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Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2009.01.04 23:56:00 - [31] Originally by: Killer Gandry What makes me more curious is why it takes me days in a row to actually find someone who wants the salvage from my missions. Same here. I never really understood the "waah waah they steal my wrecks waaah" attitude. Mine just expire uncollected most of the time and I'd gladly ask anybody in even for free (but if they dump me a percentage of the stuff they collect it would be even nicer). _ Create a character \|\| Fit a ship \|\| Get some ISK
Dracthera	Posted - 2009.01.05 01:20:00 - [32] Originally by: sirovai Why must every complaint be met with calls of "whine stfu whine" When did all this start, why are you people so angry? Frankly a lot of the so-called 'angry' replies you see here (they're not really angry IMO) are because whiny posts like this are often what causes CCP to change the game (not always for the best) to overcome a non-issue. It's simple social inertia, and you happen to be at the receiving end of it. It takes a lot of whining to overcome the inertia, and this is just part of the weeding process.
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2009.01.05 04:03:00 - [33] Originally by: Akita T Mine just expire uncollected most of the time and I'd gladly ask anybody in even for free (but if they dump me a percentage of the stuff they collect it would be even nicer). I'll add you to my address book and see if you happen to run missions during my play time, in systems that I'm able to get to without border police mugging me
Sierra Lima	Posted - 2009.01.05 11:16:00 - [34] Originally by: Kahega Amielden Edited by: Kahega Amielden on 04/01/2009 17:48:03 An organized Russian corp ninjaing in Motsu, like we do in Dixie? Suddenly, Cossacks. I like it. I'm reliably informed that a large number of these Russian Ninjas in Motsu, are high-sec alts of Red Alliance members.
Kaya Divine Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.05 15:47:00 - [35] Its so fun when ninja salvagers start to approach wrecks and you pop wrecks close to them, its like playing donkey and carrot on a stick game. Sometimes its just what I need to make missions more amusing. I consulted moralists to learn how to appear philosophers to find out what to think and novelists to see what I could get away with and in the end it all came down to one principle:win or die.
Tchell Dahhn Suddenly Ninjas Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service	Posted - 2009.01.05 19:56:00 - [36] Its so fun when Mission Runners start to pop wrecks and you pop wrecks as I approach them, its like they do exactly as they're told. Sometimes its just what I need to make salvaging more amusing. We're Recruiting!
Kahega Amielden Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2009.01.05 20:20:00 - [37] I think it's amusing that missioners think they've scored some victory by popping the wrecks. Most of us (in SN anyway) aren't exactly desperate for cash, and if we really needed to make omgwtfhueg monies salvaging, we'd be in Amarr space. So why do we do it? Hint: the OP is a big, big clue. Originally by: Catharacta My CNR runs on salvager tears.
Ghengis Tia	Posted - 2009.01.05 20:37:00 - [38] Edited by: Ghengis Tia on 05/01/2009 20:39:28 Originally by: Tchell Dahhn Originally by: sirovai I ask, why is this allowed? The wrecks would not even be present in Eve world had I not blown the ship up. Also, why are they mostly Russian? Salvage is free to the first person there with a salvager, however, you still have the loot. Why is there a problem? Why do you feel that it is your right to have everything? I trained for the ability to scan out Mission Deadspaces and Salvage wrecks very effectively, just as you trained for Mission Running. Oh, and I cannot speak for Motsu, however, Dodixie has a primarily English speaking Ninja Salvaging component, so please feel free to move here. We'd be happy to have you. "You still have the loot"???? Salvage can be as valuable, or more than, the loot itself, and you damn well know it... A Russian got into my deadspace site in Kor-Azor after I spent a significant amount of time finding the site, then clearing it. Anyone who goes into a site he/she has not personally cleared is a lazy a-***, leeching off of some other player's efforts. I followed him and blew up wreck after wreck as he approached them, but he continued on. After awhile I gave up, said dosvydanya* tovarisch and proceeded to salvage what I could. Say and think what you will, anyone who does this is a parasite, plain and simple. You have no honor and insult other players who legimately deserve to get all the rewards from missioning or exploration.
Dedalus77 Junkyard Dogs	Posted - 2009.01.05 21:13:00 - [39] Originally by: Ghengis Tia ...who legimately deserve to get all the rewards from missioning or exploration. Wow, talk about entitlement. Why do you deserve anything? This is EVE, not the local mission runners union office.
Tchell Dahhn Suddenly Ninjas Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service	Posted - 2009.01.05 21:18:00 - [40] Originally by: Ghengis Tia Say and think what you will, anyone who does this is a parasite, plain and simple. You have no honor and insult other players who legimately deserve to get all the rewards from missioning or exploration. MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! OMG, STOP!!! YOU'RE KILLING ME!!! LMAO!!! Please, keep it up... You're making me LOL IRL. We're Recruiting!
Kaya Divine Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.05 22:50:00 - [41] Originally by: Tchell Dahhn Its so fun when Mission Runners start to pop wrecks and you pop wrecks as I approach them, its like they do exactly as they're told. Sometimes its just what I need to make salvaging more amusing. Nice try, but fail. So you wasted time, just to be in range of wrecks, who explode around you. While mission runner still will claim cash, and LP for that time you will have a green on your face because you succeeded what? TO have absolutely 0 earned ISK per hour. While that same mission runner can gain 15-25mil/h. Wow, you really did it. I consulted moralists to learn how to appear philosophers to find out what to think and novelists to see what I could get away with and in the end it all came down to one principle:win or die.
Tiirae The New Era HUZZAH FEDERATION	Posted - 2009.01.05 23:43:00 - [42] I've done some salvage thieving over the last few days, done dodixie & motsu and a couple of less populated places in metropolis. I was doing it as a test to see if it could serve as entertainment for a corp revenue night, instead of the usual mining, ratting, mission nights. Jesus, was I wrong. It's easy enough to do but fark you don't earn much money doing it. it's got to be the worst-paying form of carebearism in the game. I can understand the fun in causing so much whining, I was the object of more than a few boo hoo comments in local and it was hilarious, but only for about half an hour. After that it was very boring and the sheer feebleness of the isk/hour numbers started getting to me badly. Personally I think mission runners need to let go and leave the salvage and loot behind. You can make more money just by ignoring the wrecks and doing another mission in the time you would have taken to loot/salvage anyway. So the whole argument is pointless. But man, I was shocked to see just how crappy the income is from this activity. And bear in mind that since QR the price of salvage has risen a lot, for example fried circuits have gone from around 20k to 38k per unit. Armor plates have gone from 90k to 200k per unit. And it's still tough to earn much money doing this. Whoever is doing it is definitely not doing it for the ISK. Funny thing: The people who cried the most in local when I salvaged their wrecks were other salvage thieves. "I was here first, I own these wrecks" etc. I got a bigger laugh out of that than any comments from mission runners. Apparently they don't 'get' irony.
Kolmogorow Freedom Resources	Posted - 2009.01.06 01:01:00 - [43] Originally by: sirovai Also, why are they mostly Russian? This question has a very bad taste - bad enough to lock this thread.
Tiirae The New Era HUZZAH FEDERATION	Posted - 2009.01.06 01:26:00 - [44] Originally by: Kolmogorow Originally by: sirovai Also, why are they mostly Russian? This question has a very bad taste - bad enough to lock this thread. Hey look, a Russian trying to make someone look like a racist, how surprising. Not. The OP didn't even mention logoffski or camping broken plexes once.
Harrent Caldari The Leathernecks	Posted - 2009.01.06 04:51:00 - [45] Originally by: Leandro Salazar What's even worse than salvage thieves is people selling GTCs and then doing their first L4 mission in a 400 mil ship in a system that anyone with half a brain avoids like the plague. So yeah, stop whining :P LOL, you just whined in a whine thread. Fail. Dont be mad at kids just because they have more money than you -.- its lame. =----------= Semper Fi
Leandro Salazar Better Dead Then Smeg	Posted - 2009.01.06 09:37:00 - [46] Originally by: Harrent Originally by: Leandro Salazar What's even worse than salvage thieves is people selling GTCs and then doing their first L4 mission in a 400 mil ship in a system that anyone with half a brain avoids like the plague. So yeah, stop whining :P LOL, you just whined in a whine thread. Fail. Dont be mad at kids just because they have more money than you -.- its lame. In EVE, whining in a whine thread is a form of winning I thought :P And I could easily afford getting all my isk via GTCs myself, it just doesn't really fit into my idea of achieving something in a game. But hell I don't even mind it so much when people use GTCs to avoid the timesink of making the isks themselves for something big they have planned, I have been guilty of that myself. Just when people start to sell GTC to compensate lack of brains and/or lack of dedication to learn the ropes, and to top it off come to the forums to whine that the game STILL does not always go their way, that is what summat irritates me. Not to mention the inflation on certain rare items exactly these people create when their first mission ship has to have a Gist shieldbooster... (Though this inflation DID earn me some nice money selling my old gear, I guess every cloud has a silver lining...) And if you are reading this, you have arrived at the signature without noticing...
Amarone Prime	Posted - 2009.01.06 11:51:00 - [47] Originally by: Ancy Denaries Originally by: FlameGlow missionrunners are "people who worked hard for their isk in-game"? While I'm not keen on trolling, this was actually very true. It's WAY too easy to make massive ISK with missionrunning. Orly? Explain me then cause probably I'm doing something wrong.....until you're talking about mission running 24/24. 1) The reward in ISKs for the missions are way low. 2) Only 2-3 lv4 like AE can give decent amount of ISK with bounties, other sucks. 3) Salvage is not always operable cause ninja stealers, and even if always there are only few rigs with decent value and you'll need tons of wrecks to gather the right items. 4) Storyline with precious implants pop once in like 12 missions, and lv4 are long ones. 5) No faction drops (dont say stupid things, never get one in months) 6)LP were good source of ISK years ago, now you can get very low profit from any LP store. So please tell me the "WAY too easy" road, I'm here to learn
Tippia Raddick Explorations BlackWater.	Posted - 2009.01.06 13:46:00 - [48] Originally by: Ghengis Tia […] players who legimately deserve to get all the rewards from missioning or exploration. Fortunately, you do get all the rewards from missioning and exploration. The LP is yours and yours alone. The mission payout is yours and yours alone. The time bonus is yours and yours alone. Beyond the actual mission rewards, you also get the bounties (if you actually do the work of killing the rats) and the loot (even if you don't). As for the salvage, you're the first on scene to claim it, and if you fail to do so, you don't deserve it anyway. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki
Tippia Raddick Explorations BlackWater.	Posted - 2009.01.06 13:53:00 - [49] Originally by: Amarone Prime So please tell me the "WAY too easy" road, I'm here to learn Get mission. Do mission. Cash in 20mil/h even if you do it wrong (like I do: using a HAC, salvaging and looting as I go, not including LP-to-ISK conversion). ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki
Dedalus77 Junkyard Dogs	Posted - 2009.01.06 14:53:00 - [50] Originally by: Tiirae Jesus, was I wrong. It's easy enough to do but fark you don't earn much money doing it. That probably because, as a non-dedicated salvager, you're doing it wrong. You don't have the skills or the proper ship fit to salvage efficiently. I personally bring in around 15-20mil/hr from salvage (and sometimes loot) because I am skilled for the job. Thinking that all you have to do to salvage is fit a salvager to make boatloads of isk salvaging is the reason why missionbears don't understand that we work just as hard to get the salvage as they do to run the mission. If you really want to salvage, you have to spec for it.
Ghengis Tia	Posted - 2009.01.06 16:18:00 - [51] Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Ghengis Tia [à] players who legimately deserve to get all the rewards from missioning or exploration. Fortunately, you do get all the rewards from missioning and exploration. The LP is yours and yours alone. The mission payout is yours and yours alone. The time bonus is yours and yours alone. Beyond the actual mission rewards, you also get the bounties (if you actually do the work of killing the rats) and the loot (even if you don't). As for the salvage, you're the first on scene to claim it, and if you fail to do so, you don't deserve it anyway. I paid for the ammo to kill that NPC, and took the time and effort to go about the combat involved. Doesn't that entitle me to first crack at salvage? When there are 50+ wrecks and maybe 7 have loot, the salvage becomes as important or more so than the loot. Mission running has to be easier and more profitable (when you get all the rewards, including salvage) than just ninja salvaging other players' wrecks. Are you ninja-salvagers so lazy that this is how you want to play this game? Just a bunch of hyenas waiting to feast on the carcasses? Granted some Mission Runners/Explorers could care less about salvage, so why don't you first ask them if you can salvage their wrecks? If they say no, then move on. At least you have the common courtesy to recognize that the wrecks wouldn't exist if not for the other player's efforts and expense. I know its a game mechanic that probably won't be changed, but I don't have to like it or the players who take advantage of it. As fare as being "first on the scene", I AM on the scene, and until I leave, the wrecks and salvage belong to the player that busted his/her ass to create them.
Ko Shimin Minmatar Independent Terran Empire Terran Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.06 16:25:00 - [52] Stop whining!!! Motsu is predestined to be a russian enclave.. the name says it all: MotSU.. SU.. Soviet Union..
Terminus Vindictus	Posted - 2009.01.06 16:35:00 - [53] Originally by: Ghengis Tia Doesn't that entitle me to first crack at salvage? No, it doesn't. You get the right of first refusal essentially by being in the middle of all those wrecks and having the knowledge of where the wrecks are, that's it. Originally by: Ghengis Tia I paid for the ammo to kill that NPC, and took the time and effort to go about the combat involved. By your same logic, the salvagers paid for those probes they're using to find your salvaging field, and took the time and effort to run their search, so they have an equal claim to their 'kill' which in this case happens to be your wrecks. It comes down to the fact that you have many other choices you could make in your playstyle to avoid this issue, and you're choosing instead to cry about it. Get a second account to salvage your own kills, mission in a quieter system that's doesn't have the attention of the salvage thieves, train for a ship that can do it's own salvaging, etc., etc. It's a game of choices, and it seems you're making the wrong ones for yourself. You only have yourself to blame for the outcome, so perhaps it's time to grow up and take some responsibility for those choices.
Tchell Dahhn Suddenly Ninjas Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service	Posted - 2009.01.06 19:15:00 - [54] Originally by: Terminus Vindictus No, it doesn't. You get the right of first refusal essentially by being in the middle of all those wrecks and having the knowledge of where the wrecks are, that's it. <...snip...> It's a game of choices, and it seems you're making the wrong ones for yourself. You only have yourself to blame for the outcome, so perhaps it's time to grow up and take some responsibility for those choices. I like this guy. Are you looking for a home? We have a nice, quiet system, full of Mission Runners you might be interested in. We're Recruiting!
Kolmogorow Freedom Resources	Posted - 2009.01.06 19:45:00 - [55] Originally by: Tiirae Originally by: Kolmogorow Originally by: sirovai Also, why are they mostly Russian? This question has a very bad taste - bad enough to lock this thread. Hey look, a Russian trying to make someone look like a racist, how surprising. Not. Someone with a Russian sounding virtual name like IVAN, BORIS or Kolmogorow and writing something in Cyrillic letters is not necessarily a Russian. Or do you believe that someone with an ingame name "Heraklit" is really a 2500 years old Greek philosopher?
Tchell Dahhn Suddenly Ninjas Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service	Posted - 2009.01.06 19:51:00 - [56] Originally by: Kolmogorow Or do you believe that someone with an ingame name "Heraklit" is really a 2500 years old Greek philosopher? Actually, with a name like that, I'd lean more towards an Eastern European Female Bodybuilder with an issue shaving her more intimate parts. We're Recruiting!
Salliene Gallente Terracorp Technologies Dark Trinity Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.06 20:08:00 - [57] Originally by: Kaya Divine Nice try, but fail. So you wasted time, just to be in range of wrecks, who explode around you. While mission runner still will claim cash, and LP for that time you will have a green on your face because you succeeded what? TO have absolutely 0 earned ISK per hour. While that same mission runner can gain 15-25mil/h. Wow, you really did it. Fact : I have been playing EVE happily for over 2 years total and my wallet balance has never been over 70 million. One Girls Journey through the EVE Universe
Suri Akagawa Caldari	Posted - 2009.01.06 23:27:00 - [58] I'm confused and am hoping someone can clarify some things for me (because the Eve community is so loving and generous :P). I'm also doing L4 missions out of Motsu, in my 100m isk ship (why on earth would anyone need a 400m isk ship for L4's?) and I've never had anyone salvaging my kills but me. I've never seen anyone warp into my missions, and I've done many of these missions. I was under the impression (mayhaps wrongly) that, until I turn the mission in, the "deadspace" the mission is in is mine and only mine. Once I turn it in, it becomes empty space, which is why I salvage the thing clean before turning it in, but I've never seen a soul in any of my mission spaces, nor lost any salvage to them. Am I just lucky and the Russky Ninjorz have passed me by? If so, how could they get into my mission space? Do every mission in the zone and way point them, and just jump around to them randomly, hoping to catch someone doing a mission and leech off their kills? ---------- "Money frees you from doing things you dislike. Since I dislike doing nearly everything, money is handy."
Markizah	Posted - 2009.01.06 23:31:00 - [59] down with the burzhui - all hail Motslavia!
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2009.01.06 23:45:00 - [60] Originally by: Suri Akagawa Am I just lucky and the Russky Ninjorz have passed me by? If so, how could they get into my mission space? Do every mission in the zone and way point them, and just jump around to them randomly, hoping to catch someone doing a mission and leech off their kills? First understand that ninja salvaging is not about the salvaging. See the name of Tchell's corp? Tear Extraction Services? They're not so much interested in the salvage as much as the severe emotional response of people like the guy who started this thread. So if you're running around in a battlecruiser, they're not so interested in you. If you're running around in a battleship, it's more likely that you're an established mission runner with lots of expensive (and highly saleable) modules fitted to your ship. If you're running in a busy missioning system, you might get lucky that they find someone else before they find you. It may also be that they popped into your deadspace in a covops frigate and you just didn't see them. As for how they find you, a quick chat to Google will help you find a Ninja Salvaging Guide, I'm sure.

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