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[Proposal] Scrap T2

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Jas Dor Minmatar	Posted - 2008.12.11 17:54:00 - [1] A Resolution: The system by which T2 goods are introduced into EvE Online has become the basis for two major scandals. It seems evident that the T2 system, as currently implemented is corrupt and taints and taints all that it touches. It is therefore resolved that the system should be scrapped In order to dismantle the current T2 system, T2 BPOs should be available through the various LP stores either for Research Points, LPÆs or some combination thereof, in quantities only limited by their LP cost. All T2 components should be buildable either from moon minerals or from items available by means that can not be controlled by any one person of group (for example either from common minerals or from items found in exploration sites). CCP should adopt the policy that when an item is intended for common use amongst the player base the means and components if its manufacture shall be available in such a way that a hard limit does not exist on participation in the process. We have seen scandals arise both from the ownership of T2 BPOÆs (a limited process) and the production of T2 components (limited by moon availability). It seems self evident that, as long as a player controllable bottleneck exists on the process, scandals will continue to occur. Names, Dates, Times, Engagements, Losses, Op-Tempo or STFU!
FunzzeR Death of Virtue	Posted - 2008.12.11 20:36:00 - [2] And create a bigger scandal by turning the entire system upside down... NO
WheatGrass Aliastra	Posted - 2008.12.25 23:40:00 - [3] Edited by: WheatGrass on 25/12/2008 23:40:35 The idea is worthy of consideration. I would like to obtain T2 BPOs with LP.
Carniflex Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2009.01.08 09:29:00 - [4] I do support idea of removing T2 BPO's from game as I fully agree that system thru what they were introduced was so bad that damage done is impossible to negate in any meaningful way. Removal of T2 BPO's would be step in right direction tho.
Brian Khan StarHunt Systematic-Chaos	Posted - 2009.01.08 09:30:00 - [5]
Vlad Wormwing	Posted - 2009.01.08 09:30:00 - [6]
Tuleingel	Posted - 2009.01.08 09:31:00 - [7]
Goumindong Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.01.08 10:01:00 - [8] There are better ways to introduce t2 BPO's into the market. http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=933562
Haakelen Gallente Federation of Freedom Fighters Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2009.01.08 10:14:00 - [9] Originally by: Jas Dor All T2 components should be buildable either from moon minerals or from items available by means that can not be controlled by any one person of group (for example either from common minerals or from items found in exploration sites). Scarcity and limited supply creates a much more interesting and realistic market environment than simply giving everyone what they want. Your myopic goal to make T2 'fair' creates a million more problems than any it would 'solve'. I would argue that there isn't anything to be solved in this instance. The side effects of making high-end moon mining worthless would be massive. Completely unsupported, as this is a stupid, terrible idea.
Maldurleon	Posted - 2009.01.10 07:37:00 - [10] Seems reasonable that Empires would control T2. But I like the idea of players being able to control resources. If it gets too constricting it should be loosened but I don't hear very many people complaining.

Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2009.01.12 10:56:00 - [11] Originally by: Haakelen Originally by: Jas Dor All T2 components should be buildable either from moon minerals or from items available by means that can not be controlled by any one person of group (for example either from common minerals or from items found in exploration sites). Scarcity and limited supply creates a much more interesting and realistic market environment than simply giving everyone what they want. Your myopic goal to make T2 'fair' creates a million more problems than any it would 'solve'. I would argue that there isn't anything to be solved in this instance. The side effects of making high-end moon mining worthless would be massive. Completely unsupported, as this is a stupid, terrible idea. The scarity and limited resources should come from the material side, not by limiting the number of 'licences' that are allowed to build those items with reasonable ME level prints. And removing the T2 BPOS's or introducing free for all T2 BPO's do nothing for material side of production. Materials are fine. If you want dysp source you can always kick someone off from the moon and take it.
Haakelen Gallente Federation of Freedom Fighters Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2009.01.12 11:11:00 - [12] Originally by: Carniflex And removing the T2 BPOS's or introducing free for all T2 BPO's do nothing for material side of production. Materials are fine. If you want dysp source you can always kick someone off from the moon and take it. Which was exactly what he was saying should be removed: Originally by: Jas Dor All T2 components should be buildable either from moon minerals or from items available by means that can not be controlled by any one person of group (for example either from common minerals or from items found in exploration sites).
Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2009.01.13 09:03:00 - [13] Originally by: Haakelen Which was exactly what he was saying should be removed: Seems so. I stand corrected. Even better tho, then we are on the same wavelenght on this issue.
Annatar The Galactic Empire Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2009.01.13 23:02:00 - [14] uhm i don't get the Point. Why remove t2 BPO's? With Invention you can produce on a couple of BPC's at the same time nd by selling more stuff, get more ISk/month comparedto a singel T2 BPO. This also counts with alchemy for the High end moon minerals. (ok they don't bring the same output without immense Investions, but you can get a couple of high end moon mins) -------------------------------------------- Never argue with an Idoit, they will drag you down to their Level and beat you with experience.
Vaal Erit Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2009.01.13 23:10:00 - [15] If a CCP employee cheats to get a T2 BPO, that doesn't mean T2 BPOs are bad: it means cheating is bad. If someone exploits POS mechanics and gets free moon minerals, that doesn't mean moon minerals are bad: it means exploiting is bad. Learn2logic. T2 BPOs for LP is maybe one of the worst ideas ever. -- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2009.01.14 21:39:00 - [16] Originally by: Vaal Erit Learn2logic. T2 BPOs for LP is maybe one of the worst ideas ever. That is not logic, it's opinion ;)
Newbee	Posted - 2009.01.18 13:18:00 - [17] Edited by: Newbee on 18/01/2009 13:18:28 absolutely no support here... some people put a extreme ammount of work and isk into purchasing t2 bpos... and with invention there is a way of going into t2 production without having t2 bpos... if you dont like invention either safe isk and buy one yourself or go along and do something else with your gaming time.
Esmenet Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.18 14:20:00 - [18] Originally by: Carniflex Originally by: Vaal Erit Learn2logic. T2 BPOs for LP is maybe one of the worst ideas ever. That is not logic, it's opinion ;) More like fact.
Yarik Mendel Privateers	Posted - 2009.01.18 14:46:00 - [19] full support
Neesa Corrinne Ore Mongers	Posted - 2009.01.18 15:22:00 - [20] ANY time you bottleneck a resource in a game this tightly, someone will find a way to cheat. As the OP stated, this craptastic system has been the root of the two largest scandals in the game. I'm not sure if your method is the best way of going about it, but I completely and 100% totally support the removal of existing T2 BPO's from the game and reintroducing them through a less ******ed manner. ---------------------------------

Druegar	Posted - 2009.01.22 11:42:00 - [21] Good idea.
Bongvir	Posted - 2009.01.22 11:43:00 - [22]
Vuk Lau	Posted - 2009.01.24 10:20:00 - [23] Invention?
Kaya Divine	Posted - 2009.01.24 11:40:00 - [24] This idea have my full support.
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre Worlds End Consortium	Posted - 2009.01.24 17:01:00 - [25] I guess no one reads the news... particularly about Tech 3 coming. No Support. OP is blind and shortsighted. You can't scrap something without allowing CCP to make changes to come.


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