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Malcanis We are Legend eXceed.	Posted - 2008.08.22 21:22:00 - [1] For the 10th time: make ECCM a sensor booster script. When a T2 Sensor Booster can give +60% lock speed OR lock range OR sensor strength, there is not problem, right? If you want to specifically fit your ship vs ECM ships, fit a second SB rather than an ECCM; 1.6 x 1.5 = 2.4x normal sensor strength - very hard indeed to jam on a BC/BS or even a HAC, and you can have extra lock sped/range when ECMers aren't around. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis We are Legend eXceed.	Posted - 2008.08.22 21:55:00 - [2] Originally by: Ignatious Mei Originally by: Malcanis For the 10th time: make ECCM a sensor booster script. When a T2 Sensor Booster can give +60% lock speed OR lock range OR sensor strength, there is not problem, right? If you want to specifically fit your ship vs ECM ships, fit a second SB rather than an ECCM; 1.6 x 1.5 = 2.4x normal sensor strength - very hard indeed to jam on a BC/BS or even a HAC, and you can have extra lock sped/range when ECMers aren't around. That is what a lot of us are advocating. OK cool, let's add in making sig distort amps work for damps/TD/TP and work up a CSM thread. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis We are Legend eXceed.	Posted - 2008.08.24 15:12:00 - [3] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Lorz0r I waste a midslot on ECCM and still get permajammed by a ship that I'm directly trying to counter. I overload it and still get permajammed. why bother Ok, so you're either lying or you get wtfbbq'd by much larger forces. A max skilled Falcon has a 75% chance of jamming a Tempest without an ECCM. A single ECCM drops it to a 37.9% chance. The only way that I'd believe the Tempest got "permajammed" is if it died in the first 20 seconds. -Liang "permajammed" = forum-speak for "more than 1 cycle of jamming acheived". CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis We are Legend eXceed.	Posted - 2008.08.24 15:12:00 - [4] Originally by: Dristra Hmph These arguments are all about "ecm is op" "no it is not" "face my theory craft" All in all the "you are now removed from the battle for 20sec" effect is what is bringing up these whines, chould there possibly be some other way for ecm to function? Such as? CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis We are Legend eXceed.	Posted - 2008.08.24 15:17:00 - [5] Originally by: Cpt Branko Originally by: Lorz0r Originally by: Liang Nuren Falcons don't carry 5 racial jammers of one type, you know. You're just making up situations... and at that rate it's fairly easy to say that the gang layout is: - 4 Battleships, 1 falcon - 5 Battleships (2x with ECCM) - Falcon instapops - 5 Battleships obliterate 4 battleships. U WIN, LOL. ECCM is very powerful, but don't expect it to completely remove the chance to be jammed. No other ewar counter does this, so don't expect it here either. -Liang Yeah, you're right they don't. They definately do tend to fit 2 of the same type of racial jammer though, that's completely realistic. Our falcon alt certainly does. - 4 Battleships, 1 falcon - 5 Battleships (2x with ECCM) - Falcon is 180km away so it still proceeds to permajam 2-3 battleships even with ECCM (I have NEVER seen a falcon within 60km of my BS) - 5 Battleships die in yet another boring as shit pvp matchup due to ECM being involved fix'd Even in the 'one is a fully ECCM-ed sniper battleship' situation: 1 falcon, 4 battleships 1 ECCM sniper BS, 4 battleships Falcons jam 3-4 BS for 20s. ECCM sniper BS fires on falcon, falcon warps away (we've had that particular situation plenty of times). So, there's now 4 battleships (assuming falcon is too scared) fighting 4 battleship plus a sniper BS (which only really contributes drone DPS), with anything from 30K to 50K effective DPS head start, so there's no clear cut winner, and the odds aren't on the 4 BS + sniper BS side either. If the 4 BS pop the sniper who'll have shit eff HP anyway, falcon returns and they have a easy victory. On the other hand, with the 4 BS + sniper BS gang fighting 5 BS, they just die horribly. Why do I mention this? Did I also mention falcons have a covops cloak? Well, Falcons have a covops cloak. That means you don't know they're there previously (well, I generally do because we set negative standings to all falcon pilots to make them show up in local, so at least nobody is screwing you over twice). 3-4 BS! I count 2 BS jammed as a good result. 3 is bloody good. 4 is great. Not infrequently I jam no BS. Oh and a Falcon without a MWD is of limited use unless he already has bookmarks set up. (No bookmarks = 100Km range, which he can improve at a whopping 212m/s) In which case you're complaining about losing to a gang that has prepared for a battle and has defender's advantage. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis We are Legend eXceed.	Posted - 2008.08.24 16:23:00 - [6] Originally by: Ambien Torca Getting 200km bookmark, all it takes is warp to gate at 100 cloaked, bookmark, warp back to station/planet/whatever and come to bookmark at 100km. There is no need to crawl at range. All of which takes a lot of time. 6 warps per bookmark, in a very slow, clumsy ship - and most of the time they won't be widely seperated so you wont be able warp from 1 to the other. And they'll be in highly predictable locations. I used to forgo a MWD in favour of an extra jammer, but after several embarrassing losses, I accept the requirement. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis We are Legend eXceed.	Posted - 2008.08.27 20:31:00 - [7] Originally by: Derek Sigres I'm not kind hearted enough towards the nerf brigade to even BEGIN to belive that forcing a falcon into closer ranges or giving it lower sensor strength will satisfy them. Their goal all along seems to be to eleminate any module, ship or strategy that provides an alternate path to success other than firepower and tank. Nerf the falcon to uselessness and the rook becomes the new hate target. Nerf that and it's the scorpion. Then the blackbird and so on down the line until the caldari ECM ship lineup is neutered like the gallente recons. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Malcanis Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.08.30 19:08:00 - [8] Originally by: OffBeaT just make damps do there job again well and ecm wont be the problem they are now. how could they let damps get so crapy.. Exactly. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.

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