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Anig Browl
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.09.17 19:47:00 -
[1]
Before starting, I'd like to point out that this is mainly a roleplay issue. Any buffs suggested herein are not meant to rebalance it all in favor of my character, OK?
Right now, once you have Science IV you can buy a tractor beam. It works out to 20km. Nothing modifies it in any way; if you want better tractoring you can get marauder (2x range and speed bonus) or a Rorqual (10x range and speed, but a much more expensive module). Also wrecks and jetcans are all the same size regardless of their original mass or contents.
I suggest some modifications to make tractor beams more interesting and fun (in return for appropriate skillage).
1. reduce the range to 15km...but allow a relevant skill (perhaps anchoring) to increase that by 20% per level.
1a. Alternatively, have the tractor range/speed be a factor of ship size. It's not really logical that a Battleship and a Frigate have identical tractoring power.
2. Allow tractoring of non-owned cans, wrecks etc. The requirement to shoot them first is a bit silly; the tractor beam is just a machine, after all. It's still a form of aggression.
3. The biggest change: allow tractoring of ships, like a weak kind of webbing. It would require some math, but no more than is used for gunnery or missiles - not an 'OMG WTF lag' problem. It's a vector differential equation, similar to (but slightly simpler) than the tracking calculation. This would give them a very interesting tactical dimension. Per 1a, the mass of your ship could be factored into this calculation once, at fitting time.
4. Allow capital tractor beaming on the other capital ships. Now whether any sane person would want to do such a thing is another question. Half the fun in Eve is seeing the clever/stupid things people do with their ship which nobody anticipated. Is it really your problem if someone decides to build a salvage titan? How about a carrier that steals ships? Narrow specifications like 'only this ship can use that module' prevent emergent gameplay, exacerbating the tendency towards every-larger blob warfare.
5. Multiple beams on a single ship can tractor one item. this actually works now, but only if you activate them at the same time. If you activate one and then the other you get an error. Doesn't make sense. Multiple tractor beams from multiple ships, probably not because you could get race conditions in the code (but see #6).
6. If small ships are targeting a much bigger one (or an anchored structure), they are pulled towards it. I'm thinking that this might help reduce the desync problems people often complain about with capital jumps. Or it could be a way to prevent such jumps - these are discussion suggestions, not prescriptions.
These ideas don't come as a package, and aren't even completely consistent, they're just meant to provoke discussion. The basic thinking is that almost all modules are modified by other factors; the tractor is something that behaves the same way for every pilot on (almost) every ship, but could do so much more.
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Caldari 5
Amarr
The Element Syndicate
Soldiers of the Forgotten Abyss
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Posted - 2008.09.17 20:04:00 -
[2]
Actually one thing that I've always wondered about was why my tractor beam doesn't work on my Giant Secure Container, presenting a error message of something like "Tractor Beams only work on Wrecks or Containers." If my GSC isn't a container, what is it?
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Anig Browl
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.09.17 20:21:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Anig Browl on 17/09/2008 20:20:48
The Space Lawyers Guild objected, same way you can't use hacking on secure containers 
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Vinarii
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Posted - 2008.09.18 01:23:00 -
[4]
Also, please seed the medium/large tractor beams that are already in the database!
Please!!!
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Kahega Amielden
Minmatar
Suddenly Ninjas
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Posted - 2008.09.18 01:41:00 -
[5]
Agreed!
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Jacob Mei
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Posted - 2008.09.18 03:26:00 -
[6]
I wouldnt mind all but number 2. Number 2 would make salvage looting, and griefing, far more easyer than it currently is.
--------------------------------
To borrow a phrase:
Players who post are like stars, there are bright ones and those who are dim.
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Epegi Givo
Amarr
32nd Space Legion
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Posted - 2008.09.18 03:26:00 -
[7]
similiar idea in sig, I even made up equations for tractoring ships in it
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Total tractor beam overhaul/engine strength |
Nick Bison
Gallente
Serenity Engineering and Transport Company
Intrepid Proprietary Alliance
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Posted - 2008.09.19 16:03:00 -
[8]
I think seeding the Medium and Large tractors BPO's and items is an idea who's time has come. Completely support it.
As for what a tractor can and can not tractor ... I would like to add being able to target and tractor those darn "Frozen Corpes". That way I could parade my defeated enemy's body around his POS like Achillies did with Hector.  Just kidding there ...
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Tarron Sarek
Gallente
Biotronics Inc.
Alternative Realities
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Posted - 2008.09.19 16:35:00 -
[9]
At least a T2 Small Tractor Beam with around 20% enhanced stats across the board but higher fitting/cap usage would be something.
___________________________________
Balance is power, guard hide it well
"Ceterum censeo Polycarbonem esse delendam" |
Brian Anderson
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Posted - 2008.09.19 18:39:00 -
[10]
 Originally by: Anig Browl
1. reduce the range to 15km...but allow a relevant skill (perhaps anchoring) to increase that by 20% per level.
Like the idea, but maybe make a new skill call Tractor or something like that and it would have a req of Science IV. That would give the range bonus to the modules and it would also allow the placement of a tech II version of the module too. Have it add range and/or speed (or thrust)
Originally by: Anig Browl
1a. Alternatively, have the tractor range/speed be a factor of ship size. It's not really logical that a Battleship and a Frigate have identical tractoring power.
That would not lend itself to most of the other modules in the game. Beside the ECM burst, the size of a ship has no factor on the effect of the module. If you could fit a Large Hybrid Laser on a frig it would still do the same dmg as if it was on the battleship.
Originally by: Anig Browl
2. Allow tractoring of non-owned cans, wrecks etc. The requirement to shoot them first is a bit silly; the tractor beam is just a machine, after all. It's still a form of aggression.
Agreed, have it cause a kill rights as if you stole from them, but not flat out can not.
Originally by: Anig Browl
3. The biggest change: allow tractoring of ships, like a weak kind of webbing. It would require some math, but no more than is used for gunnery or missiles - not an 'OMG WTF lag' problem. It's a vector differential equation, similar to (but slightly simpler) than the tracking calculation. This would give them a very interesting tactical dimension. Per 1a, the mass of your ship could be factored into this calculation once, at fitting time.
4. Allow capital tractor beaming on the other capital ships. Now whether any sane person would want to do such a thing is another question. Half the fun in Eve is seeing the clever/stupid things people do with their ship which nobody anticipated. Is it really your problem if someone decides to build a salvage titan? How about a carrier that steals ships? Narrow specifications like 'only this ship can use that module' prevent emergent gameplay, exacerbating the tendency towards every-larger blob warfare.
5. Multiple beams on a single ship can tractor one item. this actually works now, but only if you activate them at the same time. If you activate one and then the other you get an error. Doesn't make sense. Multiple tractor beams from multiple ships, probably not because you could get race conditions in the code (but see #6).
6. If small ships are targeting a much bigger one (or an anchored structure), they are pulled towards it. I'm thinking that this might help reduce the desync problems people often complain about with capital jumps. Or it could be a way to prevent such jumps - these are discussion suggestions, not prescriptions.
I like this idea, you could apply the same formula for both ship, cans, and wracks. For example a single tractor beam would provide 100000 thrust on the two objects pointing at each other. The thrust and mass would be calcualted just as it is now to get the speed. Objects would be anything that is not anchored down.
The mass of a can or wreck would be based on whatever is in it.
If this cant be done, at least make a Tech II version that has better range and beam speed.
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