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EVE vs Jumpgate vs SWTOR vs Stargate vs Star Trek

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CornerStoner	Posted - 2008.10.28 16:24:00 - [31] blackprophecy I'm not sure if this one will even make it to/past Beta status, but it's out there.
Caan Buhaao Gallente 72nd Squadron	Posted - 2008.10.28 16:28:00 - [32] Jumpgate: Evolution promises to be a good one. The market and trade system was more robust than eve's in the original Jumpgate (which was like ... 2001?). Though not as complex, trade routes made sense and weren't exploitable. There were events in the game that basically amounted to unlocking advantages for one faction over another for a period of time (eventually they trickled down to all the player factions) and the mission running wasn't just pure grind, it actually had a point to it. I was a big fan of JG's PvP system. You could fly civilian or honor guard in secure space--basically carebear or PvP, turning even the equivalent of 1.0 space into 0.0 if you wanted to fly that flag on behalf of your nation. The catch is, if you attacked a player of a certain faction, you lost points with that faction, and eventually you'd become an outlaw. Lot of granularity there. I forget the exact numbers, but it was like ... -1, when you dock they fine you. -3, when you dock they fine you and take your guns and ammo. -5, when you dock, they fine you, take your guns and ammo, and strip your ship of armor (hope you're a shield tanker). -6, you can't dock, and -8 the stations fire on you and cops actively chase you. And when I say chase, I don't mean "to the gate." I mean CHASE YOU. Enter phase two of the PvP system: unregulated space. Even with the civvie/honor guard system, there still exists secure space that ran the gamut from (in eve speak) 1.0 to 0.0. Stations in 0.0 became the only place that pirate characters could dock (and they were damn good places to sell guns and ammo, as they couldn't get them elsewhere and no pirate stations had production facilities). To get from one faction space to another, you generally had to fly through unreg'ed space. And the combat system was great. It was as complex as eve's was at launch (meaning I suspect it to be as complex as eve's is now, when JG:E launches), but it wasn't skillpoints/tech2 > noob gear, it was basically if you can buy it, you can use it, provided you can aim it. Most of the stuff was ship-race specific, and you had to earn faction with the NPC supplier to gain the rights to buy it (or the blueprints or whatever to manufacture it--hazy on this bit), but once it existed it could be swapped out, trucked, sold, whatever, so if you had enough money you could use the weaps, even if you had to buy them in unreg'ed space. I could go on and on, but it was a cool game, even then, and still has players--and that's saying a lot, considering the graphics suck (ghetto tron spaceships) and there hasn't been new content in a long time. The ORIGINAL jumpgate has potential to hurt eve's market base, if enough eve players find out about it--I can only assume the updated JG:Evolution will be a strong competitor. -- sig temporarily busted. kinda like the game.
SharpMango 14th Legion	Posted - 2008.10.28 16:34:00 - [33] Edited by: SharpMango on 28/10/2008 16:33:54 i'm a MASSIVE star trek fan.. But the premise of that particular MMO does sound rather rubbish. give credit where credit is due. Star trek works GREAT as a tv show. Eve works great as an MMO. Btw, this is in reference to the back story etc.
Niccolado Starwalker Shadow Templars	Posted - 2008.10.28 16:35:00 - [34] My opinion? All online games currently on the market - with exception of EVE - stinks. All online games coming soon to a market - stinks - in one way or other. So for me it seems it will be EVE all the way! Originally by: Dianabolic Your tears are absolutely divine, like a fine fine wine, rolling down your cheeks until they flow down the river of LOL
Phasics Imperium Technologies	Posted - 2008.10.28 21:21:00 - [35] You know it seems to me the majority of MMO's with "staying" power are the ones built from the ground up and are not based on existing franchises.
Pesky LaRue Minmatar	Posted - 2008.10.28 22:10:00 - [36] Originally by: Phasics You know it seems to me the majority of MMO's with "staying" power are the ones built from the ground up and are not based on existing franchises. you mean, apart from the most successful MMOG to date, WoW? ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++
Chelone Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.10.28 22:24:00 - [37] Eve is becoming a capital ship fest. A lot of people (like me) don't enjoy that at all. CCP has also completely given up on making large fleet battles workable, instead focusing on smaller things like FW, ambulation and other frills instead of fixing the heart of the game. So, new space MMO's definitely have a lot of openings to surpass Eve. But whether they actually will, I have doubts.
Richard Aiel Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.10.28 23:57:00 - [38] Originally by: Phasics Well not really a competition just yet. None of these are even out yet. However the space MMO scene is set to get alot more crowded. Wondering what you guys think on how EVE is positioned for the long run, against a more hotly contested MMO space buck. Yes these are different games, with differnt play styles, but the "space MMO genre" will draw a play style independent crowd. Will EVE hold onto it current market share ? P.S this thread is about EVE and how it will fair in the years to come. Finger crossed this doesn't degenerate into a X better than Y thread. lets see... ghost training byebye... hello next new space MMO ------------------------------------------------ CCP you are your own worst enemy. ------------------------------------------------
Siona Windweaver	Posted - 2008.10.29 00:07:00 - [39] Todays Dev Chat with Jumpgate on MMORPG.com was full of fail. They avoided important questions didn't really gave any new information that wasn't available already.
Cassandra Valieries	Posted - 2008.10.29 00:16:00 - [40] Jumpgate - Not going to waste my time on Hermann and the hamsters after they messed up AA. Star Trek - Absolutely hate the setting, so happy to hear that the game seems to stink as well. Star Wars - Don't hate the setting. Just find it dull. My corp will take a hit if the game is good as we have a few SW fanatics Stargate - Now we're talking! I will defintaly try it out (said that about AoC as well, and chickened out, canceled my preorder and got EVE instead. Pure Win), and unless it is utterly crapstatic will share my gaming time with Eve
Taram Caldar Noir. Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2008.10.29 00:17:00 - [41] Edited by: Taram Caldar on 29/10/2008 00:21:48 Originally by: Phasics Well not really a competition just yet. None of these are even out yet. However the space MMO scene is set to get alot more crowded. Wondering what you guys think on how EVE is positioned for the long run, against a more hotly contested MMO space buck. Yes these are different games, with differnt play styles, but the "space MMO genre" will draw a play style independent crowd. Will EVE hold onto it current market share ? P.S this thread is about EVE and how it will fair in the years to come. Finger crossed this doesn't degenerate into a X better than Y thread. It's going to degenerate no matter how many fingers you cross. However I will keep mine finger free and stick to the facts. Before SWG and Earth & Beyond collapsed EVE sat, steady, at around 20,000 subscribers. When E&B collapsed CCP did a VERY smart thing: They gave a free EVE account to any E&B player who provided them with their CD Key to E&B. This basically doubled EVE's subscriber base in just a couple month's time. After this CCP sat at right around 50,000-60,000 subscribers for a very long time... Enter the CU over at SWG.... EVE started spiking in numbers again.... next enter the NGE over ate SWG.... BOOM! EVE's population almost trippled over the next year. We went from 60,000ish players to over 180,000ish players in VERY short order... Now... enter your question: What will the advent of these other Sci-Fi MMORPG's cause within the EVE community? My prediction: Initially very little. But over time EVE will bleed players off to the other games. I suspect that, unless CCP addresses several of the more 'boring' aspects of the game before those games start to take root (and, of course, assuming those games come out and are worth a darn) they will see numbers at the very least stop climbing, and worse case they'll start bleeding subscribers down to about 100,000 or so. (not that this is a bad thing, imo). EVE's success is partly due to a very solid game but also partly due to the fact that EVE has no competition. It either collapsed (E&B) or shot itself in the head (SWG). As a result EVE has benefited from a 'perfect storm'. Two Sci-Fi MMORPG's bled players over to CCP when they both collapsed while at the same time EVE is good enough that players don't leave easily. Now... will those games be "better"? Dunno... it really isn't easy to predict something like that. I will say this: BioWare is making SW:TOR.... If anyone thinks BioWare is not fully capable of making a top notch game they are deluding themselves. It's also pretty important to remember that EVE's most recent HUGE growth spurt was caused, primarily, by dissaffected SWG players.... "Star Wars" players.... if SW:TOR is even remotely good many of them will at the very least start splitting time between SW:TOR and EVE. I myself am very much looking forward to it. I also have my eye on Stargate Worlds.... as do many other players I know. So what will happen to EVE? Anyone who says 'nothing' is lying.
Chelone Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.10.29 00:36:00 - [42] Originally by: Taram Caldar EVE's success is partly due to a very solid game but also partly due to the fact that EVE has no competition. It either collapsed (E&B) or shot itself in the head (SWG). As a result EVE has benefited from a 'perfect storm'. This. But -1 for ever using the phrase "perfect storm."
Phasics Imperium Technologies	Posted - 2008.10.29 01:07:00 - [43] Originally by: Pesky LaRue Originally by: Phasics You know it seems to me the majority of MMO's with "staying" power are the ones built from the ground up and are not based on existing franchises. you mean, apart from the most successful MMOG to date, WoW? The exception , not the rule and I did say staying power will WoW still be a powerhouse 3-5 years from now ?
Sakhrachen	Posted - 2008.10.29 01:20:00 - [44] Jumpgate Evolution, Jumpgate Evolution trailer1 - Clicky Link Jumpgate Evolution trailer2 - Clicky Link
Murk Loar Polytope	Posted - 2008.10.29 01:27:00 - [45] Originally by: Kethry Avenger A game I am watching as direct competition to eve is Infinity the Quest for earth, especially since its developer story sounds so much like eve, 8-9 guys with a dream. Linkage This looks interesting...planetside aerial attacks included.
Gojyu Ever Flow Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.10.29 01:31:00 - [46] Originally by: Phasics Originally by: Pesky LaRue Originally by: Phasics You know it seems to me the majority of MMO's with "staying" power are the ones built from the ground up and are not based on existing franchises. you mean, apart from the most successful MMOG to date, WoW? The exception , not the rule and I did say staying power will WoW still be a powerhouse 3-5 years from now ? Umm... yes? Given that wow subscriber numbers are only going up. They hit, what, 11 million subscribers last week? The thought that that many people are just suddenly going to get bored and go "oh well, time to leave now" is just ludicrous. Even if they didn't get a new subscriber in the next decade, they're still going to be the dominant mmo until another blizzard mmo comes out.
Pesky LaRue Minmatar	Posted - 2008.10.29 01:50:00 - [47] Originally by: Phasics Originally by: Pesky LaRue Originally by: Phasics You know it seems to me the majority of MMO's with "staying" power are the ones built from the ground up and are not based on existing franchises. you mean, apart from the most successful MMOG to date, WoW? The exception , not the rule and I did say staying power will WoW still be a powerhouse 3-5 years from now ? lol, stop backpedaling and take your slapdown like a man :P it's been the #1 for what, 4 years next month already and is still growing? if you're you're saying that they they have to hit the 8 or 10 year mark and still be the biggest and arguably most successful MMOG of all time to prove they have staying power, then we have confusin over the definition of the term :P ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++
Pesky LaRue Minmatar	Posted - 2008.10.29 01:54:00 - [48] Originally by: Gojyu Umm... yes? Given that wow subscriber numbers are only going up. They hit, what, 11 million subscribers last week? The thought that that many people are just suddenly going to get bored and go "oh well, time to leave now" is just ludicrous. Even if they didn't get a new subscriber in the next decade, they're still going to be the dominant mmo until another blizzard mmo comes out. even though WoW's not for me (hate fantasy, love sandbox games) the day they come out with Systems of StarCraft is the day they'll dominate the sci-fi market. back to the op - quite honestly, i'm not sure EVE has much to worry about from any of those games, and more from it's own creators. EVE is unique and somewhat of an anomaly and for any MMOG to really threaten it they would have to include things like the single-shard and continue the sandbox element of it. EVE has many, many flaws, but the only people that will really have the potential to bring this game down are CCP (and this is coming from a CCP-fan) - as long as they keep adding new features and content to EVE, it'll be around. EVE is in better shape after 5.5 years than ANY other game on the market - excluding that "flash in the pan" WoW - no reason to think that with proper management it won't continue down that path. ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++

CCP Mitnal C C P	Posted - 2008.10.29 01:56:00 - [49] Moved to OOPE. Mitnal Community Representative CCP Games, EVE Online Email / Netfang

Aritico Kazo	Posted - 2008.10.29 01:58:00 - [50] Hrmm... all of you should play the Infinity quest for earth combat proto ;p look into that game.. the resurgence of sandbox... sadly Bob and goons are looking and establishing corps pre launch waaa... lol and so is our dear revan nefaris lol
Chelone Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.10.29 02:39:00 - [51] Originally by: Aritico Kazo Infinity quest for earth ... Bob and goons are looking and establishing corps pre launch waaa... Hmm, disgusting. Like a cancer spreading to more organs of the body. Single player games are now sounding more appealing...
Joey Meow MURAKAMI INDUSTRIES	Posted - 2008.10.29 02:40:00 - [52] Should any of those games be even little better than EVE, I am gone from here.
Veldya Guristari Freedom Fighters	Posted - 2008.10.29 03:52:00 - [53] I like the way Jumpgate has gone with their combat, it being more flight sim than strategic turn based. I like flying in space and think that is somewhat of a flaw in EVE, you really don't do a whole lot of flying, most flying is done in a very limited pocket of space and movement is very limited. Between my accounts I have hundreds of ships, was thousands when I was actively making them. EVE just seems too disposable at a high end which limits the potential for growth. Jumpgate the combat ships are all fighter level ships which I think gives them more scope to introduce "real" capital class ships in the future. They look to have adopted a WoW type of graphic engine, it is more vibrant, less realistic looking but those cartoony type graphic engines are significantly lighter on PCs as they have far fewer polygons. I like many aspects of EVE but also feel EVE is very slow to evolve, EVE has a great theme but the PvE level is exceptionally poor. EVE's economy is very interesting but is also problematic because simpletons and kids who have nfi what they are doing ruin the ability to have a far more dynamic economic system. EVE basically has a low value on wealth. Ships are cheap and homogonised, very disposable, very cheap to make, very easy to lose and the rate wealth comes in makes the cost of flying trivial, even inconsequential. If I was to make changes to EVE it would be the same but be very different, I don't think CCP take advantages of the game's strengths as much as they should and deficiencies are literally left for years and years before being addressed. The potential of competition will hopefully see a change from CCP.
Pesky LaRue Minmatar	Posted - 2008.10.29 03:57:00 - [54] Originally by: CCP Mitnal Moved to OOPE. I moved it back to General Discussion. Please don't make this mistake again, Mitnal. ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++ ++
SghnDubh BattleClinic	Posted - 2008.10.29 04:17:00 - [55] Originally by: Kai Lae Originally by: SghnDubh And since BattleClinic first started out as a support site for StarFleet Command games, we're total Trek geeks and we'll support STO even if it (touch wood) ends up with the same curse as most previous trek games. Sigh. We'll see. Speak for yourself Chris, some of us aren't nannerslug or rat boy lol. God they drove me nuts. And there's nothing about that series of games a well placed shape charge send to paramount wouldn't fix, because then SVC could make a computerized version of SFB and say "screw you paramount" and get away with it. ROFL at least Frey's still alive and kicking over at Dyna. That guy blows my mind. What's EVE's version of the Hand of Bethke? Timecodes: http://shop.BattleClinic.com
Richard Aiel Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.10.29 08:15:00 - [56] Originally by: Murk Loar Originally by: Kethry Avenger A game I am watching as direct competition to eve is Infinity the Quest for earth, especially since its developer story sounds so much like eve, 8-9 guys with a dream. Linkage This looks interesting...planetside aerial attacks included. Too bad it might as well be vaporware ------------------------------------------------ CCP you are your own worst enemy. ------------------------------------------------
Crumplecorn Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations	Posted - 2008.10.29 10:26:00 - [57] Maybe these games will hammer EVE's playerbase, and with all the carebears gone, Oveur will come back and make the entire game 0.0 for the remaining 50000 people. - DesuSigs
Kai Lae Gallente Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.10.29 13:05:00 - [58] Originally by: SghnDubh ROFL at least Frey's still alive and kicking over at Dyna. That guy blows my mind. What's EVE's version of the Hand of Bethke? Being blackscreened with 220 oh so friendly bob on the same grid as you due to a node crash?
Aritico Kazo	Posted - 2008.10.30 01:28:00 - [59] Originally by: Richard Aiel Originally by: Murk Loar Originally by: Kethry Avenger A game I am watching as direct competition to eve is Infinity the Quest for earth, especially since its developer story sounds so much like eve, 8-9 guys with a dream. Linkage This looks interesting...planetside aerial attacks included. Too bad it might as well be vaporware isnt that what they said about eve?

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