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PaperLion Gallente Old Man Industrial and Mining	Posted - 2008.10.23 15:51:00 - [1] Any industrialists out there willing to sell me an Orca future? i.e., I give you 500 mm isk _now_ for an Orca when they're released? PL
Ruffio Sepico Minmatar Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering	Posted - 2008.10.23 16:50:00 - [2] Originally by: PaperLion Any industrialists out there willing to sell me an Orca future? i.e., I give you 500 mm isk _now_ for an Orca when they're released? PL The demand for these at release will be much higher than supply, price will be a lot more than 500m for these babbies. Home: http://www.hidden-agenda.co.uk
Kazzac Elentria	Posted - 2008.10.23 16:53:00 - [3] Considering a Rorq is 3bil give or take, a freighter is 800m to 1bil give or take. And these are to fill the role between those two. Yeah I'd say its going to be worth quite a bit more than 500m
Chaos Incarnate Faceless Logistics	Posted - 2008.10.23 16:57:00 - [4] Originally by: Kazzac Elentria Considering a Rorq is 3bil give or take, a freighter is 800m to 1bil give or take. And these are to fill the role between those two. Yeah I'd say its going to be worth quite a bit more than 500m 3b for a rorqual? From who? Either way, the ship only has a mineral cost of a few hundred million, so I don't expect prices to be that high at first _____________________ The unofficial faceless Achura alt of EVE Online
Mazzarins Demise Profit Development and Research Association	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:12:00 - [5] Edited by: Mazzarins Demise on 23/10/2008 17:12:31 The BPO will be seeded in Empire and the mineral cost will be around 400 mil. I'm pulling my info from the Dev blog. Expect prices to go higher than 500 mil of course when the Orca first hits the markets. The scammers will also do their thing to it. But since it can all be done in Empire, I doubt the price gouging will last too long.
mr bighelmet EnTech	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:25:00 - [6] Originally by: Kazzac Elentria Considering a Rorq is 3bil give or take, a freighter is 800m to 1bil give or take. And these are to fill the role between those two. Yeah I'd say its going to be worth quite a bit more than 500m I think u need to read it again Orca will not be between freight and Rorq it will be a small clone of those two. It will fill the role of rorq in running mining OP but will not be as good and it will be able to move cargo but at much smaller amounts then freight. So basicly u could use it as a mini rorq or as a mini freight. For the part of the freight i think that 500m is going to be abit high, 90k cargo space + 400k for ships for 50% of the price of freight is a bit much.
Jacque Custeau Knights of the Minmatar Republic	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:28:00 - [7] Edited by: Jacque Custeau on 23/10/2008 17:29:18 Lets not forget that, according to the dev blog, it will use capital components. This will be a barrier to entry for every Tom, Dick and Harry. I'll probably make one at ME 0 and take advantage of the high prices, and then pop in the lab for a month.
Mazzarins Demise Profit Development and Research Association	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:31:00 - [8] Edited by: Mazzarins Demise on 23/10/2008 17:31:27 Originally by: Jacque Custeau Edited by: Jacque Custeau on 23/10/2008 17:29:18 Lets not forget that, according to the dev blog, it will use capital components. This will be a barrier to entry for every Tom, Dick and Harry. I'll probably make one at ME 0 and take advantage of the high prices, and then pop in the lab for a month. What I did for the Magnate when it first came out, albeit it was a crap ton of ISK less. Same principle though .
Kazzac Elentria	Posted - 2008.10.23 17:37:00 - [9] Originally by: mr bighelmet Originally by: Kazzac Elentria Considering a Rorq is 3bil give or take, a freighter is 800m to 1bil give or take. And these are to fill the role between those two. Yeah I'd say its going to be worth quite a bit more than 500m I think u need to read it again Orca will not be between freight and Rorq it will be a small clone of those two. It will fill the role of rorq in running mining OP but will not be as good and it will be able to move cargo but at much smaller amounts then freight. So basicly u could use it as a mini rorq or as a mini freight. For the part of the freight i think that 500m is going to be abit high, 90k cargo space + 400k for ships for 50% of the price of freight is a bit much. I missed the devblog this morning... retract my original estimate. 800m the first month with a gradual decline towards 600m
Clair Bear Coalition of Nations Free Trade Zone.	Posted - 2008.10.23 18:10:00 - [10] Depends on how long the BPO takes to copy, how long the production time is, and how expensive the BPO is. If we're talking 1B for the BPO and copy times comprable to a freighter there's no reason for the markup to be < 100-300M over mineral cost, just like a freighter. Of course, there's no reason for freighter BPOs to be as cheap as they are in that case, either. Who wants to gamble?
Kazzac Elentria	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:16:00 - [11] Originally by: Clair Bear Also, I saw no mention that the BPO will be seeded in empire. This could be an ORE ship, which means... Covops runs near downtime ftw! Gotta love those. Stay up insanely late to make the run into null about an hour before DT, catch a nap and make the run right after up time!
cosmoray Cosmoray Construction	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:24:00 - [12] All depends on where the BPO is seeded. If devblog is true the BPO is cheap and seeded in Empire then everyone will grab one. In that scenario expect returns to be same as other standard BPO's - around 10% profit over mineral costs at maximum. Also depends on build and research time. If the build time is too long then it will be cheaper to keep churning out normal production. I wouldn't want to waste a slot that takes 3 days to build 1 ship to give 20-40 mill in profits.
Kazzac Elentria	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:30:00 - [13] Originally by: cosmoray In that scenario expect returns to be same as other standard BPO's - around 10% profit over mineral costs at maximum. Using cap components should push the margin up slightly. I'd expect them around freighter margins now
Shar Tegral	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:30:00 - [14] Originally by: cosmoray If devblog is true the BPO is cheap and seeded in Empire then everyone will grab one. The bpo will be seeded in empire space at Deep Core Mining stations. Dev post confirming this. I have a new clone, her skill points are quite low but i forsee vast potential. Born at 05:56 18-Oct-08, weighing 7 lbs 12 oz, and was named Lara Florence. Mother & baby doing well - Dylythium
Kazzac Elentria	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:31:00 - [15] And thinking about it a little more, now would be a good time to get out of the freighter build business. Expect demand to drop.. significantly
Jacque Custeau Knights of the Minmatar Republic	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:41:00 - [16] Originally by: Kazzac Elentria And thinking about it a little more, now would be a good time to get out of the freighter build business. Expect demand to drop.. significantly I couldn't agree with this. Freighters still have a huge role to play. I could be wrong, but a freighter seems easier to train up for and carries more than 20 times the Orca. Keep in mind that the 30,000m3 given to the Orca is roughly the capacity of one jet can. Its true that the Orca has the maintenance bay going for it, but that's only enough for one battleship. No, I believe the freighters are here to stay. As for Orca futures, I wouldn't mind selling them once I knew what components were needed and I pre-built them. The main issue is if the customer will keep his end of the bargain or run for the hills if he sees a better deal post-patch. -------------------
Level5	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:50:00 - [17] Edited by: Level5 on 23/10/2008 19:49:56 here is the blueprint info from sisi.. http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/haffrage/orcablueprint.jpg can someone calculate its cost/value now :)
Kazzac Elentria	Posted - 2008.10.23 19:54:00 - [18] Originally by: Jacque Custeau I couldn't agree with this. Freighters still have a huge role to play. I could be wrong, but a freighter seems easier to train up for and carries more than 20 times the Orca. Keep in mind that the 30,000m3 given to the Orca is roughly the capacity of one jet can. Its true that the Orca has the maintenance bay going for it, but that's only enough for one battleship. No, I believe the freighters are here to stay. Well maybe not a constant drop, but we will still see a drop in demand for at least 3 to 4 months IMHO. I have been wrong in the past though so.
Kazzac Elentria	Posted - 2008.10.23 20:06:00 - [19] Originally by: Level5 Edited by: Level5 on 23/10/2008 19:49:56 here is the blueprint info from sisi.. http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/haffrage/orcablueprint.jpg can someone calculate its cost/value now :) Approx 340m at current build prices, if the blueprint stays true
Ruffio Sepico Minmatar Hidden Agenda Deep Space Engineering	Posted - 2008.10.23 20:11:00 - [20] BLOCKQUOTE font class=quote size=9px face= Verdana img src= /images/icon_quote_message.gif border= 0 b Originally by: /b i Kazzac Elentria /i hr height=1 noshade BLOCKQUOTE font class=quote size=9px face= Verdana img src= /images/icon_quote_message.gif border= 0 b Originally by: /b i Level5 /i hr height=1 noshade span style= font-size:7pt i Edited by: Level5 on 23/10/2008 19:49:56 /i /span br here is the blueprint info from sisi.. br br a href= http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/haffrage/orcablueprint.jpg target= _blank http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/haffrage/orcablueprint.jpg /a http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/haffrage/orcablueprint.jpg can someone calculate its cost/value now :) Approx 340m at current build prices, if the blueprint stays true With such small numbers on the cap parts, not much rush to research the print either. Time better spent producing. Home: http://www.hidden-agenda.co.uk
Kazzac Elentria	Posted - 2008.10.23 20:15:00 - [21] Originally by: Ruffio Sepico Originally by: Kazzac Elentria Originally by: Level5 Edited by: Level5 on 23/10/2008 19:49:56 here is the blueprint info from sisi.. http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/haffrage/orcablueprint.jpg can someone calculate its cost/value now :) Approx 340m at current build prices, if the blueprint stays true With such small numbers on the cap parts, not much rush to research the print either. Time better spent producing. I do know that I've spent the last few months with my prints in research for PE improvements since its been stated time and time again that eventually PE will take a larger role in manufacturing.
flakeys Coalition of Nations Free Trade Zone.	Posted - 2008.10.23 22:08:00 - [22] Originally by: Mazzarins Demise Edited by: Mazzarins Demise on 23/10/2008 17:12:31 The BPO will be seeded in Empire This bpo belongs in outer ring since it belongs to the mining vessels.If CCP decides otherwise i'm curious why the rorqual bpo is sold in outer ring like all other mining vessel bpo's and yet this one won't.Would be verry odd.
Shar Tegral	Posted - 2008.10.23 22:24:00 - [23] Originally by: flakeys *****ing, moaning, and useless whining. Well according to the blog the ship was developed by two corporations. It would only go to reason that both corporations would give access to the blueprint. Of course I think it would be more interesting to have ORCA bpc's released some other method and have the bpo not exist period. Of course the only option at that point would like be LP store... and that's already way to heavily farmed. I have a new clone, her skill points are quite low but i forsee vast potential. Born at 05:56 18-Oct-08, weighing 7 lbs 12 oz, and was named Lara Florence. Mother & baby doing well - Dylythium
cosmoray Cosmoray Construction	Posted - 2008.10.23 23:48:00 - [24] Mid 300's seem about right. A week long build time does not seem like it will make a good return. Makes the BPO purchased for an alliance/corps.
Kylar Renpurs Dusk Blade	Posted - 2008.10.24 01:02:00 - [25] Off-topic. Orca specs make me sad :( Glorified Battlecruiser mixed with a transport ship, with built in can-flip protection. Hi-sec version of a carrier minus combat ability,,, Improve Market Competition!
PaperLion Gallente Old Man Industrial and Mining	Posted - 2008.10.24 02:48:00 - [26] Originally by: Jacque Custeau As for Orca futures, I wouldn't mind selling them once I knew what components were needed and I pre-built them. The main issue is if the customer will keep his end of the bargain or run for the hills if he sees a better deal post-patch. I'd be willing to put the money in escrow with a trusted third party. PL
Max Teranous Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.10.24 10:22:00 - [27] Originally by: flakeys Originally by: Mazzarins Demise Edited by: Mazzarins Demise on 23/10/2008 17:12:31 The BPO will be seeded in Empire This bpo belongs in outer ring since it belongs to the mining vessels.If CCP decides otherwise i'm curious why the rorqual bpo is sold in outer ring like all other mining vessel bpo's and yet this one won't.Would be verry odd. It's because it is not purely an ORE vessel, but a collaboration between ORE & Deep core mining. Hence will be available in empire from them also. Max
flakeys Coalition of Nations Free Trade Zone.	Posted - 2008.10.24 12:17:00 - [28] Originally by: Max Teranous Originally by: flakeys Originally by: Mazzarins Demise Edited by: Mazzarins Demise on 23/10/2008 17:12:31 The BPO will be seeded in Empire This bpo belongs in outer ring since it belongs to the mining vessels.If CCP decides otherwise i'm curious why the rorqual bpo is sold in outer ring like all other mining vessel bpo's and yet this one won't.Would be verry odd. It's because it is not purely an ORE vessel, but a collaboration between ORE & Deep core mining. Hence will be available in empire from them also. Max Another 500 mille easy pick up and deliver in empire down the drain.Guess i'll actually have to build them then . And shar i agree about the whining and moaning
Jacque Custeau Knights of the Minmatar Republic	Posted - 2008.10.24 12:30:00 - [29] Originally by: PaperLion Originally by: Jacque Custeau As for Orca futures, I wouldn't mind selling them once I knew what components were needed and I pre-built them. The main issue is if the customer will keep his end of the bargain or run for the hills if he sees a better deal post-patch. I'd be willing to put the money in escrow with a trusted third party. PL I'll get on to Sisi on Saturday and we can discuss the details Sunday.
PaperLion Gallente Old Man Industrial and Mining	Posted - 2008.10.24 14:45:00 - [30] Originally by: Jacque Custeau Edited by: Jacque Custeau on 24/10/2008 12:42:04 Originally by: PaperLion Originally by: Jacque Custeau As for Orca futures, I wouldn't mind selling them once I knew what components were needed and I pre-built them. The main issue is if the customer will keep his end of the bargain or run for the hills if he sees a better deal post-patch. I'd be willing to put the money in escrow with a trusted third party. PL I'll get on to Sisi on Saturday and we can discuss the details Sunday. If you do decide to go for it, I can pre-build the components. You'd be able to cancel the order right up until the patch (just in case it gets nerfed) and I can always use the components on the other cap ships I build. Great...let's talk in-game at some point in the next week or so. PL

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