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On low sec and mission whining (WAY TL;DR for most of you)

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Joar Mendar Gallente Trader's Academy Blue Sky Consortium	Posted - 2008.08.23 19:21:00 - [91] Originally by: Trathen c) They have too little protein in their diet to pose a serious threat. LOL
Lividicus Caldari Villains By Necessity	Posted - 2008.08.23 19:21:00 - [92] Originally by: Joar Mendar Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Joar Mendar Hmm.. the belief that murder is immoral makes me smug? No, the belief that eating meat is murder makes you self-righteous. Wait, so we can now obtain meat WITHOUT killing animals? I must be really behind the times. Anyway, my initial problem in this thread was with the fact that the OP is a hunter. I don't really know why the discussion was moved on to meat-eating... One animal invariably eats another. It's the way of things. If you found out plants could feel pain would you stop eating? I hope so.
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2008.08.23 19:22:00 - [93] Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
Lividicus Caldari Villains By Necessity	Posted - 2008.08.23 19:22:00 - [94] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Lividicus Originally by: Kwedaras Originally by: Lividicus Edited by: Lividicus on 23/08/2008 03:51:02 There is a lot of truth in that post. Coming from someone who has a POS in low sec, and attempts to do exploration in low sec from time to time, only to lose whatever ship i try to get out there... ( i have never successfully returned from low sec exploration alive. Today as a matter of fact I scouted for a couple hours and scanned down a plex in 0.2, went and got a spare raven and fitted it for the plex, went 16 jumps of warping 0 down there, only to hit a pirate hictor camp 1 jump away and get completely smashed, risk v reward can only be discussed when the risk isnt CERTAIN HORRIBLE FIERY DEATH ) I realize now that until i can get a large fleet to warp around with (and split loot with) or some volunteer to scout for me everywhere i go (sounds fun!) I cant spend a lot of time in low security space. Edit: please note that i did scout the path there and found no camps on the way to get the raven, also that i took the extra precaution of nano and stabbing the raven in an effort to be safer and planned to refit at my destination, there is nothing more other than not going to lowsec i could have done on my own to prevent what happened. Thats is not a scouting like you describe. You could prevent it by many ways, like using other fit (mwd + some overdrives and mwd away for example or use heavy neuts), using an alt to fly in front of you, using jammers. hell, you could even use your pve fit, you could kill a single hic under sentry fire fyi. It was a hictor and 9 BS... I was sensor damped so badly i didnt land a target before i was down. You're in a corp and not 1 guy in it would spare half an hour to shuttle-scout your BS through low-sec? I mean top marks for scouting out the route and all that, that was a good plan, but a lot can change in the time it takes to make an 18-jump round trip. While i agree, what am i supposed to do? change to a shuttle at every jump? I can spend the same 450 years in high sec actually having fun rather than avoiding being griefed.
Joar Mendar Gallente Trader's Academy Blue Sky Consortium	Posted - 2008.08.23 19:29:00 - [95] Originally by: Lividicus Originally by: Joar Mendar Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Joar Mendar Hmm.. the belief that murder is immoral makes me smug? No, the belief that eating meat is murder makes you self-righteous. Wait, so we can now obtain meat WITHOUT killing animals? I must be really behind the times. Anyway, my initial problem in this thread was with the fact that the OP is a hunter. I don't really know why the discussion was moved on to meat-eating... One animal invariably eats another. It's the way of things. If you found out plants could feel pain would you stop eating? I hope so. I would certainly consider fruitarianism; however to the best of my knowledge it is not possible to meet all dietary needs with such a diet, whereas it is very possible with a vegan diet. Also, it is purely hypothetical as all the evidence points to plants being incapable of suffering.
Ruze Amarr No Applicable Corporation	Posted - 2008.08.23 20:39:00 - [96] Originally by: Joar Mendar Originally by: Lividicus Originally by: Joar Mendar Originally by: Ki An Originally by: Joar Mendar Hmm.. the belief that murder is immoral makes me smug? No, the belief that eating meat is murder makes you self-righteous. Wait, so we can now obtain meat WITHOUT killing animals? I must be really behind the times. Anyway, my initial problem in this thread was with the fact that the OP is a hunter. I don't really know why the discussion was moved on to meat-eating... One animal invariably eats another. It's the way of things. If you found out plants could feel pain would you stop eating? I hope so. I would certainly consider fruitarianism; however to the best of my knowledge it is not possible to meet all dietary needs with such a diet, whereas it is very possible with a vegan diet. Also, it is purely hypothetical as all the evidence points to plants being incapable of suffering. Um, actually scientific evidence suggests that plants ARE capable of suffering and may indeed have some form of consiousness, as well as science can define 'consiousness', that is. It's my own personal belief that we human beings simply aren't smart enough to figure out what it is that makes plants seem 'alive' to us, beyond gut instincts. On that same sheet of music, plants live, eat and breath. Talking to my wife about this, her remark was priceless: "The only problem I have with Vegans is that they can see killing an animal for food as murder, but they don't believe cutting down a tree or harvesting grain is." Everyone defines themselves as 'better' than others. Yes, I would personally rather to be the one responsible for harvesting my food, or taking the life of the animal I eat, instead of letting someone else do it. Modern society doesn't work like that, and I adapt. Whatever. When our science catches up with our instincts (or some peoples instincts, that is) and tells you that not only can animals talk and think and feel and have similar lives as us, with a little more evolution, but so can plants ... what will you eat then? Bacteria cultures? Or will you do exactly what the murderous meat eaters do already, and simply decide that you are 'superior' to your food, and thus it's your right to devour it. The only real difference between a vegan and an evil raging Texan meat eater, is the level of arrogance and self-evaluation. Back on topic, it's funny, but our arguments are the same. I'm right there with you. If players are upset about being victimized, the SMART thing to do is to grab a gun and stop being the victim. Otherwise, recognize that you are cattle and food for the predators, and enjoy your life of grass-chomping bliss. The dumber the creature, the happier it seems to remain, if you've ever noticed Quote: If you like playing EvE, but don't like to PvP ... Maybe it's time you recognize that you don't really like to play EvE.
Roy Batty68 Caldari Immortal Dead	Posted - 2008.08.23 20:51:00 - [97] This thread has made me so hungry I feel like beating baby seals to death with a bag of kittens! Whatever happened to that, "Order pizza for delivery through your MMO" idea? Didn't SWG do that? With Pizza Hut or Dominos I think it was. Well, anyway... with threads like these I think Eve needs something like that. Maybe put the call in points in lowsec. This weeks special: Meat Lovers Pizza for those in Minmatar space... Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Dave Davies	Posted - 2008.08.23 21:14:00 - [98] How the christ did this turn into vegans?
Ki An Gallente The Really Awesome Players	Posted - 2008.08.23 21:21:00 - [99] Originally by: Dave Davies How the christ did this turn into vegans? OP went hunting and ended up hitting a couple of Vegans.
Mithrantir Ob'lontra Gallente Ixion Defence Systems	Posted - 2008.08.23 21:27:00 - [100] Originally by: Cpt Branko This is a BAD thing. More people flying T2 / etc because they can afford to do so and lose said ships regularly - since they have a safe ISK printing machine in high-sec - is bad. It makes attrition completely meaningless, for starters; it gives high-sec people the ability to throw more and better ships then their low-sec dwelling competitors. That is altogether bad news for their low-sec competition. I thought this would not be too hard to grasp. And yeah, FW blobs with tons of nano-shit have really been awesome for pirates (who can't use similar tools themselves thanks to sentries). Roaming is much much more dangerous, so we stick to RR BS gangs or gatecamping more then we used to. And after you kill them, they're still back there tommorow, because ISK is easy to make T2 may be the highest tech achieved so far, but according to what the Devs where saying about the development of EVE, it's won't be the highest possible. The (then?) discussions are mentioning t5 tech. Which means effectively that the price scaling will be also progressive. As it stands now mission running is not as profitable as other activities that can be considered pvp (trading, building etc). Even by having lv4 missions in high sec. People that overuse them, will find other activities to overuse. Activities involving minimal risk, as possible that is. ------- Nobody can be exactly like me. Even I have trouble doing it.
Andrest Disch Amarr EXILED WINGS	Posted - 2008.08.23 22:29:00 - [101] Originally by: Joar Mendar I would certainly consider fruitarianism; however to the best of my knowledge it is not possible to meet all dietary needs with such a diet, whereas it is very possible with a vegan diet. Also, it is purely hypothetical as all the evidence points to plants being incapable of suffering. Would you stop walking in fields aswell? o.O
Flaming Lemming Caldari Puppeteer Press	Posted - 2008.08.23 22:52:00 - [102] Originally by: Joar Mendar I would certainly consider fruitarianism; however to the best of my knowledge it is not possible to meet all dietary needs with such a diet, whereas it is very possible with a vegan diet. Also, it is purely hypothetical as all the evidence points to plants being incapable of suffering. Carrot Juice is MURDER!
Cassandra Valieries	Posted - 2008.08.24 02:32:00 - [103] Sigh, excellent post by the OP and the whiners still don't get it I'll use myself as an example, and I've learned the hard way i'm pretty damn average (Yes. I'm a newb so do feel free to correct my numbers) Let's see. I can make X amount of ISK running missions. Supposedly around 20 million an hour is the current benchmark (I make around 500k an hour so I suck big time) I can buy an GTC and sell it legimately. Guessing here, so please correct my numbers, and GTC is worth something like 100-150 million isk right? And costs around 15 USD more or less Most carebears seems to me, are adults with jobs and family and stuff. Still using me as an example, I make around 100 USD an hour, which for any remotely competent European isn't unreasonably high. Even at EU minimum vages you only need to work for 2-3 hours to afford an GTC. So nerfing the moneyprinting machines of highsec carebears are completely pointless. For most Eve players, skipping one lunch and bringing sandwiches instead, maybe two or three lunches allows them to get more ISK (legally) than they ever would get playing the game... So nerfing highsec missions won't help anybody but CCP in selling more GTCs And for the question of the day: How is it that so many failures at being intelligent human beings actually play this game??? Just proves that you don't have to be dumb to be a ******...
Cassandra Valieries	Posted - 2008.08.24 02:43:00 - [104] Originally by: Joar Mendar This is.. so very very misguided. I don't think there are many vegans who object to eating meat as "unnatural" (although modern farming methods certainly are so). The objection is based on the grounds that a) animals are capable of suffering, and b) eating meat is not necessary. The idea that it is okay to kill another sentient creature just to satisfy your palatte is, quite frankly, disgusting. [/quote Derailement, but I can't let this utter idiocy stand unopposed. Meat is nescessary to keep a human body functioning. I'm a pagan and a militant enviro protector, and there is nothing more disgusting to me than idiot vegans. Give me a hardcore republican any day, at least they have some facts to support their beliefs. People who think that the main use of animals is anything else than being food for us (for **** sake vegan idiots would rather starve human people to death rather than eat their sacred animals) Sorry, rant off
Cpt Branko Surge.	Posted - 2008.08.24 02:46:00 - [105] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 24/08/2008 02:53:31 Edited by: Cpt Branko on 24/08/2008 02:47:03 Originally by: Joar Mendar So me killing you would be okay... as long as I eat you afterwards? What? No, because cannibalism isn't a good survival trait for a species and killing people for food is bad for the species as a whole (together with being bad for smaller units of society as well), while killing animals for food is just good old natural business and generally good for humans (which is really all that matters). We're here because we've been killing sentient animals and eating them. What's the issue here? Don't give me the BS 'oh, but ecology matters' talk. Of course it does. Having a environmentally friendly society is good for us as a species - only idiots fail to see that. Decimating wildlife and killing off bio-diversity is bad, for us. Breeding other animals for food is a sane and reasonable approach given the fact that we're omnivores. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Cpt Branko Surge.	Posted - 2008.08.24 02:49:00 - [106] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 24/08/2008 02:50:09 Originally by: Cassandra Valieries I fail to realize the following: - if everyone starts buying GTCs rather then make ISK, that you will suddenly get much less supply of ISK and much more demand, resulting GTCs yielding much less ISK Failing to realize basic things about demand and supply does not refrain me from insulting the intelligence of other posters. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Cassandra Valieries	Posted - 2008.08.24 02:52:00 - [107] Sigh, this needs to said very bluntly: Considering killing an animal as anything close to using violence on a human is so stupid that is almost beyond words. If there was a god he would place idiot vegans in the middle of the wilderness (with cameras so the rest of us could watch) and I'd have the laugh of my life watching them starving to death I mean, I almost respect people who think the world is flat compared to vegans (and please note my former post about me being a pagan and a militant enviromentalist...)
Cpt Branko Surge.	Posted - 2008.08.24 02:55:00 - [108] Originally by: Cassandra Valieries (and please note my former post about me being a pagan and a militant enviromentalist...) What? Militant environmentalists are perfectly sane people. Decimating the environment is bad for us in the long run. I believe that coercing people and societies/countries at gunpoint to do what's best for the species in the long run is a good idea personally. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Cassandra Valieries	Posted - 2008.08.24 02:59:00 - [109] Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 24/08/2008 02:50:09 Originally by: Cassandra Valieries I fail to realize the following: - if everyone starts buying GTCs rather then make ISK, that you will suddenly get much less supply of ISK and much more demand, resulting GTCs yielding much less ISK Failing to realize basic things about demand and supply does not refrain me from insulting the intelligence of other posters. Why thank you in proving to be a complete and utter imbecil :-) Maybe try running a business for a couple of years before exposing your complete lack of understanding of economy
Ruze Amarr No Applicable Corporation	Posted - 2008.08.24 03:01:00 - [110] Originally by: Cassandra Valieries Sigh, this needs to said very bluntly: Considering killing an animal as anything close to using violence on a human is so stupid that is almost beyond words. If there was a god he would place idiot vegans in the middle of the wilderness (with cameras so the rest of us could watch) and I'd have the laugh of my life watching them starving to death I mean, I almost respect people who think the world is flat compared to vegans (and please note my former post about me being a pagan and a militant enviromentalist...) Actually, I'm all up for cannibalism. I'm an omnivore. Meat, veggies, baby carrots and baby calves. But just as I wouldn't eat beef in India, I won't eat human flesh in countries where it's 'bad.' But nothing makes humans 'above the chain' in my eyes. I'll eat trees before my dog, and my dog before my friend, but if he dies before me, ain't no way I'm missing a meal Quote: If you like playing EvE, but don't like to PvP ... Maybe it's time you recognize that you don't really like to play EvE.
Cpt Branko Surge.	Posted - 2008.08.24 03:02:00 - [111] Originally by: Cassandra Valieries I cannot reply with a counter-argument, but I can quote my alleged RL experience and call you a imbecil if you prefer. Fixed. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Cassandra Valieries	Posted - 2008.08.24 03:11:00 - [112] Originally by: Cpt Branko Originally by: Cassandra Valieries (and please note my former post about me being a pagan and a militant enviromentalist...) What? Militant environmentalists are perfectly sane people. Decimating the environment is bad for us in the long run. I believe that coercing people and societies/countries at gunpoint to do what's best for the species in the long run is a good idea personally. (Personal insult intended) and this is why I'm involved in politics and wasting my time voting on legislastion that has no effect whatsoever. Anybody trying to force anyone to behave like you describe deserves to be euthanised for the safety of our species. And trust me, if I have to choose between torching a fur store and your home, the fur store will live. For the best of our species... Wonder how long I can keep this up without getting banned. Any ban is worth it regarding this kind idiocy. Those who accuse me in RL of being to animalfriendly should actually read this discussion FFS I sit in the town council of my home town for the GREEN PARTY and have several sentences for vandalism against stuff like furstores. I NEVER imagined that animalrights people could be this imbecilic
Cassandra Valieries	Posted - 2008.08.24 03:14:00 - [113] Originally by: Cpt Branko Originally by: Cassandra Valieries I cannot reply with a counter-argument, but I can quote my alleged RL experience and call you a imbecil if you prefer. Fixed. Thank you for proving that you can't argue, people can read what I say, and see that you don't have the ******* to answer You sir, make the original Daniel Jackson seem like an upstanding citizen
Cassandra Valieries	Posted - 2008.08.24 03:18:00 - [114] Heh, didn't think spanish would be censored. But dear idiot Branko, please try to prove that you older than 7 years by actually answering my posts If you have nothing to add to defend yourself just STFU and stop ridiculing yourself
Cpt Branko Surge.	Posted - 2008.08.24 03:22:00 - [115] Hey. Dear Cassandra, please try to actually provide arguments for anything you claim. It is generally how discussions are conducted, which you will most likely learn in time as you grow up. Also, try learning how to read properly - it will prove very valuable to you when you get out of elementary school. Thank you Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Cassandra Valieries	Posted - 2008.08.24 03:24:00 - [116] Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 24/08/2008 03:18:18 Originally by: Cassandra Valieries ... You utterly fail at reading comprehension. Nobody was talking about animal rights. However, IF the current trend of increasing pollution happens and countries will not conform to protocols, eventually they'll have to be forced to before we all go to shit. It has **** all to do with animal rights and a lot to do with ensuring the survival of us as a species. But I guess you're too idiot to understand that. Calling people imbeciles while providing no arguments (or arguments which are based on horribly misunderstanding posts) is just Okies, might as well continue to derail this thread... If you had bothered reading the stuff I'm writing you'd seen I'm pro enviroment as well. I just think that telling other people what they should do is inherently wrong. And the day somebody tries to tell me how I should live (like you did) and at gun point (which you wanted) they'll get a shotgun showed up a place the sun isn't supposed shine and I will enjoy pulling that trigger
Cassandra Valieries	Posted - 2008.08.24 03:26:00 - [117] Originally by: Cpt Branko Hey. Dear Cassandra, please try to actually provide arguments for anything you claim. It is generally how discussions are conducted, which you will most likely learn in time as you grow up. Also, try learning how to read properly - it will prove very valuable to you when you get out of elementary school. Thank you Well try to answer instead of ridicoulus "fixed" crap and somebody might bother taking you seriously
Cpt Branko Surge.	Posted - 2008.08.24 04:15:00 - [118] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 24/08/2008 04:18:54 Originally by: Cassandra Valieries I'm pro enviroment as well. I just think that telling other people what they should do is inherently wrong. And the day somebody tries to tell me how I should live (like you did) and at gun point (which you wanted) they'll get a shotgun showed up a place the sun isn't supposed shine and I will enjoy pulling that trigger Look, when your actions start actively endangering me and my way of life, then it is the time to tell other people how to live. At gunpoint. (Historically, we've told other people how to live without any pressing danger to us - just because we needed their land/resources/whatever.) My comment did not contain any hints as to how you should live your life or that I was going to put a gun to your head. It said I believe it's the correct approach when it comes to insuring the survival of our species. You disagree? Fine. I'm still quite convinced that it will be necessary to do precisely that in the future. Claiming I want to force you to live in a specific way at gunpoint is ridiculous at best. Originally by: Cassandra Valieries And I have to add (it's sad to fall to this level) I have PhDs in Sociology, History and Religion and make around 1 mill USD a year, so you might want to have some experience with RL before you make yourself look even dumber It is quite sad that the only way you can try to get people to take you seriously is claiming that you have three PhDs and make 1M/year. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Dave Davies	Posted - 2008.08.24 04:21:00 - [119] Well this thread sure did go from zero to screeching ****head in a hurry. ----- Pop Quiz ----- Can you tell me what's wrong with this sentence.
Cassandra Valieries	Posted - 2008.08.24 04:26:00 - [120] Well, dear Captain seems like we are wasting way too much of other peoples bandwith... I kinda hope that you're the alt of your corps CEO, cause then you will be able to read the message sent to him by our CEO You might wanna take a look in another forum btw where it seems that I'll put a couple of hours of RL earnings into something usefull

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