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Industrial ship rebalancing in Quantum Rise

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Anig Browl Caldari	Posted - 2008.10.22 19:06:00 - [1] I'd like to make a few comments on the planned industrial rebalance. But I can't, because there are no details available. Please, CCP, let us know approximately what's happening. Right now I don't know whether to get (racial) industrial V in training because transport ships are getting a whole lot better, or whether to wait because they'll be avilable to fly with (racial) industrial IV. And so on. I love my little garbage hauling ships, so it would be really nice to get some idea what the changes will be like. In general, I wish that CCP would refrain from announcing changes if there aren't details available.
Mad Crafter Green Men Incorporated	Posted - 2008.10.22 19:43:00 - [2] Details? I'd be happy with something that's not hopelessly vague!
Jonak Gallente	Posted - 2008.10.22 20:18:00 - [3] It would be nice if they did give us some info. There is suppose to be a blog coming this week, I really hope so because it help in planning.
Tasko Pal Heron Corporation	Posted - 2008.10.22 20:51:00 - [4] What I'll be looking for. Better choice of ship bonuses for the blockade runners, say an agility or speed bonus instead of a repping bonus. Add some grid to the crane so it can fit an MWD and cloak. Some sort of improvement to the rorqual, maybe a massive reduction in cycle time on the industrial core from 300 seconds to 30 seconds (with corresponding reduction in fuel cost and yield).
Anig Browl Caldari	Posted - 2008.10.22 21:34:00 - [5] Anyone got info from SiSi? I can't get in right now - I have a shortcut of the form 'eve.exe /end /server:xx.xx.xx.xx' (forget the IP right now, but it's the correct one) and have successfully patched to .66185, but I keep getting 'incompatible'.
endaler	Posted - 2008.10.22 23:10:00 - [6] Originally by: Anig Browl Anyone got info from SiSi? I can't get in right now - I have a shortcut of the form 'eve.exe /end /server:xx.xx.xx.xx' (forget the IP right now, but it's the correct one) and have successfully patched to .66185, but I keep getting 'incompatible'. Download sisi patch
Anig Browl Caldari	Posted - 2008.10.23 18:57:00 - [7] Originally by: endaler Originally by: Anig Browl Anyone got info from SiSi? I can't get in right now - I have a shortcut of the form 'eve.exe /end /server:xx.xx.xx.xx' (forget the IP right now, but it's the correct one) and have successfully patched to .66185, but I keep getting 'incompatible'. Download sisi patch Ahem.
Mrs Perception	Posted - 2008.10.26 10:59:00 - [8] all t2 ships require lvl 5 of the previous ship skill to use, so dont hold your breath waiting on that one, train the skill to 5 ps. if anyone tries to say jump frighters are t2, their wrong :P
Anig Browl Caldari	Posted - 2008.10.28 18:46:00 - [9] Good point MsP. Meantime, any word on the rebalancing?
El Yatta Mercenary Forces	Posted - 2008.10.28 19:10:00 - [10] Its going to be a massive nerf, what other kind of "rebalancing" is there?
Anas Damona KOM TV	Posted - 2008.10.29 01:30:00 - [11] I'd rather not see every race have matching industrial ships, I like that there's variety. I think rebalancing might include: Add the Badger Mark III: Requires Caldari Industrial level 5 Improve the Iteron Mark I-IV or give them some specialized roles Downgrade the Bestower a bit, improve the Sigil but require Amarr Industrial level 4-5 I don't know about Minmatar, maybe improve the Mammoth and require Minmatar Industrial level 5 General improvements for all ships: All industrial ships should be capable of shield tanking, regardless of the usual racial preferences. More cargo! Ability to fit an 'Industrial' module. I don't know what would be good, but something to make them unique, something even the Transport Ships don't have. I always thought the idea of a mobile refinery would be great, but with the Rorqual compressing ore I suppose that's not an option now. Maybe a corporate hangar?
Kahega Amielden Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2008.10.29 01:33:00 - [12] Quote: Ability to fit an 'Industrial' module. I don't know what would be good, but something to make them unique, something even the Transport Ships don't have. I always thought the idea of a mobile refinery would be great, but with the Rorqual compressing ore I suppose that's not an option now. Maybe a corporate hangar? No. Considering that indies are incredibly easy to get into, any unique capability beyond what they have now should go with t2 transports or a new ship class. I hope they differentiate the T1 indies. Right now there's only one of each race worth flying unless you're being cheap on skills/money (Itty V, Mammoth, Badger II and Bestower) Originally by: Catharacta My CNR runs on salvager tears.
Anas Damona KOM TV	Posted - 2008.10.29 01:47:00 - [13] Originally by: Kahega Amielden any unique capability beyond what they have now should go with t2 transports or a new ship class Well Mining Barges can use strip miners, that's a specialized module. I'm thinking of something other than hauling, that only industrial ships can do. Maybe a salvaging role would work.
Clansworth Burning Sky Labs Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2008.10.29 03:57:00 - [14] Wait no more... new Dev Blog up about the proposed changes: Dev Blog: Rollin' Rollin' Rollin' Summary: Blokade Runners become Covert Ops Cloak and Black Ops Portal Capable, lose warp core strength bonus Deep Space Transports get Active tank bonus swapped out for Extender/Plate (HP buffer) bonus, gain Blockade Runner's old warp core strength bonus Procurer/Skiff gain added Bonus Skiff gains Warp Core Strength Bonus (which, it apparently already secretly has) Mackinaw gets it's long needed +10CPU and +1000m¦ Rorqual gets a boost to Corp Hanger space POS Personal Storage
Kylar Renpurs Dusk Blade	Posted - 2008.10.29 04:38:00 - [15] Quote: Blokade Runners become Covert Ops Cloak and Black Ops Portal Capable, lose warp core strength bonus This is made of win. Improve Market Competition!
Shintai Gallente Balad Naran Orbital Shipyards	Posted - 2008.10.29 13:24:00 - [16] Holy nice. I had not even imagined that. -------------------------------------- Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry
Korizan	Posted - 2008.10.29 14:28:00 - [17] SWEET is all I can say
Nas Daq	Posted - 2008.10.29 14:30:00 - [18] Originally by: Clansworth Wait no more... new Dev Blog up about the proposed changes: Dev Blog: Rollin' Rollin' Rollin' Summary: Blokade Runners become Covert Ops Cloak and Black Ops Portal Capable, lose warp core strength bonus Deep Space Transports get Active tank bonus swapped out for Extender/Plate (HP buffer) bonus, gain Blockade Runner's old warp core strength bonus Procurer/Skiff gain added Bonus Skiff gains Warp Core Strength Bonus (which, it apparently already secretly has) Mackinaw gets it's long needed +10CPU and +1000m¦ Rorqual gets a boost to Corp Hanger space Where is the whine train of low sec pirates that cant gank anymore at low sec chokepoint?
Rees Noturana Red Rock Mining Company	Posted - 2008.10.29 14:36:00 - [19] Originally by: Nas Daq Where is the whine train of low sec pirates that cant gank anymore at low sec chokepoint? This way... http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=909660
Lili Lu Purveyors of Uber Research Valuables and Ships	Posted - 2008.10.29 16:54:00 - [20] Originally by: Anas Damona I'd rather not see every race have matching industrial ships, I like that there's variety. I think rebalancing might include: Add the Badger Mark III: Requires Caldari Industrial level 5 Cladari already gets the most cargo in its freighter, now you want the most in Indys? Improve the Iteron Mark I-IV or give them some specialized roles Not really needed IMO Downgrade the Bestower a bit, improve the Sigil but require Amarr Industrial level 4-5 What? If anything the other way around. But really just leave them, Caldari, and Minmatar alone. I don't know about Minmatar, maybe improve the Mammoth and require Minmatar Industrial level 5 No, see above General improvements for all ships: All industrial ships should be capable of shield tanking, regardless of the usual racial preferences. Yes!! I don't understand how CCP got onto thinking anyone was gonna fit plates in lowslots on haulers More cargo! Agreed
Anas Damona KOM TV	Posted - 2008.10.30 02:34:00 - [21] Originally by: Lili Lu Originally by: Anas Damona Add the Badger Mark III: Requires Caldari Industrial level 5 Cladari already gets the most cargo in its freighter, now you want the most in Indys? Not necessarily, just add a new ship for Caldari. I didn't say make it haul more than the Iteron Mark V. Originally by: Lili Lu Originally by: Anas Damona Improve the Iteron Mark I-IV or give them some specialized roles Not really needed IMO Downgrade the Bestower a bit, improve the Sigil but require Amarr Industrial level 4-5 What? If anything the other way around. But really just leave them, Caldari, and Minmatar alone. I don't know about Minmatar, maybe improve the Mammoth and require Minmatar Industrial level 5 No, see above You're basically saying don't change any of them. If they're gonna be rebalanced I think that implies some changes are coming, so what should they be?
Lord Fitz Project Amargosa	Posted - 2008.10.30 07:48:00 - [22] Originally by: Anas Damona If they're gonna be rebalanced I think that implies some changes are coming, so what should they be? No one said anything about rebalancing the vanilla T1 haulers. The changes coming to industrial ships are already listed here Dev Blog Originally by: CCP t0rfifrans CCP is a greedy money chewing monster
Anas Damona KOM TV	Posted - 2008.10.30 09:33:00 - [23] Originally by: Lord Fitz No one said anything about rebalancing the vanilla T1 haulers. The OP was made before that announcement I believe, and no-one said the tech 1 Industrial Ships wouldn't be rebalanced either. I'd like to see some changes, and since industry in general is being looked at, now's the time to discuss it. I suppose anyone who can pilot an Iteron Mark V now doesn't want changes that make it 'not the best,' and I'm not asking for that, as was suggested earlier. I think the distribution of industrial ships is odd in some cases, like getting access to both Amarr ships with Amarr Industrial level 1. And I love when new ships are added!
Tsual Minmatar Iikhelahii khulemah'lal	Posted - 2008.10.30 17:11:00 - [24] Edited by: Tsual on 30/10/2008 17:15:41 Edited by: Tsual on 30/10/2008 17:13:28 Originally by: Anas Damona Originally by: Lord Fitz No one said anything about rebalancing the vanilla T1 haulers. The OP was made before that announcement I believe, and no-one said the tech 1 Industrial Ships wouldn't be rebalanced either. I'd like to see some changes, and since industry in general is being looked at, now's the time to discuss it. I suppose anyone who can pilot an Iteron Mark V now doesn't want changes that make it 'not the best,' and I'm not asking for that, as was suggested earlier. I think the distribution of industrial ships is odd in some cases, like getting access to both Amarr ships with Amarr Industrial level 1. And I love when new ships are added! One possible thing that might make lower tier industrials worthwhile over higher tiers except lower prices would be some kind of specialisation away from the subwarp speed bonus which as well could be moved to hull entirely by a general 25% speed increase replacing it with something else. t1 alternative for the DST with an inbuild +1 or +2 warp stabiliser bonus or fast cargo runner by getting either an increase in warp speed per level or an overall increase in warp speed (0.1 Au/s per level thus 5 AU/s at industrial 5 dunno but with 0.2 Au and thus 5.5 Au at industrial 5 it would sort of barge into cargo frigat territory, though not directly as those are specialized in their own) (ic: to bette or if that is even still necessary a change to agility or what is necessary so that it is able to get faster into warp or decrease in signature so that it is harder to hit and wreck or stealthbomber cloaking abilities can't warp while cloaked but has no subwarp speed decrease (ic: as production of blokade runners has the bottleneck of t2 material high command sees use in creation of a low end blokade runner) second +5% cargohold bonus giving 10% entirely 2 high slots bonus to tractor beam specialized compression ability or compression to cargo containers (decrease of cargo/secure container size by 100m¦ per level) instead of 5% cargohold bonus a bonus to cargohold expanders (+0.25% (i.e. 1.25% on level 5 - expanded cargohold I from 17.5 to 18.75) or +0.5% (i.e. 2.5% on level 5 - expanded cargohold I from 17.5 to 20) cargohold increase for cargohold expander just some random ideas. I'm sure there are more possibilities like swapping cargo space for higher armor and shield points. Oh and to humor the audience (the not seriously meant) armed transporter: 4 or 5 high slots and 1 bonus to small weapons (tracking, rof, or capacitor use) or 20m¦ drone space and 1 bonus to drones(velocity, hp, or damage) ******************** Moral is only usefull so far as society demands it from one to accept his presence.
Anig Browl Caldari	Posted - 2008.10.30 18:05:00 - [25] Originally by: Tsual Oh and to humor the audience (the not seriously meant) armed transporters: 4 or 5 high slots and 1 bonus to small weapons (tracking, rof, or capacitor use) or 20m¦ drone space and 1 bonus to drones(velocity, hp, or damage) Perhaps of the above some, for fleet issued industrials that were designed with having in mind the needs and necessities for operating best in war zone/frontlines, and maybe the pirate cartells have develloped own versions of industrials. Yeah, I'd quite like to see that (with a vastly reduced cargo of course). That's what happens in the real world during wartime - cargo ships are fitted with light guns/rocket batteries. Then again, I'd like to get rid of the turret/launcher hardpoints and be able to put anything in a high slot if you have the grid/cpu requirements, and I know this will never happen. Less predictable fittings/roles always = win for me. Anyway, thanks to CCP for putting up details of the upcoming changes.
Alaris Nightshadow Nightshadow Industries	Posted - 2008.10.30 20:25:00 - [26] The Crane has some interesting changes so far. Old ============== Caldari Industrial Skill Bonus: +5% cargo +5% velocity 10% shield and armor thermal 5% shield and armor kinetic Transport Ships Skill Bonus: +10% shield booster boost amount Special Bonus: +2 Warp Strength New ============== Caldari Industrial Skill Bonus: +5% cargo capacity per level +5% velocity per level Transport Ships Skill Bonus: +5% shield booster boost amount -10% bonus to cpu need of covert ops cloaks Role Bonus: can fit covert ops cloaks ----------------------------------------------- "EVE isn't meant to look like a harsh, uncaring universe..........it is one..."
Nekopyat	Posted - 2008.10.30 20:48:00 - [27] Originally by: Anig Browl Yeah, I'd quite like to see that (with a vastly reduced cargo of course). That's what happens in the real world during wartime - cargo ships are fitted with light guns/rocket batteries. While qships as an idea would be really cool, I can't see how they would work in the EvE universe. q-ships really depended on weapons being much stronger then armor (so that even light guns were dangerous if surprised) which does not work in EvE's PvP model. It would also require being able to mask the exact ship type which does not currently exist. Lastly.. .keep in mind that q-ships were a dismal failure in the real world.

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