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Do Sensor Dampeners need buffing?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Mister Kwong State War Academy Caldari State 6	Posted - 2012.04.09 18:29:00 - [1] - Quote I've heard that they are underwhelming. I will be training for Gallente recon and would like to hear from others
FT Diomedes Factio Paucorum 33	Posted - 2012.04.09 18:31:00 - [2] - Quote No, but the ships that specialize in them do need buffing.
Biced Mnt N' Dew. 8	Posted - 2012.04.09 18:34:00 - [3] - Quote FT Diomedes wrote: No, but the ships that specialize in them do need buffing. this and target painters as well.
Liang Nuren Parsec Flux 1496	Posted - 2012.04.09 18:35:00 - [4] - Quote I don't bother using damps on damp specialized ships. Why would you? -Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
Traejun DiSanctis School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State 2	Posted - 2012.04.09 18:58:00 - [5] - Quote Biced wrote: FT Diomedes wrote: No, but the ships that specialize in them do need buffing. this and target painters as well. Painters are ok...not great, but functional. I notice a difference when I'm firing at ships one size-tier below the appropriate size for the missiles I'm using (i.e. Cruise missiles vs. BC's). Beyond that - gotta pack at least 2 to notice a difference. Nonetheless, they serve their purpose and they do so in at least a serviceable fashion.
Biced Mnt N' Dew. 8	Posted - 2012.04.09 19:07:00 - [6] - Quote Liang Nuren wrote: I don't bother using damps on damp specialized ships. Why would you? -Liang damp logis and falcons.
Arzaiuc The Screaming MONKJACKS GekkoState. 2	Posted - 2012.04.09 19:13:00 - [7] - Quote Damps are good against the following ships: -Interceptors That is all.
Mister Kwong State War Academy Caldari State 6	Posted - 2012.04.09 20:04:00 - [8] - Quote So how much buffing do they need then? And why are they considered underpowered atm?
Lost Greybeard Fenrir's Dogs of War Union 0f Revolution 4	Posted - 2012.04.09 20:40:00 - [9] - Quote Arzaiuc wrote: Damps are good against the following ships: -Interceptors That is all. In theory, with the Arazu you can point from, what, 40k with just ship command skills? You could probably damp a cruiser or an overconfident BS with a close-in setup down below that as well. But yeah, for general use they're not very good on un-bonused ships.
Kattshiro Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 52	Posted - 2012.04.09 20:43:00 - [10] - Quote Would make sense if most fighting didn't occur with in point and web range...
Arzaiuc The Screaming MONKJACKS GekkoState. 3	Posted - 2012.04.09 20:52:00 - [11] - Quote Mister Kwong wrote: So how much buffing do they need then? And why are they considered underpowered atm? They could be buffed up to 150% of their current strength and be good. The problem is that either you have enough damp to render the target useless (like an ECM on crack) or don't have enough damp to render the target useless (in which case the damps are completely pointless). Against 90% of ships, even a dedicated recon ship can't damp more than 1 target effectively. A non-recon damp ship can't damp anything effectively.
Pulgy Shadows Of The Federation Drunk 'n' Disorderly 53	Posted - 2012.04.09 20:53:00 - [12] - Quote Clearly no one in this thread has tried using damps against nano/alpha ships, let alone logistic ships but shhh don't tell anyone. No range? No problem!Join the Church of the Holy BlasterGäó . A Hybrid religion.
Katalci Creative Cookie Procuring Veto Corp 49	Posted - 2012.04.10 06:33:00 - [13] - Quote Load the scan resolution script, damp logis and suddenly you have a lot more effective alpha.
Darthewok Perkone Caldari State 49	Posted - 2012.04.10 06:45:00 - [14] - Quote Damps will be readjusted with ship balancing, but expect to wait 9999999999 years for it. CAVEAT RICHARDUS VOLVERE - YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0
Baneken Hyvat Pahat ja Eric The Polaris Syndicate 99	Posted - 2012.04.10 06:47:00 - [15] - Quote You can also grief a lone BS with keres/arazu/lach by keeping it damped down to less then 30km targeting range while having +30km disruptor. So yeah damps have some uses but all in all they could be less situational as it is they are mostly useless against anything that is medium sized with MWD fitted, unless the dampening ship has buddies with him.
X Gallentius Quantum Cats Syndicate Villore Accords 154	Posted - 2012.04.10 15:50:00 - [16] - Quote Damps has its place. 1. Mid range engagements. Damp the opponent to below your optimal engagement range (usually near 40 km). 2. Anti-logi. Scan res scripts keep logi from locking targeted ship in time to apply reps. 3. **** off e-war/kiters in general by breaking their locks at longer ranges. What it doesn't do well is damp down opponents to an engageent range where Gallente blasters can be effective. Most of the time the target ship is damped down to a range outside of blaster effective range. So it can still point the Gallente hull and be immune to any damage.
MeBiatch Republic University Minmatar Republic 254	Posted - 2012.04.10 17:05:00 - [17] - Quote the problem with damps pre stacking/scripting nerfs was they were op... everyone used them including your grandma... imo ships like the arazu/lach could get the bonus upped to like 7.5% effectiveness per lev... but i would like to see damps also decrease max targets... so one tech I damp on an unbonused ship will reduce max target by 0.5 and a tech II by 1 then on a bonused ship tech I = 1 tech II = 1.5 this could make gal ewar pretty interesting as you would have less targets to choose from plus would make logi pilots job even harder... plus it would make the current rock paper scissors game we have more interesting... edit plus it would make the low slot sensor enhancer usefull as it add max locked targets which would be imune to the sensor damp so you could atleast target two ships...
Zyress Caldari Provisions Caldari State 49	Posted - 2012.04.10 17:12:00 - [18] - Quote I use a couple meta 4 Damps on my Stealth Bomber
Dark Pangolin Snuff Box 64	Posted - 2012.04.10 18:38:00 - [19] - Quote Pulgy wrote: Clearly no one in this thread has tried using damps against nano/alpha ships, let alone logistic ships but shhh don't tell anyone. ^ This
Reppyk The Black Shell 93	Posted - 2012.04.10 23:09:00 - [20] - Quote The 2 buffs I would like to see is one for the rig (and for the td too). Since damps/tds can use a script, the rig gives a very small bonus to both. The sensor booster for example, has 2 different rigs. And... Damp/td/painter overload please.
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative. 3301	Posted - 2012.04.11 14:34:00 - [21] - Quote FT Diomedes wrote: No, but the ships that specialize in them do need buffing. Exactly. (and also the gang link bonuses) Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players. Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Roime Shiva Furnace 455	Posted - 2012.04.11 14:56:00 - [22] - Quote CCP Soundwave has stated exactly the same. They will look at the damping ships, he didn't specify when, but I wouldn't be surprised if they got fixed already in Inferno.
Mister Kwong State War Academy Caldari State 7	Posted - 2012.04.11 14:57:00 - [23] - Quote Malcanis wrote: FT Diomedes wrote: No, but the ships that specialize in them do need buffing. Exactly. (and also the gang link bonuses) What other buffing do the T2 Gallente recons need? They already get a 5% bonus to Remote Sensor Dampener effectiveness per level. Unless you think they need a higher bonus? Can you be more specific about the gang link bonuses? I will consider putting this up on Assembly Hall once I get more information. Gallente can be more relevant especially with all these sniping Tier 3 gangs running around
Roime Shiva Furnace 456	Posted - 2012.04.11 15:25:00 - [24] - Quote Yes, higher bonus is needed. 7,5-10% at least imo. Probably even higher for the T2 ships. Not directly comparable of course, but Falcon gets a whopping 30% per level to ECM strength. Main point here is to make damping multiple targets a viable option, and also damp targets enough to force them closer to blaster range. I find it also a bit awkward that the Gallente recons somehow don't have the best drone capabilities.
FT Diomedes Factio Paucorum 40	Posted - 2012.04.12 02:23:00 - [25] - Quote I agree that those ships need a higher bonus to damps as their buff. Something that could make them a force multiplier on the dampening front would be awesome. I would love to see the information warfare links get some love too.
Trinkets friend Sudden Buggery 290	Posted - 2012.04.12 02:52:00 - [26] - Quote I've done the math on this before, in other threads, but basically it breaks down to this: You need 4 bonused damps to knock a Drake's targeting range down far enough it becomes putty in your hands. Ergo, you deploy a single Lachesis to knock out one ship. Compare to a Falcon which can effectively permajam multiple targets. Your sensor damps with res scripts can make life hell for BS's. But as for damping off Logis? Only if the Logi is actually working to rep sig-tanking AHACs or other low-sig targets. Versus a BS, a Lachesis full of res damps turns a Logi's lock time from 1.2s to...2.3s. Hardly a difference considering you are blowing a full rack of mids on a single Logi. Same for their lock range; you take them down from 70km+ to around 30km by using 4 scripted damps. The buff damps need is to around 10% per level to effectiveness (in real terms, 2.1%). Eg, right now an Imicus gets 21% range dampening on a SD. Lachesis gets 26.1% at level 5. Wow, more power to the guy who spend 4 weeks getting recon ships to 5. At 10% per level you would have a base range dampening modifier of 30.5%. You could affect these various ships thusly, with one unscripted dampener: Drake - 72km -> 50.4km (still greater than your dissy range of 40km) Cane - 56km --> 39km (whee! it works) Abbadon - 100 --> 70km (ruh roh) Scripting the dampener would then result in zomg awesome dampening, but even if you double it to 60% effectiveness per damp your Abbadon without a SeBo would be able to shoot a Lachesis which was pointing it. Etcetera. Right now, damps are effective only versus T1 cruisers, a couple of BC's (eg, Cyclone, Brutix, Prophecy) and frigates. The skilful employer of men will employ the wise man, the brave man, the covetous man, and the stupid man. Sun Tzu https://twitter.com/#/trinketsfriend
FT Diomedes Factio Paucorum 41	Posted - 2012.04.12 03:13:00 - [27] - Quote Trinkets friend wrote: Good stuff Good post.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 6025	Posted - 2012.04.12 03:17:00 - [28] - Quote FT Diomedes wrote: No, but the ships that specialize in them do need buffing. Not empty-quoting. Making damps universally better would make them horribly annoying, but right now, they're universally horrid, including on the ships where they are supposed to be really goodGÇª and that's a problem. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants.
SuccessfulBlackMan SBM Republic University Minmatar Republic 3	Posted - 2012.04.12 05:02:00 - [29] - Quote Back then, Damps were overpowered and just like ECM was put on every ship. Unlike ECM where things are chance based, Damps will work 100% of the time within their optimal range. So you can't buff damps too much otherwise you'll just turn it into another ECM.
FT Diomedes Factio Paucorum 41	Posted - 2012.04.12 05:07:00 - [30] - Quote SuccessfulBlackMan SBM wrote: Back then, Damps were overpowered and just like ECM was put on every ship. Unlike ECM where things are chance based, Damps will work 100% of the time within their optimal range. So you can't buff damps too much otherwise you'll just turn it into another ECM. Right, this is why it is necessary to buff the ships that specialize in Damps - just as the ECM ships were specialized.
Hrett Quantum Cats Syndicate Villore Accords 54	Posted - 2012.04.12 05:49:00 - [31] - Quote With all of the t3 snipers around, damps have some new utility. And I think a single scripted damp from a bonused ship on a cane/drake/T3 BC cuts their targeting range to the 30-40k range - essentially nerfing them in nano fights and forces them into tackle range. I agree that the bonused ships need their bonus bumped, but damps arent useless in those fights. And the bonused ships also need a cap usage reduction bonus. Those things eat cap like it is going out of style.
Baneken Hyvat Pahat ja Eric The Polaris Syndicate 99	Posted - 2012.04.12 06:18:00 - [32] - Quote With the upcoming on-grid-warp-drives dampening is bound to get more interesting.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts 255	Posted - 2012.04.12 10:53:00 - [33] - Quote Trinkets friend wrote: I've done the math on this before, in other threads, but basically it breaks down to this: Versus a BS, a Lachesis full of res damps turns a Logi's lock time from 1.2s to...2.3s. Hardly a difference considering you are blowing a full rack of mids on a single Logi. Same for their lock range; you take them down from 70km+ to around 30km by using 4 scripted damps. Try doing the maths again, because this is completely wrong. Or train some skills and stop using T1 mods, I dunno. Base Guardian locktime on Abaddon: 1.2 s With 1, 2 and 3 Lachesis damps: 3.8 s, 7.0 s and 10.1 s. Abaddon base lock range: 81.3 km With 1, 2 and 3 Lachesis damps: 38.1 km, 20.5 km and 14.3 km. Add a link Proteus (and why not? Everyone has link Lokis these days...) and these become 5.0 s, 11.3 s and 17.8 s, and 29.0 km, 12.8 km and 8.1 km.
Shpenat Pafos Technologies 8	Posted - 2012.04.12 12:49:00 - [34] - Quote Gypsio III wrote: Trinkets friend wrote: I've done the math on this before, in other threads, but basically it breaks down to this: Versus a BS, a Lachesis full of res damps turns a Logi's lock time from 1.2s to...2.3s. Hardly a difference considering you are blowing a full rack of mids on a single Logi. Same for their lock range; you take them down from 70km+ to around 30km by using 4 scripted damps. Try doing the maths again, because this is completely wrong. Or train some skills and stop using T1 mods, I dunno. Base Guardian locktime on Abaddon: 1.2 s With 1, 2 and 3 Lachesis damps: 3.8 s, 7.0 s and 10.1 s. Abaddon base lock range: 81.3 km With 1, 2 and 3 Lachesis damps: 38.1 km, 20.5 km and 14.3 km. Add a link Proteus (and why not? Everyone has link Lokis these days...) and these become 5.0 s, 11.3 s and 17.8 s, and 29.0 km, 12.8 km and 8.1 km. Interesting is that neither of you are completely correct nor completely wrong. Trinkets friend took into account only recon lvl IV (with presumed 10% bonus) and probably lvl V in Signal suppression. No script applied. He applied it to the ship with lvl V long range targeting Gypsio III took into account all current bonuses, so 100% from script, 25% from recon V and 25% from signal suppression. But applied it to the ship with no skills applied. So in reality, current state with all lvl V lachesis vs all lvl V abaddon is (1-(0.1721.251.25))100=46.8km locking range on abaddon. With proposed 10% bonus it will became (1-(0.1721.51.25))100=36.25km. All of that is without rigs. against falcon with 150km lock range the ranges are 70km and 54km (ergo right now putting single damp on falcon which sits at 70km does nothing) taking rigs into account we can go down to 39km and 27km lock range on abaddon and 50km respective 40km on falcon. In my opinion giving bonused ships 10% per lvl would be a good move. dont forget that those calculations were done for scripted damps. SO the locking speed is unaffected.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts 255	Posted - 2012.04.12 12:52:00 - [35] - Quote Shpenat wrote: Gypsio III took into account all current bonuses, so 100% from script, 25% from recon V and 25% from signal suppression. But applied it to the ship with no skills applied. oh dear Well spotted, I'll update my post. :facepalm: I'll also add in basic gang bonuses to the ships being RSDed.

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