you ARE jettison can mining. and when you can use them.... its so much more relaxed to mine into a secure can, since you have no worry of the stuff being stolen, even if you were blown up, your ore is still safe.
personally for mining in lower sec areas, I think the investment is well worth it.
uhh... topic, right topic.
ore stealer getting stolen from: Ha Ha!.
ore stealers in general: is there nothing better for you to do than greif others by stealing the results of their time and effort mining? especially in areas where they can't fight back?
edit: oh yeah. I do not personally have some sort of obsessive revulsion to PvP, but stealing from someone when they can't defend themself is seriously cowardly.
also... I've never had ore stolen. even when I do use jettison cans.
~~~~~
To see a World in a Grain of Sand
And Heaven in a Wild Flower
Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand
And Eternity in an hour
~~William Blake |
MooKids
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Posted - 2004.06.06 19:50:00 -
[12]
Kel Shek, there is no such thing as ore theft or ore stealing. The process of using a jettison can means it is open to anyone. Hell, the word jettison describes throwing GARBAGE overboard! So you are saying that if you keep throwing hundred dollar bills into a trash can on the street, I am a thief because I am taking the money out of there? All I would be is a garbage picker (who is picking out hundred dollar bills  ).
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CCP can patch away bugs, but they can't patch away stupidity. |
CodeFreeze
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Posted - 2004.06.06 19:53:00 -
[13]
Ore theft has to be about the dullest occupation in this game. Thus it marks you out as rather sad.
I do admire Vogon though, the only gamer to carry out ore theft with aplomb and humour. 
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Kel Shek
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Posted - 2004.06.06 20:00:00 -
[14]
if someone (for some unknown reason) is transporting something... to try to make the comparison more reasonable... say, hell I don't know, bagels. in a trash can. they open the back of their vehicle, one person unloads the trash cans(they say trash can on the label, since they are still new) of bagels off the vehicle, while the other person carrys the trash cans and/or their contents into the building.
you come along and take the whole can, or the contents, or both.
in this situation, guess what? thats stealing. wether your doing it with a cop standing behind you, in a populated area, or wether your doing it in the middle of the desert where authoritys could not effectively stop you, or if they drove off and the cans haven't all been brought in the building, so nobody would even know its you... its STILL STEALING.
the fact that its in a jettison can, is merely a pathetic excuse. the fact that its in the middle of being used in a manner other than its original purpose, overrides the fact that it was intended as a "I don't want this anymore" type disposable container.
for goodness sakes, if your going to be a criminal at least be honest with yourself and admit that it IS stealing. maybe in a sense the fact that so many people deny the idea that it REALLY is stealing, is a sign that they aren't really bad people being able to show it in a game, where they can't in real life... that they are just playing a certain way, and would feel bad if they thought of what they were doing as stealing and hurting someone else. (which it is).
and the other thing, for goodness sakes, be a criminal where they can defend themselves, its pretty pathetic and cowardly not to.
~~~~~
To see a World in a Grain of Sand
And Heaven in a Wild Flower
Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand
And Eternity in an hour
~~William Blake |
CodeFreeze
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Posted - 2004.06.06 23:05:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Kel Shek
in this situation, guess what? thats stealing.
Of course it is! If you help yourself to a can full of ore that you had no part in filling then you're taking the fruits of someone else's labour.
So you are as lowly as a common pickpocket/theif/burglar.
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MooKids
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Posted - 2004.06.06 23:11:00 -
[16]
Last thing we need is another flame war on the so called "ore theft." Besides, if you think about it, jet can mining is actually a form of exploiting that CCP just turns a blind eye towards.
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CCP can patch away bugs, but they can't patch away stupidity. |
agrizla
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Posted - 2004.06.06 23:19:00 -
[17]
Originally by: MooKids
Last thing we need is another flame war on the so called "ore theft." Besides, if you think about it, jet can mining is actually a form of exploiting that CCP just turns a blind eye towards.
Way way back Helmar (IIRC) actually stated that mining into a jetcan was an exploit. For a while the GMs said this too and then the whole thing got quietly dropped.
Whatever - it's BORING and has been for a year now. Either :
a) use jetcans and stfu if someone takes the ore;
b) use secures.
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Etoile Chercheur
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Posted - 2004.06.07 03:30:00 -
[18]
i think it's silly to argue about whether it's really stealing or not. who cares? the salvager still ****es-off the miner either way.
miners have the right to voice their concerns and feelings about somone taking ore they intended to haul to the station themselves. calling it stealing is just the easiest way to refer to what's happened. it's what people understand.
how would people that hunt npc rats feel about someone following them around in a faster ship, snatching all their loot before they could get to it? wouldn't you naturally refer to that as stealing somone's loot?
but it's not in their hold yet... so it's not theirs really. not yet. it belongs to the first person to take it into their hold and keep it there...
but wouldn't the npc rat hunters have a right to post to the forums and express extreme displeasure concerning someone swiping their loot? of course they would.
and you can bet that no one would flame them for complaining about someone merely "salvaging" what they clearly had no interest in. if they really wanted the loot, they'd have a faster ship... this is the reasoning of people that flame miners for getting angry about ore thieves.
Midshipman Etoile Chercheur - Logistics Division (M&T) | Hadean Drive Yards
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Kel Shek
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Posted - 2004.06.07 03:37:00 -
[19]
and we come to why dead horses get so badly beaten! newer people who haven't had the debate before...
honestly at first i presumed we couldn't put things into jettison cans... for the pure fact of the whole "exploiting" issue. seemed odd to me when I found out you could...
to put it simply... its easy enough to avoid the problem of ore stealing. I find it intriguing that theres such a problem of it, when the benefits of the obvious solution are practically overwhelming,,,,(secure cans being more relaxed, safer, the areas you can put the cans in having even things like scord in much higher quantitys...)
~~~~~
To see a World in a Grain of Sand
And Heaven in a Wild Flower
Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand
And Eternity in an hour
~~William Blake |
Latex Mistress
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Posted - 2004.06.07 06:19:00 -
[20]
<Ring>
<Ring>
EVE Community: "Hello?"
Dead Horse: "Hi, I was just wondering when you'd like to stop BEATING ME!!!"
<Click>
If ECM is an act of aggression, why am I not on kill mails?
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EXZODIER
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Posted - 2004.06.07 12:10:00 -
[21]
what u all should do is mine in 0.4 or below that way i dont have to steal your ore i can just kill you instead
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Dark Dynamite
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Posted - 2004.06.07 12:26:00 -
[22]
Originally by: EXZODIER
what u all should do is mine in 0.4 or below that way i dont have to steal your ore i can just kill you instead
Uhm but if he kills you?
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Sammyantha
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Posted - 2004.06.07 12:38:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Latex Mistress
<Ring>
<Ring>
EVE Community: "Hello?"
Dead Horse: "Hi, I was just wondering when you'd like to stop BEATING ME!!!"
<Click>
haha
.
EVE GUARDIAN - I am a Pirate Alliance - pleased to meet you.
"The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse *****(prostitute). We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and riffle their pockets for new vocabulary." |
ore thief
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Posted - 2004.06.07 18:34:00 -
[24]
i have never stolen from anyone ive erm just opened alot of unsecure cans  
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Lance60266
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Posted - 2004.06.08 13:26:00 -
[25]
CCP could fix this in Shiva if they choose to. I can debate both sides of a jettison can being stealing or not but quite frankly it is not worth it here in this forum since both side are so deeply entrenched that neither would ever even consider the others point of view.
The solution is to remove the ability to jettison ore in space. Now before you jump to conclusions hear me out.
Create a True Industrial ship. One that has cargo cap between 7 to 15K cargo. with spots for Miners not weapons. maybe 4 miners and mining drone space. perhaps one defense turret.
Then you would combine Mining and hauling into one job which from what I have read is supposedly how CCP planned it from the beginning. Also, You then will need Fighter to cover your mining operation which gives use back to Frigates in high sec space and Noobs. and also gives use to Cruiser and Battleships in low sec space.
This also would solve the lifelong argument about people using Battleships to mine.
To me this sounds like a Very easy solutiuon, The only reason I could see not doing it is that CCP wants this kind of contraversy in the game.
Who knows TomB might have a alt character that he uses to steal ore with just to try to get people out in 0.0 where he can blast them.
"Its all fun and games til somebody gets Podded" |
Galban Hunter
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Posted - 2004.06.08 14:00:00 -
[26]
In Shiva ore 'taken' in this way will be flagged and thus be conisdered contraband for anyone but the owner. Thus Concord will/can blow up your ship and/or fine you ISK for doing this.
--------------------------------------------
[2005.02.08 13:58:16] Your Mega Beam Laser II perfectly strikes Sansha's Beast, wrecking for 709.6 damage.
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Lance60266
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Posted - 2004.06.08 14:44:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Galban Hunter
In Shiva ore 'taken' in this way will be flagged and thus be conisdered contraband for anyone but the owner. Thus Concord will/can blow up your ship and/or fine you ISK for doing this.
I would love to read the information on this if you can point me to a source, I have heard of "Criminal Flagging" but have not seen specific details yet.
I would however still maintain that creating a system that removes the need to dump ore in space would be a total answer for ore thieves, Then if they want ore they would have to pirate a ship and face consequences rather than steal and run like scavengers.
Maybe even a system that allows ore to be transfered Directly from one cargo hold to another would be useful.
"Its all fun and games til somebody gets Podded" |
Galx
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Posted - 2004.06.08 15:18:00 -
[28]
WTF an ore theif complaining he got his ore stolen?
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2004.06.08 15:38:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Lance60266
Maybe even a system that allows ore to be transfered Directly from one cargo hold to another would be useful.
I once debated posting a "mod item" in the ideas forum. Essentially it would require two parts to function.
On the miner it would be a med slot item, or high even, called "laser redirector" which would allow the miner to "redirect" the ore laser beam to an industrial.
On the industrial it would be be "laser reciever", or some such name. This would allow the "redirected" beams to deposit the ore in the cargo hold of the truck. Make it something with atrocious power requirements. (Would force the use of rcu's to limit cargo hold and also disallow burners.)
These could have interesting skill req combinations and even one or two new skill reqs. I.e. for a miner he would need sensor linking, a very underused skill imho, to be able to link up with the truck. For the truck it might require a special skill to run the "reciever". With the added fillip of limited number of recievings based on skill level. (another i.e. Ore Redirection = 1 redirection reciept per skill level).
This would remove ore jet canning but it would also remove much of the dreariness involved in mining. Not a good thing really since the amount of dreariness involved is part of the risk/effort vs. reward.
Note: People seem to always say it "risk vs. reward" eliminating anything connected to effort. A true contradtiction in my mind. It is as if the overall mindest is that "someone who wants to spend the effort, hours upon hours, shouldn't recieve any value for that"
/me is boggled.
Of course this whole "ore collecting/stealing" argument has merits that the "collectors" are intentionally ingoring in all of thier commentary.
It is completely accurate that ore being stolen, or collected, is part of the "risk vs. reward" of mining into jet cans.
What they don't want anyone to "solve" is the lack of any associated "risk" with the collecting.
Inequality, in their favor of course. And they will do what they can to defend it.
Vigorously and incessantly.
Eve Guardian - Former Reporter
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Lance60266
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Posted - 2004.06.08 15:50:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Originally by: Lance60266
Maybe even a system that allows ore to be transfered Directly from one cargo hold to another would be useful.
I once debated posting a "mod item" in the ideas forum. Essentially it would require two parts to function.
On the miner it would be a med slot item, or high even, called "laser redirector" which would allow the miner to "redirect" the ore laser beam to an industrial.
On the industrial it would be be "laser reciever", or some such name. This would allow the "redirected" beams to deposit the ore in the cargo hold of the truck. Make it something with atrocious power requirements. (Would force the use of rcu's to limit cargo hold and also disallow burners.)
I would see it working maybe in the same mannor as the shield transfer devices, I like the idea of it being a medium slot for the indy and the miner.
OK CCP, we have solved the issue, could you please implement it soon. (tm)
"Its all fun and games til somebody gets Podded" |
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