On April 27th, the start of spring, the Sebiestor New Year

Yes, because currently you, Airaken, are exactly what every Matari would want in their celebration of Renouncing the God of slavery.

No, wait. Not really.

Sounds very intriguing. I would love to attend and observe if you would be so kind as to permit it.

I am Sebiestor and where I come from, New Year starts on 1.1., with celebrations usually for the two weeks before, and there is another important yearly date at midsummer (date varies a little, end of 06 or beginning of 07). Some folks we have close ties with count Years from harvest, too, but we never were that rural. Customs sound familiar though; new year is a time for remembering the death and your Vanquishing sounds like what I know as Renouncing.

For the record, if I have my geography right, my folks are a little way further north from where this is taking place.

Have a good festival. Probably won't be able to make it. And my folks would kill me if I went to yours and missed midsummer at home, which I was planning to do... :P

Sounds very intriguing. I would love to attend and observe if you would be so kind as to permit it.

Sounds very intriguing. I would love to attend and observe if you would be so kind as to permit it.

*She laughs, finding the idea of Boma attending simply hilarious. After choking back the laughter her face falls completely flat and deadpan*
Haha, No.

I assure you this is purely in the interest of anthropological education.

In lieu of the Zhayedan's presence, which is clearly non-negotiable, would the hosts be opposed to my attendance of this festival?

I assure you this is purely in the interest of anthropological education. It has been a desire of mine for some years to visit a homeworld of the vast Matari people: this is an ideal opportunity. Capsuleers who have interacted with me in person can testify to my meek and docile nature. It is certainly not my intention to incite detestation or abhorrence during a culturally significant event. Clearly, you understand the position that would place me in. I can guarantee my best behavior.

Thank you in advance for your consideration.

Were you to have shown any prior interest in the affairs of tribal society your request may have been considered, but prior to this point, I have not seen you show any curiosity at all. This makes me highly suspicious you must understand. I believe we will need to talk further if this is something you really wish to pursue.

Well I guess if those genocidal tenancies are a tradition its ok then. Carry on then, don't let me bother you.

As the keeper of Historical Annals for Huang Yinglong, we believe that seven great Vherokior shamans banished the Devourer long ago, but that evil sorcerers have managed to resurrect and free the demon many times in the past.

It's always amusing that the followers of the only empire to ever have actually committed genocide are so quick to see threats of genocide from others.

Let's hope your fears do not come true, and your enemies treat you better than you treat them.

Well I guess I will just show up anyways. It is too intriguing to miss and I have no fear of those in attendance.

IGÇÖm sure your god would be happy to meet you in person. Remember Boma, once youGÇÖre out of that pod your just another mass murderer of slaves surrounded by vengeful Minmatar.

Can we shift the focus of this back away from Boma and his cult? I believe enough of the forum is taking up by his talking without it here, if he keeps trying to stir up things, just ignore him. Don't feed him the attention he's after.

Schere, that'd be fine, I've added your registration. You're actually the first one.

Lyn, because of your past loyalties, we'll need to speak on the matter, but it should be no trouble.

Will there be hallucinogenic mushrooms?

See you there, I'll be around.

No, I don't think you will.

(...) Yet still, the empire persists in its evil ways. (...) The festival will open, on Friday the 27th, and will continue until Sunday the 29th, culminating in the Vanquishing of the Devourer, where we will destroy the evil devouring spirit of the empire in ritual. (...)

Thinking and knowing are two different things, my dear.

Feel free to explain to us how a known slaver and Cartel associate thinks he's going to show up planetside on Matar in the middle of a gathering of people who would be entirely and probably legally justified in tearing him limb from limb, and walk away breathing.

Let us know how that works out.

It pains me to read something like this. Instead of having a ritual to strengthen and heal the spirit of the Republic or the Matari people, you choose to rather attack and destroy. And there you should know that what you ritually bring into the world, you first have to raise inside yourself.

Nonetheless, or rather exactly because of what you intend to do, I wish you all the best with your festivities.

Faithfully,
N. Mithra

Feel free to explain to us how a known slaver and Cartel associate thinks he's going to show up planetside on Matar in the middle of a gathering of people who would be entirely and probably legally justified in tearing him limb from limb, and walk away breathing.

Let us know how that works out.

Your former CEO looks ready to apply a 'trespassers will be removed at the end of a spear' philosophy.

I suggest you put Mr. Airaken's supposed immortality-through-other-means-than-technology to the test, if he shows up.

I understood as a way to heal the Amarrian spirit in their own way, but I suppose this is again something subject to personnal interpretations.

Then the choice of words as "we will destroy the evil devouring spirit of the empire" was kind of off the mark.

Thats rather close functionally Uraniae. Its like...the Spirit of the Empire itself is sick, twisted and evil. The Empire can't heal until the evil spirit that is driving it has been slain, to give a chance for new spirits to arise, and take the nation in a new direction.

Thats rather close functionally Uraniae. Its like...the Spirit of the Empire itself is sick, twisted and evil. The Empire can't heal until the evil spirit that is driving it has been slain, to give a chance for new spirits to arise, and take the nation in a new direction.

So, clearly, it's not about healing that Spirit. With that reasoning in place it'd not only be okay to break the Matari spirit, but to get rid of it entirely, if one would be willing to demarcate it as "sick, twisted and evil".

If you'd think that the Empire is in need of healing, there'd always be the - by far better - option of doing an explicit healing ritual instead.

Thats rather close functionally Uraniae. Its like...the Spirit of the Empire itself is sick, twisted and evil. The Empire can't heal until the evil spirit that is driving it has been slain, to give a chance for new spirits to arise, and take the nation in a new direction.

And it is exactly this assertion that the "Spirit of the Empire" is a damageing virus, bacteria or a malignant tumor that is not only offensive, but speaks of the ignorance of those seeing it as thus. Maybe her intentions are not malicious, but she's thoroughly misguided in this.

Since someone needs to stop tiptoeing around the issue:

Yes, such rituals in the Matari culture are very much about a desire to destroy the Empire. Not necessarily the Amarrian people, but the Empire as it exists now, most importantly the parts that believe in (or for their selfish goals promote) an expansionist "Reclaiming" ideology. It is the belief of our culture that we can never live in safety and freedom as long as we live as neighbors of a vastly larger and more powerful Empire with a mandatory religion the major tenets of which includes the idea that it would be better for us to not be free and independent. Even the most benign forms of peaceful Reclaiming ideas include this belief at its core, and that belief is indeed more twisted and evil than it is sick.

If you object to this, I respectfully suggest you start working towards healing that Spirit yourself.

And we could not care less about whether an Amarrian considers our rituals "acceptable" or not.

Captain Mithra; since you speak of appreciating honest words, it would you do well to openly admit that your Empire's religion does indeed contain as its core beliefs the idea that the Amarrian people has been chosen by God to bring other peoples to His light, if necessary by conquest and slavery. Even the most peaceful Amarrian sects tend to disagree only on to what extent such violent means are necessary - not on the task God has given to the Empire.

That is not "my very own perception" of the Empire. It is what your nation is. Any discussion between us will be completely fruitless if you are unable to admit in public.

[quote=Elsebeth Rhiannon]Captain Mithra; since you speak of appreciating honest words, it would you do well to openly admit that your Empire's religion does indeed contain as its core beliefs the idea that the Amarrian people has been chosen by God to bring other peoples to His light, if necessary by conquest and slavery. Even the most peaceful Amarrian sects tend to disagree only on to what extent such violent means are necessary - not on the task God has given to the Empire. That is not "my very own perception" of the Empire. It is what your nation is. Any discussion between us will be completely fruitless if you are unable to admit in public.[/quote I admit it

I admit it

Cpt. Fehrnah, I'm not surprised you put special emphasis on the 'sick' part and try to get the 'twisted and evil' part out of view. While I appreciate your attempt at reconciliation here, I don't agree in the least with your method of downplaying what has been said here. If the Spirit is 'simply' sick you'd try to heal it, not claim, as explicitly specified by Cpt. Truzhari, that it needs to be slain. I wouldn't have any problem with the 'sick' part, if it weren't quite clear from context ('Sick, twisted and evil' - sick being obviously part of this climaxing tricolon.) that not a medical condition is meant here. And even if the medical condition is meant, there is the 'twisted and evil' part left, spelling it out in quite clear terms.
And of course you aren't offended when someone is pointing out that your drooler is sick. But first, by the choice of your words is implied that it would indeed be sick, and second he probably wouldn't say: "Cpt Fehrnah, your slaver hound Fesh is sick, twisted and evil. It needs to be slain!" Think about that.
As to the 'misguided', I think I've been very specific in that Cpt. Truzhari is misguided in this for specific reasons. It's not at all about her being Matari. So, please, stop arguing with stereotypes, it's really below the standards of good debating

In regard to what Cpt. Farel said: Indeed, considerations about other cultures are often clumsy and we Amarr aren't innocent of doing equally stupid things. It doesn't change the fact that doing something like that is not acceptable, independent of who is doing it and of the fact that it is done quite often.

And that, hey, MAYBE we will have rituals which, you know, being of a very different culture, may seem very alien and inappropriate to you .

No, I do not wish to see the Empire or its people destroyed, but the current culture, beliefs, and doctrines of the empire are patently a threat to us. As long as the idea of the reclaiming; of being so correct about your own beliefs that it is your sacred duty from your god to forcefully spread them; remains prevalent. I do not think there can be any true and lasting peace between our people. May we make cease fires? Yes. May we take breaks from the conflict? Yes.

But the core belief that forcefully spreading your religion and government will make us better will always loom there like a dark cloud. The devourer is always hungry. I do not think that anyone in New Eden not of the Amarrian faith is truly safe from the empire, not even your allies.

Turn or burn. I've heard the phrase in local enough to know that it is an attitude still held by many Amarrians. It is that idea that we seek to destroy. The hungry spirit that devours and spreads and enforces its will by laser and sword, is evil and needs to be destroyed. For the good of my people, for the good of the Amarrian people, and for the good of the cluster, it must happen.

I don't know, Crow, I've never been asked to give up my beliefs by any Matari I've spoken with. No Matari has ever said or even hinted that I would be better off without my beliefs. No Matari has ever tried to push their beliefs on me without me asking about them.

We don't proselytize, we are perfectly content to let anyone walk whatever path they wish, provided it does not harm us. You have to jump though many, many, many hoops to prove you wish to be Matari. Not only do we not force it on anyone, we make it hard for even those who'd want to. One has to truly desire to become Matari, and prove it by action, to become one of us.

We don't proselytize, we are perfectly content to let anyone walk whatever path they wish, provided it does not harm us. You have to jump though many, many, many hoops to prove you wish to be Matari. Not only do we not force it on anyone, we make it hard for even those who'd want to. One has to truly desire to become Matari, and prove it by action, to become one of us.

Thousands apologies, I must have been mistaken. I thought I was in a public discussion of a religious event with the main attraction being spiritual warfare in an attempt to destroy 'the Spirit of Amarr.'

Yes we Amarrians practice Reclaiming, yes it is a part of our religious doctrine. Yes we practice slavery, yes it is part of our culture. Yes these two are in our doctrine and culture because of our beliefs.

Tribes are seeking to change all three through force. I care not one whit if you preach to the Gallante or not Truzhari. That is not what I said of you. So thank ms. Fehrnah for trying to shield you from what I did say.

So, out of curiosity, is that white shirt now a uniform for -TRA, or what? It seems like every one of your pilots is wearing it.

I wanted it, then I didn't want to feel too obvious so I forced everyone else to wear it.

Well, this really opened my eyes.

Trust me, I use the membership for my amusement and self-confidence in ways you can't even begin to imagine.

If I may be sincere,

Yes, I can begin to imagine.

Aphoxema certainly does have a way of... persuading us to do what she wants.

Interesting, after two days spent in system, I have seen no evidence of any campgrounds or festival.

I would have liked to meet some of you misguided souls. If nothing else to help you all understand that there is only one God, and Empire is not evil, but only looking out for your souls.
I will of course pray for you as I return my ship to Amarr this evening.

-Rorin Cutter
Let us pray! Let us Fght! Let the universe be ours! Amarr Victor! Deus vult!