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Mikal Drey
Minmatar Priory Of The Lemon Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.29 20:01:00 -
[1]
hey hey
Ok so we all know weird **** can come up in corp chat some days :) Heres the situation . . .
Player A orders pizza from the internet but instead of using his address for delivery he inputs player B's
Player B gets pizza and then pays Player A with isk (XR equivilant to current GTC prices)
Because player B is technically paying for OOG services using Isk he is breaking the ELUA would be subject to CCP's punishment. however...... if i had a lan party and decided to order in some pizza for everyone and some of them decided to give me some isk as thanks would that be against the EULA ?
in any case would you buy pizza with isk if someone offered and you were hungry ? or what if you had a corp mining op and the CEO decide for giggles he would order everyone pizza regardless of their location ? |
Dirk Magnum
Royal Hiigaran Navy
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Posted - 2009.01.29 20:03:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Dirk Magnum on 29/01/2009 20:05:52 You can't pay ISK for out of game services? Aren't there killboards that rent for ISK?
Personally I wouldn't pay for pizza in this manner. A pizza costs like ten dollars and that's like a third of a GTC, yes? A third of the ISK cost of a GTC would cut my in-game wallet almost in half |
kor anon
Amarr The Tuskers
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Posted - 2009.01.29 20:04:00 -
[3]
Edited by: kor anon on 29/01/2009 20:06:16 double post |
kor anon
Amarr The Tuskers
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Posted - 2009.01.29 20:06:00 -
[4]
edit: oh wait i thought you was talking about a ransom situation nvm |
Mikal Drey
Minmatar Priory Of The Lemon Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.29 20:06:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Dirk Magnum You can't pay ISK for out of game services? Aren't there killboards that rent for ISK?
some things have been accepted and its for CCP to decide which is and isnt allowed. IIRc Killboards and websites are eve related and do not break the EULA and is considered in the spirit of the game.
RL services that are non eve related are in direct violation of the EULA. KB good Pizza bad :''( |
Leaving Eve
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Posted - 2009.01.29 20:07:00 -
[6]
You are allowed to charge ISK for OOG services that cost money. I don't believe it works the other way around, ie I can't charge you cash for a CNR or whatever. I could charge cash or ISK for making a killboard or other OOG service though. |
Rhatar Khurin
Minmatar Free Ammatar Aid Organisation
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Posted - 2009.01.29 20:11:00 -
[7]
In everquest in the US you could order pizza whilst playing using some in game method afaik. Although i don't believe it was paid with by ingame money. |
Lochmar Fiendhiem
Caldari Quicksilver Industries and Painful Effects Inc.
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Posted - 2009.01.29 21:47:00 -
[8]
there is no issue here as the pizza was "gifted" to the other person who then donated the isk instead. Hell if anything this is terribly hilarious.
I remember a while back a guy held an auction or lottery or something where the prize was an extra xbox 360 he had, i'm pretty sure ccp did not have a problem with that as no real cash changed hands (other then the seller paying the shipping fees).
I'd probably give some isk to a friend of mine who i went to highschool with for a few "cigarettes". If i couldn't afford those same "cigarettes" myself.
If anything its a two way donation, not an actual service.
Now if some guy was having a flee market for isk, then yea, thats bad. But two friends trading pizza for isk, thats just silly, but still awesome.
Originally by: Halkin bob is dead, goons are great, cheese is cheesy, there we go no need for any more threads
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Asuka Smith
Gallente StarHunt Systematic-Chaos
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Posted - 2009.01.29 21:52:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Rhatar Khurin In everquest in the US you could order pizza whilst playing using some in game method afaik. Although i don't believe it was paid with by ingame money.
You typed /pizza and it windowed you out of the game and loaded www.pizzahut.com or whatever that companies site is.
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Kuar Z'thain
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2009.01.29 21:54:00 -
[10]
I admit I transferred 125m isk for 3 slices of New York style pepperoni.
Damn was it good....
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Dani SP
Rupture Farms Mining
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Posted - 2009.01.29 21:58:00 -
[11]
is it legal to trade real-life money and ISK?
I think its not. And this is exactly the same, just that you are doing lets say some triangulation to cover the real fact :) |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2009.01.29 22:05:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Leaving Eve You are allowed to charge ISK for OOG services that cost money.
Small correction. You are allowed to charge ISK for directly EVE-related OOG services that might cost money.
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Asuka Smith
Gallente StarHunt Systematic-Chaos
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Posted - 2009.01.29 22:06:00 -
[13]
I do not know about you, but I just reported him for ISK selling...
In seriousness, it is a slippery slope and I think CCP will say "NO!" and you will be lucky if you do not receive some sort of reprimand. Killboards are the only exception because they are practically a requirement of playing EVE, and I doubt that until another server as essential as a killboard comes along you will not be able to spend your ISK on anything else out of game. |
Sheriff Jones
Amarr Clinical Experiment
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Posted - 2009.01.29 22:09:00 -
[14]
I don't think i even have to post what comes to mind when i hear "Out of game "services" bought with ISK"
...
FINE!
*ring ring* Hello, Naughty Nannies for Lonely Johnnies, how can i help you? Yes umm, i'd like some "services". Certainly sir, would you like a quick visit to lovely fantasy, a day trip to funsyland or a bed and breakfast special? Umm..e...how much are those? Well sir, we assure that our quality is of highest standard. We have a strict money back quarantee if the client doesn't find our "services" "satisfactory". The prices are from hundred and fifty dollars to fourhundred and fifty for the bed and breakfast. Right, well, i think...lemme see...i think i can afford the...trip to funland? Day Trip to Funsyland sir, with our lovely Jenny. That is an excellent choice. Now, how would you like to pay? With ISK. I'm sorry sir, but we currently don't accept foreign currency. No no, i mean ISK, EVE moneys. Sir? You come, i have fun, i transfer ISK from my wallet to yours and... *click* Hello?
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Kuar Z'thain
Destructive Influence Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2009.01.29 22:11:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Dani SP is it legal to trade real-life money and ISK?
I think its not. And this is exactly the same, just that you are doing lets say some triangulation to cover the real fact :)
One could read the EULA to say that any market transaction within EVE itself is a violation of the EULA.
Quote: You may not transfer, sell or auction, or buy or accept any offer to transfer, sell or auction (or offer to do any of the foregoing), any content appearing within the Game environment, including without limitation characters, character attributes, items, currency, and objects, other than via a permitted Character Transfer as described in section 3 above.
All you Jita alts should just leave now.
...damn that was good pizza.
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Lochmar Fiendhiem
Caldari Quicksilver Industries and Painful Effects Inc.
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Posted - 2009.01.29 22:24:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Lochmar Fiendhiem on 29/01/2009 22:24:43
Originally by: Asuka Smith I do not know about you, but I just reported him for ISK selling...
In seriousness, it is a slippery slope and I think CCP will say "NO!" and you will be lucky if you do not receive some sort of reprimand. Killboards are the only exception because they are practically a requirement of playing EVE, and I doubt that until another server as essential as a killboard comes along you will not be able to spend your ISK on anything else out of game.
I don't see CCP or GM in front of your name, and your not in BoB so you got a long way to go before you get that far.
Also pizza was eve related as without pizza he could have died from hunger/starvation and then have been unable to pay his sub.
For more information on whats good to eat, Marilyn Manson has something to say.
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=8K8BUCapgS4
confirmation can be seen here.
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=G36iBobmXhQ&feature=related
Originally by: Halkin bob is dead, goons are great, cheese is cheesy, there we go no need for any more threads
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DubanFP
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2009.01.29 22:28:00 -
[17]
Edited by: DubanFP on 29/01/2009 22:29:31 Technically you are breaking the EULA in the strictest sense, but in reality its not something the GMs would care about even if they did find out. Its not like either of the parties is making any actual money off of it and its meant in good fun. Just don't expect the GMs to do anything if one of the parties doesn't hold to his/her end of the bargon. _______________
This is EVE. Here you have the right to settle any disagreements with lethal force. |
Grarr Dexx
Amarr Divinity's Edge
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Posted - 2009.01.29 22:48:00 -
[18]
Even if CCP did care, they wouldn't need to know. Since we're talking about maybe 100-200 million ISK, you could just call it a donation, untied to anything out-of-game not-eve related. |
Dani SP
Rupture Farms Mining
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Posted - 2009.01.29 22:53:00 -
[19]
Originally by: DubanFP Edited by: DubanFP on 29/01/2009 22:29:31 Technically you are breaking the EULA in the strictest sense, but in reality its not something the GMs would care about even if they did find out. Its not like either of the parties is making any actual money off of it and its meant in good fun. Just don't expect the GMs to do anything if one of the parties doesn't hold to his/her end of the bargon.
I totally disagree with that
One part is saving money (having dinner for free) while the other dude is paying for it. And this dude gets the ISK.
So... its a real life money <---> isk operation. |
Heroldyn
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Posted - 2009.01.29 22:56:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Mikal Drey if i had a lan party and decided to order in some pizza for everyone and some of them decided to give me some isk as thanks would that be against the EULA ?
how about this:
if you had a lan party and decided to give everyone 10 euro and then some of them decided to give you some isk as thanks.
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Dani SP
Rupture Farms Mining
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Posted - 2009.01.29 23:02:00 -
[21]
lol and we could go on... in the end player donations should be disabled just like on trial accounts |
Cereah
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Posted - 2009.01.29 23:33:00 -
[22]
I think its about time to start up an isk selling company where the people dont pay with money, but with 'donated' food.
yea, thats good... I think it'll work. |
Lochmar Fiendhiem
Caldari Quicksilver Industries and Painful Effects Inc.
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Posted - 2009.01.29 23:35:00 -
[23]
"I'll give the first person who tells me what the capital of france is."
could also be deemed against the eula. I don't think the devs would care about something so trivial.
Now trying to sell a car, or aluminum stocks for isk, thats bad. |
Haradgrim
Tyrell Corp INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2009.01.29 23:48:00 -
[24]
In everquest '/pizza' used to open Pizza-hut's website.
--
Originally by: CCP Oveur Just donęt forget the reach-around.
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Hana Lena
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2009.01.30 00:06:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Mikal Drey
Player A orders pizza from the internet but instead of using his address for delivery he inputs player B's
Player B gets pizza and then pays Player A with isk (XR equivilant to current GTC prices)
This is eather the most ingenuous method of ISK laundering we will ever see. Or proof that if you find the right land lord you can in fact LIVE off of EVE. I'm not sure whats worse. _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ADHD + Dyslexia = BAD SPELLING!
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Gonzo Hadron
Gracious Bodily Harm
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Posted - 2009.01.30 00:09:00 -
[26]
WTT Stocks in EXXON MOBIL CORP for isk
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Malcanis
R.E.C.O.N.
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Posted - 2009.01.30 00:18:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Dani SP
Originally by: DubanFP Edited by: DubanFP on 29/01/2009 22:29:31 Technically you are breaking the EULA in the strictest sense, but in reality its not something the GMs would care about even if they did find out. Its not like either of the parties is making any actual money off of it and its meant in good fun. Just don't expect the GMs to do anything if one of the parties doesn't hold to his/her end of the bargon.
I totally disagree with that
One part is saving money (having dinner for free) while the other dude is paying for it. And this dude gets the ISK.
So... its a real life money <---> isk operation.
In the same way that finding a dollar and not declaring it to the IRS is tax evasion.
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DubanFP
Caldari Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2009.01.30 00:20:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Dani SP
I totally disagree with that
One part is saving money (having dinner for free) while the other dude is paying for it. And this dude gets the ISK.
So... its a real life money <---> isk operation.
In the same way that finding a dollar and not declaring it to the IRS is tax evasion.
QFT. Only in the technical sense. _______________
This is EVE. Here you have the right to settle any disagreements with lethal force. |
Gunnanmon
Gallente UNITED STAR SYNDICATE
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Posted - 2009.01.30 00:27:00 -
[29]
My head just exploded.
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Ergebt Euch
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Posted - 2009.01.30 00:45:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Mikal Drey if i had a lan party and decided to order in some pizza for everyone and some of them decided to give me some isk as thanks would that be against the EULA ?
It can't make a diffrence if he gave you the isk so that you buy the pizza or gave you the isk as thanks. An isk buyer could also say he got a gift of isk from his chinese friend and gave him real money as thanks.
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Nan Curunir
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Posted - 2009.01.30 01:38:00 -
[31]
Originally by: kor anon edit: oh wait i thought you was talking about a ransom situation nvm
Sorry for beeing late but i ransom you for a Hawaii |
Kessiaan
Minmatar Army of One
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Posted - 2009.01.30 01:42:00 -
[32]
God damn, and people say I'm uptight. Sheesh.
I think it's fine, because..
1) Nobody in any position to do anything about it (should) give a ****, and 2) No RL cash changed hands. Player A bought a service from player B in ISK, player B procured the service using cash, but did not transfer it in any way to player A. Thus, it's the same conceptually as the killboards and GTC sales. |
Dani SP
Rupture Farms Mining
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Posted - 2009.01.30 01:45:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Kessiaan God damn, and people say I'm uptight. Sheesh.
I think it's fine, because..
1) Nobody in any position to do anything about it (should) give a ****, and 2) No RL cash changed hands. Player A bought a service from player B in ISK, player B procured the service using cash, but did not transfer it in any way to player A. Thus, it's the same conceptually as the killboards and GTC sales.
money ---> pizza ---> isk money ---> hardware item ---> isk money ---> whatever ---> isk
who cares about what? fact is, someone is converting real life money into game ISK... |
Sythyss
Fine Goods for Fine Gentlemen
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Posted - 2009.01.30 01:53:00 -
[34]
man, who really gives two ****s about this. I can't believe how uptight some people are being....it's insane
---------------------------
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Lochmar Fiendhiem
Caldari Quicksilver Industries and Painful Effects Inc.
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Posted - 2009.01.30 02:32:00 -
[35]
nothing really matters because at this point there is just an isk transfer and the hard evidence has already been digested.
moving on...
Originally by: Halkin bob is dead, goons are great, cheese is cheesy, there we go no need for any more threads
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Barasu
Minmatar Wreckless Abandon
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Posted - 2009.01.30 03:37:00 -
[36]
The pizza is in spirit of the game so u can play on without getting hungry. CCP just wants 20 dozen peperoni pizzas delivered to their HQ at the same time. |
Joss Sparq
Caldari ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.30 04:03:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Mikal Drey if i had a lan party and decided to order in some pizza for everyone and some of them decided to give me some isk as thanks would that be against the EULA ?
Hint: If you're all good friends then just don't tell anyone |
HankMurphy
Minmatar Pelennor Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.01.30 04:12:00 -
[38]
back when i started eve my broke college roommate would give me isk if i'd buy him a pack of cigarettes. (pretty good too, 10-30mil depending, big deal for a newb) ---------- "This is Chopper Dave's made for TV movie, Blades Of Vengeance. See, he's a chopper pilot by day, but by night he fights crime as a werewolf... YEAH!" |
Saibotek
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Posted - 2009.01.30 04:35:00 -
[39]
What about nookie for isk? I'm sure there is some funny stuff going on between our CEO and his wife as they both "play" Eve. She gets all sweet and cutsie on vent and poof shes got a new Anathema.
I'm not saying it happened but checking the logs and i see a few withdrawls after long perionds of silence on vent and some new ships are purchased. What happened in that time is only left to imagination. But i have my suspicions
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2009.01.30 06:19:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Leaving Eve You are allowed to charge ISK for OOG services that cost money.
Small correction. You are allowed to charge ISK for directly EVE-related OOG services that might cost money.
so you are only allowed to order black forest gateaux for isk, no pizza!
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Hauler McHaul
Gallente Garoun Investment Bank
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Posted - 2009.01.30 07:55:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Sheriff Jones I don't think i even have to post what comes to mind when i hear "Out of game "services" bought with ISK"
...
FINE!
*ring ring* Hello, Naughty Nannies for Lonely Johnnies, how can i help you? Yes umm, i'd like some "services". Certainly sir, would you like a quick visit to lovely fantasy, a day trip to funsyland or a bed and breakfast special? Umm..e...how much are those? Well sir, we assure that our quality is of highest standard. We have a strict money back quarantee if the client doesn't find our "services" "satisfactory". The prices are from hundred and fifty dollars to fourhundred and fifty for the bed and breakfast. Right, well, i think...lemme see...i think i can afford the...trip to funland? Day Trip to Funsyland sir, with our lovely Jenny. That is an excellent choice. Now, how would you like to pay? With ISK. I'm sorry sir, but we currently don't accept foreign currency. No no, i mean ISK, EVE moneys. Sir? You come, i have fun, i transfer ISK from my wallet to yours and... *click* Hello?
/threadwin!!
Ho hum,the bad man comes |
DJTheBaron
Caldari FinFleet Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2009.01.30 10:04:00 -
[42]
Edited by: DJTheBaron on 30/01/2009 10:04:56 I would gladly buy my caryrouts with isk if given the chance, i'd save a fortune. But i dont think ccp would approve & its not worth risking my characters & assets.
I know many people buy beer & pizza for isk at fanfest, and not the local currency.
People do rent voice servers, webspace or even buy forum signitures for isk, its an interesting question to ask, but when in doubt, dont, would be my advice. |
Roymundo
Caldari Perkone
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Posted - 2009.01.30 11:24:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Dirk Magnum Edited by: Dirk Magnum on 29/01/2009 20:05:52 You can't pay ISK for out of game services? Aren't there killboards that rent for ISK?
Personally I wouldn't pay for pizza in this manner. A pizza costs like ten dollars and that's like a third of a GTC, yes? A third of the ISK cost of a GTC would cut my in-game wallet almost in half
also there are eve poker sites.
lots of stuff costs isk.
just put it down as a thank you donation.
how would ccp ever find out it was for pizza rather than just a cheers. |
Copine Callmeknau
North Central Positronics LTD
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Posted - 2009.01.30 11:35:00 -
[44]
This raises an interesting possibility, can you get pizza delivered to CCP HQ and get GTC's as thanks? |
Steve Celeste
Caldari Paxton Industries
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Posted - 2009.01.30 11:37:00 -
[45]
I really dont see the problem here.
If you break a "law" and there are no witnesses alive and no proof, then i wouldnt even consider it a crime.
No wait |
H Lecter
Gallente The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates
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Posted - 2009.01.30 12:05:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Lochmar Fiendhiem I'd probably give some isk to a friend of mine who i went to highschool with for a few "cigarettes". If i couldn't afford those same "cigarettes" myself.
Hey, you got some "cigarettes" wink wink - yo man, check out these excellent jamaican ones
My opinion may or may not be shared by my alliance |
Sarethis
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Posted - 2009.01.30 13:54:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Asuka Smith I do not know about you, but I just reported him for ISK selling...
You reported a guy who posed a hypothetical about getting pizza for ISK? mmmkay |
Nareg Maxence
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.01.30 15:02:00 -
[48]
There is an easy way to get an answer to questions such as these. It's called a petition.
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Jesslyn Daggererux
Gallente SRIUS BISNIS
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Posted - 2009.01.30 16:58:00 -
[49]
CG OP, you made the unwashed masses go in a circle with their logic. Most of them do not even seem aware of it.
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ShardowRhino
Caldari Legion 0f The Damned
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Posted - 2009.01.30 18:15:00 -
[50]
What you should be asking is how the hell would CCP know if you traded pizza for isk? Really if the gtc sellers are having a hard time buying cards they should ask ccp to make a change. They could start an in game trade for isk by the slice. Of course the price of a slice would soon reach 500mil.
I'm sure the Devs have tried using isk for far more dubious trades. "hey baby, how bout you give me a ** and a beer for a bil isk?". As for pizza I'm sure theres some people that would gladly trade an x-tra large for a bil but then again do Icelandishers eat pizzas? |
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