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Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2008.11.09 09:35:00 - [1] Edited by: Shadowsword on 09/11/2008 09:36:02 http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=287282 Quote: The star feature of Tech 3 will be modular, customisable ships. Instead of providing each faction with one or two new ships each, CCP will provide each with a template that comes in five sections, with five options in each. That's a total of 25 possible basic ships for each faction, with many more thousands of smaller modifications possible (7776 permutations possible, to be exact). Err, according to the video of your presentation, you can do 55555 possible permutations, that's a hell of a lot more than "25 possible basic ships for each faction". 3125 to be exact. But then, where does that 7776 number come from? And if you can plug in other minor components on those 5 ship blocs, as the article strongly imply, the possible permutations become near unlimited, no? I'm confused now. PS: You gave a precise realease date 5 months from now. WTF? What did you do to the CCP I know, you fraud? ^^ ------------------------------------------
Ordais	Posted - 2008.11.09 09:40:00 - [2] They got confused ;) Oveur wanted the number 7776 because its "cooler" (it was a joke)! But it will be 5^5=3125.
Jalif Scorpion's Sting	Posted - 2008.11.09 09:44:00 - [3] Edited by: Jalif on 09/11/2008 09:46:07 Edited by: Jalif on 09/11/2008 09:45:23 Ill hit the second question above without making a senseless 2nd topic about t3 ships. Is it going to be modular for each ship size such as frigate, cruiser & BS size? Or is just going to be just 1 thing not related to any of those? to the OP. 3125 doesn't have to be right either. Using the same modules probably is not possible as I recal you will have only 1 "main" module (I think). Its still in development & only on paper as far as I saw. EDIT: aahhh.. ok... that explains :)
Kalintos Tyl Minmatar	Posted - 2008.11.09 09:48:00 - [4] dont rforget cargo capacity hulls so it will be like 4 4 4 4 ;] Quote: It's not a good idea to place a Exotic Dancers in a Giant Secure Container. The Exotic Dancers will not survive intact, if transported in such a container.
Glasyra	Posted - 2008.11.09 10:09:00 - [5] 7776 possable ship types comes from fanfest key note speeker, when asked why that number he said "I like it". Honestly 7776 was a joke, the final number of custom mods is still up in the air.
Meiyang Lee Gallente Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2008.11.09 10:15:00 - [6] Originally by: Glasyra 7776 possable ship types comes from fanfest key note speeker, when asked why that number he said "I like it". Honestly 7776 was a joke, the final number of custom mods is still up in the air. 3125 was mentioned as the current number of options available, however the number may be reduced for technical and balance reasons before release. The 7776 was indeed a joke, and as the person explaining all this said "it made no sense".
Tiirae The New Era HUZZAH FEDERATION	Posted - 2008.11.09 10:48:00 - [7] Originally by: Jalif Edited by: Jalif on 09/11/2008 09:46:07 Edited by: Jalif on 09/11/2008 09:45:23 Ill hit the second question above without making a senseless 2nd topic about t3 ships. Is it going to be modular for each ship size such as frigate, cruiser & BS size? Or is just going to be just 1 thing not related to any of those? to the OP. 3125 doesn't have to be right either. Using the same modules probably is not possible as I recal you will have only 1 "main" module (I think). Its still in development & only on paper as far as I saw. EDIT: aahhh.. ok... that explains :) It's being released in five months. It must be basically finished already, certainly it's too late for any major changes. CCP has a history of hitting their launch dates pretty well.
sg3s Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.11.09 11:01:00 - [8] But 7776 is way cooler, I demand 7776 different permutations as well! It's about time I put something sensible in here, but I couldn't really come up with something so you'l have to do with this. Are you like really bored, or did you not notice this is my sig?
Chris Liath Gallente Red Dwarf Mining Corporation space weaponry and trade	Posted - 2008.11.09 11:05:00 - [9] Yay, a rifter with a detachable fin. "Oh dear," says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic.

CCP Mephysto	Posted - 2008.11.09 11:13:00 - [10] Actually, you have 12k combinations. 5^5x4 races However, I dont believe you'll be able to put amarr components on a caldari hull etc. though. (I havent seen the designs, so anything I say should be treated as hearsay. or possibly heresy.)


Chribba Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire	Posted - 2008.11.09 11:16:00 - [11] What about ORE ships, faction ships? Secure 3rd party service ■ Veldspar

Kagura Nikon Minmatar Infinity Enterprises	Posted - 2008.11.09 11:17:00 - [12] Just trying to understand how this will work with ship sizes. Will we get a single size of t3 ships? If yes what size? I would be cruiser most likely. Because I fail to see how you could make it cover from cruiser to battleship level unless you add size levels for the components. Some people might get disapointed I fear. Since if they do it for cruisers, people that like Battleships most will be left on dust (Again after the double fiasco of black ops and marauders). If they do battleships they will leave the gerrilha warfare band angry. Maybe 5^5 options for cruisers and 5^5 for BS? (that woudl get close to the 7.7k funny number). But I can see hwo this will ad a hell lot of work to CCP. Would end up in 2542 models (200 models) ------------------------------------------------- If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
sg3s Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.11.09 11:19:00 - [13] Originally by: Chribba What about ORE ships, faction ships? Faction ships probably not, faction components... hmmmm whole new range of possibilities.. As for ORE ships, I would like to see those as well but I don't think that will happen with the next patch, they have enough work as it is getting the 4 different races working. It's about time I put something sensible in here, but I couldn't really come up with something so you'l have to do with this. Are you like really bored, or did you not notice this is my sig?
sg3s Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.11.09 11:22:00 - [14] Originally by: Kagura Nikon Just trying to understand how this will work with ship sizes. Will we get a single size of t3 ships? If yes what size? I would be cruiser most likely. Because I fail to see how you could make it cover from cruiser to battleship level unless you add size levels for the components. Some people might get disapointed I fear. Since if they do it for cruisers, people that like Battleships most will be left on dust (Again after the double fiasco of black ops and marauders). If they do battleships they will leave the gerrilha warfare band angry. Maybe 5^5 options for cruisers and 5^5 for BS? (that woudl get close to the 7.7k funny number). But I can see hwo this will ad a hell lot of work to CCP. Would end up in 2542 models (200 models) From what I gathered I couldn't exactly make out the size of theses ships. However a photo of a presentation slide hinted that larger ships would take 5 components while smaller may take only 3-4... Thats just speculation though... It's about time I put something sensible in here, but I couldn't really come up with something so you'l have to do with this. Are you like really bored, or did you not notice this is my sig?
Seth Ruin Minmatar Ominous Corp Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.11.09 11:31:00 - [15] Originally by: CCP Mephysto Actually, you have 12k combinations. 5^5x4 races However, I dont believe you'll be able to put amarr components on a caldari hull etc. though. (I havent seen the designs, so anything I say should be treated as hearsay. or possibly heresy.) I was actually hoping (partially for the balancing team's sake) there would be one set of race-neutral parts. 12500 combinations is a bit much to balance, and will invariably end up with something overpowered in my opinion.
Veldya Guristari Freedom Fighters	Posted - 2008.11.09 11:42:00 - [16] Edited by: Veldya on 09/11/2008 11:42:30 Originally by: Seth Ruin Originally by: CCP Mephysto Actually, you have 12k combinations. 5^5x4 races However, I dont believe you'll be able to put amarr components on a caldari hull etc. though. (I havent seen the designs, so anything I say should be treated as hearsay. or possibly heresy.) I was actually hoping (partially for the balancing team's sake) there would be one set of race-neutral parts. 12500 combinations is a bit much to balance, and will invariably end up with something overpowered in my opinion. I think much of the modulation of spaceship design will revolve around building blocks you will use, I just think you will have more one-dimensional ship designs. Will they be unbalanced? I guess if their mechanics do not allow for extremes then yes, if the core mechanics are solid then they may need to fine tune some extremes but doubt it would represent any massive difficulties given EVE combat overall is probably one of the more simplistic MMO combat systems.
sg3s Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.11.09 11:42:00 - [17] Originally by: Seth Ruin Originally by: CCP Mephysto Actually, you have 12k combinations. 5^5x4 races However, I dont believe you'll be able to put amarr components on a caldari hull etc. though. (I havent seen the designs, so anything I say should be treated as hearsay. or possibly heresy.) I was actually hoping (partially for the balancing team's sake) there would be one set of race-neutral parts. 12500 combinations is a bit much to balance, and will invariably end up with something overpowered in my opinion. So? If someone makes an overpowered setup, you build one to counter it... It's about time I put something sensible in here, but I couldn't really come up with something so you'l have to do with this. Are you like really bored, or did you not notice this is my sig?
Deva Blackfire D00M.	Posted - 2008.11.09 11:45:00 - [18] Originally by: sg3s Originally by: Seth Ruin Originally by: CCP Mephysto Actually, you have 12k combinations. 5^5x4 races However, I dont believe you'll be able to put amarr components on a caldari hull etc. though. (I havent seen the designs, so anything I say should be treated as hearsay. or possibly heresy.) I was actually hoping (partially for the balancing team's sake) there would be one set of race-neutral parts. 12500 combinations is a bit much to balance, and will invariably end up with something overpowered in my opinion. So? If someone makes an overpowered setup, you build one to counter it... Nonono - in this game raven must kill everything. Even in npcing setup.
sg3s Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:01:00 - [19] Edited by: sg3s on 09/11/2008 12:01:17 Originally by: Deva Blackfire Originally by: sg3s Originally by: Seth Ruin Originally by: CCP Mephysto Actually, you have 12k combinations. 5^5x4 races However, I dont believe you'll be able to put amarr components on a caldari hull etc. though. (I havent seen the designs, so anything I say should be treated as hearsay. or possibly heresy.) I was actually hoping (partially for the balancing team's sake) there would be one set of race-neutral parts. 12500 combinations is a bit much to balance, and will invariably end up with something overpowered in my opinion. So? If someone makes an overpowered setup, you build one to counter it... Nonono - in this game raven must kill everything. Even in npcing setup. Ah yes, I'm sorry, I forgot. Forgive my insolence. It's about time I put something sensible in here, but I couldn't really come up with something so you'l have to do with this. Are you like really bored, or did you not notice this is my sig?
Dahin Euphoria Released	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:17:00 - [20] Originally by: Chribba What about ORE ships, faction ships? We've repeatedly told you. Noone cares about things that don't run missions in empire. When will you ever get it? We don't even care about people running missions outside the empire, so GTFO. Btw, that "wormhole" thingie kept screaming 'instancing' in my ear. Oh dear god... Why fly covops? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0WOIwlXE9g

CCP Mephysto	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:21:00 - [21] Originally by: Dahin Originally by: Chribba What about ORE ships, faction ships? We've repeatedly told you. Noone cares about things that don't run missions in empire. When will you ever get it? We don't even care about people running missions outside the empire, so GTFO. Btw, that "wormhole" thingie kept screaming 'instancing' in my ear. Oh dear god... No, Wormholes and the systems they lead to are not instances.

sg3s Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:21:00 - [22] Originally by: CCP Mephysto Originally by: Dahin Originally by: Chribba What about ORE ships, faction ships? We've repeatedly told you. Noone cares about things that don't run missions in empire. When will you ever get it? We don't even care about people running missions outside the empire, so GTFO. Btw, that "wormhole" thingie kept screaming 'instancing' in my ear. Oh dear god... No, Wormholes and the systems they lead to are not instances. Nice reply speed! Thanks for that, it sort of said the same to me but this made my day good again. It's about time I put something sensible in here, but I couldn't really come up with something so you'l have to do with this. Are you like really bored, or did you not notice this is my sig?
Arthur Frayn V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:24:00 - [23] Originally by: Dahin Originally by: Chribba What about ORE ships, faction ships? We've repeatedly told you. Noone cares about things that don't run missions in empire. When will you ever get it? We don't even care about people running missions outside the empire, so GTFO. You're new here, aren't you? -- Eventus stultorum magister.
Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:25:00 - [24] Originally by: CCP Mephysto Actually, you have 12k combinations. 5^5x4 races However, I dont believe you'll be able to put amarr components on a caldari hull etc. though. (I havent seen the designs, so anything I say should be treated as hearsay. or possibly heresy.) Thanks for the answer. Another big question: On the screenshot we see every part for caldari ships, and 5 example of completed ships given. But, it seem to indicate that they'll all be more or less similar in size. And I could see how it would be fairly wierd to have a ship with 3 interceptor parts and 2 BS part carring torps and going 3km/sec. So, is T3 going to be divided by classes? One class with 25 parts for frig/destroyer hulls, another for cruiser/BC hulls, and a third for BS/sub-cap hulls? I see it as the best way to prevent weird setup no one tought about to eventually appearing and being overpowered... ------------------------------------------
Amy Wang	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:29:00 - [25] Edited by: Amy Wang on 09/11/2008 12:32:43 Originally by: sg3s So? If someone makes an overpowered setup, you build one to counter it... A truly overpowered setup is per definition something that has no real counter except bringing more of the same setup. You know, like nano-ships had no counter...oh wait Well, case in point, if you think people will bother building a counter instead of just whining on the forums to get it nerfed you dont "get" Eve I suppose on topic: From what I understand I think there will be one ship only per race but depending on what kind of components you stick on it will be a different ship size class (measured in sig radius for lack of better way I suppose), e.g. you stick on a big capacitor unit, a big weapon battery and huge armor section and you get a ship comparable to BS size, you stick on tiny components for cap, armor and weapons but a strong propulsion system and you get an inty, etc so imho there will be only one base ship but the components will be equivalent to different size classes (each modifying the stats of the ship when you strap them on), that way you can maybe steer the ship in a specific direction, e.g. build a true attack cruiser with higher firepower then a BC but the tank and hp of a destroyer or something along those lines the true number of combinations will depend on how many different building blocks are available for each of the five sections obviously and I agree, while it is a truely innovative idea it will be hard to balance
sg3s Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:30:00 - [26] Originally by: Shadowsword Originally by: CCP Mephysto Actually, you have 12k combinations. 5^5x4 races However, I dont believe you'll be able to put amarr components on a caldari hull etc. though. (I havent seen the designs, so anything I say should be treated as hearsay. or possibly heresy.) Thanks for the answer. Another big question: On the screenshot we see every part for caldari ships, and 5 example of completed ships given. But, it seem to indicate that they'll all be more or less similar in size. And I could see how it would be fairly wierd to have a ship with 3 interceptor parts and 2 BS part carring torps and going 3km/sec. So, is T3 going to be divided by classes? One class with 25 parts for frig/destroyer hulls, another for cruiser/BC hulls, and a third for BS/sub-cap hulls? I see it as the best way to prevent weird setup no one tought about to eventually appearing and being overpowered... There are pretty solid ways on testing these things... One simple but extensive one is just let a script make all the possible setups and review each and pick the ones out that are over the top, balance, repeat... But I also think it's just going to follow CCPs pattern they've followed for the past year or so, introduce things pre-nerfed then work from there. So t3 might actually be on the same level as t2 for a while, with better possibilities for specialisation. Note how the rorq will receive a corporate hangar boost and CCP has said to give black ops a feul bay to make them viable etc... It's about time I put something sensible in here, but I couldn't really come up with something so you'l have to do with this. Are you like really bored, or did you not notice this is my sig?
Meiyang Lee Gallente Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:32:00 - [27] Edited by: Meiyang Lee on 09/11/2008 12:32:29 Originally by: Shadowsword Originally by: CCP Mephysto Actually, you have 12k combinations. 5^5x4 races However, I dont believe you'll be able to put amarr components on a caldari hull etc. though. (I havent seen the designs, so anything I say should be treated as hearsay. or possibly heresy.) Thanks for the answer. Another big question: On the screenshot we see every part for caldari ships, and 5 example of completed ships given. But, it seem to indicate that they'll all be more or less similar in size. And I could see how it would be fairly wierd to have a ship with 3 interceptor parts and 2 BS part carring torps and going 3km/sec. So, is T3 going to be divided by classes? One class with 25 parts for frig/destroyer hulls, another for cruiser/BC hulls, and a third for BS/sub-cap hulls? I see it as the best way to prevent weird setup no one tought about to eventually appearing and being overpowered... Most of what I could see from those presentation sheets appeared to be around Cruiser/BC size, the largest may have been BS class though. The smallest may have been Destroyers, but then they'd be pretty massive for a destroyer. We'll have to wait and see I suppose, but to be honest I can't wait.
sg3s Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:33:00 - [28] Originally by: Amy Wang Originally by: sg3s So? If someone makes an overpowered setup, you build one to counter it... A truly overpowered setup is per definition something that has no real counter except bringing more of the same setup. You know, like nano-ships had no counter...oh wait Well, case in point, if you think people will bother building a counter instead of just whining on the forums to get it nerfed you dont "get" Eve I suppose on topic: From what I understand I think there will be one ship only per race but depending on what kind of components you stick on it will be a different ship size class (measured in sig radius for lack of better way I suppose), e.g. you stick on a big capacitor unit, a big weapon battery and huge armor section and you get a ship comparable to BS size, you stick on tiny components for cap, armor and weapons but a strong propulsion system and you get an inty, etc the true number of combinations will depend on how many different building blocks are available for each of the five sections obviously and I agree, while it is a truely innovative idea it will be hard to balance Don't worry, I 'get' eve... The weak whine while the strong will do some out-of-the-box thinking to make solutions to problems, adapt or die. It's about time I put something sensible in here, but I couldn't really come up with something so you'l have to do with this. Are you like really bored, or did you not notice this is my sig?

CCP Mephysto	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:43:00 - [29] Originally by: Shadowsword Thanks for the answer. Another big question: On the screenshot we see every part for caldari ships, and 5 example of completed ships given. But, it seem to indicate that they'll all be more or less similar in size. And I could see how it would be fairly wierd to have a ship with 3 interceptor parts and 2 BS part carring torps and going 3km/sec. So, is T3 going to be divided by classes? One class with 25 parts for frig/destroyer hulls, another for cruiser/BC hulls, and a third for BS/sub-cap hulls? I see it as the best way to prevent weird setup no one tought about to eventually appearing and being overpowered... Sorry, I dont know this one. As I said, I havent seen the designs yet.

Deva Blackfire D00M.	Posted - 2008.11.09 12:46:00 - [30] Originally by: Meiyang Lee Most of what I could see from those presentation sheets appeared to be around Cruiser/BC size, the largest may have been BS class though. The smallest may have been Destroyers, but then they'd be pretty massive for a destroyer. Well destroyers are as big as cruisers and some are even bigger.
ElCoCo KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.09 13:02:00 - [31] Originally by: Deva Blackfire Nonono - in this game raven must kill everything. Even in npcing setup. I've always wondered why the tractor beam doesn't work on nano ships! If it did then noone would whine about them and we'd still have them. Tractor beam the vagabond pointing you down, fire up the salvage module and instant destruction! Boink!
Kweel Nakashyn Minmatar Aeden	Posted - 2008.11.09 15:56:00 - [32] Originally by: Chribba What about ORE ships, faction ships? I saw what you did there, Chribba :) Fetchez la vache !
Avalira Caldari Tau Ceti Green Card Free Trade Zone.	Posted - 2008.11.09 16:40:00 - [33] Originally by: Chribba What about ORE ships, faction ships? Knowing CCP they'll probably only release for the 4 main factions then say "hey, it would be a good idea to add even MOAR... for the next expansion". But seriously, I truly hope that they will think about other factions too... would be awesome. Originally by: CCP Tuxford Its been fixed. All in all its one of the more embarrassing mistakes I made, but it made game design laugh. Now lets never speak of this again.
Illwill Bill Genos Occidere	Posted - 2008.11.09 16:49:00 - [34] Anyone know if it will be possible to set up POS's in the new systems? And will it be possible to take sovereignty over them?

CCP Nozh C C P	Posted - 2008.11.09 17:20:00 - [35] There have been talks about having the "base" ships consists of 5 "tier 0" components. Then having an additional 5 tiers of components resulting in 6^5 = 7776 unique combinations. No joke, just some confusion. Nozh Game Designer CCP Games

StinkFinger Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2008.11.09 17:45:00 - [36] will there be any role for t1 or t2 blueprints in the composition of t3 ships/items? Originally by: Karanth That's like sitting on your hand till it goes numb, so it's like a stranger. It's not as satisfying, and I'LL know the difference.
Tiuwaz Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force	Posted - 2008.11.09 17:52:00 - [37] Originally by: CCP Nozh There have been talks about having the "base" ships consists of 5 "tier 0" components. Then having an additional 5 tiers of components resulting in 6^5 = 7776 unique combinations. No joke, just some confusion. May i hump your leg in anticipation kind sir? It sounds awesome and i have no doubts it will prove even more depth to Eve. The only thing i am curious about if there will be several sizes available or if there will only be 1 size availabe for the time being (and if which size that would be). Havent found any info about that. Anyone knows something in regard to that? ___________________________________
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2008.11.09 17:58:00 - [38] What I don't understand is this: Are these 3125 combinations just different graphics of the same ship, or will we able to have some design on the 'inner values' of ships also like different slot layouts, shields, armour, cap, recharge rates, ship bonus etc.? If these we can only design the hulls but no 'inner' values would be fixed, well then it is a nice graphics thing, but really not that an important change. If we will be able to design the 'inner' values (slot layouts, tanks etc.) then how will it be balanced? Will there are some calibration points for high slots for example and each missile laucher costs a certain amount of points, each turret costs some points and so on?
Neth'Rae Gallente Decorum Inc Tygris Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.09 18:18:00 - [39] Edited by: Neth''Rae on 09/11/2008 18:18:59 Edited by: Neth''Rae on 09/11/2008 18:18:48 Originally by: Gnulpie will we able to have some design on the 'inner values' of ships also like different slot layouts, shields, armour, cap, recharge rates, ship bonus etc.? Yes. And I guess there will be some popular cookiecutter builds emerging :P I do Sigs, Banners and other Graphics for ISK.
Tippia Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2008.11.09 18:33:00 - [40] Originally by: Illwill Bill Anyone know if it will be possible to set up POS's in the new systems? And will it be possible to take sovereignty over them? They said POSes would be a possibility — in essence, they're just like any other system (only displaced in space and tiiiiiime), except that they don't have any normal jumpgates leading to them. Instead, you have to rely on the unstable wormholes…
Saint Lazarus Spiorad ag fanaiocht	Posted - 2008.11.09 18:57:00 - [41] Originally by: Arthur Frayn Originally by: Dahin Originally by: Chribba What about ORE ships, faction ships? We've repeatedly told you. Noone cares about things that don't run missions in empire. When will you ever get it? We don't even care about people running missions outside the empire, so GTFO. You're new here, aren't you? haha lawl at someone tellin Chribba to GTFO ----------------- My EvE Comic
digitalwanderer Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.11.09 19:03:00 - [42] Nice,i'l be able to fly all T3 ships,for all races,by the time they're out....
Nyphur Pillowsoft	Posted - 2008.11.09 19:15:00 - [43] Originally by: CCP Nozh There have been talks about having the "base" ships consists of 5 "tier 0" components. Then having an additional 5 tiers of components resulting in 6^5 = 7776 unique combinations. No joke, just some confusion. How do you plan to avoid "golden pathing"? If you give people thousands of combinations, they'll quickly discover the optimum setups as they've done with ship module layouts and 90% of people will stick to a handful of setups. What's being done to combat this or is it actually seen as a positive aspect of the system? EVE-Tanking.com - Helping you keep your hull in-tact.
royal killer Amarr Shadows Of The Federation	Posted - 2008.11.09 19:35:00 - [44] Originally by: Dahin Originally by: Chribba What about ORE ships, faction ships? We've repeatedly told you. Noone cares about things that don't run missions in empire. When will you ever get it? We don't even care about people running missions outside the empire, so GTFO. Btw, that "wormhole" thingie kept screaming 'instancing' in my ear. Oh dear god... Dude stfu, you do not talk like that to Chribba -------------------- ding ding! Wrangler: Hello and w ding ding! Wrangler: ...damn nanowhiners.
Constantinee Caldari Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams	Posted - 2008.11.09 19:56:00 - [45] christ just release the skillset needed already so i can get crackalaken on getting into one of these!!! -------------------- My Videos.
Faraelle Brightman Gallente Placid Reborn	Posted - 2008.11.09 22:29:00 - [46] Originally by: Deva Blackfire Well destroyers are as big as cruisers and some are even bigger. Destroyers, for most game purposes, are considered to be most comparable to frigates (i.e. you can fly a destroyer though a acceleration gate that's configured for frigates but you can't fly a cruiser through it). They're just above a frigate's size and durability with 8 weapon slots cramed onto it. ----------------------- "Every once in a while, declare peace. It confuses the hell out of your enemies."
Ris Dnalor Minmatar Ex Cruoris Libertas	Posted - 2008.11.09 22:51:00 - [47] Originally by: Constantinee christ just release the skillset needed already so i can get crackalaken on getting into one of these!!! this. no... THIS.
Deva Blackfire D00M.	Posted - 2008.11.09 23:03:00 - [48] Originally by: Faraelle Brightman Originally by: Deva Blackfire Well destroyers are as big as cruisers and some are even bigger. Destroyers, for most game purposes, are considered to be most comparable to frigates (i.e. you can fly a destroyer though a acceleration gate that's configured for frigates but you can't fly a cruiser through it). They're just above a frigate's size and durability with 8 weapon slots cramed onto it. OHGOD THANK YOU After 4 years of playing someone at least managed to explain me what they are used for! /sarcasm I was talking about ship model ffs. Know well enough what they are supposed to do and why they are bad at their own role...
Dr Slaughter Minmatar Rabies Inc.	Posted - 2008.11.09 23:06:00 - [49] Originally by: CCP Mephysto Actually, you have 12k combinations. 5^5x4 races I pity the authors of EFT ~~~~ There is no parody in this thread. Honest.
Shard Merchant Minmatar	Posted - 2008.11.09 23:10:00 - [50] Destroyers are supposed to be extremely anti-frigate, while being vulnerable to cruisers. They suck at that role because cruisers/battlecruisers can do the job pretty well. If EVE ever gets classed warfare, then pretty much every destroyer model gets a boost.
Elea Electronica Gallente Dragon Enterprises	Posted - 2008.11.09 23:45:00 - [51] hm did Chribba now getting a Pink Veld Mining Dread :)
soldieroffortune 258 Gallente Trinity Council	Posted - 2008.11.10 02:01:00 - [52] Quote: The unnamed expansion will introduce "Tech 3" modular ship designs, branching epic mission arcs, further improvements to the new player experience, and exploration of uncharted space through unstable wormholes man, screw tech 3 ships, i want to know more about THIS MORE MOOOOOORE Originally by: soldieroffortune 258 "*Eve is about making yourself richer while making the other guy poorer*"
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2008.11.10 03:12:00 - [53] Originally by: Shard Merchant Destroyers are supposed to be extremely anti-frigate, while being vulnerable to cruisers. They suck at that role because cruisers/battlecruisers can do the job pretty well. If EVE ever gets classed warfare, then pretty much every destroyer model gets a boost. have you seen the changes to speed resently? cruisers are not the anti-frigate any more.
Daan Sai Polytrope	Posted - 2008.11.10 06:56:00 - [54] Originally by: Meiyang Lee Originally by: Glasyra 7776 possable ship types comes from fanfest key note speeker, when asked why that number he said "I like it". Honestly 7776 was a joke, the final number of custom mods is still up in the air. 3125 was mentioned as the current number of options available, however the number may be reduced for technical and balance reasons before release. The 7776 was indeed a joke, and as the person explaining all this said "it made no sense". Could make sense really: 5^5 = 3125 = 5 module types, 5 levels each 6^5 = 7776 = 5 module types, 6 levels each Probably just decided to drop a level to save complexity a bit, plus they are probably going to have to impose some fitting restrictions so we won't really be able to get nearly this many practical combos.
Kuolematon Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United	Posted - 2008.11.10 08:01:00 - [55] Originally by: sg3s So? If someone makes an overpowered setup, you whine at forums for nerf to counter it... Fixed it for you. "The Amarr are the tanking and ganking floating rods of ~~gold~~crap"
sg3s Battlestars GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.11.10 08:05:00 - [56] Originally by: Kuolematon Originally by: sg3s So? If someone makes an overpowered setup, you build one to counter it... Fixed it for you. Oh no you didn't. It's about time I put something sensible in here, but I couldn't really come up with something so you'l have to do with this. Are you like really bored, or did you not notice this is my sig?
Kuolematon Space Perverts and Forum Warriors United	Posted - 2008.11.10 10:38:00 - [57] Originally by: sg3s Originally by: Kuolematon Originally by: sg3s So? If someone makes an overpowered setup, you whine about it on forums to counter it... Fixed it for you. Oh no you didn't. Oh yes I did. Now stfu. "The Amarr are the tanking and ganking floating rods of ~~gold~~crap"
Pikkuhukka Caldari Enterprise Estonia	Posted - 2008.11.10 10:43:00 - [58] Edited by: Pikkuhukka on 10/11/2008 10:45:35 Edited by: Pikkuhukka on 10/11/2008 10:44:45 all i want to know is : WHAT SKILLS DO I NEED TO FLY T3 SHIPS. not to mention the modules. (no i dont want to know what skills do i need to in order to _fly_ the modules, to use them, for you smartas***) so i can know what to train, is it so damn hard, frack.
Meiyang Lee Gallente Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2008.11.10 11:01:00 - [59] I'd say the relevant racial ship skill to level 5, but probably some new skills for assembling the modular sections into a ship you can actually fly. We'll just have to wait for the skills/ships to show up on SiSi to find out.
Deva Blackfire D00M.	Posted - 2008.11.10 11:09:00 - [60] I wonder if build skills will be separate from flight skills. So actually there can be "industry boost"...
Nekopyat	Posted - 2008.11.10 17:07:00 - [61] My big question about T3 is what it will take to assemble these ships? Is this going to be something anyone can do in their hanger at no notice (essentially like modules and rigs) or something that will require specialized skills/manufacturing lines/etc? And how will this tie into blueprints? Will T3 configurations be packaged into a blueprint for manufacturing?
Meiyang Lee Gallente Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2008.11.10 17:17:00 - [62] Originally by: Nekopyat My big question about T3 is what it will take to assemble these ships? Is this going to be something anyone can do in their hanger at no notice (essentially like modules and rigs) or something that will require specialized skills/manufacturing lines/etc? And how will this tie into blueprints? Will T3 configurations be packaged into a blueprint for manufacturing? I'm going to pull out a Crystal Ball here and guess that you can create/find/research BPCs for the ship modules and that with the right skills you can assemble those into ships. (those skills may not be required to fly them, which could give ship-builders a boost) Fully assembled ships will probably be available through the Store Fronts they'll hopefully have finished by then. If a player has the necessary assembly skills to patch together a ship from modules, then purchasing the individual components is also an option. But as I said, just guessing here, we'll have to wait for CCP to deploy the stuff to SiSi or a Dev Blog before we get the first reliable glimpses at how T3 will work in detail.
Prometheous Light	Posted - 2008.11.15 22:27:00 - [63] Edited by: Prometheous Light on 15/11/2008 22:28:43 I think that this will add a substancial dimension to the game. We can already customise our modules, and to an extent modify the basic attributes of our ships, ie speed, power grid etc, but it confused me as to why when you purchase a ship it already had systems pre installed into it. I guess it may be because of technical limitations of the game. By providing these aditional modules it will make the game significantly more varied, and more varied means more server calculations. Or to make it easier to create ships, which I agree with at least for new players but not for more experianced players. And it will be interesting how modules combine. At least in my opinion, for example, when you purchase a hull of a ship it may have an aerodynamic attribute from its design, which partly determines speed, and an agility attribute from its engine mountings, which partly determines how fast you turn, and then you have to combine the hull with a choice of engines, each with unique thrust and agility attributes to create strengths and weaknesses. These would combine and determine your overall maximum speed and maximum agility, however this is reduced as you add more modules, which adds more weight to your ship. This would make customising your ship a much more involved process from the ground up, however I agree with previous posts that modules will have to be limited to certain ship so that battleship class modules do not end up on frigates, which is simple enough to do by classifying the modules to a particular class of ship. Another more interesting method would be to give the hull a total volume limit, and the modules volume requirements, and then if people are silly and place an oversized engine onto their ship, clearly out of their class, it will leave very little space for any other items. Another feature I would like to see is an overhaul of the properties system for modules. I find that, for example, the Optimal Range, and Accuratcy Falloff properties for weapons so inadequate having unrealistic FIXED values, even if they are calculated in more detail on the server. I would like so see a graph detailing the weapons range and accuratcy, so I can see that at 5km my accuratcy is 87%, but at 10km if falls to 13%, and that at 3km its damage is twice that at 5km. This will allow people to customise their ships to match their styles of fighting. Another perfect example is for the asteroid mining modules. The description for all of the modules are inadequate, and as someone with little experiance with them I have no idea what the difference between them is, and the only way to find out would be to experiment. The only thing you can tell from looking at them are things like range, cpu usage, power useage, but it would be more useful to have clearer descriptions so that if one could mine a certain ore, but not a different ore, then you could see without purchasing it and testing it out. It may seem like I complain a bit, but trueth be told I do love EVE, and while these are my ideas, and thusly (C) to me, I am just suggesting things that would make it more enjoyable to play. And while others may not like the ideas, or if there are better ones out there, or if there are limitations on the servers, then I understand, but if it could be done, why not?
Kayosoni Caldari Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.11.15 23:18:00 - [64] Originally by: CCP Mephysto No, Wormholes and the systems they lead to are not instances. can black ops jump bridge to them or is this a titans only thing? -----------------------------------
Rivur'Tam Fatality.	Posted - 2008.11.15 23:32:00 - [65] No i think you will have to find them like u do rader sites etc. .. I like teh secs and teh boobies
Kazuo Ishiguro House of Marbles Zzz	Posted - 2008.11.15 23:46:00 - [66] Originally by: Nyphur How do you plan to avoid "golden pathing"? If you give people thousands of combinations, they'll quickly discover the optimum setups as they've done with ship module layouts and 90% of people will stick to a handful of setups. What's being done to combat this or is it actually seen as a positive aspect of the system? Several ways they could easily do it: 1. Make the best ones much rarer/more expensive, so that most of the time people don't have to worry about encountering them. 2. Rock-paper-scissors; make sure that each trait can reliably defeat at least one other trait and reliably defeated by one other trait. 3. Severe stacking penalties, so that a highly skewed ship is weaker overall than a more balanced one. --- Can't afford that BPO? Look here. 20:1 mineral compression The EVE f@h team
Rolly Polly 20th Legion	Posted - 2008.11.15 23:51:00 - [67] There would have to be some sort of time delay for swapping sections out on a ship, perhaps a short stay in a shipyard or assembley array to stop people from being able to produce ships to act as perfect counters in whatever situation they're in at the drop of a hat.
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue	Posted - 2008.11.16 00:07:00 - [68] Originally by: Rolly Polly There would have to be some sort of time delay for swapping sections out on a ship, perhaps a short stay in a shipyard or assembley array to stop people from being able to produce ships to act as perfect counters in whatever situation they're in at the drop of a hat. Hopefully ship modules will act like rigs, you can remove them, but if you do, they're destroyed.
Typhado3 Minmatar Ashen Lion Mining and Production Consortium Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.11.16 01:06:00 - [69] Edited by: Typhado3 on 16/11/2008 01:13:21 7776 = 6^5 imo most likely you'll see about 20-50 of those combinations regularly used some just won't work (or won't work in a way worth the *** mil isk u spent on it) others will be more specialist that individual pilots will have to work out for themselves and you will get into a case of you reeaaally have nfi what that guy is flying and how it works. damn it nozh beat me to 6^5 =s and I had to work it out from scratch.
Max Hardcase Art of War Exalted.	Posted - 2008.11.16 09:38:00 - [70] I wonder why we need a new tier of materials just to make some ships, I mean we already have a 2 layered tier of materials to make em with. Invention required to make the parts, sure by all means but yet more materials ? T3 invention of parts to build the ship components from makes more sense. Might also do include some of the less used salvage components.
Freyya GeoCorp. Paxton Federation	Posted - 2008.11.16 10:30:00 - [71] One thing i'm wondering; Are there any transcipts around that detail EXACTLY what was said by the devs at fanfest? I've seen a couple of vids but i didn't get the complete picture of them so i would like to read (or see vids of high quality) about this in detail.
djenghis jan Amarr 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2008.11.16 10:38:00 - [72] This feature is truly great suppose you can make a hauler which is actually a super armored drone carrier complete with interdiction sphere and web. That would be cool :-)
ThaDollaGenerale The Priory	Posted - 2008.11.16 11:38:00 - [73] Quote: However, I dont believe you'll be able to put amarr components on a caldari hull etc. though. (I havent seen the designs, so anything I say should be treated as hearsay. or possibly heresy.) That would be epicly awesome.

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