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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
0
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Posted - 2012.03.27 01:55:00 -
[1] - Quote
Encouraging people to commit suicide is one thing, doing it as a public figure is a different thing ;)
Go Mittens!
May many other excellent career moves decloak in your path
(I was wondering why you no longer work as a lawyer - I wonder no more... ;)
Cheers |
MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
0
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Posted - 2012.03.27 02:33:00 -
[2] - Quote
President Obama was a "kid with potential". He gets people killed, even encourages it, every day - and most people don't give a rats ass.
Mittens on the other hand, just proved he is not such a "kid with potential".
If you are going to encourage people to die, do it within a proper politically correct framework and with proper perspective.
This should be the shortest CSM Chairmanship ever, if CCP do their job right... but meh, when did they ever...
Cheers
Kyle Yanowski wrote:This topic is personal; I understand that the mittani is a kid with potential.... His rise in eve is a reflection of what is possible in life, however, what he did was wrong; what his followers are saying is wrong.... And it needs to be fixed.
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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
2
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Posted - 2012.03.27 04:05:00 -
[3] - Quote
Shitposting is only natural when your head is stuck so deep up your arse.
Sometimes it affects ones judgement. In your case, severely.
Try to leave your basement now and then, if you mingle with people in the real world for a few years, you may understand the gravity of what our beloved Mittens did.
orphenshadow wrote:Princess Nana wrote:EULA was broken. CSM Chairman called out of game for a player in game to be openly harassed. The one who is meant to represent the community has disgraced the community. Time to go. No, It was not. He did not give the players real name. He called out for the in game character to be hunted and killed. In a game that is all about hunting and killing of others. I'm sorry but just because you say that you want to commit suicide over loosing a ship in a game, does not mean that its suddenly some crime for players to come and shoot you or to encourage others to shoot you. this is eve so HTFU.
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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
3
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Posted - 2012.03.27 04:19:00 -
[4] - Quote
I, for one, think former President Clinton deserved every good oral treatment there is from Ms. Lewinsky - with no repercussions whatsoever.
In particular since it has no effect on me at all. No apology needed.
However, the political and corporate world are not as forgiving, and Mr. Clinton had to face the consequences.
And so for Mittens.
Cheers
orphenshadow wrote:MindRanger wrote:Shitposting is only natural when your head is stuck so deep up your arse. Sometimes it affects ones judgement. In your case, severely. Try to leave your basement now and then, if you mingle with people in the real world for a few years, you may understand the gravity of what our beloved Mittens did. orphenshadow wrote:Princess Nana wrote:EULA was broken. CSM Chairman called out of game for a player in game to be openly harassed. The one who is meant to represent the community has disgraced the community. Time to go. No, It was not. He did not give the players real name. He called out for the in game character to be hunted and killed. In a game that is all about hunting and killing of others. I'm sorry but just because you say that you want to commit suicide over loosing a ship in a game, does not mean that its suddenly some crime for players to come and shoot you or to encourage others to shoot you. this is eve so HTFU. The gravity of what mittens did has no effect on you at all. The only thing It did was enrage a bunch of people who were already bitter that he wont the election by such a landslide. He manned up and apologized for his actions. He also went a step further and reached out to the pilot and made amends in private. I for one accept his apology to the community and think that all of this bandwagon rage is silly. |
MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
3
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Posted - 2012.03.27 04:29:00 -
[5] - Quote
Yes. This is why we have elections.
So that the chairman forcefully relieved of his position can appoint his successor?
In Soviet Russia the president can appoint his successor. Everywhere else, not.
Candente wrote:I'm pretty sure "the bulk of his accusers" don't get elected to CSM just to generate bad PR for CSM, CCP, this game, and the general player base of this game. His apology is rather shallow, and quite frankly, the best apology for this starting shitstorm is to resign and possibly appoint a successor that is less inclined to start similar shitstorm during fanfest.
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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
3
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Posted - 2012.03.27 04:50:00 -
[6] - Quote
I'm pretty sure the job description as CSM Chairman includes the words "community", "communication" and "manager".
Which implicitly makes it a position reporting to the PR department (I'm pretty sure the PR department employs 3x the amount of people than the programmers department, anyway)
Further more, the PR department should not under any circumstance employ people who can not represent their corporation or organisation, under heavy influence of alcohol or drugs - regardless. Alcohol and drugs are considered essential and much needed tools for proper bonding and communication related to their products or services, and as such all employees must maintain self control and better judgement regardless of these external factors.
When cockups occurs, as in the case of Mittens, the subjects are usually quickly relieved of their position, and their (promising) career comes to an unfortunate, but necessary, end.
I'm sure Mittens is a likeable dude all in all, but a major cockup is a major cockup, and somebody will have to take the fall. I'm pretty sure it won't be Hilmar...
Cheers
Snow Axe wrote:
He didn't generate bad publicity for CCP, CCP did. They put a livestreaming camera in front of a drunk guy and let it linger for a good, long while. They don't get to act all shocked and awed then the drunk guy says something problematic, as drunk people tend to do that. CCP actually vetting his presentation (i.e. having no issue with him even beinging The Wis and the original email up in the first place) is just icing on that cake.
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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
3
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Posted - 2012.03.27 05:16:00 -
[7] - Quote
The main difference here being, neither you nor me are representing CCP - so we can tell anybody to F..off and go kill themselves, in the most hurtful way possible. In worst case we'll receive a ban for breaking the TOS/EULA/etc.
However, CCP and their employees, can not do this. In particular when its encouraging a major part of the EVE community, in which he is no less a major motivational figure - to harass another (apparently suicidal) player, to efficiently speed up the suicide process.
What may appear as a very thin and insignificant line said by a player, is in fact a massive grand canyon said by a person employed by CCP. It may appear as a relatively harmless joke to you, but really is (insert legal mumbo jumbo here) very serious for other people. In fact, his statement can be prosecuted in most countries and on most continents, exception being Somalia or something. And, you should think he, being a lawyer and all, would know this...
This case is, as we rant on this forum, a significant liability on CCP's end. If that dude (the subject of Mittanis outburst) actually hurts himself directly or indirectly (regardless of relation to Mittens verbal or written outbursts), a massive lawsuit is potentially piling up in the horizon...
Just my $0.02
orphenshadow wrote:But we (eve players) are by and large a bunch of jerks. We say hurtful things to each other all the time. We have some of the most personal and most bitter rivalries of any game. In no other game is there that level of hatred towards the enemy and emotions expressed. |
MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
3
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Posted - 2012.03.27 05:31:00 -
[8] - Quote
Riverini, dude...
Put our toons together, we look like an 80's Pornstar version of Starsky & Hutch.
o7
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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
4
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Posted - 2012.03.27 06:15:00 -
[9] - Quote
Lets try to make "kill yourself" look like an erryday-harmless-joke, so Mittens gets off the hook since "we all do it"
+1 for trying, -2 for being horrible at such...
Highauger's animated corpse wrote:http://i.imgur.com/Fuj0e.jpg
Come on This is Eve,
you all know the score
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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
6
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Posted - 2012.03.27 06:28:00 -
[10] - Quote
Dude... I know you're totally depending on Mittens to keep your space and all, but jeez... This is a bad case of brownnosing... "noble and honoureable name" ... That was uncalled for.
Also, I'm not your bro. I know you'd like to bro me, but no. Sorry. Maybe next time.
Zagdul wrote:MindRanger wrote:Lets try to hang on "kill yourself" look like an its-all-we-got, so Mittens' noble and honoureable name gets "dragged-through-the-mud" +1 for trying, -2 for being horrible at such... Highauger's animated corpse wrote:http://i.imgur.com/Fuj0e.jpg
Come on This is Eve,
you all know the score fyp bro |
MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
5
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Posted - 2012.03.27 06:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
Nerfing Titans is fair enough. But nothing beats nerfing Mittens ;)
orphenshadow wrote:MindRanger wrote:Lets try to make "kill yourself" look like an erryday-harmless-joke, so Mittens gets off the hook since "we all do it" +1 for trying, -2 for being horrible at such... Highauger's animated corpse wrote:http://i.imgur.com/Fuj0e.jpg
Come on This is Eve,
you all know the score Your titans are still getting nerfed... Just sayin'
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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
8
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Posted - 2012.03.27 06:42:00 -
[12] - Quote
Well, if there be no repercussions in this regard, and Mittens keeps his position - I guess it means CCP purportedly condones such behavior, and we can freely and openly encourage anybodys suicide as we see fit.
I don't mind either way, I'm no humanist whatsoever. I just want the rules to be clear, and the same, for everyone.
Xoana Antia wrote:de4deye wrote:Resignation is the only option. Or you could kill yourself, then you wouldn't have to worry about it. Hey, if we're talking about options...
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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
9
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Posted - 2012.03.27 06:54:00 -
[13] - Quote
I think we all agree on this particular part, but I'm shamelessly born without the talent to segregate the ones 'flaunting' and the ones in dire need of help.
To be honest, I wouldn't know the difference until the gravel hits the coffin... and as such, I try not to encourage people who may or may not be eligible...
I also react in a particular negative way when others, including very public figures such as community leaders, tells me to encourage other people to suicide.
orphenshadow wrote:
I don't really have any sympathy for anyone who goes around flaunting suicide as a way to gain attention. It detracts from those who are actually in need of help.
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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
9
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Posted - 2012.03.27 07:04:00 -
[14] - Quote
Riverini is unfortunately not as articulate as Mittens, and would most likely be spending more time digging into the dictionary than he would be telling people to encourage suicide.
Apart from that, he might have worked out just alright, at least for us outside of the CFC it'd probably be better... :)
orphenshadow wrote:I think we should just make Riverini the Chairman.
Then watch the game fall apart. |
MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
9
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Posted - 2012.03.27 07:05:00 -
[15] - Quote
Utchytotty for CSM Chairwoman!
(And welcome page 103)
Death Killer21 wrote:He should be removed. That should be a bannable offence. If CCP keep him then i quit my sub and im going to start writing reviews to give CCP a bad name. This is wrong and people like this dont deserve to be CSM |
MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
11
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Posted - 2012.03.27 12:43:00 -
[16] - Quote
Looking at this image with Red Bull and Jaeger - I can honestly understand why better judgement went **** up.
I'm such a hypocrite, I'd easily do the same blunder ingesting those amounts of rocket fuel myself...
^^ But meh, what can you do. GG Mittens, better luck next time ..
http://postimage.org/image/lb4yecqrr/ |
MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
12
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Posted - 2012.03.27 21:04:00 -
[17] - Quote
TLDR;
While acting as a representative of a corporation or organisation, you must abide by the very rules and regulations of such, no less follow the laws of the respective country they reside within.
No corporation can or will condone an employee or contractee promoting "death by proxy", not even as a joke.
This is a very serious matter, and opens up for huge liabilities.
Thats all there is to it. Thats what it boils down to, one misplaced sentence in the heat of the battle, with rocket fuel flowing freely. Everything else is irrelevant. Alcohol consumption will never work as an excuse. "Sorry, judge, I was so drunk I shot the guy in the face, I have no idea why"
Obviously, I don't fancy Mittens nor the Goons very much, and I certainly didn't want him as a chairman of the CSM. But regardless, I would not be a part of a lynchmob witch-hunting Mittens if I had even the slightest of doubts. I am not a Goon, I will not lower myself to their level to make sure Mittens leaves office.
Maybe I would not have been as eager to argue about it, if it was my own candidate. But I am sure, if he had done the same, we'd have an even worse shitstorm on these forums, demanding his imminent demise.
As for Mittens, the person, I have no problems with him. We all do stupid sh*t while drunk. However, as a spokesperson for CCP/CSM, he'll need to start over again, at least from where I'm sitting...
Cheers
esc shk wrote:I'm still laughing at you guys using this event, which had no effect on the guy in question (seriously he gives not a single ****), as an excuse to get a democratically elected leader removed from his position merely because a few vocal morons posting under NPC Alts have an issue with suicide ganking and scamming, which are allowed under the EULA.
Underhanded politics indeed
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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
14
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Posted - 2012.03.27 21:56:00 -
[18] - Quote
Not exactly.
Minor sentence, major offense.
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:So, mittens could lose his seat on the CSM for a miner offence?
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MindRanger
Versatech Co.
Raiden.
14
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Posted - 2012.03.27 22:04:00 -
[19] - Quote
Another TLDR... This is the respective law related to this particular subject, in the UK...
Suicide Act 19611961 CHAPTER 60 9 and 10 Eliz 2
Criminal liability for complicity in anotherGÇÖs suicide.(1)A person who aids, abets, counsels or procures the suicide of another, or an attempt by another to commit suicide, shall be liable on conviction on indictment to imprisonment for a term not exceeding fourteen years.
(2)If on the trial of an indictment for murder or manslaughter it is proved that the accused aided, abetted, counselled or procured the suicide of the person in question, the jury may find him guilty of that offence.
(3)The enactments mentioned in the first column of the First Schedule to this Act shall have effect subject to the amendments provided for in the second column (which preserve in relation to offences under this section the previous operation of those enactments in relation to murder or manslaughter).
(4). . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . F1no proceedings shall be instituted for an offence under this section except by or with the consent of the Director of Public Prosecution
Criminal liability for complicity in anotherGÇÖs suicide.(1)A person who aids, abets, counsels or procures the suicide of another, or an attempt by another to commit suicide, shall be liable on conviction on indictment to imprisonment for a term not exceeding fourteen years. |
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