. I m sorry, I m just that bad at posting...

Why is the quote button so close of the edit one

I ... maybe he decides that after all the harassment that has rained down from his actions that maybe internet spaceships isn't worth it.

oops I did it too


Look

There were two incredible public learning moments. First, we watched the alliance presentation where we saw a player beg and beg to be left alone. Then after the presentation, speaker went on to call for players to finish this guy off in RL by continuing to grief him in game.

That is the conversation you need to have.

What is griefing? Why are you doing it? Do you see how this affects your RL behavior now?

We watched on film how ingame behavior leaks out into RL. FREE him? He's in RL as tho that is a prison and he is being kept from his REAL life in EVE?

The lines are really blurry. That you should consider.

And, do I need to point out that you all feel a little bit of what you have been handing out? And now you going to just step it up?

What is this? EVE jihad? Take the 30 days and reflect...that is what the 30 ban is for. I suggest a course correction, but I don't expect it. Good luck with this convo

My suggestion? BALANCE and perhaps don't play the game when you are not actually playing the game?

...But some people clearly used that to get him out of the CSM and I feel it was somewhat wrong.

Surely in an organization as large as GoonWaffe there must be a decent leadership structure to save from being thrown into irrelevance in a mere 30 days. An up and coming #2 looking to make a name for themselves.... the capable steward....

Like the Mittani himself?

He seemed popular enough at the polls

He seemed popular enough at the polls

Yes he was, does this mean you have no one else at all. You poor Goons.

i think it's time to declare a moratorium on tildes thx

i think it's time to declare a moratorium on tildes thx

Ah don't worry about that. It isn't as though he singlehandedly runs the whole CFC.

But odd to see someone pitying goons, normally you'd be telling everyone about our ~structural weakness~ and agitating for ~regime change~ and ~humanitarian intervention~.

It is tough being a goon these days. The common goons have largely lost faith in The Mittani, and rarely log in anymore. Dear Leader's current battles with the directorate are legendary, and now I hear the corp wallet has gone missing,. I hear there's a term for what I'm seeing but I can't remember it

oops I did it too


Look

There were two incredible public learning moments. First, we watched the alliance presentation where we saw a player beg and beg to be left alone. Then after the presentation, speaker went on to call for players to finish this guy off in RL by continuing to grief him in game.

That is the conversation you need to have.

What is griefing? Why are you doing it? Do you see how this affects your RL behavior now?

We watched on film how ingame behavior leaks out into RL. FREE him? He's in RL as tho that is a prison and he is being kept from his REAL life in EVE?

The lines are really blurry. That you should consider.

And, do I need to point out that you all feel a little bit of what you have been handing out? And now you going to just step it up?

What is this? EVE jihad? Take the 30 days and reflect...that is what the 30 ban is for. I suggest a course correction, but I don't expect it. Good luck with this convo

I heard you guys spent the week end losing fleets after fleets to abaddons and archons, never able to reinforce any structure.

To the point: killing unarmed ships is not only morally offensive to some players, but in my opinion this is the last stop in leaving honor behind.

Ohh, ~e-honoure~

He seemed popular enough at the polls

With out Mittens at the helm of CSM, EVE will become a boring carebear haven. I shudder to think of what will happen this year.

With out Mittens at the helm of CSM, EVE will become a boring carebear haven. I shudder to think of what will happen this year.

sorry that post was technical fail

P.S. There are plenty of miners who are sick in bed, dying, with blood pressure problems, emotional problems...all who love the game and feel they are part of the community and contributing by their mining.

It would be great if nothing but a barge could even get into an ice field (hello, whoever has sovereignty over an ice field). That would be akin to keeping kids from bringing guns to school. But I'm not asking for that

If you have a goal that requires fighting, then fight. What kind of goal is "licking your tears?" Why do that to people who are already ill and crying and maybe hanging on; and enjoy mining so they can have some social experience? You have dehumanized players. In doing so, you have dehumanized yourselves before all of EVE

But hey! You get to. \o/

Thank you for letting me try to help. I hope I can.

Psychological warfare? Okay, you wish to be feared and hated. Okay. Fine with me.

The question is this: why did your leader get so lulled by the lulz of griefing that he called for using your ingame psychological warfare to get this guy to off himself in real life?

That is is the issue.

That is the question: do ingame leaders have any responsibility for the human mental hygiene of their members? Are your members cannon fodder? Didn't this psychological warfare cut down your leader? Are you committing psychological warfare on yourselves?

And nice try. Sadism is sadism. That is the tool you choose to call psychological warfare. Fine with me.

How's that working out for you?

I'm raising the question. I don't have the answer...well unless you think the Golden Rule is viable. Some of us do.

"EVE: Our Dress Rehearsal for the Future, Should Humanity Survive." I'm quoting myself.

Psychological warfare? Okay, you wish to be feared and hated. Okay. Fine with me.

The question is this: why did your leader get so lulled by the lulz of griefing that he called for using your ingame psychological warfare to get this guy to off himself in real life?

That is is the issue.

That is the question: do ingame leaders have any responsibility for the human mental hygiene of their members? Are your members cannon fodder? Didn't this psychological warfare cut down your leader? Are you committing psychological warfare on yourselves?

And nice try. Sadism is sadism. That is the tool you choose to call psychological warfare. Fine with me.

How's that working out for you?

I'm raising the question. I don't have the answer...well unless you think the Golden Rule is viable. Some of us do.

"EVE: Our Dress Rehearsal for the Future, Should Humanity Survive." I'm quoting myself.

my dictionary says sadism is taking joy in causing someone else to suffer.

You went for the sexual arousal, I didn't. Apparently there are various degrees. lol

You say you are using this tactic to gain fear and hatred in the game.

You say under the guise of psychological warfare you are using griefing, or "licking tears" but that is not who you really are?

I'll bite. Who are you really?

P.S. I saw this remark and I did some real digging around and self reflection.

"What saddens me is the fact that you,in opposite to average cfc member,and our leaders clearly cant tell the difference between game and real life"


This is psychological warfare, the griefing is griefing.

There is no line. There is real life and you are bringing yourself to whatever you are paying attention to.

The opinion is that there is no real life and game life, just life.

Your plea that there is a difference and gaming is somehow some secret no-holds-barred magic kingdom is a lie.

Maybe you can get away with stuff in a game you can't get away with in RL...oh wait...we just sat that happen.

You are pleading a false construct.

Okay, ta ta and thank you for prompting me to settle the issue for myself. ROCK ON!!!

: ) thanks.

I just finally realized that this false construct of game vs real life is truly your psychological warfare, player on player and metagaming CCP.

Hell the whole world has bought this idea of two different worlds...

I'M FREE!!!

I bought this for some five years in EVE.

I have to give you credit for brainwashing your members and a bunch of EVE itself.

I'm FREE!!!!

*Rabble rabble rabble, rabble rabble rabble*

And off I go, like a herd of turtles.

This was my first real visit to the forums. I am encouraged!!

Byeeeee!!

OK ... Somehow you guys want to play both sides of the game, you want to say " Its just my ingame role playing" bs, and then you say you want the "REAL TEARS". Thats my problem, you GOONIES took the game from just a game and are trying to bring real life misery into peoples lives.

Lets start with your dumb leaders words... "I AM NOT A CYBER BULLY"

Well here is the Dictionary


cyber-
GÇé

a combining form meaning GÇ£computer,GÇ¥ GÇ£computer network,GÇ¥ or GÇ£virtual reality,GÇ¥ used in the formation of compound words ( cybertalk; cyberart; cyberspace ) and by extension meaning GÇ£very modernGÇ¥ ( cyberfashion ).



bul-+ly
1 GÇé GÇé[bool-ee] Show IPA noun, plural -lies, verb, -lied, -ly-+ing, adjective, interjection

noun
1.
a blustering, quarrelsome, overbearing person who habitually badgers and intimidates smaller or weaker people.

So a Cyber Bully is someone who uses a computer to badger or INTIMIDATE smaller or weaker people. Miners cant fight back, and people whose real lives SUCK SO MUCH that they might end their own lives are weaker. So that pretty much sounds right to me.

Finally, you goons try to act as if your mittens made one small mistake. IT WASNT!

He made all those slides, sent in a prepared speech to be looked over by ccp where he said "If you are a miner we WANT YOU TO KILL YOURSELF bla bla bla"

Here are the facts, not everyone who plays this game is healthy, not everyone is here for YOUR entertainment, and if you catch the right person at the right moment your "GO KILL YOURSELF" bullcrap just might send someone over the edge. An edge that your actions pushed them over...

BTW, just INCITING SUICIDE is illegal in all 50 US states... So If I were you I would choose my words carefully, because what your leader is trying to get you to suck through a straw is a lie. You dont have to INCITE more than once, just once is enough to be charged.

Why cant you guys just play the game and leave the real life headgames out of it????

Con

I am saddened that Dear Leader's grand vision for the future of eve has been struck down due to his being a drunken Jersey Shore reject.

Fixed.

THem's fightin' words.

OK ... Somehow you guys want to play both sides of the game, you want to say " Its just my ingame role playing" bs, and then you say you want the "REAL TEARS". Thats my problem, you GOONIES took the game from just a game and are trying to bring real life misery into peoples lives.

Lets start with your dumb leaders words... "I AM NOT A CYBER BULLY"

Well here is the Dictionary


cyber-
GÇé

a combining form meaning GÇ£computer,GÇ¥ GÇ£computer network,GÇ¥ or GÇ£virtual reality,GÇ¥ used in the formation of compound words ( cybertalk; cyberart; cyberspace ) and by extension meaning GÇ£very modernGÇ¥ ( cyberfashion ).



bul-+ly
1 GÇé GÇé[bool-ee] Show IPA noun, plural -lies, verb, -lied, -ly-+ing, adjective, interjection

noun
1.
a blustering, quarrelsome, overbearing person who habitually badgers and intimidates smaller or weaker people.

So a Cyber Bully is someone who uses a computer to badger or INTIMIDATE smaller or weaker people. Miners cant fight back, and people whose real lives SUCK SO MUCH that they might end their own lives are weaker. So that pretty much sounds right to me.

Finally, you goons try to act as if your mittens made one small mistake. IT WASNT!

He made all those slides, sent in a prepared speech to be looked over by ccp where he said "If you are a miner we WANT YOU TO KILL YOURSELF bla bla bla"

Here are the facts, not everyone who plays this game is healthy, not everyone is here for YOUR entertainment, and if you catch the right person at the right moment your "GO KILL YOURSELF" bullcrap just might send someone over the edge. An edge that your actions pushed them over...

BTW, just INCITING SUICIDE is illegal in all 50 US states... So If I were you I would choose my words carefully, because what your leader is trying to get you to suck through a straw is a lie. You dont have to INCITE more than once, just once is enough to be charged.

Why cant you guys just play the game and leave the real life headgames out of it????

Con

misery, Im pretty sure I know exactly what it is... I live it every damn day

Mr Mugged said "Misery? MISERY? My friends father died, and his mother became an alcoholic before ending her own life. That's misery! If you start beating your wife because you lose **** in a computer-game, it's time to find another game. 90% of the time you play, you are enjoying yourself, otherwise you would not be playing. You sir, should choose your words carefully, as linking misery to a ******* computer-game is so far off it's not even funny.
*******




Sir, Not everyone plays this game because mommy and daddy sent them to thier room for staying out past dark. Some of us, myself included have real life problems that we use eve to get away from. For some of us, getting up and going outside, or running to town with friends is not something we can manage every day. I for one cant even manage to get to eve every day. So for those of us whose lives already suck, the last thing we need is a bunch of people making a concerted effort to try and get us to kill ourselves.

Now your going to say "But he only picked on one person!" WRONG WRONG WRONG..



Here is what the goon speech was about quoted from the GOONS OWN MATERIAL..


*************************************
"The theme of this year's Goonswarm Alliance Presentation is going to be 'Goonswarm Hates you'. And basically just talk about each different little aspect... demographic of EVE. Of how much we hate and want people to die and kill themselves. Like, highsec miners: We want them to kill themselves. People who roleplay? We want them to kill themselves. People with Titans? We want them to kill themselves. There's just a whole host of people who I hope to really offend by telling them to commit suicide while on stage in front of a thousand nerds.
**********************************************



The goons leaders FIRST STRIKE TARGET was someone we all know now. Not because the guy hurt the goons in anyway, but because the guy was WEAK...

We were lucky to be honest that he chose to say this PUBLICALLY so we can work it out, but had he said it behind goonies closed doors hundreds if not thousands of sick minded people would have been picking on the guy to see if they could get him to kill himself

THAT IS MY PROBLEM...



Now, I am not smart enough to argue on how many people commit suicide becuase of being hassled in a game, but I think we all know that people at least BLAME ONLINE CRAP .... The even larger point tho is, WHY ARE PEOPLE DEFENDING THE "RIGHT" TO TRY TO GET SOMEONE TO KILL THEMSELVES?????



As far as feeling BULLILED or INTIMIDATED .... Again, WHY ARE YOU DEFENDING YOUR RIGHT TO BULLY??? Why are the other gamers supposed to "SUCKUP" whatever kind of trash goonies want to sling??? You are correct tho, people can stop paying to play the game, then you will have to find another place to bully.



So there you have it. I have YET TO SEE ONE PERSON who can explain why its "ACCEPTABLE" to allow goons to TARGET people they dont like and "want them to kill themselves". Again, not my words, goon words. I have yet to see one person who can explain how it makes the game better for everyone. It sounds to me like only the bullys want it.

CCP has the power and hopefully the brains to inforce thier own rules, just because people break the rules doesnt mean that its a GOOD THING...

I am not asking for hello kitty. I am asking to remove the insane vileness... Anything close to "I want you to kill yourself" does not belong in a game. Taking over coms that people pay for with thier real life money does not belong in a game. FIght hard, fight clever, no problem, but leave it in the game...



As for misery, Im pretty sure I know exactly what it is... I live it every damn day


Con

Sir, Not everyone plays this game because mommy and daddy sent them to thier room for staying out past dark. Some of us, myself included have real life problems that we use eve to get away from. For some of us, getting up and going outside, or running to town with friends is not something we can manage every day. I for one cant even manage to get to eve every day. So for those of us whose lives already suck, the last thing we need is a bunch of people making a concerted effort to try and get us to kill ourselves.

Now your going to say "But he only picked on one person!" WRONG WRONG WRONG..



Here is what the goon speech was about quoted from the GOONS OWN MATERIAL..


*************************************
"The theme of this year's Goonswarm Alliance Presentation is going to be 'Goonswarm Hates you'. And basically just talk about each different little aspect... demographic of EVE. Of how much we hate and want people to die and kill themselves. Like, highsec miners: We want them to kill themselves. People who roleplay? We want them to kill themselves. People with Titans? We want them to kill themselves. There's just a whole host of people who I hope to really offend by telling them to commit suicide while on stage in front of a thousand nerds.
**********************************************


The goons leaders FIRST STRIKE TARGET was someone we all know now. Not because the guy hurt the goons in anyway, but because the guy was WEAK...

We were lucky to be honest that he chose to say this PUBLICALLY so we can work it out, but had he said it behind goonies closed doors hundreds if not thousands of sick minded people would have been picking on the guy to see if they could get him to kill himself

THAT IS MY PROBLEM...


Now, I am not smart enough to argue on how many people commit suicide becuase of being hassled in a game, but I think we all know that people at least BLAME ONLINE CRAP .... The even larger point tho is, WHY ARE PEOPLE DEFENDING THE "RIGHT" TO TRY TO GET SOMEONE TO KILL THEMSELVES?????

As far as feeling BULLILED or INTIMIDATED .... Again, WHY ARE YOU DEFENDING YOUR RIGHT TO BULLY??? Why are the other gamers supposed to "SUCKUP" whatever kind of trash goonies want to sling??? You are correct tho, people can stop paying to play the game, then you will have to find another place to bully.

So there you have it. I have YET TO SEE ONE PERSON who can explain why its "ACCEPTABLE" to allow goons to TARGET people they dont like and "want them to kill themselves". Again, not my words, goon words. I have yet to see one person who can explain how it makes the game better for everyone. It sounds to me like only the bullys want it.

"I want you to kill yourself"

What strikes me is the overlap between the griefing and what my friends and I jokingly say is the message of dictators generally: "Don't have too much fun!!! Don't get too happy!! We will make you pay!!"

I've been thinking about this until the dust has settled in my head (call me whatever you want) and this event has changed me.

For five years I have bought the "this is just a game" stuff; not willingly and certainly not enough to grief anyone.

But the truth is that cyberbullying is cyberbullying. If you choose to do it in a game, you are REALLY still doing it, and the effect is still REAL on your victims. And surprisingly, you REALLY feel good about doing it.

What strikes me is the overlap between the griefing and what my friends and I jokingly say is the message of dictators generally: "Don't have too much fun!!! Don't get too happy!! We will make you pay!!"

Maybe you don't think of real human beings when you are griefing. Maybe you just feel the need to put a dent in someone's enjoyment. Is that it? Are you hating happiness? You just can't stand to see anyone having fun in an unarmed ship? You just can't stand to see people who don't suffer like you do actually having fun?

I accept that CCP says cyberbullying in EVE is okay. That is their decision, but consider this:

Some 3,000 peeps got on mumble in goonswarm. 3.000. wow. There is an entire universe out there to settle and develop and these 3,000 are dreaming of destroying the game?

Why make the game suckier than everyday stresses? You just hate love and happiness? Maybe you don't think it exists? Maybe you don't think that is fun?

Screw the cult of eternal suffering. I hope you are learning something.

Mr Mugged said "Misery? MISERY? My friends father died, and his mother became an alcoholic before ending her own life. That's misery! If you start beating your wife because you lose **** in a computer-game, it's time to find another game. 90% of the time you play, you are enjoying yourself, otherwise you would not be playing. You sir, should choose your words carefully, as linking misery to a ******* computer-game is so far off it's not even funny.
*******




Sir, Not everyone plays this game because mommy and daddy sent them to thier room for staying out past dark. Some of us, myself included have real life problems that we use eve to get away from. For some of us, getting up and going outside, or running to town with friends is not something we can manage every day. I for one cant even manage to get to eve every day. So for those of us whose lives already suck, the last thing we need is a bunch of people making a concerted effort to try and get us to kill ourselves.

Now your going to say "But he only picked on one person!" WRONG WRONG WRONG..



Here is what the goon speech was about quoted from the GOONS OWN MATERIAL..


*************************************
"The theme of this year's Goonswarm Alliance Presentation is going to be 'Goonswarm Hates you'. And basically just talk about each different little aspect... demographic of EVE. Of how much we hate and want people to die and kill themselves. Like, highsec miners: We want them to kill themselves. People who roleplay? We want them to kill themselves. People with Titans? We want them to kill themselves. There's just a whole host of people who I hope to really offend by telling them to commit suicide while on stage in front of a thousand nerds.
**********************************************



The goons leaders FIRST STRIKE TARGET was someone we all know now. Not because the guy hurt the goons in anyway, but because the guy was WEAK...

We were lucky to be honest that he chose to say this PUBLICALLY so we can work it out, but had he said it behind goonies closed doors hundreds if not thousands of sick minded people would have been picking on the guy to see if they could get him to kill himself

THAT IS MY PROBLEM...



Now, I am not smart enough to argue on how many people commit suicide becuase of being hassled in a game, but I think we all know that people at least BLAME ONLINE CRAP .... The even larger point tho is, WHY ARE PEOPLE DEFENDING THE "RIGHT" TO TRY TO GET SOMEONE TO KILL THEMSELVES?????



As far as feeling BULLILED or INTIMIDATED .... Again, WHY ARE YOU DEFENDING YOUR RIGHT TO BULLY??? Why are the other gamers supposed to "SUCKUP" whatever kind of trash goonies want to sling??? You are correct tho, people can stop paying to play the game, then you will have to find another place to bully.



So there you have it. I have YET TO SEE ONE PERSON who can explain why its "ACCEPTABLE" to allow goons to TARGET people they dont like and "want them to kill themselves". Again, not my words, goon words. I have yet to see one person who can explain how it makes the game better for everyone. It sounds to me like only the bullys want it.

CCP has the power and hopefully the brains to inforce thier own rules, just because people break the rules doesnt mean that its a GOOD THING...

I am not asking for hello kitty. I am asking to remove the insane vileness... Anything close to "I want you to kill yourself" does not belong in a game. Taking over coms that people pay for with thier real life money does not belong in a game. FIght hard, fight clever, no problem, but leave it in the game...



As for misery, Im pretty sure I know exactly what it is... I live it every damn day


Con

Now you're just being silly. Despite having our own dictator (right? I heard someone say that on EVE-O a very reliable source of information) he definitely likes us to be happy

---

The human issue here is not silly, even if I am

The issue is sadistic behavior in a video game. If you've been on the receiving end you quickly realize that it has nothing to do with the game at all. This is a cult of cruelty (muwahahaha, kill yourself, loser) that is sitting in a game meant for simulating the development of space in a capitalist based competitive economy. We have "opponents" in the game. We fight

We can argue about the definition, but everyone knows griefing is and where the line is

No one thinks game designers built this game for sado/masochism, but here you are! Guess you have to be somewhere. Better you in game than doing this stuff out of the game. oh, wait.....

So, silly me. These encounters are "happy" for you and miserable for the other guy, is that what you mean: he wants us to be happy?

That's the issue. I don't think anyone really calls this stuff "gameplay". Feeding on another's emotions with an appetite for cruelty is usually the domain of "two consenting adults"

In the game, it is really a personal assault against another human being that is illegal and disqualifying in games historically. Most of us got straightened out on that issue by about...oh...say...three years old. I actually remember my dad biting me after I bit my brother. It was the wake up call of my life. "How do you like that?" he asked. I didn't. I haven't bitten anyone since.

Maybe you just need to be on the receiving end to really know what you are doing? Dunno. Mittani is trying to act like a griefed victim for no reason. How ironic. Why not have griefing tourneys among griefers, let the rest of us play the game we are paying to play. Surely you can find some way to have fun without torturing the unsuspecting....uh....maybe not.

Maybe you should spend some more time dwelling on the difference between reality and fantasy. I don't think you have that concept quite worked out yet.

---

hmmmm the difference between reality and fantasy is a "concept"? Good for you. That's a start. What comes after a concept, an idea? Then, maybe some experimental stuff; analysis, judgement, process of elimination -- that sort of stuff -- I guess we call that learning.

And boom! You get a glimpse of uh...oh yea, reality. But you do have to come out of a total fantasy world to taste it. Just my experience.

Congrats on reaching the concept stage. No need to insult anyone about it. We all get there sooner or later.

(this post brought to you by unexpected game shutdown)

I don't see what all the controversy is about. He did a Bad ThingGäó and got a suitable 'punishment'. Seems to me like the system works.

You are wasting your love, your time and shaping your future emotional health in a way you will replay over and over in your old age.

To be honest, I feel sorry for you stuck in this infinite loop of sadistic linguistics. You can keep your blood.

"Pubbies are mad because they want actual blood and didn't get it."

This is cyberbullying. This has nothing to do with EVE or any game.

You are wasting your love, your time and shaping your future emotional health in a way you will replay over and over in your old age.

To be honest, I feel sorry for you stuck in this infinite loop of sadistic linguistics. You can keep your blood.

I wish you peace and love. Everyone I have ever spoken to wants that for their life.

"Pubbies are mad because they want actual blood and didn't get it."

This is cyberbullying.

Maybe you should spend some more time dwelling on the difference between reality and fantasy. I don't think you have that concept quite worked out yet.

---

hmmmm the difference between reality and fantasy is a "concept"? Good for you. That's a start. What comes after a concept, an idea? Then, maybe some experimental stuff; analysis, judgement, process of elimination -- that sort of stuff -- I guess we call that learning.

And boom! You get a glimpse of uh...oh yea, reality. But you do have to come out of a total fantasy world to taste it. Just my experience.

Congrats on reaching the concept stage. No need to insult anyone about it. We all get there sooner or later.

(this post brought to you by unexpected game shutdown)

Video games are fantasy.

That place where you eat and sleep and poop and do all that other stuff is reality.

One place does not matter. If you dislike how you're being treated there, or think it's too much for you, you can leave whenever you like. This is done by turning off your computer, or finding something else to do on your computer.

The other place matters sometimes. If people are doing bad things to you there, you should seek legal help.

If you're confused about which is which, as you seem to be, then perhaps you should exit the forums and seek mental help.



Ultimately, I cannot feel bad for anyone that claims they're being victimized in a video game, especially a video game in which it is flat out stated that people being mean to each other is a vital part of the game. They have so many options to avoid it that claims they're being bullied are insulting to all the victims of actual bullying. You're one step down from that Yuki Ona nutcase who wanted to invite the Dalai Lama to play EVE to help promote peace here rather than trying to stop the ethnic cleansing of Tibet.

You might consider replacing the words "video game" with the words "real world".

I believe anyone could possibly say the exact same things with what they see go on in what is known as "the real world".

How a person acts in any venue is who a person is.

Just look at the actors in various films that acted like they were "in love" and end up having a "real world" thing. (Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie anyone?)

Plus, being bullied in the real world or imaginary shouldn't stop someone from doing what they enjoy most.

First point: No.

Second point: Somewhat I guess. People who whine about things that happen in a world where it doesn't really matter must be complete tools in real life.

Third point: That's very true, I mean look at all the people Anthony Hopkins has eaten or Christian Bale has dismembered while listening to Huey Lewis and the News.

Fourth Point: What I love is suicide ganking people, and you're cyber-bullying me by trying to get me to stop. Any place where people have to interact, they're going to bump up against each other. If suicide ganking is that intolerable to you, find a game where behavior like that is prohibited and play it. CCP flat out states that suicide ganking, scamming, and all those other mean things are allowed, and by playing their game you consent to their rules. Deal with it.

I never said anything about making you stop doing anything and i said nothing about the things you said as breaking any kind of rules CCP has set forth.

Not sure why you said no to my first point. At least in my eyes replacing those words looks pretty much exactly like something you see in the real world.

Yes, there are "bad guys" in movies that don't actually do terrible deeds in the real world. There are laws and some basic human ethics that people in the "real world" usually tend to follow. But many relationships where actors had to "act" like they loved each other, or "act" like friends have brought forth many "real world" relationships.

I'm just saying from experience in eve that many "conflicts" go beyond simple "roleplay". Most people who are being jerks to players are actually being a jerk instead of "roleplaying".

Honestly I don't know who you are and this next sentence is really for any eve player.

Try spending the day playing eve like you normally would, but "act" like the way you really are in the "real world".

See if you are the same in the real world as you are in eve or totally different.

Ok, again.

So the real world is fantasy and video games are where you poop and eat? Or if you're referring to my final statement, in the real world people being mean to each other is not vital, necessary, or wanted. In EVE Online it's necessary because otherwise nothing at all happens. There're no villains, no drama, nothing beyond mining and missioning and that's boring. Whenever you feel like it's too much, you can turn it off and escape all the bad people. Or switch to a different character. Or just put the mean people on ignore. Worst case scenario is you've lost some assets in a video game. Big whoop, I lost a supercarrier once that I spent months earning the isk for, lost my pod with a fortune in implants, and got taunted in local about it. That was a part of the game, and I accepted it because sometimes just winning all the time gets boring. It's losing big every now and then that makes winning fun. In real life, you can't escape bullies, you can't just turn off or switch to someone else, and if you lose your house or you car or your health you're screwed. So no, you're totally wrong, or you're a sociopath and totally wrong. Either way claiming the two can be swapped is idiotic and my point stands.

Two, you agree actors don't do bad things in real life just because they play a bad guy in a movie. This directly refutes your point, and I don't see why you continue arguing. You do though, you claim that because actors pretend to be in love in a movie they fall in love in real life, therefore when people pretend to be bad in a video game they are bad in real life. Do you have any grasp of human emotion at all? When two attractive, single people spend extended amounts of time together, sometimes they end up screwing. That's it. Moreso, there're plenty of actors that behave like friends but can't stand each other in real life as well. For instance, Penn and Teller never speak outside of work even though they've worked together for years. Nimoy and Shatner did not like each other during Star Trek. David Duchovny did not like Gillian Anderson. There're plenty of other examples. Actors act, and people in a video game are free to act as well. Some are jerks in real life, but plenty are perfectly nice folks.

I'm not going to act in real life like I do in EVE because doing what I do in EVE to people in real life would be terrible. I'm a nice guy in real life, I don't like or want to hurt people, because the stuff we do in real life matters. Real life and video games are not the same thing and part of being an adult is being able to separate the two. Look at people that play villains in Dungeons and Dragons or take the evil route in single player games. They do this because it adds to the story or because it gives them a perspective they would normally never want to experience.

The one thing that is the same between me in EVE and me in real life is that I hate when people are being dumb. You are being dumb. Go somewhere else and do that.

I'm sorry if you are not understanding what i am trying to get at.

I am just saying that these supposed things that only apply to video games like eve do actually exist in the real world that you speak of.

One thing these online MMOs don't show is the person you are playing against, as do most games online any person plays. So a person playing against you can't actually see that you are this nice guy you speak of, instead they only see the dark side, or the side where you seem to insist that I am dumb.

If, say, you were sitting next to a person while playing some FPS on a console and you started spouting things like that , it probably wouldn't go over well. Unless they actually knew you were this nice guy you say you are and decide that you are just kidding around.

Like i said, I don't know you, and you don't know me. Your actions and responses here do compare to what is seen in the real world with real face to face contact. (or face to fist for some I suppose)

People are quick to assume. I'm sure you know the saying that goes with that.

Eh, I'm never going to speak with you in real life though and in the end I could care less what you think of me. I've already refuted your arguments, and now you're left with nothing but saying "I think you're a jerk in a game and therefore are a jerk IRL". You have a child's view of the world and are unwilling to change it, so there's no point in continuing this.

in the end I could care less what you think of me.

you moron. what is it about people from north america and saying this stupid thing?

We're not talking about other places, we're talking about EVE. EVE is a game where it is explicitly stated in plenty of news articles and by the developers as well that people will be mean to you. If someone tells you they lost their hand, odds are you'll feel bad for them. If someone tells you they lost their hand by sticking it into a blender and turning it on, then you're going to think they're a moron.

Coda, Jade, can I get you ladies' thoughts on this?

Let's take the sandbox issue. When kids get in a sandbox, bullying is not allowed even though the kids are just "playing" .

When I joined EVE I was pretty good at mixed-company hilarity and language.

(I counted 17 women during all the fanfest coverage I watched.) I learned quickly that EVE is not a mixed company affair. Since I loved the game, I had little trouble dodging hard core **** or sadism. It seemed easy enough to hang with players who were just playing the game to have some fun.

The idea of calling this stuff sandbox behavior is a corruption of what sandbox play is meant to be. Kids are encouraged to play in sandboxes to learn how to get along with each other. Adults know that when you put kids in a sandbox, some are going to try and take over and bully the other kids. Adults KNOW this going in. The adults then get to TEACH kids about how to care about each other.

Clearly, not everyone in EVE learned how to care about and enjoy other people when they were a kid. I get that.

The bottom line is that EVE is not a sandbox or anything like one. Concord was billed at the authority. They have stopped protecting high sec and I see devs just whooping it up over Burn Jita and Hulkageddon.

But in response to emotional personal bullying, Concord/CCP is no longer securing high sec; no longer being the adult in the sandbox. You can't throw kids in a sandbox without rules and supervision. Eventually you will have kid goons who just like to make the other kids cry.

I've downloaded "Sail Simulator 5" to play for the summer. I'll just come back later, much later, to see what's going on.

Life is too short. SCREW THE CULT OF ETERNAL SUFFERING!

I'd like to talk about all this controversy lately regarding the Internet Goons. I hear that some things were said. Let's begin the healing process by laying out our emotions on the table, so we can maybe sort through how we feel and maybe make some sense of how our relationship has become so rocky.

I'll start by posting. I'd like to share that maybe I feel a little violated, and a little hurt. Some confusion too. We (Goons) have always put a lot of stock in our representation on the CSM, and now that our great hope has been extinguished we feel a little... rudderless... if you will. Who will we look to? We have hard times ahead, and I'm fearful that without our Dear Leader's CSM representation his potency will suffer, his vision remain fallow and stunted. I've looked to my friends and family for support, but sometimes what we really need is to network with others in the same situation.

So my fellow pods, I've noticed a dearth of suitable threads for discussing this issue. What's your opinion?

You feel that making others cry in a sandbox that simulates war on an intergalactic scale is going too far?

Let's take the sandbox issue. When kids get in a sandbox, bullying is not allowed even though the kids are just "playing" .

When I joined EVE I was pretty good at mixed-company hilarity and language.

(I counted 17 women during all the fanfest coverage I watched.) I learned quickly that EVE is not a mixed company affair. Since I loved the game, I had little trouble dodging hard core **** or sadism. It seemed easy enough to hang with players who were just playing the game to have some fun.

The idea of calling this stuff sandbox behavior is a corruption of what sandbox play is meant to be. Kids are encouraged to play in sandboxes to learn how to get along with each other. Adults know that when you put kids in a sandbox, some are going to try and take over and bully the other kids. Adults KNOW this going in. The adults then get to TEACH kids about how to care about each other.

Clearly, not everyone in EVE learned how to care about and enjoy other people when they were a kid. I get that.

The bottom line is that EVE is not a sandbox or anything like one. Concord was billed at the authority. They have stopped protecting high sec and I see devs just whooping it up over Burn Jita and Hulkageddon.

But in response to emotional personal bullying, Concord/CCP is no longer securing high sec; no longer being the adult in the sandbox. You can't throw kids in a sandbox without rules and supervision. Eventually you will have kid goons who just like to make the other kids cry.

I've downloaded "Sail Simulator 5" to play for the summer. I'll just come back later, much later, to see what's going on.

Life is too short. SCREW THE CULT OF ETERNAL SUFFERING!

this may actually be the most pathetic thing I have read on the internet

the pimp's gambit

all is fair game when you play the meta game like goons do

Re: votes for impeachment
I wasn't aware that you need a vote for impeachment, only a trial.
I think poster may have confused impeachment for a vote of no confidence. Maybe it's different in American law.

Anyway the point is that he oops'd in RL and he is punished in RL by the rules in RL (CSMrules)
If it was politically motivated well, all is fair game when you play the meta game like goons do.
Live by the sword die by the sword.

Look Goon your dear moron of a leader made a Huge mistake and they cut him to the quick like they should have point blank he try getting people to do something to have a RL affect.

To hell with your csm chair he lost it do to his owe doing.

As for my now thoughts hes ass should have been permaban i know alot of people the feel the same what he did there was no call for in game or RL if he had done that in the states he would have in handculfs or damn close to it.

If that player woul have been my son and someone said something like that trust me i would not be able to post here on the forums for the fact i would be locked up right now for putting to rest a mouth like that.

He should in fact be thankfull he was not permaban and you goons should look at it like that. So you lost your csm chair oh no tough tit deal with it. Goons as a whole i could really careless about all of you but your dear leader if i ever get the shot at his pod i will take it. given what he said and ask other to do make him the real world a low life no better then the stuff on the bottom of my shoe.

"If you can lead, there is no limit to what you can do"

I'd like to talk about all this controversy lately regarding the Internet Goons. I hear that some things were said. Let's begin the healing process by laying out our emotions on the table, so we can maybe sort through how we feel and maybe make some sense of how our relationship has become so rocky.

I'll start by posting. I'd like to share that maybe I feel a little violated, and a little hurt. Some confusion too. We (Goons) have always put a lot of stock in our representation on the CSM, and now that our great hope has been extinguished we feel a little... rudderless... if you will. Who will we look to? We have hard times ahead, and I'm fearful that without our Dear Leader's CSM representation his potency will suffer, his vision remain fallow and stunted. I've looked to my friends and family for support, but sometimes what we really need is to network with others in the same situation.

So my fellow pods, I've noticed a dearth of suitable threads for discussing this issue. What's your opinion?

"God, is this still a thing? Jesus, that was like 3 months ago? Mittani is still here, and he still has amazing charismatic sway over Goonswarm, and you are still a pubbie whinging over dread pirates wrecking your game."

The following is a line from Wiki definition of cyberbullying:


"Cyberbullying can be as simple as continuing to send e-mail to someone who has said they want no further contact with the sender, but it may also include threats, sexual remarks, pejorative labels (i.e., hate speech), ganging up on victims by making them the subject of ridicule in forums, and posting false statements as fact aimed at humiliation."

Your answer had to include ridiculing. Cyberbullying has been used in more than half the responses in this forum. We are doing it in here and we are cyberbullying to talk about cyberbullying.

Personal ridicule did not stop 3 months ago. Cyberbullies can't even have a discussion about ridicule.

CCP allows personal ridicule. It's actually illegal in some places in the world. Maybe we need to really understand why lawmakers are getting involved in this. Why is cyberbullying, personal ridicule, so offensive as to become criminal at some point?

Personal ridicule has become the reason to play EVE for a bunch of players. Players who are repulsed by that form of play either have to put up with it or leave the game. Personal humiliation is a parasite on the game, not game mechanics.

The real irony here is that goons have joined the attacks to avoid becoming a victim of this crap themselves. I guess if you show your buddies you are willing to ridicule others, they won't ridicule you? Very junior high school.

Adults tend to stop bullying on the playground and in traditional games. That is not the case in EvE. But it doesn't make it right or fun for the victims. Not sure this is something you just "man up" to and accept. *sigh*.

Since we can't even talk about tihs, maybe we should just seal off high sec for players who just want to settle and build the universe, protect their accomplishments and not cry about anything

Look Goon your dear moron of a leader made a Huge mistake and they cut him to the quick like they should have point blank he try getting people to do something to have a RL affect.

To hell with your csm chair he lost it do to his owe doing.

As for my now thoughts hes ass should have been permaban i know alot of people the feel the same what he did there was no call for in game or RL if he had done that in the states he would have in handculfs or damn close to it.

If that player woul have been my son and someone said something like that trust me i would not be able to post here on the forums for the fact i would be locked up right now for putting to rest a mouth like that.

He should in fact be thankfull he was not permaban and you goons should look at it like that. So you lost your csm chair oh no tough tit deal with it. Goons as a whole i could really careless about all of you but your dear leader if i ever get the shot at his pod i will take it. given what he said and ask other to do make him the real world a low life no better then the stuff on the bottom of my shoe.

Your post is very hard to read. Also, obviously we should criminalize all forms on non-consentual pvp because it could hurt people's feelings. Also it should be a bannable offense for me to tell you that I think your argument is the dumbest argument I've heard outside of a NickyYo post.

All is fairly broad. Would you see this as fair to be applied to yourself as well?

I am the leader Goonswarm needs!

Man I should not have read this entire post. That was a huge whine fest. My understanding is a guy who plays made a bad decision. It was compounded by being broadcast across the world as well. He admitted he messed up, he took responsibility as well. In addition he took his punishment without trying to whine about it. That is what counts to me.I'm not in Goonswarm but at least their leader stood up and took full responsibility and the penalties with it. He has served his sentence and moved on.

In regards to RL/IG paradigm a lot of us play this game as a way to relax or escape the day jobs we have. Many people who play may not be balanced or have some issues as well. That is on them and the people in their real life that care about them. In the end this is a game, that gives all of us an unprecedented amount of freedom to forge the universe to our will. That also means sometimes we all get a little to serious or attached to things that happen in the game and that can bleed out into life.

Instead of kicking on a person, back when his punishment was in effect before he finished it, why don't you take the time to say that was messed up but I can at least respect you for owning the mistake and accepting the consequences. For the guy who was thinking about suicide over everything, did any of you know him? Did any of you offer to help him? Email him get his name? Thought so. If you did by chance thank you for reaching out to help another person instead of taking the time to kick another for a mistake. The next time you all want to hop on the lynch wagon and go crusading take the time to do something stupid your not proud of at all, then post the link of the video for it in this forum and show all of us. I would actually like to see the kind of character you have after the ridicule. So to close this post up, mistakes were made, prices were paid, and in the end all that is left is a forum post grieving a player that served his punishment out several months ago that people won't let go. Bravo.

hate to spoil it for you, but nobody was really mad at the guy

it was mostly trolls and really bad pubbie metagaming

I read the OP. The message I got from it was "Hey, I like attention and am willing to say or do anything to get it, regardless if it's good or bad."

I think everyone who posts on eve-o unironically

God, is this still a thing? Jesus, that was like 3 months ago? Mittani is still here, and he still has amazing charismatic sway over Goonswarm, and you are still a pubbie whinging over dread pirates wrecking your game. You're just mad because GSF wins at EVE, and you are still in the little league.



Sounds like he is winning at EVE to me.

I've already committed to voting the Xenuria ticket once you run for Goon Leader in the Goonfleet Open Elections what more do you want Lyris' support?

Good luck with that!

and if you're gonna lead thousands of people you're gonna need some charisma too

out-charm the mittani

There is an innate smugness that comes from being autistic and having a grasp of the system of laws that is otherwise used against you.

Does he still drink alot?

While I appreciate your skill at bringing out the hilarious reactions in others does it exemplify charisma when everything you say sounds like its coming from a rogue AI

So, in other words, your greatest aspiration is to ride on our coat tails?

Either that, or be the freak-show on a leash.

Watch out, enemies of the goons, or we'll bring out the gimp!

I would not ride on anybodies coat tails, I would do my best to create and grow something of my own design.

I am not a freak on a leash, contrary to what the cool kids will tell you.

For some odd reason goonswarm hates me with a passion. I aim to find out why.

I have no idea who you are, nor have I ever heard anyone ever mention your name.

I have no idea who you are, nor have I ever heard anyone ever mention your name.

I remember mittens- likes a drink now and again.

On a more serious note, Eve needs folk like him to spice our game community up a bit.

For what it is worth, I actually feel sorry for him, that his 'drunken outburst' is mostly what he will be remembered for.

I remember mittens- likes a drink now and again.

On a more serious note, Eve needs folk like him to spice our game community up a bit.

For what it is worth, I actually feel sorry for him, that his 'drunken outburst' is mostly what he will be remembered for.

You obviously have not seen the leaked video where he goes over his plans for fanfest. He planned that "outburst".

Mittens did the crime, paid the time.

Let it go.

^ Yeah CCP should have posted how big a s|ut the mittani is on his facebook account. And tell him they already moved on and found another guy with a bigger ****.