Dude. Your threads.

Ok, I'll play this one too. Faction guns are kind of a mixed bag. As you noted, they do slightly more damage up until spec 3, where they are overtaken by T2 guns. However, they sometimes have significant ancillary benefits of clip size (can be useful on occasion I guess), lower fitting (marginally useful, especially for tight PvE fits), and cap use (immensely useful if you're talking about tachyon beams). Their drawback, other than lower damage, is that they can't use T2 ammunition and are limited to T1/faction.

Faction launchers are more situationally useful. Rather than directly increasing damage the way faction guns do, they increase RoF (as do the launcher spec skills). However, good faction launchers will always have a higher RoF than T2 launchers at spec 5 -- and they have a higher capacity on top of that. So firing the same missiles, faction launchers always do more damage. T2 launchers of course retain the advantage of being able to fire T2 missiles, which is critical for unguided missiles and at least useful for guided missiles. So there's a real choice to be had there.

As to why? Because the spec skills are designed to work with T2. There's really nothing more to it. Faction offers an option for lower skilled players and allows tight fitting that otherwise wouldn't work -- that's the advantage.

Edit: as for that wasted expense: sell them. It's not like they depreciate. All you've done is limited your liquidity for a time.

However, making them just as good as tech II seems like a bad idea. The already have easier fitting and use less capacitor. Giving them the same or better dps than tech II just makes tech II obsolete. (And of course, make faction weapons even more pricey.)

They should be cheaper however, no more than 3 to 4 times as expensive as their tech II counterparts.

I don't think people understand how prices work in this game. Prices are set by players. Both the sellers and buyers. Given the high price of these items it's clear they work just fine as they are. Personally I always use tech 2 use I have a fitting issue.

>Faction weapons for low skilled characters

LOL

Bring the price down if they're supposed to be for noobies

Deadspace is better than T2.

Faction is more like T1.5.

Generally:
Use faction until you have the skills to use T2, use T2 until you have the ISK to use deadspace/pirate


[EDIT] Clearly some exceptions exist, but that is why I said 'generally'.

T1 faction should stay as they are. CCP should add new faction t2 mods like a Caldari Navy Cruise Missle Launcher II, or a Fed Navy Neutron Blaster II.

Only those would be able to benefit off of spec skills.

Just for badassness, a Federation Navy Stasis Webifier II (the sqeekuel).

Call me jaded I read these threads (ben brought up a few times) and think one of 3 things.

Some of the people who support or put up this idea are avoiding AWU 5 training. Its a pita, I know...but it is worth it.

Some of you need to learn to compromise on your fits. HItting cpu or pg problems with AWU 5 even....its for a reason. CCP kind of wants you to choose between tank or gank. Go uber highs slots, tank gives up some meat. Want to tank standing still....your highs or damage low slot mods need to give up some bang. Don't like this setup...bending or breaking the rule about too many fitting mods being fail an option . If what some think is fail makes you the isk per hour you want..all that matters really. YOu are flying the ship. they aren't lol.

Or some are jsut tired of selling faction ammo and ds gear pretty much buries faction gear (few exceptions ofc) and is usualluy better priced so there goes selling faction tank mods as well . Granted this is due to ccp's jacked dogtag based setup that needs to go or readjust quantity . But till that happens....yeah you can keep your tank mods pretty much. So here some are trying to make faction guns more sellable.

1. Not me: http://eveboard.com/pilot/Liang_Nuren
2. I'm more interested in the extra DPS potential that would come from faction than the fittings. This goes for both PVE and PVP - though I know some people are so risk averse they'd never use them in PVP. Doesn't mean we all are. :)
3. I don't see anything wrong with faction guns having a use. As it stands, they're totally obsolete* because they can't use faction ammo and do less DPS than T2 at Spec 4. Either way, I don't have a horse in the race because I don't have a way to produce faction guns.

* Faction tachs are actually useful because of cap use + fittings. Also, T2 ammo is much less attractive on Tachs.

-Liang

no T1 gun should be able to load T2 munition. This is what T2 guns are for.

I think the obviously solution is to apply specialization skills to all weapons of that type.

Large blaster Specialization adds 2% damage to ALL Large blasters, T1/T2/Faction/Officer. It *also* allows the use of T2 large blasters.

Keep T2 ammo for T2 turrets only!

problems solved . ..


-FM

Please provide the complete list of faction items that are WORSE than their T2 version (other than turrets of course).

Hell provide ONE example of a faction item that is WORSE than it's T2 version.

-FM