Obvious troll is obvious. 0/10.

This proposal will go far.

TL:DR Synposis: LP rewards consitute the largest chunk of an intelligent mission runners rewards. However the isk reward per LP is grossly different depending on which empire faction you run missions with, due to variations in the market costs of faction insignias. Two solutions are given to this problem.

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A little while ago an ex-corpmate was bragging to me about how he had, some years back, bought up the entire market stock of a particular republic fleet insignia, and then reintroduced those insignias back onto the market at a vastly inflated price. He noted that the price has still not recovered from his actions. This discussion led me to look deeper into the insignia system.

I will give one example that is representative of the situation. The price of the five different Caldari Navy Captain Insignia, with the rough cost to buy in Jita compared to the price NPC's will give for the same insignias:

Capitain I - Price in Jita: 65,000 // NPC buys at 20,000
Capitain II - Jita: 110,000 // NPC 25,000
Capitain III - Jita: 3,550,000 // NPC 30,000
Capitain IV - Jita: 40,000 // NPC 30,000
Capitain V - Jita: 70,000 // NPC 25,000

If the NPC price is taken as an intended baseline market price, and perhaps the value CCP intended them to sell for, we can see that the Captain III insignia is inflated by almost 120 times this baseline.

Looking now at the Federation Navy Tracking Computer, an item that requires a relatively modest 18,000 LP and 7,200,000 isk to claim, because the Captain III insignia is so overpriced the cost in insignias alone is 500 million isk. This is insane, and completely prices the item out of the market. They and Shadow Serpentis equivalents actually sell at around 350 mil (these are the only faction TC), so even if you had somehow collected all the tags you needed, why would you build the item? You would sell them to market, rather than actually losing money on your LP.

Putting aside clear market manipulation, the larger picture is that mission runners for one faction are at a great disadvantage compared to another faction. Another example, the price to make a Federation Navy Armor Explosive Hardener is more than the Imperial Navy Armor Explosive Hardeners sell for GÇô even though the two items are identical. For Amarr mission runners, it is possible to get up to 3000 isk/lp. A caldari mission runner can get maximum of 2000 isk/lp. My initial review of the gellente LP rewards indicate they can get less than 1000 isk/lp. I have not looked into Minmatar. Considering that LP rewards constitute the majority of a mission runners income, this situation is grossly unbalanced.

I should add at this point, that the above figures are all from buying the insignia. It may have been the intention for mission runners to collect their own insignias and use these for LP rewards. However this is generally not a good idea in the long term, and many people don't bother, as the negative impact on standings from the faction you are killing is so high. Besides, even if you do these missions, clearly there are not enough insignias to meet demand.

Under normal market conditions, the supply and demand equation would kick in, but this does not apply here. Missions are given on a random basis, so the insignia supply is limited while demand is always high GÇô what else are mission runners going to do with LP? This creates excessive price inflation and makes it an easy market to manipulate.

So, two solutions to the problem:

1 GÇô Remove insignias entirely from the LP rewards requirements.
- By far the best option, insignias are an unnecessary aspect of LP rewards that add nothing to game enjoyment, and will always be open to arbitrary market forces and manipulation. Note that I am not saying that these market fluctuations are necessarily a bad thing in themselves, but they will always lead to inbalance between the different factions and their LP mission rewards. And really, why should we have to go through a middle man to collect LP rewards?

2 GÇô Greatly lower or eliminate the negative faction standing from missions that drop insignias, give more anti-faction missions and selectively increase ships that drop specific highly inflated insignias.
- A less severe option, but would also work. However, total drops would need to be significantly higher in order to meet demand.

CCP, I hope you will take this on board and do something. I not just whining, I have run missions with Amarr for ages and get decent LP rewards, but the situation is broken. Such severe imbalances between different factions rewards is something you must want to avoid.

Thanks for reading!!

MastaRob

Eve is a PVP game period.
Whoever does not pvp doesn't know how to play eve, right? Instead of wasting time, money and tears about how to "fix" wardec, incursions etc and to be sure empire carebears do not earn more isk than peeveepeers i propose to turn safe Empire to 0.0 or better to low sec.


p.s. Be nice

Sure...right after your permabanned.

lol sure anned for what?

I answer with stupid/riduclous requests with an equally stupid riduclous request.



If you want something that outragious...then i expect an equal payment in likewise for my/our support.


Forcing people to play the game your way will never work here....if your going to do that...I demand to have you forcefully removed from the game as a fair price tag.

Permantely.

Don't like it? Then don't make stupid requests.

Thanks for your anwer. First of i dont force nothing. I think i have the right to make a proposal, if it's accepted or not thats a different story.

Now.
http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=28542

This is the Dev Blogg there it says:

"Q: How long will wars last?
A: As long as the aggressor pays every week and no one surrenders (or no surrender offer is accepted), then a war can last forever."

Q: What about corp-hopping?
A: We're adding tracking in the backend to track this. How we will then display it in game is undecided, but we do have stories in the backlog (todo list) for the character war history to show if the character left a corp at war. We also want to have it cost a little to corp-hop during a war. We're also looking into not allowing you to join a corp you've left during a war while that war is still ongoing. We're also exploring some limitations to joining and leaving a corp on the fly.

"...but if you absolutely do not want to be war decced, then the only option right now is to be in a NPC corp."

Now what? Who is forcing who?

My proposal is more serious than you think. It solves a lot of issues. Everybody can kill everybody without to have anyone declare war or to pay for it? If someone doesnt want to participate in killing he stays in a NPC Corp.

Again my proposal solves a lot of issues and CCP can invest its efforts otherway.

Stupidest, most ridiculous and least thought through proposal of all time.

-10,000,000 Internetz

Do you mind enlighten me why is it that?

For a noob corp or an industrial corp that is wardect by some griefers isn't empire turned to at least 0.4/0.0? Why not turn it for everyboddy to low sec or 0.0 and only for the wardeced corp?

"Q: How long will wars last?
A: As long as the aggressor pays every week and no one surrenders (or no surrender offer is accepted), then a war can last forever."

Pretty ironic considering your in an NPC corp yourself smartass. For someone who hates being immune to war decs you are the pinnacle of a hypocrite.

There is no argument.

Eve has a wide variety of play styles. Many many people enjoy the relative safety of highsec. I myself often use my alt to make ISK in highsec to fund my nullsec antics (he runs a small corp filled with new players that has rarely had problems with war). You will have thousands of non-pvping players and many of the pvping players unsubscribing almost instantly. The relative safety afforded in highsec is where 90% (estimated) of T1 production occurs. If you think prices for ships is high now, just imagine what it would be like with no safe place for miners.

Just imagine Jita for a moment. It would be bloody horrible chaos. War decs don't even come into it, they are such a small part of Eve compared to the vastness of high security space. New players would die instantly on undocking, or best case scenario at the exit stargate. Some players will never ever PvP, and you will take that choice from them. They wont want to play anymore, and its those carebears that fuel most of the economy, and provide the ships for us to blow each other up in. If I wrote out everything that was wrong with your suggestion, it would take me days to write it all out.

I can't believe you couldn't think of these things yourself.

It is beyond my ability to even imagine how another human being, intelligent enough to type, can think this is a good idea.

drake drake, 1) this is an alt, 2) i am at your side you just do not notice it. Read again what i wrote. ok englsh not my favorite but still.

Some arguments would be nice. thanks.

And how does that not make you an hypocritical moron again?

You detest NPC's hiding to avoid war-decs yet you use said mechanic yourself.

Seriously...get out and stay out...

I apprechiate your comments. Well this proposal shows just how ridiculous the changes in Inferno gonna be. And since this proposal do not seem to work out that will lead soon to my new proposal. "Make Empire entirely safe and scrap wardecs", i hope you gonna support it.

p.s. alt as forum alt.

Eve is a PVP game period.
Whoever does not pvp doesn't know how to play eve, right? Instead of wasting time, money and tears about how to "fix" wardec, incursions etc and to be sure empire carebears do not earn more isk than peeveepeers i propose to turn safe Empire to 0.0 or better to low sec.



Edit: Empire as we know it now should be only for NPC Corps. The moment you leave the NPC Corp you leave empire.

p.s. Be nice

I apprechiate your comments. Well this proposal shows just how ridiculous the changes in Inferno gonna be. And since this proposal do not seem to work out that will lead soon to my new proposal. "Make Empire entirely safe and scrap wardecs", i hope you gonna support it.

p.s. alt as forum alt.

Oh look a PvPer who doesn't know that Empire is about PvP as well.

As you said, EVE is about PvP. That includes the miners and missioners.

Also why don't you wait and see what CCP has for us and/or screws up with their new war dec and aggression stuff.

The proposal is to turn empire into 0.0 or low sec, except the NPC Corps. That would lead to equal rules for all.
Right now esspecially new miners think they are safe but they are not you see the tears on forums etc.




oh well you know i would be with you in that but from what i 've read they wanna do something bad more bad
Thia is my proposal instead of waitng maybe they read and think about it. I don't expect them to do it but maybe gives them (or us too) some new ideas.

There is no argument.
Eve has a wide variety of play styles. Many many people enjoy the relative safety of highsec. I myself often use my alt to make ISK in highsec to fund my nullsec antics

You will have thousands of non-pvping players and many of the pvping players unsubscribing almost instantly. The relative safety afforded in highsec is where 90% (estimated) of T1 production occurs. If you think prices for ships is high now, just imagine what it would be like with no safe place for miners.

Stupid alt is stupid

(Cause we all know you are not going to make the ship)

If OP reveals main I will endorse this.

Thank you everybody who posted an argument even against my proposal.


Some other people can't use their brains or are unable to communicate, they lack the ability to understand what a "proposal" is and to have a discution. It 's their age for sure. They should try to give an argument that supports their view and, as we know, attacking the poster instead of bringing any argument to oppose what has been posted is a sign of lacking arguments.

The proposal is to turn empire into 0.0 or low sec, except the NPC Corps. That would lead to equal rules for all. It would be a good step against griefing and bulying newer player. The war mechanings right now force the playstyle of the attacker to the defender. It also leads to easy kills. A wannabe pvper decs an indy corp knowing the indy cant fight back. A real pvper fights in 0.0 or low sec. If someone wants to pvp the low sec and the 0.0 is right next door.

Support my proposal to achive a real new gamethinking.
New players leave now more than they would leave in this scenario. They would be safe in a NPC Corp and almost every industry guy would have pvp skils or a pvp alt.

Be nice stop trolling start arguing.

My proposal is more serious than you think. It solves a lot of issues. Everybody can kill everybody without to have anyone declare war or to pay for it? If someone doesnt want to participate in killing he stays in a NPC Corp.

Again my proposal solves a lot of issues and CCP can invest its efforts otherway.

Eve is a PVP game period.
Whoever does not pvp doesn't know how to play eve, right? Instead of wasting time, money and tears about how to "fix" wardec, incursions etc and to be sure empire carebears do not earn more isk than peeveepeers i propose to turn safe Empire to 0.0 or better to low sec.



Edit: Empire as we know it now should be only for NPC Corps. The moment you leave the NPC Corp you leave empire.

p.s. Be nice

If you want to taste what this would be like from the indy pilot's perspective, jump out into sov null, with no backup, no scout, no cloak and make your jump path back to safety no less than 50 jumps.... see how long you make it before falling to a gatecamp out there. The 0.0 alliances will gladly deprive you of your ship and pod very quickly.

You state, "Eve is a PvP game."
You are wrong, "Eve is a Sandbox game everywhere but high sec"

I agree. Everywhere but starting systems should be 0.0. Newbies get 30 days of not being attackable to learn the game, skill up and find a corp. I was living in a 0.2 within days of starting the game with no such protection. It's not hard.


Fixed.

Eve is a PVP game period.



Whoever does not pvp doesn't know how to play eve, right? Instead of wasting time, money and tears about how to "fix" wardec, incursions etc and to be sure empire carebears do not earn more isk than peeveepeers i propose to turn safe Empire to 0.0 or better to low sec.



Edit: Empire as we know it now should be only for NPC Corps. The moment you leave the NPC Corp you leave empire.

p.s. Be nice

I agree. Everywhere but starting systems should be 0.0. Newbies get 30 days of not being attackable to learn the game, skill up and find a corp. I was living in a 0.2 within days of starting the game with no such protection. It's not hard.

Fixed.

Eve is a PVP game period.

I answer with stupid/riduclous requests with an equally stupid riduclous request.



If you want something that outragious...then i expect an equal payment in likewise for my/our support.


Forcing people to play the game your way will never work here....if your going to do that...I demand to have you forcefully removed from the game as a fair price tag.

Permantely.

Don't like it? Then don't make stupid requests.