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FT Cold The Scope	Posted - 2008.12.27 01:52:00 - [31] Originally by: Dantes Revenge Originally by: masternerdguy what? thats easy to get around! All you have to do is use a OCR program to identify the characters to type. Use a catcha? one problem: some of these exist that get 80% accuracy or more on catchas. You don't need it. Most game macros now integrate with the software itself and read the memory locations. The problem is that computers don't talk in puctures, they talk in code... ASCII being one of them. No doubt someone will soon find the location of the memory containing the ASCII code it's looking for and just code it into the macro to look there. Probably the best way is if you come across any macro programs for Eve, grab them and send them to CCP so they can use algortihms to specifically find them in the same way a VK finds viruses. First, no. Second, Unicode. Third, it's all yes's or no's, and the faster you learn calculus + statistics, the better more informed you will be. Fourth, I can't believe I got trolled... Now, now, now. Sounds like someone's got a case of the poor me's. If you were gonna die, you would have done it by now! Maybe you just need to realize you're gonna to have to live with intense pain
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2008.12.27 07:20:00 - [32] First, check your assumptions. How many macro miners are actually out there? Having discovered how many there are, compare their contribution to the minerals economy against people who are mining properly. Then, go figure out how many macro mission runners are out there. Would you suggest that we have to fill in a CAPTCHA every time we activate a weapon module on a hostile target? A simple solution to the perceived "macro miner" problem is to mine the rocks out from under them.
Barbara Nichole Cryogenic Consultancy Black Sun Alliance	Posted - 2008.12.27 08:26:00 - [33] Quote: Then you never have played or never will play a battle.net game. When you create your online account you have to agree to let it use "Warden" on you. This would be why I no longer play on battlenet. I don't agree with their EULA; it's an invasion of privacy regardless of whether they find anything or not.
Deturnasis	Posted - 2008.12.27 09:03:00 - [34] I thought the main problem lay with macro missioners. Why is the price of Trit so high if these awful macro miners are ruining the game?
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2008.12.27 16:45:00 - [35] It seems as if the war on Macros specifically is at a standstill--- most of the macros that mine mine ice. You have to make a specific distinction here: Macro: Repetitive tasks performed by a scripted set of instructions. "click here, wait 40 seconds, click there, repeat". Farmer: Farmers are extremely difficult to catch and take weeks(sometimes months or a year) to catch. You have to realize that 75% of "Farmers" are just kids with no life (of varying nationalities), farming missions for THEIR OWN wallets. We've all done it when low on cash. It's perfectly legal. 25% of these players, however, report to WORK and play Eve to make isk to in turn contract, market order, or gift (launder) their isk to their coordinator, which in turn gifts, contracts, or market order (launder) their isk to another coordinator, and then so on until the isk is sold through websites. 99% of the time, when stalking a suspected rmt farmer, it will become apparent within minutes that it's a real person. Bots: Bots are programs run with an AI tuned for the job they've been assigned. They use OCR, a specific set of "hooks" on the gui or loaded into ram, and a built-in "understanding" of what their world is, programmed by their creator. Macros: all mine ice now. There are a few mining ore, but not many. The greedy ones mine ice, the college kids mine ore. There is no such thing as a mission macro. None. Farmers: Too many. They are everywhere. It's why isk for USD is soooooo cheap. These are your missioners. They leave AE open for a week and usually ignore you if you steal from them. Bots: I would challenge anyone to find a working one. There was an autopilot warp to zero "bot", but it really was a macro with a few options. There was a "belt ratting bot" scheme sold on ebay, but it was bogus. There is NO SUCH THING as an Eve bot since you need the source to implement your hooks. You could reverse engineer, but you'd find nothing of value since all your client does is math. It's not CounterStrike, it's just not built that way. I'm a little off topic here, but all I'm saying is that your suggestion would only serve to annoy the real players. No one would mine!
masternerdguy Gallente Gate Control Eradication Alliance	Posted - 2008.12.27 21:27:00 - [36] personally i love macros, they flood market with cheap ore so that my stuff costs less.
AmosTrask Minmatar	Posted - 2008.12.27 23:11:00 - [37] /AmosTrask bangs head against the wall to reset cpu and clear ram. Told you we should have talked about mince pies
Safri Wolff	Posted - 2008.12.27 23:14:00 - [38] no, what they do is sell their dastardly recieved ores at a little below your prices so thiers sell first, so you drop your price below theirs and they drop again, its a vicious circle and it all leads to ****ing the genuine miner off so much that they end up changing professions. How many times have you keenly logged on monday or friday after DT to find ZILCH! no ore at all in the system...wtf? where has it gone, then you check local and see 30 or 40 odd, 4-6 random letter named chars in local, all in npc corp, all same race, style, sex and BIRTHDATE!!!.....all flying hulks and a BC sitting outside the station giving the boosts....THATS where the ore went. Petitioning CCP gets the petition closed insanely quickly with the same old crap "we will look into this" its all umgwalla-gwalla and nothing is done about it simply because CCP cant afford to lose the accounts! Tell me im wrong CCP or ban the macros. There is NO other way!!!!!
AmosTrask Minmatar	Posted - 2008.12.27 23:17:00 - [39] Originally by: Safri Wolff no, what they do is sell their dastardly recieved ores at a little below your prices so thiers sell first, so you drop your price below theirs and they drop again, its a vicious circle and it all leads to ****ing the genuine miner off so much that they end up changing professions. How many times have you keenly logged on monday or friday after DT to find ZILCH! no ore at all in the system...wtf? where has it gone, then you check local and see 30 or 40 odd, 4-6 random letter named chars in local, all in npc corp, all same race, style, sex and BIRTHDATE!!!.....all flying hulks and a BC sitting outside the station giving the boosts....THATS where the ore went. Petitioning CCP gets the petition closed insanely quickly with the same old crap "we will look into this" its all umgwalla-gwalla and nothing is done about it simply because CCP cant afford to lose the accounts! Tell me im wrong CCP or ban the macros. There is NO other way!!!!! BINGO
Concorduck Gallente	Posted - 2008.12.27 23:19:00 - [40] Macros contribuite for 52-53% of the whole tritanium market. the left 48-47% is divided equally between players and Chribba. ----------------------------------------- Originally by: Crumplecorn Contact the CSM about it, voting themselves into disbandment wouldn't be pushing the boundaries of absurdity for them.
Safri Wolff	Posted - 2008.12.28 16:42:00 - [41] quote "48-47% is divided equally between players and Chribba". Do you seriously expect us all to believe that Chribba is somehow manipulating the EvE mining market to an extent that he has a share of the roids.....you obviously havent been in Chribba's part of space.....space being the word as thats ALL there is.....space where the roids used to be, space in his dread's hold where the ore used to be.....space in everyone elses wallet where their hard earned ISK they used to buy Chribba's ore used to be.....SPACE its called! CHRIBBA'S SPACE!!!!
Shadowschild	Posted - 2008.12.28 16:57:00 - [42] it's the same song & dance in every mmo. If the game designers were not serious about botters from the very start, then it will-not-change. Okay? We are clear on the concept now?? On a side note, I would assume it's only an issue in HIGH-SEC?

Chribba Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire	Posted - 2008.12.28 18:13:00 - [43] Leave my space alone? Secure 3rd party service

FarosWarrior Amarr Sonnema	Posted - 2008.12.28 21:56:00 - [44] almost everything you will do to try and counter macro's will fail, sometimes it arent'even computers but just someone that has a 'job' with some 'company' to mine all damned day with 15 chars and then earn 1$ a day... but when countering programmes it should be possible... I think Cheers, Faros
Ocih Amarr	Posted - 2008.12.28 22:53:00 - [45] Originally by: Boris Naeb hi, i do not know how exacly works macro mining programs. Idea is to apply some veryify real preson test when mining ship warp in asteroid belt. example - when we warp in asteroid belt EVE client pop up some letter in one row , and in second row four letters with one from first row, the player should pick good one to be able to mine. That would be difficult for honest players (miners) - but isn't worth to do that? This is general look, what you think? sorry for terrible english thx borys No worries on the English and on Macro Mining, my view is they are smarter than me. Anyone (myself included) who devotes any amount of time to this 'feature needs to mine the rocks out of thier head first. In a game that supposed to be about a universe full of drones and human to machine interface, they leave something like this up to some poor toad? fly to rock.. shoot rock.. fly to base dump cargo, fly to rock shoot rock, fly to base dump cargo. wo kids and a dumb monkey could do this blind folded but they can't make a drone or a macro for it?
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2008.12.29 00:02:00 - [46] Originally by: Safri Wolff no, what they do is sell their dastardly recieved ores at a little below your prices so thiers sell first, so you drop your price below theirs and they drop again... Have you seen the price of tritanium lately? Originally by: Safri Wolff How many times have you keenly logged on monday or friday after DT to find ZILCH! no ore at all in the system...wtf? where has it gone Nope. I don't mine in Caldari space. In the systems I do regularly mine, I know exactly who is responsible for strip mining the asteroid belts within two hours of downtime. There are a bunch of folks who do the "warp to belt, fill hold, warp to station" thing. Then there's this other person encroaching on my territory with a Hulk/Orca pair. Damn them! Originally by: Safri Wolff There is NO other way! Find another system, or mine the rocks before they do. There's two options for you, and I only spent five seconds thinking those ones up. Another option is to actively recruit Australian/Korean/Singaporean players into your mining corporation. Their prime time is wrapped right around EVE's daily downtime. Took me another 10 seconds to think of that one :)
Bullageddon Caldari	Posted - 2008.12.29 00:32:00 - [47] Originally by: Dr Axler Originally by: Abulurd Boniface Don't put the onus on me, the honest player, put the onus on the people who break the system. Abulurd Boniface ME ME CEO in order to see who breaks the system you must check everyone. so by letting ccp scan everyone's PCs, only those actually breaking would be affected. I absolutely agree here. I believe in warrantless search and seizures as well!
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2008.12.29 00:41:00 - [48] Originally by: Dr Axler in order to see who breaks the system you must check everyone. so by letting ccp scan everyone's PCs, only those actually breaking would be affected. Yes that's right, only those breaking the rules would get affected by a "Warden" style program that watches everything you do on your computer. Except when the Warden program triggers the anti-virus software. Or causes Windows to crash. Or makes a mistake by identifying the drivers for my Logitech Mx518 as botting software. Or makes a mistake by identifying Windows Vista SP2 as botting software. Or clobbers C:\boot.ini (but that's never happened has it). Sorry, there is no way I'm letting someone run a program on my computer that will monitor every keystroke, and scan all the memory of my computer. My passwords and SSH keys are only secure because noone knows them. Perhaps the people who write Microsoft Windows should up the ante and provide separate memory spaces for each application?

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