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Mining - Risk / Reward Needs Rebalancing

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Jeanette Plato Caldari Amargosa Observatory Zzz	Posted - 2009.01.06 21:15:00 - [1] If you take a look at the Mining Optimizer, one of the things that strikes you is the fact that you can actually make MORE money mining Veldspar safe and secure in HiSec, than you can make mining Dark Glitter in perilous 0.0 space. Worse, is the fact that EVERY single type of Ice that you only find in 0.0 actually brings in less per hour than mining Veldspar in HiSec! Another issue is the fact that there isn't a single other type of Ore found in .1 to .4 systems that brings in more money than Veldspar, again a very unbalanced aspect of the risk vs reward that needs to be brought to the game. These are a few suggestions on balancing the game to bring the prices back to reality: 1. First we need to reduce the Demand for Titanium. I believe that all modules and ships in the game should have their need for Tritanium reduced by at least 20% 2. Second we need to increase the Demand for rarer Minerals. While lowering the amount of Tritanium used to manufacture goods, we should increase the need for all other minerals by at least 10% on each (Except Zydrine & Megacyte), and possibly another 10% later, once the effects start to take hold. 3. Third we need to increase the supply of Tritanium in the market to guarantee the price falls, by increasing yields by at least 10%. 4. Fourth, we to increase the supply of the types of Minerals found in .1 to .4 systems by about 5% (enough to increase income, but not enough to match increased demand - so the ISK per hour increases). 5. Fifth, we need to reduce the massive size of Ice fields in .5 and above space. Just like regular Mining areas, let these areas run out of Ice and possibly move them to Exploration. 6. Double the Yields on .1 to .4 Ice fields, (Glare Crust and Enriched Clear Icicle) and Triple Yields on 0.0 Ice (Pristine White Glaze, Smooth Glacial Mass, Thick Blue Ice, Dark Glitter, Gelidus and Krystallos) to compensate for the diminished fields in .5 and above space. I believe that by making these changes, the balance of Risk vs Reward will once again be in balance and the fact that us some Ice Miners are risking life and limb out in 0.0 should be much more amply rewarded. ----------------------------------------------- The Amargosa Observatory Initiative
Joe Starbreaker Starbreaker Frigateers	Posted - 2009.01.06 21:33:00 - [2] Jeanette, take an economics course. If mining in 0.0 is not profitable enough to be worth the risk, then mining in 0.0 will drop, and mining in highsec will be more popular. Then prices for highsec ores will fall and prices for 0.0 ores will drop. This will continue until risk/reward is balanced. If the reward of mining in general is too low, people will switch to other professions until the reward of mining increases. In other words, stop whining. With free markets, everything will work out in the end. .............
Straight Chillen Gallente Solar Wind	Posted - 2009.01.06 21:44:00 - [3] Of all the things to mine in 0.0 your going to mine DARK GLITTER?!? Please resize image to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Da'iel Zehn Construct Core Operations Construct Consortium	Posted - 2009.01.06 22:47:00 - [4] mmmmmm... Veld... /me chews veld pebble -- DZ's website ∞
Illectroculus Defined	Posted - 2009.01.06 23:42:00 - [5] I think there's a need for a general discussion on how to rebalance mining so that the value of tritanium isn't becoming the dominant force. This is partly a result of removing the NPC shuttle sales from the game which removed a the cap on the price of trit and set veldspar on its way to the top. I hang out in 0.0 and the systems are full of exotic 0.0 ore which is almost always less valuable than veldspar. Some people are still asking for this magic mineral creation mechanism be added back. Another factor in making the less dull ores less interesting is the amount of mid-high end minerals dropped by rats, and in particular by drones. Many people talk about nerfing these as a mechanism for increasing the value of those midrange minerals. Such a change would push the prices of all the midrange ores up. I've suggested that the rate of scrap metal drops from salvaging wrecks could be massively increased to add to the pool of trit in the game. Sure It would make salvage a little more dull, but maybe we could silence the whines of the dedicated salvagers by giving the salvaging profession some lover by adding a special purpose salvage ship, T2 salvagers and salvage drones. It's also been suggested that the refining yields from all ores in the game, with the obvious exclusion of veldspar, be modified to return much more tritanium, so that the amount of trit per m^3 is constant across all ores, thus guaranteeing that veldspar is the least interesting ore. So, any other ideas out there?
Jeanette Plato Caldari Amargosa Observatory Zzz	Posted - 2009.01.07 00:35:00 - [6] Originally by: Joe Starbreaker Jeanette, take an economics course. If mining in 0.0 is not profitable enough to be worth the risk, then mining in 0.0 will drop, and mining in highsec will be more popular. Then prices for highsec ores will fall and prices for 0.0 ores will drop. This will continue until risk/reward is balanced. If the reward of mining in general is too low, people will switch to other professions until the reward of mining increases. In other words, stop whining. With free markets, everything will work out in the end. Eve isn't exactly a free market. In the 1970's when the price of Steel and Wood was surging, Auto manufacturers decided to substitute Plastics in many areas of automobile manufacturing. This is not a luxury that we have in Eve. We can't engineer blueprints to use more or less of a particular mineral, we have to build it in whatever manner CCP specifies. If CCP makes Tritanium the Dominant mineral that is used in the construction of every item in Eve, then it creates inflation on that particular item. It's a mechanism that only CCP can rectify. As I've stated before, they can rectify the situation by reducing the percentage of Tritanium used in the construction of Ships and modules in the game, and increasing the percentage of other minerals used. "Free Markets" can't rectify this situation because true free markets only exist in the real world, not so much in simulated worlds. ----------------------------------------------- The Amargosa Observatory Initiative
Jeanette Plato Caldari Amargosa Observatory Zzz	Posted - 2009.01.07 00:50:00 - [7] Edited by: Jeanette Plato on 07/01/2009 00:50:50 Originally by: Illectroculus Defined I think there's a need for a general discussion on how to rebalance mining so that the value of tritanium isn't becoming the dominant force. This is partly a result of removing the NPC shuttle sales from the game which removed a the cap on the price of trit and set veldspar on its way to the top. I hang out in 0.0 and the systems are full of exotic 0.0 ore which is almost always less valuable than veldspar. Some people are still asking for this magic mineral creation mechanism be added back. Another factor in making the less dull ores less interesting is the amount of mid-high end minerals dropped by rats, and in particular by drones. Many people talk about nerfing these as a mechanism for increasing the value of those midrange minerals. Such a change would push the prices of all the midrange ores up. I've suggested that the rate of scrap metal drops from salvaging wrecks could be massively increased to add to the pool of trit in the game. Sure It would make salvage a little more dull, but maybe we could silence the whines of the dedicated salvagers by giving the salvaging profession some lover by adding a special purpose salvage ship, T2 salvagers and salvage drones. It's also been suggested that the refining yields from all ores in the game, with the obvious exclusion of veldspar, be modified to return much more tritanium, so that the amount of trit per m^3 is constant across all ores, thus guaranteeing that veldspar is the least interesting ore. So, any other ideas out there? Actually most of the higher end exotic Minerals in 0.0 ARE more profitable than Veldspar. As an example, in a perfect setup, you could be earning about 40M an hour with Arknor, Bistot or Crokite, vs about 12-14M per hour with Veldspar. However, in .1 to .4 systems where you find things like Jaspet, you could be earning as little as 5 to 6 Million per hour and not more than maybe 11 Million an hour with Hedbergite. Again, much less than Veldspar with much more risk. The minerals in the Midrange have gotten totally out of whack with the amount of effort and danger that it takes to get them. Especially so with Ice Mining, where most 0.0 Ice brings you less than 4 Million an hour with a perfect setup. Especially with Ice Mining, the HiSec belts need to be paired back, just as regular roids were pared back in Jita to reduce lag. These MASSIVE belts that go on and on contribute to the flooding of the market that makes Ice mining in 0.0 completely unprofitable. As I've stated before as those are paired back the yields on 0.0 and .1 to .4 ice needs to be increased to make it more profitable to mine in lower sec areas. It's all about re balancing the Risk Reward ratio that used to exist in the game. ----------------------------------------------- The Amargosa Observatory Initiative
k'nah Manaan	Posted - 2009.01.07 00:54:00 - [8] I'm willing to bet that alot of thought was put into this for the release of T3 ships im march. Dr. Enjyo knows his stuff and I am positive that with this next expansion we will see a rise in demand for low sec ores.
Kahega Amielden Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2009.01.07 01:27:00 - [9] Quote: In other words, stop whining. With free markets, everything will work out in the end. You know not of what you speak. Tell me, how much money is there to be made in mining lowsec ores? Veldspar is more valuable, and that's NOT because most miners choose to mine lowsec ores. The solution is simple: remove rogue drone alloys or rebalance them so that they give a balance of minerals (Or even large amounts of low-end minerals) rather than a crapton of midgrade minerals. Done. Originally by: Catharacta My CNR runs on salvager tears.
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2009.01.07 01:33:00 - [10] The high value of Veldspar provides a very nice starting income for new players. I do agree with Jeanette regarding the need to rebalance mineral requirements for BPs - with the introduction of rogue drones providing a mineral faucet, there was no mineral sink to compensate. Adjustments of 10% are too big though, I'd expect that minor adjustments of 2-3% over a period of months would be enough to bring things into balance. The scale of changes that Jeanette suggests would totally destroy the EVE economy. The supply of tritanium will only increase as prices increase. There is an unlimited supply of veldspar in hisec, it's just that the price of tritanium does not make mining an attractive alternative to mission running as an income source. I agree that ice fields need to deplete in the same timescale as asteroid belts. It doesn't make sense that a chunk of ice can be mined for a day straight without depleting it. I'll wait to see what changes to mining occur in the upcoming expansion before suggesting any changes to yields, respawns, etc.

Illectroculus Defined	Posted - 2009.01.07 06:40:00 - [11] Originally by: Jeanette PlatoActually most of the higher end exotic Minerals in 0.0 ARE more profitable than Veldspar. As an example, in a perfect setup, you could be earning about 40M an hour with Arknor, Bistot or Crokite, vs about 12-14M per hour with Veldspar. However, in .1 to .4 systems where you find things like Jaspet, you could be earning as little as 5 to 6 Million per hour and not more than maybe 11 Million an hour with Hedbergite. Again, much less than Veldspar with much more risk. The minerals in the Midrange have gotten totally out of whack with the amount of effort and danger that it takes to get them. Especially so with Ice Mining, where most 0.0 Ice brings you less than 4 Million an hour with a perfect setup. [/quote Actually there are huge areas of 0.0 which don't contain any of those ores - 0.0 just indicateds a negative security rating and some systems are more negative than others.
Bunyip	Posted - 2009.01.07 06:51:00 - [12] Actually, I found one huge reason why the price of Tritanium is so high. The high-sec ores used to respawn every downtime, now they only respawn twice a week. This is the reason why belts don't last long (at least as far as Veld is concerned). I'm not sure why the devs did this, maybe to counteract macros. Either way, I plan to discuss this with CCP in Reykjavik. "May all your hits be crits." - Knights of the Dinner Table.
Daemien Murdoc	Posted - 2009.01.07 11:34:00 - [13] 1st: Nerf the mission running rat loot to oblivion 2nd: Replace the rat loot by metal scraps containing trit 3rd: CCP wont do anything to ice mining. Because CCP needs income and macro accounts are perfect solution. This is why they are implementing station walk. Seriously now, who wants to run missions, mine, etc do other activities while macros can do it way better. When station walk is implemented to the game, people will just idle at stations. After awhile best and only way of making isk will be selling GTCs to macro accounts. This is how i see the future of Eve after station walk... But hey, we can walk at stations.... It will be so cool !
Princess Boon	Posted - 2009.01.07 13:53:00 - [14] I believe the comparatively high demand for Trit is due to the reprocessing of drops from NPC rats (missions and belt). The demand for Trit only seems high due to the low demand for the rarer minerals. Judging from the congestion around level 4 mission hubs, the increase in mission runners has boosted the supply of high end minerals in high security systems. Since there are no limiting factors to mission running, the supply of minerals determined only by time and the number of people mission running. In contrast, mining is limited by the availability of asteroids. The unlimited nature of mission running creates an unrealistic element to the Eve universe which upsets the economy. Replacing some, or all, items which are dropped from mission rats, with scrap metal that could be reprocessed for Trit; would address the anomaly caused by mission runners. Another benefit would be a boost to the T1 equipment market, since very few items are cost effective to manufacture.
Jeanette Plato Caldari Amargosa Observatory Zzz	Posted - 2009.01.07 15:19:00 - [15] Originally by: Bunyip Actually, I found one huge reason why the price of Tritanium is so high. The high-sec ores used to respawn every downtime, now they only respawn twice a week. This is the reason why belts don't last long (at least as far as Veld is concerned). I'm not sure why the devs did this, maybe to counteract macros. Either way, I plan to discuss this with CCP in Reykjavik. This change has only moved Veldspar miners from 1.0 systems to .5 and above systems. let's face it, you actually make MORE money in a .5 system sitting in a Hulk or a Covetor because all the rats your drones kill provide a bit more cash plus loot to reprocess. Unless you don't have drone skills, there is absolutely zero danger of you getting blown up by these weak rats. While Velspar might disappear from a particular belt for a bit, Miners never REALLY have any problems finding more, they simply move on to another belt or possibly another system. No the real reason Tritanium prices are so high is because of Capital Ships, they take ENORMOUS amounts of Tritanium to build, this has been balanced by the much higher capabilities of the Mining ships, but at the same time the percentage of Tritanium vs other minerals, I believe is unbalanced. This is the reason why I'm saying that the amounts of tritanium used needs to be reduced, while the midrange minerals need to be increased. Perhaps CCP should start off small, and over several patches make a 1% change downward on Tritanium, while makeing 1% changes upwards in the midrange minerals, but one way or another, I believe this is one of the things that needs to be done to bring this back into balance. ----------------------------------------------- The Amargosa Observatory Initiative
Jeanette Plato Caldari Amargosa Observatory Zzz	Posted - 2009.01.07 15:31:00 - [16] Originally by: Princess Boon I believe the comparatively high demand for Trit is due to the reprocessing of drops from NPC rats (missions and belt). The demand for Trit only seems high due to the low demand for the rarer minerals. Judging from the congestion around level 4 mission hubs, the increase in mission runners has boosted the supply of high end minerals in high security systems. Since there are no limiting factors to mission running, the supply of minerals determined only by time and the number of people mission running. In contrast, mining is limited by the availability of asteroids. The unlimited nature of mission running creates an unrealistic element to the Eve universe which upsets the economy. Replacing some, or all, items which are dropped from mission rats, with scrap metal that could be reprocessed for Trit; would address the anomaly caused by mission runners. Another benefit would be a boost to the T1 equipment market, since very few items are cost effective to manufacture. If anything, the loot from these missions is what has caused the virtual destruction of the market in some areas. Invention is really the only way to make money in Manufacturing anymore, because it's the only items that are not dropped by rats. Let's face it, in most of the major market hubs, items are up for sale at lower prices than what it costs to manufacture, or the margins are RAZOR thin. This is a separate, and yet related problem, but I believe that rats should instead drop consumer items and books. In other words, items that are not manufactureable, and can't be refined into minerals. This way loot drops are not competing with the industrialists of the game. I remember in Star Wars Galaxies, they used to have a very robust economy because all the BEST items could ONLY be manufactured from the player base. One of the things that destroyed the game, was that they decided to make it "easy" for people to get everything they needed by having the best items dropped by doing mission quests. Well we all know what happened to SWG. ----------------------------------------------- The Amargosa Observatory Initiative
Illectroculus Defined	Posted - 2009.01.07 15:40:00 - [17] Originally by: Bunyip Actually, I found one huge reason why the price of Tritanium is so high. The high-sec ores used to respawn every downtime, now they only respawn twice a week. This is the reason why belts don't last long (at least as far as Veld is concerned). I'm not sure why the devs did this, maybe to counteract macros. Either way, I plan to discuss this with CCP in Reykjavik. Do you have a reference for this? The last dev comment on the subject which I read suggested that veldspar respawned daily, while everthing else was on a slower respawn cycle. Besides, theres still loads of veld in belts, throughout empire it's not a lack or materials that pushing the prices up.
Traders Outpost	Posted - 2009.01.07 15:43:00 - [18] Why mine in low sec? Who wants to be pirate bait in a ship that has no defenses? If there was better ore in low sec and my barge could actually hold off an attack, I'd be there in a half a second. Barges are sitting ducks in low sec and the hassle of moving a mining OP there isn't worth it. 0.0 is about as safe as empire for mining (if you stay in your alliances area), as long as you pay some attention to the intel channels or watch local for reds. I've seen guys mining in 0.0 nearly AFK with out being bothered. When low sec becomes that safe people will move there. Removing or lowering the ore from high sec won't help the little guy but will help those in nullsec alliances. If high sec doesn't have any ore worth while, hauling from nullsec to empire will cause shortages or major price increases.
JanSVK	Posted - 2009.01.07 15:50:00 - [19] Problems with low end mins and espetially trit. 1, Only difference between hi-sec veldspar and 0.0 veldspar is that no one mines the Veldspar in 0.0 as there are still more valuable mins available there and it is plain stupid to mine Veldspar in 0.0. I checked some never ever mined Veldspar roids in 0.0 and found out that a standard never mined 0.0 belt got around 10 mil trit with the biggest rock containing only 300 000 units of Veldspar. Making Veldspar artifitially more rare as it should be by greatly limiting the amouth of Veldspar in a single belt and in a single rock. 2, A decend miner mines about 90 000 m3 of ore/hour which is around 2.7 mil trit mining Veld or 14 900 Zydrin mining Crokite. 14 900 Zyd is enough to build 2 Raven BUT from 2.7 mil trit you got only 1/3 of the required trit to build a single Raven. This fact artifitially rises the price of low end mins by seriously limiting the max amouth you can mine/hour. Artifitially rising the value of tritanium. 3, Hauling Tritanium is just a pain. Raven requires 7,5 mil trit to build which requires at least a cargo expanded Orca to haul in one go. Artifitially rising the price of trit because of the high hauling costs. My solution would be the creation of high end ore which would be high end because it would contain high concentrations of low end minerals (tritanium, pyrite maybe mexallon) or additional type of low end ore in low-sec and 0.0 like super dense veldspar containing twice as much tritanium as a normal Veldspar rock.
Jeanette Plato Caldari Amargosa Observatory Zzz	Posted - 2009.01.07 16:45:00 - [20] Originally by: Traders Outpost Why mine in low sec? Who wants to be pirate bait in a ship that has no defenses? If there was better ore in low sec and my barge could actually hold off an attack, I'd be there in a half a second. Barges are sitting ducks in low sec and the hassle of moving a mining OP there isn't worth it. 0.0 is about as safe as empire for mining (if you stay in your alliances area), as long as you pay some attention to the intel channels or watch local for reds. I've seen guys mining in 0.0 nearly AFK with out being bothered. When low sec becomes that safe people will move there. Removing or lowering the ore from high sec won't help the little guy but will help those in nullsec alliances. If high sec doesn't have any ore worth while, hauling from nullsec to empire will cause shortages or major price increases. This is my whole point on this thread is that it USED to be MORE profitable to mine in .1 to .4 systems, whereas now that is no longer the case. Same for Ice Mining, it used to be that there was actually a huge reward for setting up a 0.0 Ice Mining and Refining POS, and that is no longer the case. Where Mining is concerned, 0.0 Mining is King where you can make about 40M an hour, HiSec Mining Veldspar makes you around 12 to 14 Million an hour, but everything in between makes less. Ice and Midrange Minerals needs some sort of re-balancing to fix this, since the "Risk/Reward" ratio is out of whack.

Jeanette Plato Caldari Amargosa Observatory Zzz	Posted - 2009.01.07 20:23:00 - [21] Originally by: JanSVK .... My solution would be the creation of high end ore which would be high end because it would contain high concentrations of low end minerals (tritanium, pyrite maybe mexallon) or additional type of low end ore in low-sec and 0.0 like super dense veldspar containing twice as much tritanium as a normal Veldspar rock. Personally I don't think we need to go this far. I remember back when I used to do "Ninja Mining" in Murethand, a .3 system that had Jaspet. Hell using a Cruiser back then I made plenty of cash selling the refined Minerals for a nice tidy profit. It serously beat any amount of money that I could reasonably make in .5 and above systems. This is no longer true because while the price of Tritanium has gone up, the price of every other mineral has gone down. This is why I'm proposing these changes so we can get back to a similar balance like we had before. Adding additional roids, I don't feel will make much of a difference. ----------------------------------------------- The Amargosa Observatory Initiative
Fullmetal Jackass	Posted - 2009.01.07 23:27:00 - [22] You realize that ice mining is custom made for macro miners right? Set up a fleet of mack alts and a hauler and yer set. Free money. The reason ice prices are low is because everyone and thier brother mines it. It's easy cash.
Jeanette Plato Caldari Amargosa Observatory Zzz	Posted - 2009.01.08 00:02:00 - [23] Originally by: Fullmetal Jackass You realize that ice mining is custom made for macro miners right? Set up a fleet of mack alts and a hauler and yer set. Free money. The reason ice prices are low is because everyone and thier brother mines it. It's easy cash. No I think what happened was that CCP over estimated the demand for Ice. They thought that half the moons in .5 to .7 space would be chock full of POS's doing research and invention and practically every moon in 0.0 space would be mining Moon materials. Instead no one wants to get into research and production anymore, because it's easier to simply buy low and sell high in Jita, than go through all the complications of researching BPO's putting them into production and producing a low priced item that sells in quantity. Why bother the Rats are dropping thousands of units per day and they simply end up flooding the market? Now the only people who do it, they do it for the gameplay value, not so much for the profit in it and of course out in 0.0 they do it to gain sovereignty. However, from what I understand even that is being changed to where you'll be able to take over a system by simply camping the gates, so even THAT source of revenue for the Ice Miners will be gone. Also, why would Ice Macroers even bother when there are plenty of areas they could make MUCH more with Veldspar being so much more profitable. You do realize that Veldspar mining yeilds more than twice as much revenue per hour as Ice mining does?
Bunyip	Posted - 2009.01.08 03:44:00 - [24] Originally by: Jeanette Plato Also, why would Ice Macroers even bother when there are plenty of areas they could make MUCH more with Veldspar being so much more profitable. You do realize that Veldspar mining yeilds more than twice as much revenue per hour as Ice mining does? Because Veld mining runs out quickly (after maybe 50k m3). Ice mining lasts practically forever. Originally by: Illectroculus Defined Do you have a reference for this? The last dev comment on the subject which I read suggested that veldspar respawned daily, while everthing else was on a slower respawn cycle. Just go to a high-sec belt after any DT but Monday or Friday. You'll see for yourself. I've been mining a ton of veld for my latest manufacturing endeavor, and I've seen it throughout Gallente space.
Jeanette Plato Caldari Amargosa Observatory Zzz	Posted - 2009.01.08 07:45:00 - [25] Originally by: Bunyip Originally by: Jeanette Plato Also, why would Ice Macroers even bother when there are plenty of areas they could make MUCH more with Veldspar being so much more profitable. You do realize that Veldspar mining yeilds more than twice as much revenue per hour as Ice mining does? Because Veld mining runs out quickly (after maybe 50k m3). Ice mining lasts practically forever. Yeah, but I'm pretty sure these guys come up with Macros that let them move around to different belts.
CommanderData211	Posted - 2009.01.08 08:18:00 - [26] Well, now that everyone knows how profitable mining veld is, they will go out there and mine it into extinction, thereby reducing the cost over time.
Jeanette Plato Caldari Amargosa Observatory Zzz	Posted - 2009.01.08 13:17:00 - [27] Originally by: CommanderData211 Well, now that everyone knows how profitable mining veld is, they will go out there and mine it into extinction, thereby reducing the cost over time. I think that anyone who's seen Tritanium go from a buck and change to over 4ISK, knows how valuable Veldspar has become.
JanSVK	Posted - 2009.01.08 15:51:00 - [28] Originally by: CommanderData211 Well, now that everyone knows how profitable mining veld is, they will go out there and mine it into extinction, thereby reducing the cost over time. That will not happen anytime soon because any experienced miner with good skills is in most cases in a player corp with access to more valuable minerals somewhere in 0.0 because it bring is more isk and hi-sec suicide gankers. There is enough low end ore/mins in the game to meet the demand and put the price back but there is no effective method in the game to collect it. Mining takes too long and is counter productive anywhere but hi-sec. There is not really a spetialized salvager ship. Mission rats drop only 1/3 if not less loot then belt rats and there is no suitable ship for belt loot collecting and marauder is too expensve to be affordable to loose.
Jeanette Plato Caldari Amargosa Observatory Zzz	Posted - 2009.01.08 21:04:00 - [29] Any alternative ideas on increasing Midrange Minerals worth so Mining in LowSec is profitable and worthwhile to do so? ----------------------------------------------- The Amargosa Observatory Initiative
Gaogan Gallente Solar Storm Sev3rance	Posted - 2009.01.08 21:53:00 - [30] The problem is quite simply that there is an enormous amount of the middle minerals entering the game as a byproduct of missions and ratting ( with the drone minerals being the worst culprit ), so there is no need for miners to produce the stuff. The solution is simple; either remove these sources of minerals, or augment the middle tier ores with more trit.



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