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Captator
Universal Securities
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Posted - 2008.09.24 18:39:00 -
[1]
Hey, first post in this section of the forums, and have a question that hopefully someone will be willing to answer.
I have been trading with capital under a billion on an alt for 2 months or so, and have doubled my money, but used it to buy ships for pvp, reason being I couldn't work out how to reinvest it in the market to make money, or rather, make more money - all I would have done is have larger buy orders up (as I had maxed out my number of orders after a week of research), but the rate of earning would be the same, so I made the same or very similar profit per week on 800m as on 200m (good week 50-100m profit).
So my question is this, what kinds of things can you do with a few billion on the market, so that you are making more of it work for you at any given time?
A subsidiary question is this, how am I doing in terms of earn rate?
Cheers.
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Captator
Universal Securities
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Posted - 2008.09.24 19:43:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: Chomin H'ak
#1 Any amount of profit is (to quote Martha): 'a good thing'... so, Good job!
#2 You're essentially asking what to with your money, a notoriously dangerous move that usually ends up with the asker bruised and bloodied (IN GAME) on the side of the market highway... never to trade the same again! 
I am asking how people trade with 10 figure sums, I know what to do with my money below this point, but above it, I don't gain any more profit (in absolute terms, so my % gain actually goes down as it were). This is the question that I am hoping someone is willing to answer.
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Captator
Universal Securities
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Posted - 2008.09.24 20:09:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Mephistocles
If you can't make more isk by expanding vertically you have to expand horizontally (ie trade a larger number of goods).
To clarify, I have 40 buy orders across 40 goods, ranging in value from under 100k to 10m. So is the only way to actually work my money to trade on higher value or much, much larger volume items?
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Captator
Universal Securities
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Posted - 2008.09.24 21:04:00 -
[4]
Is there any advantage in having a large buy order for something, eg: 10k instead of 1k?
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Captator
Universal Securities
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Posted - 2008.09.25 09:28:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Captator on 25/09/2008 09:30:36
Originally by: Fumbles
The next step for you I'd say would be to train up the Margin Trading skill to lvl 4.
You will allow yourself to have a MUCH larger value of buy orders for the same amount of money invested = more buy orders being filled = more profit.
So do you reckon it is worth me stopping training on Cap to train up the alt for a bit? (is currently an 800k SP alt on one of the spare slots). If yes, how far do you reckon I take the training?
Thanks for the advice so far guys. I have found the ship market so far impenetrable, due to the incredible rate of 0.01 isk undercutting, I can't really keep up, is this less of an issue outside the more major trade hubs?
Edit: So the margin trading skill allows me to put up a higher value of buy orders than I actually have money for, what happens if they fill sufficiently that I don't have enough capital to buy the stock they sell to me?
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Captator
Universal Securities
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Posted - 2008.09.25 13:59:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Shadarle
First, 40 buy orders is not enough. Not even close.
How many should I be aiming for? This ties back into my question as to whether it is worth stopping training on my main for a bit to train this alt up.
Originally by: Shadarle
Second, you really shouldn't be having issues until you reach 10-15 bill in buy orders with 3-10 bill in sell orders. Up until this point I really thought it was fairly smooth sailing. Afterwards it starts taking a lot more orders across multiple rregions and multiple alts, which means a massive increase in time required. Or you have to move into non-trading profit generating areas, which you will have to find out for yourself.
I can put more money into orders, and have bigger buy and sell orders, but it doesn't increase my rate of earning, i just have to put new orders up less often. From this and what your post implies, am I trading on goods that don't have sufficient isk flow through them, if the earn/traded item rate isn't scaling up from 10m --> 100m (example figures) invested?
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Captator
Universal Securities
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Posted - 2008.09.25 17:36:00 -
[7]
Originally by: SencneS
I'd recommend scaling down your volume of trade in your few items and expanding the amount of items you trade. Then scale each one of those upward. When you saturate those parts, scale it all down down again and expand into more items.
As I said earlier Originally by: Captator
To clarify, I have 40 buy orders across 40 goods, ranging in value from under 100k to 10m. So is the only way to actually work my money to trade on higher value or much, much larger volume items?
Does what you have said still apply now?
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Captator
Universal Securities
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Posted - 2008.09.25 17:37:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Tasko Pal
At his isk range, 40 works. More would be better, but not necessary. For example, if he vastly reduced his transaction fees (broker fees near 0% and taxes down to 0.5%), daytrading would be a valid option. It doesn't require a lot of slots. Just be aware that you probably will need 4 or so orders per market to daytrade the really active markets. That means you can daytrade say half a dozen markets with plenty of margin for a little long term trading. If you want to daytrade 40 active markets, well, that won't work on 40 orders.
Added: I see he wants to know what a few billion will do. Yea, more orders. Sorry, Shad.
What do you mean by daytrading? Thanks for the further advice guys  .
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Captator
Universal Securities
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Posted - 2008.09.26 17:13:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Wen Deivar
people trading with 10 figure sums generally have 100+ open orders that they work with
also try trading on higher value items because for example trading almost any T2 mod worht ~1mil can give you 100K profit per module + large volume sales and i doubt your 100K items are making you the same kind of isk
What kind of volumes do you consider 'large' ?
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