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YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2008.09.06 01:59:00 -
[1]
Edited by: YouGotRipped on 06/09/2008 02:04:11
Ho, ho, ho, ho! Merry Christmas to everyone!
It's getting boring around here so I thought a little refresher on MD scams would do nicely. Please provide a link to your all time favorites. 
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YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2008.09.06 02:10:00 -
[2]
Edited by: YouGotRipped on 06/09/2008 02:12:36
I will now link Ricdic's favourite scam:
Original IPO
Expansion
Scam announcement
Blah, blah, blah.
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Finedele
Marquie-X Corp
Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2008.09.06 02:14:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Finedele on 06/09/2008 02:14:17
hope it gets high in your ranking, right behind this guy:
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YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2008.09.06 02:17:00 -
[4]
LOL, thank you Finedele.
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Finedele
Marquie-X Corp
Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2008.09.06 02:19:00 -
[5]
i knew it would make you smile ;) how is your precious mothership you wanted to buy?
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YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2008.09.06 02:25:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: Finedele
i knew it would make you smile ;) how is your precious mothership you wanted to buy?
On hold, I've lost interest in the game TBH. But I should check my ingame mail.
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Finedele
Marquie-X Corp
Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2008.09.06 02:54:00 -
[7]
Originally by: YouGotRipped
Originally by: Finedele
i knew it would make you smile ;) how is your precious mothership you wanted to buy?
On hold, I've lost interest in the game TBH
are you serious? i think
you just need a new goal, maybe a titan ;)
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Ricdics
Tleilex Developments
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Posted - 2008.09.06 04:49:00 -
[8]
Someone needs to get laid eh YGR. |
YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2008.09.06 04:51:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Ricdics
Someone needs to get laid eh YGR.
Was waiting for you to post ric.
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Kwint Sommer
Caldari
XERCORE
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Posted - 2008.09.06 05:15:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Ricdics
Someone needs to get laid eh YGR.
Please do not feed the trolls.
Purchasing and Shipping Moon Minerals |
YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2008.09.06 05:20:00 -
[11]
Edited by: YouGotRipped on 06/09/2008 05:35:06
Originally by: Kwint Sommer
Originally by: Ricdics
Someone needs to get laid eh YGR.
Please do not feed the trolls.
And for you too Kwint. Shar?
P.S.
My interest in the topic at hand is genuine. I would like to see how scam content has evolved over time.
Someone with Ricdic's game experience and enhanced emotional memory could provide valuable insight as I am sure you all could.
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2008.09.06 06:03:00 -
[12]
Originally by: YouGotRipped
My interest in the topic at hand is genuine, I would like to see how scam content has evolved over time.
I've been doing what I can to uncover and unveil scams, wherever I can, since 2004. And the scams change as regularly as the game mechanics do. Morbor was the first Ponzi scam (in 2003). Zeepo was a regular repeat scammer of 2004-05 note. It is mostly hard to keep track as the names are constantly recycled on disposable alts. Most of the scams, originally, were of the "bridge for sale" kind. There used to be alot of lab slot transfer scams, etc., etc..
To Shar -verb:
1 - To say what you mean.
2 - To say what it means.
3 - To say something mean. |
Ricdics
Tleilex Developments
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Posted - 2008.09.06 06:05:00 -
[13]
Cally / Dentara Rast
ROME0 (I have always believed him to be YGR tbh)
GHSC (ofc)
Probably some of the larger or at least more known ones to date not counting Morbor as mentioned above by Shar. |
Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles
Zzz
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Posted - 2008.09.06 07:42:00 -
[14]
If you allow smaller scams, ones that weren't Ponzi schemes and general failures, there are quite a few more.
So you could probably add the following:
Portsmouth Shipyards Inc (aka PSI, Wylker) failed capital ship IPO turned scam
New Moon Industries (more recent fake POS investment scheme that passed an audit)
FRPB - status uncertain; I think Ionia paid out more in dividends than the capital originally paid for the bonds, so probably not a scam.
Lothian Quay Industries (aka LQI, Kirjava): failed reaction chain IPO (poor risk management)
I'm sure that there are plenty of others.
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DIY copying in Liekuri
20:1 low-end compression |
Roguehalo
Caldari
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.09.06 08:14:00 -
[15]
Von Fitzheise already maintains a comprehensive list of scammers
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Finedele
Marquie-X Corp
Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2008.09.06 12:23:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Finedele on 06/09/2008 12:23:32
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Ponzi scam
would anyone be so kind and explain what a ponzi scam is? heard it for the first time.
Originally by: Kazuo Ishiguro
So you could probably add the following:
FRPB - status uncertain; I think Ionia paid out more in dividends than the capital originally paid for the bonds, so probably not a scam.
after two months the returns are around 210%, so this is more a very exception on the roi compared to other ventures that are currently around
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Feronia
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.09.06 13:22:00 -
[17]
Morbor was indeed the first Ponzi scam.
While most of the discussions happend on the (around that time) popular EVE-I forum, here's an old link: Morbor.
Also, the EIB scam was uncovered by Currin Trading here and here.
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Robacz
Essence Trade
Essence Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.09.06 13:25:00 -
[18]
Ponzi scheme
Ponzi is not a scam if you tell "players" it is a ponzi game before they invest. It is a scam, if you don't tell them.
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2008.09.06 14:32:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Robacz
Heh, good old EIB drama.
EIB always gets under my skin. I got called 5 kinds of troll when I posted, on the old eve guardian, that Cally had no experience, no history, and no reputation with which to start such a business. Called this by some supposedly reputable people. Goes to show you what happens to judgment values when large amounts of isk get involved. Wylker is a very good example to bring up though. Whenever someone is touting their IPO and there is some level of Alliance involvement... that Alliance should make its presence known. Still, I guess most alliances don't really care if one of their own is a scammer and thief. Just as long as they get access to the funds/resources so gained. Best of both worlds, benefit with plausible deniability.
To Shar -verb:
1 - To say what you mean.
2 - To say what it means.
3 - To say something mean. |
Ami Nia
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Posted - 2008.09.06 18:33:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Robacz
Ponzi is not a scam if you tell "players" it is a ponzi game before they invest. It is a scam, if you don't tell them.
It would be interesting to know how many would likely invest in such a "non scam" Ponzi scheme.
However I contend that the real Ponzi scheme is a stealth scheme. If it is not, then it's best classified as a pyramid rather than a Ponzi.
---
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
So we can 1 v 1 with Garmon.
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Kwint Sommer
Caldari
XERCORE
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Posted - 2008.09.06 18:34:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Kazuo Ishiguro
Lothian Quay Industries (aka LQI, Kirjava): failed reaction chain IPO (poor risk management)
That definitely was not a scam. It was a very high risk investment with very high dividends. You knew the risks going in, you still got ~50% of your money back and had it held on a few months longer you'd have seem some very nice profit. Perhaps the risk wasn't managed perfectly but Kirjava took a bath along with his investors and he really threw himself into the liquidation of the remaining assets to the point where he didn't enjoy playing anymore. I know, I "helped" with the liquidation.
Purchasing and Shipping Moon Minerals |
YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2008.09.07 02:38:00 -
[22]
Edited by: YouGotRipped on 07/09/2008 02:43:22
For how long has the EIB been running? If I remember well the guy released a boring video about how he pulled if off. I can't seem to find it though.
Scratch that, found it.
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Letias
Caldari
Poofdinkles
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Posted - 2008.09.07 02:50:00 -
[23]
A ponzi works like a proper business for the initial investors, the firsts ones in get the payouts and if the ponzi is run well enough you can actually make a lot of money off of one of these. The problem for initial investors is when people realise what is going on and call it for what it is. Then people withdraw money and stop investing.
_____________________________
Originally by: Damini Frostmane
Sex isn't sex unless one of you is crying afterwards :-)
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YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2008.09.07 02:52:00 -
[24]
Edited by: YouGotRipped on 07/09/2008 02:53:31
Or they try to convince others to invest in a hope the scam will last a bit longer for them to cash out.
Apart from the owner there are a lot of those that profited from Ponzi scams.
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Devian 666
Igneus Auctorita
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.09.08 04:59:00 -
[25]
Can we list EBANK as a possible future scam?
http://obeythekitten.com/ |
Kwint Sommer
Caldari
XERCORE
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Posted - 2008.09.08 04:59:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Devian 666
Can we list EBANK as a possible future scam?
Can we have this troll moderated?
Purchasing and Shipping Moon Minerals |
Devian 666
Igneus Auctorita
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.09.08 05:01:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Devian 666 on 08/09/2008 05:05:18
Originally by: Kwint Sommer
Originally by: Devian 666
Can we list EBANK as a possible future scam?
Can we have this troll moderated?
While I don't expect Riddic to run atm. I don't discount the possibility.
Edit: note that R0me0 turned scammer when the opportunity arose. That and multi-billion scams are not impressive anymore. I've been waiting for the first trillion isk scam myself.
http://obeythekitten.com/ |
Ami Nia
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Posted - 2008.09.08 05:47:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Devian 666
been waiting for the first trillion isk scam
All at once, or as an alliance wide summation?
---
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
So we can 1 v 1 with Garmon.
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Devian 666
Igneus Auctorita
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.09.08 06:35:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Ami Nia
Originally by: Devian 666
been waiting for the first trillion isk scam
All at once, or as an alliance wide summation?
Either individual or small group of people or it doesn't count.
http://obeythekitten.com/ |
Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles
Zzz
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Posted - 2008.09.08 09:11:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Kwint Sommer
That definitely was not a scam. It was a very high risk investment with very high dividends.
I should probably have been more explicit, but I didn't actually label it as a scam. It comes under the 'general failures' category. While I agree that a considerable effort went into planning, execution and winding up, it can hardly be called a success.
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DIY copying in Liekuri
20:1 low-end compression |
Devian 666
Igneus Auctorita
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.09.08 11:01:00 -
[31]
I think it's worth clearly labelling contributions as failed business ventures are definately not scams.
http://obeythekitten.com/ |
SencneS
Amarr
Rebellion Against big Irreversible Dinks
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Posted - 2008.09.08 17:32:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Devian 666
Originally by: Devian 666
Can we list EBANK as a possible future scam?
While I don't expect Riddic to run atm. I don't discount the possibility.
Note that R0me0 turned scammer when the opportunity arose. That and multi-billion scams are not impressive anymore. I've been waiting for the first trillion isk scam myself.
If you're looking for EBANK to be the first then you're looking in the wrong direction. There is no way Ricdic could run off with One Trillion ISK. Let alone a select half of EBANK's Staff running off with One Trillion.
It's just not setup that way, could a scam happen, yes, but not for as much as you'd expect. Any one of EBANK's Staff or Directors could run off with what they have. Our Tellers, maybe 20bil once. Ricdic maybe a hundred billion but then again he is the center point for deposits for distribution so there is elevated risk there.
I think Possible Future Scam is incorrect or at least too broad. I have no problem with people identifying risk and making those comments public. In fact it actually fuels us to find some way to prevent that from happening.
Under the current operation of EBANK, I think I can speak this for all of EBANK's Staff and Directors in saying, If someone was to run off with a fraction of EBANK's ISK or Assets, it would not be the public getting scammed. It would indeed be EBANK being scammed.
The remaining staff and directors would do anything possible to recover the loss so our account holders would not feel the impact.
Amarr for Life |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2008.09.08 17:56:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Kazuo Ishiguro
I should probably have been more explicit, but I didn't actually label it as a scam. It comes under the 'general failures' category. While I agree that a considerable effort went into planning, execution and winding up, it can hardly be called a success.
This I agree with. Failed ventures, or underperformers, are far too often labeled as scams by the disaffected. Sadly this does a great disservice to those who make honest effort and suffer from fate as well as those who invested for very good reasons. I'm not one to avoid saying a failure is a failure but I'm also not one to go lynching someone for risking and losing.
To Shar -verb:
1 - To say what you mean.
2 - To say what it means.
3 - To say something mean. |
Lexander Morinex
Caldari
LDD Investments
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Posted - 2008.09.08 19:45:00 -
[34]
I tend to put EBANK less into the 'deliberate scam' category than into the 'One bad bet, bank run, and things fall apart, then we see a scam' category.
A scam to me carries the connotation of a deliberate and planned attempt to bilk investors, as opposed to the 'well, that fell apart, I quit and goodbye' type of failure.
- Lexander Morinex
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Kwint Sommer
Caldari
XERCORE
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Posted - 2008.09.08 20:32:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Lexander Morinex
I tend to put EBANK less into the 'deliberate scam' category than into the 'One bad bet, bank run, and things fall apart, then we see a scam' category.
A scam to me carries the connotation of a deliberate and planned attempt to bilk investors, as opposed to the 'well, that fell apart, I quit and goodbye' type of failure.
- Lexander Morinex
And you are?
Purchasing and Shipping Moon Minerals |
Chomin H'ak
The Trivenerate
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Posted - 2008.09.08 22:32:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Kwint Sommer
And you are?
You mean you missed the 'Lexander Morinex' on the bottom AND on the side?! Wow Kwint, just wow...
On-topic (for once): I agree that a scam is an intentional deliberate action from start to finish. Otherwise, I would tend to call it embezzlement.
Originally by: Frenden Dax
My heart hopes that people aren't that stupid, but my experiences thus far suggest otherwise.
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YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2008.10.05 19:10:00 -
[37]
Has anyone seen Riethe lately?
hahah
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Mr Horizontal
Gallente
KIA Corp
KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2008.10.06 07:56:00 -
[38]
Well the true shitlist is here.
Director | www.eve-bank.net |
Astorothe
Aperture Science Industries
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Posted - 2008.10.06 09:01:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Mr Horizontal
Well the true shitlist is here.
There it is - thanks for the linky was scratching my head.
RPGN Gaming Network - Eve News, Gaming News, Forums & Community - Home of Aperture Science Corp [ApSci] |
flakeys
Coalition of Nations
Free Trade Zone.
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Posted - 2008.10.06 09:37:00 -
[40]
Would be nice to make this an MD scam only topic.So only IPO/BOND/Loan scams.
On a sidenote to my own scam-experience 2 days ago.I'd like to thank the person who scammed me - and surely is monitoring this part of the forum -.Thanks to you i set my 2nd account back to trading and allready made a 600 M out of it.Just like with previous isksinks i had i allways come stronger out of it.
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YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2008.11.04 10:30:00 -
[41]
Edited by: YouGotRipped on 04/11/2008 10:36:16
Originally by: flakeys
Would be nice to make this an MD scam only topic.So only IPO/BOND/Loan scams.
Sorry Flakeys but this is too good not to post.
I was flying my freighter through Jita today and received an interesting mail from a certain "YarR Boi" just upon leaving 4-4:
"Ive got special 'Mod' that cant only be installed by myself to Freightors allowing a 5 second warp, Also alowing 7AU/S warp time, Convo me for details. I Got the best r&d Agent in the game!
My Agent gave me a 10run bpc and a skillbook to build/install these so called 'mods' . Said I was the first/only one to get them untill their seeded. I Will Give away 1-2 After that and their on forums I wwill charge 500mil each.
<<url=showinfo:2183//NotFound>Freightor Warp I</url>
Freighter Warp Mod I
Improves Freighters handling and maneuverability.
Penalty: Using more than one type of this module or similar modules that affect the same attribute
on the ship will be penalized.
Armor Bonus -60%
Inertia Multiplier -75%
Skill: Spaceship Modification
Prim : Intel
Secondary :Memory
Skill at adding Mods to spaceships"
For a small sum I've been traded the 10 run BPC, if anyone is interested please post here.
Scams compilation |
EBANK Ricdic
Eve-Tech Savings n Loans
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Posted - 2008.11.04 10:42:00 -
[42]
I don't like the judgement you are placing down YGR. You are assuming people are scammers because of poor business plans. I count about 3 of the ones you have listed as not being a scam
Scammer > 2.to cheat or defraud with a scam.
Some of those you have listed have not yet scammed. Maybe they will, but you can also easily be wrong. I think posting your beliefs as facts completely invalidates your list.
The Fitz list linked by Horizontal was a factual list with actual scammers being named and shamed. They were determined to be a scam based on proof. Some of yours are being determined a scam based on your gut feeling.
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YouGotRipped
Ewigkeit
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Posted - 2008.11.04 10:51:00 -
[43]
Edited by: YouGotRipped on 04/11/2008 10:55:50
What?
Just joking, Ricdic is right. I've trimmed the list, only proven scams will be included from now on.
Scams compilation |
Ricdics
Tleilex Developments
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Posted - 2008.11.04 11:05:00 -
[44]
Thanks, much better. |
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