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cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:43:00 - [1] Hello, Due to the GBP becoming alot weaker recently, particularly in relation to the Euro (1 - 1.1 ratio down from 1 - 1.4) subscription for the UK now costs around 13 pounds per month. Is it possible for CCP to revise UK subscription fees to be payable in GBP too? ....... The reason I ask is that many gaming companies (such as steam) have now placed their costs in GBP to UK customers so that prices remain constant to customers. Previously all games offered by steam were sold in USD. Thanks for listening to one customer, and hopefully British people can rally behind me on this one.
Sensor Ghost Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:49:00 - [2] I want cpt Mark's babies. Officially.
Shionoya Risa The Xenodus Initiative. Overclockers Podpilot Services	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:53:00 - [3] Also, as CCP want to be like Blizzard all the time, what with those 60 day GTC's and all that... You can pay for WoW in Pounds. So, get to work, CCP. -----
Major Deviant	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:53:00 - [4] Originally by: cpt Mark Hello, Due to the GBP becoming alot weaker recently, particularly in relation to the Euro (1 - 1.1 ratio down from 1 - 1.4) subscription for the UK now costs around 13 pounds per month. Is it possible for CCP to revise UK subscription fees to be payable in GBP too? ....... The reason I ask is that many gaming companies (such as steam) have now placed their costs in GBP to UK customers so that prices remain constant to customers. Previously all games offered by steam were sold in USD. Thanks for listening to one customer, and hopefully British people can rally behind me on this one. You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? Short memory span? Seriously though, euro and dollar paying customer had to ride the currency wave for years, enjoy.
Gone'Postal Aztec Industry	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:55:00 - [5] Edited by: Gone''Postal on 29/01/2009 20:54:52 Originally by: Major Deviant Seriously though, euro and dollar paying customer had to ride the currency wave for years, enjoy. This and I'm British. Originally by: masternerdguy Officer mods arent spread out because the bpos are innacesible to 99% of eve.
Shionoya Risa The Xenodus Initiative. Overclockers Podpilot Services	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:57:00 - [6] Edited by: Shionoya Risa on 29/01/2009 21:00:22 Originally by: Major Deviant You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? UK Market != UK Government. Disclaimer: 'UK Market' defines active subscribers of the online computer game, EVE Online, and no other parties. -----
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.29 20:59:00 - [7] Originally by: Major Deviant You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? Short memory span? Seriously though, euro and dollar paying customer had to ride the currency wave for years, enjoy. The fact it is an icelandic company has no matter in this whatsoever. The reason why Icelandic assets were seized was because your country went bankrupt and so to ensure the millions of BRITISH public money invested in Icelandic banks was secure, this action had to be taken. The Euro is a far more stable currency, as it involves a large proportion of states (hence why it hasn't dropped as much from this situation), and the dollar is also the same. Many products are sold for USD or Euros, and the GBP isn't exactly an obsolete currency. P.S just because you hate my country, doesn't mean you should involve yourself in a situation that doesn't concern you at all.
Major Deviant	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:01:00 - [8] Originally by: Shionoya Risa UK Market != UK Government. Ask an Icelander how he/she feels about the UK, the country, right now. And pls train International Relations past level 1.
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:03:00 - [9] Originally by: Major Deviant Ask an Icelander how he/she feels about the UK, the country, right now. And pls train International Relations past level 1. Please don't troll this topic, and stop displaying hatred against the UK.
Qordel Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:06:00 - [10] This topic is original. --
Major Deviant	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:08:00 - [11] Originally by: cpt Mark The fact it is an icelandic company has no matter in this whatsoever. The reason why Icelandic assets were seized was because your country went bankrupt and so to ensure the millions of BRITISH public money invested in Icelandic banks was secure, this action had to be taken. The Euro is a far more stable currency, as it involves a large proportion of states (hence why it hasn't dropped as much from this situation), and the dollar is also the same. Many products are sold for USD or Euros, and the GBP isn't exactly an obsolete currency. P.S just because you hate my country, doesn't mean you should involve yourself in a situation that doesn't concern you at all. I just stated facts you just have to put 1+1 together. Ask the Americans how they faired when the dollar was sliding for the last three years against any other single currency. BTW I am not from Iceland and what makes you think I hate the UK? Why should I? Have UK done something naughty lately that would give cause for hate? Sleep on that.
Khemul Zula Amarr Keisen Trade League	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:14:00 - [12] plants flag in center of the thread Yes. I do think that is about the right spot. Everyone will want to stay atleast 6 posts away from that flag or risk certain death when the modbomb drops. Also, British people are evil anyways, so supporting their currency would be a bad thing for CCP to do. ------ I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it.
hedfunk Caldari Low Sec Liberators Chubby Chuppers Chubba Chups	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:20:00 - [13] Originally by: Major Deviant Originally by: cpt Mark The fact it is an icelandic company has no matter in this whatsoever. The reason why Icelandic assets were seized was because your country went bankrupt and so to ensure the millions of BRITISH public money invested in Icelandic banks was secure, this action had to be taken. The Euro is a far more stable currency, as it involves a large proportion of states (hence why it hasn't dropped as much from this situation), and the dollar is also the same. Many products are sold for USD or Euros, and the GBP isn't exactly an obsolete currency. P.S just because you hate my country, doesn't mean you should involve yourself in a situation that doesn't concern you at all. I just stated facts you just have to put 1+1 together. Ask the Americans how they faired when the dollar was sliding for the last three years against any other single currency. BTW I am not from Iceland and what makes you think I hate the UK? Why should I? Have UK done something naughty lately that would give cause for hate? Sleep on that. Take that Great Britain! I'm sure the people of iceland are more concerned about how thier country is bankrupted, rather than Britain taking measures to secure public money. Arc of prosperity indeed Mr. Salmond, ho ho ho.
cpu939 Gallente OffBeat Creations	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:22:00 - [14] Edited by: cpu939 on 29/01/2009 21:26:16 Originally by: Khemul Zula plants flag in center of the thread Yes. I do think that is about the right spot. Everyone will want to stay atleast 6 posts away from that flag or risk certain death when the modbomb drops. Also, British people are evil anyways, so supporting their currency would be a bad thing for CCP to do. we the people of Great Britain are not evil we are in fact peace loving miners and all we love cat dog and hamsters (thats why the server is in london)come to our far country and enjoy the sites then when you get back to eve we will pod you over and over cos its fun once again not evil we just like to have fun lol
Khemul Zula Amarr Keisen Trade League	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:24:00 - [15] Edited by: Khemul Zula on 29/01/2009 21:24:06 Originally by: cpu939 Originally by: Khemul Zula plants flag in center of the thread Yes. I do think that is about the right spot. Everyone will want to stay atleast 6 posts away from that flag or risk certain death when the modbomb drops. Also, British people are evil anyways, so supporting their currency would be a bad thing for CCP to do. we the people of Great Britain are not evil we aer in fact peace lovong miners and all we love cat dog and hamsters (thats why the server is in london)come to our far country and enjoy the sites then when you get bad to eve we will pod you over and over cos its fun once again not evil we just like to have fun lol Sounds exactly like something an evil person would say!
Qordel Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:24:00 - [16] Originally by: cpu939 we the people of Great Britain are not evil we aer in fact peace lovong miners And of course, history totally backs that up. :P
Kagura Nikon Minmatar The Black Dawn Gang	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:25:00 - [17] Originally by: cpt Mark Hello, Due to the GBP becoming alot weaker recently, particularly in relation to the Euro (1 - 1.1 ratio down from 1 - 1.4) subscription for the UK now costs around 13 pounds per month. Is it possible for CCP to revise UK subscription fees to be payable in GBP too? ....... The reason I ask is that many gaming companies (such as steam) have now placed their costs in GBP to UK customers so that prices remain constant to customers. Previously all games offered by steam were sold in USD. Thanks for listening to one customer, and hopefully British people can rally behind me on this one. Brasilian real devaluated 80% against Dolar and euro. So stop complainign for this minimal change of yours.
cpu939 Gallente OffBeat Creations	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:31:00 - [18] Originally by: Qordel Originally by: cpu939 we the people of Great Britain are not evil we aer in fact peace lovong miners And of course, history totally backs that up. :P well if you look at any countrys history you will find in has a ton of evil in there. we must work on the here and now.
Asuka Smith Gallente StarHunt Systematic-Chaos	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:32:00 - [19] I certainly hope the Icelandic population at large is not so ignorant as to feel slighted on a personal level by the general population of the UK. As it happens most countries have atrocious government and the populace is completely out of step with the party line. The Icelanders probably do not even hate Brown as much as some people in the UK.
Qordel Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:37:00 - [20] All I know is that one of the greatest things about EVE-Online is getting to play with a very diverse population with fellow geeks across the globe. Period. --
nether void Caldari Shrapnel Industries	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:39:00 - [21] GB should have gone with the Euro when it was being rolled out. --------------------
Armoured C Gallente Federation of Freedom Fighters Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:47:00 - [22] Originally by: nether void GB should have gone with the Euro when it was being rolled out. maybe we should have i love to hav ...wait what they left out wales on a euro brochure.... i hate EURO This week EvE Life: Fleet fighting blog is now available
Rutger Centemus Joint Empire Squad	Posted - 2009.01.29 21:57:00 - [23] Originally by: cpt Mark snip The Euro is a far more stable currency snip It seems like you answered your own question on the why and how of currencies. FYI: quite a few companies don't really like dealing with fixed rates in several currencies, as you can never be sure what rate you will be getting. Hell, just for fun: what exchange rates should you CCP base their new subscriptionrates in pounds, on? * the current one? * 1 GBP = 1 EU = 1 US$? * changing monthly / quarterly / yearly based on (average?) exchange rates? * the exchange rate of the Zimbabwian Dollar? Seriously... Originally by: Crumplecorn I prefer launching bathtubs of antimatter at my opponents over pointing an open DVD player at them, even if the bathtubs do miss a lot. So no.
Denaris Aschanna	Posted - 2009.01.29 22:19:00 - [24] Well if memory serves, I seem to recall when I first started playing by monthly subscription that prices were ú15 a month for the UK, and also $15 for US players, which at the time was equivalant to about ú10 with exchange rates - therefore US players were getting the same service cheaper. I don't know if this is still the case as I play by GTC now. Oh, and as for the UK hating.. maybe people should remember that the servers are in London, which is in - last time I checked anyway - the UK! Hehe.. time to go ransom the servers lol
Morsus Argent	Posted - 2009.01.29 22:26:00 - [25] Originally by: Rutger Centemus Hell, just for fun: what exchange rates should you CCP base their new subscriptionrates in pounds, on? * the current one? * 1 GBP = 1 EU = 1 US$? * changing monthly / quarterly / yearly based on (average?) exchange rates? * the exchange rate of the Zimbabwian Dollar? Seriously... Don't be daft. Any new regional price would typically be set by considering all the relevant factors, including exchange rates (over the long-term) and the pricing of similar products in that regional market. Which is how everyone else who sells a product in multiple markets does it. The price would then usually be fixed, unless a long-term change in exchange rates or markets made a price change necessary. Which is how everyone does it. You're acting like this is some wild bizarre idea that no-one else has ever done. Seriously...
Taylor timenenzi	Posted - 2009.01.29 22:38:00 - [26] I used to pay 200 million isk for 90 days of game time. I now pay 340 million isk for 30 days CCP please fix this for me.
Rutger Centemus Joint Empire Squad	Posted - 2009.01.29 22:42:00 - [27] Originally by: Morsus Argent Originally by: Rutger Centemus Hell, just for fun: what exchange rates should you CCP base their new subscriptionrates in pounds, on? * the current one? * 1 GBP = 1 EU = 1 US$? * changing monthly / quarterly / yearly based on (average?) exchange rates? * the exchange rate of the Zimbabwian Dollar? Seriously... Don't be daft. Any new regional price would typically be set by considering all the relevant factors, including exchange rates (over the long-term) and the pricing of similar products in that regional market. Which is how everyone else who sells a product in multiple markets does it. The price would then usually be fixed, unless a long-term change in exchange rates or markets made a price change necessary. Which is how everyone does it. You're acting like this is some wild bizarre idea that no-one else has ever done. Seriously... Pricingstrategies depend on (among others) type and quality of product, market and competitors. Fixed prices have the benefit for the customers that they know over longer periods what they'll pay in their local currency. They do however add a tiny problem for the supplier: exchange rates, or 'roulette' as you might call it. Whilst exchange rates often keep within a certain bandwidth, sudden changes of 30 - 40 % between currencies aren't uncommon. Customers will (of course) often look for the cheapest way to get a product, especially in a case such as this where the product is easily 'shipped' from abroad after being bought in another currency. I can remember times when, for instance, the GBP was worth 4 to 5 times [to my former currency, NLG] as much as it is nowadays. Same for for instance (be it less extreme) US Dollars and French and Swiss Francs. So, what would be the 'normal' exchange rate? I know this is RL, and not Eve, but take the bitter with the sweet. I have yet to see the first player (or customer, in any business) complain that due to changes in exchange rates they're now paying to little. The only time we see complaints is when changes are in your disadvantage. Understandable, but please also understand that people will respond to this. tl;dr: You had good exchange rates and had some profit from it for some time, for the moment things have changed. Suck it up. PS: Question still stands - what exchange rate? Originally by: Crumplecorn I prefer launching bathtubs of antimatter at my opponents over pointing an open DVD player at them, even if the bathtubs do miss a lot. So no.
Lupra Nermona	Posted - 2009.01.29 22:42:00 - [28] Originally by: cpt Mark Hello, Due to the GBP becoming alot weaker recently, particularly in relation to the Euro (1 - 1.1 ratio down from 1 - 1.4) subscription for the UK now costs around 13 pounds per month. Is it possible for CCP to revise UK subscription fees to be payable in GBP too? ....... The reason I ask is that many gaming companies (such as steam) have now placed their costs in GBP to UK customers so that prices remain constant to customers. Previously all games offered by steam were sold in USD. Thanks for listening to one customer, and hopefully British people can rally behind me on this one. choose a new governmment...? ...and switch to real money...? UK does not wish to be a part of europe. Now you are lost ___ ...EVE is a cruel, harsh world - but reality also....
Suboran Gallente Victory Not Vengeance Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2009.01.29 22:42:00 - [29] dont vote for labour again?
Julian Lynq	Posted - 2009.01.29 22:52:00 - [30] the solution is to eat less fish&chips. it also saves the lifes of the innocent fishes.
Schani Kratnorr x13	Posted - 2009.01.29 23:03:00 - [31] If a non-vital luxury good like EVE is getting too expensive for your private echonomy, I suggest you consider not buying it.
Morsus Argent	Posted - 2009.01.29 23:26:00 - [32] Originally by: Rutger Centemus PS: Question still stands - what exchange rate? Yes, exchange rates vary. That's why, if you were doing this, you'd typically look at the LONG TERM like I said. Which part of 'long term' didn't you understand? You'd want a value that, over the long term, is comparable to other markets and competitive within the local market. This isn't that hard a concept to grasp, is it? As for the arguments about people buying from other regions depending on the exchange rates, those apply as soon as you offer a product in multiple currencies, which in case you hadn't noticed, CCP already do. Do you think they should stop offering the product in USD? How would offering the product in GBP be any worse, exactly? I'm not saying they must offer the product in GBP. I don't know if they have enough British subscribers to justify it. But a fixed price has benefits for both the consumer and the supplier. It's certainly not an unreasonable thing to ask for.
NeoTheo Federation of Freedom Fighters Executive Outcomes	Posted - 2009.01.29 23:28:00 - [33] Originally by: cpt Mark Hello, Due to the GBP becoming alot weaker recently, particularly in relation to the Euro (1 - 1.1 ratio down from 1 - 1.4) subscription for the UK now costs around 13 pounds per month. Is it possible for CCP to revise UK subscription fees to be payable in GBP too? ....... The reason I ask is that many gaming companies (such as steam) have now placed their costs in GBP to UK customers so that prices remain constant to customers. Previously all games offered by steam were sold in USD. Thanks for listening to one customer, and hopefully British people can rally behind me on this one. i am british, and no. just no. we could have joined the euro, but veto'd it years ago. nobody else (some easten block countrys) gets breaks, nore should we.
CyberGh0st Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force	Posted - 2009.01.29 23:32:00 - [34] Edited by: CyberGh0st on 29/01/2009 23:35:46 Edited by: CyberGh0st on 29/01/2009 23:34:47 Originally by: Lupra Nermona Originally by: cpt Mark Hello, Due to the GBP becoming alot weaker recently, particularly in relation to the Euro (1 - 1.1 ratio down from 1 - 1.4) subscription for the UK now costs around 13 pounds per month. Is it possible for CCP to revise UK subscription fees to be payable in GBP too? ....... The reason I ask is that many gaming companies (such as steam) have now placed their costs in GBP to UK customers so that prices remain constant to customers. Previously all games offered by steam were sold in USD. Thanks for listening to one customer, and hopefully British people can rally behind me on this one. choose a new governmment...? ...and switch to real money...? UK does not wish to be a part of europe. Now you are lost ___ ...EVE is a cruel, harsh world - but reality also.... This ! It was not just the government that did not want to join the Euro, it was also a large percentage of the population if I remember correctly. UK never was and still is not fully commmited to the EU, so yah, if you wanna go solo, suck it up :p
Morsus Argent	Posted - 2009.01.29 23:42:00 - [35] Originally by: CyberGh0st UK never was and still is not fully commmited to the EU, so yah, if you wanna go solo, suck it up :p You do realise Iceland isn't even a member of the EU, right?
Cibo Seidensha Amarr Biotronics Inc. Alternative Realities	Posted - 2009.01.29 23:46:00 - [36] Originally by: Julian Lynq the solution is to eat less fish&chips. it also saves the lifes of the innocent fishes. Don't forget the innocent potatoes. Will someone please think of the potatoes!
Vincent Death Caldari K Directorate	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:01:00 - [37] I would just like to confirm that contrary to what other posters may say, the UK is a sinkhole of pure evil which makes Mordor look like Candy Land. We haven't forgotten about our former colonies either, so watch your back America, watch your back.
Rutger Centemus Joint Empire Squad	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:16:00 - [38] Edited by: Rutger Centemus on 30/01/2009 00:17:15 Originally by: Morsus Argent Originally by: Rutger Centemus PS: Question still stands - what exchange rate? Yes, exchange rates vary. That's why, if you were doing this, you'd typically look at the LONG TERM like I said. Which part of 'long term' didn't you understand? You'd want a value that, over the long term, is comparable to other markets and competitive within the local market. This isn't that hard a concept to grasp, is it? First off: Very nice way to circumvent a large part of my post, gotta hand it to you. Tell me, what long term? Also: a lot off companies nowadays seem to think 2 - 3 months is long term. Subscriptions for Eve should be 14 - 15 GBP / month? Agreed? With all due respect, what part of free trade between countries, and the difficulties wich this brings for companies having to deal with multiple currencies, do you not understand? Sorry, posting from the other side of a foggy channel - but it seems we're not the ones feeling cut off at the moment. Gee, I hope the sarcasm in that last sentence isn't too hard to grasp for you. Originally by: Morsus Argent As for the arguments about people buying from other regions depending on the exchange rates, those apply as soon as you offer a product in multiple currencies, which in case you hadn't noticed, CCP already do. Do you think they should stop offering the product in USD? How would offering the product in GBP be any worse, exactly? No, I did not say they should stop offering the product in USD. Based on the OP I must however say I don't see any reason to implement any form of new "Eve light - subscription" just because the Pound got weaker. As was said earlier: Originally by: Schani Kratnorr If a non-vital luxury good like EVE is getting too expensive for your private economy, I suggest you consider not buying it. Originally by: Morsus Argent I'm not saying they must offer the product in GBP. I don't know if they have enough British subscribers to justify it. But a fixed price has benefits for both the consumer and the supplier. It's certainly not an unreasonable thing to ask for. Having run a company producing in 1 country selling it's products over Europe both before and after the Euro, I respectfully disagree. Having to deal with multiple currencies and gambling on exchange rates is a major PITA for any company. Being able to pay in your local currency is often something customers will ask. Main question in a case such as this usually is, which of both parties has the stronger position (not 'needing' to sell versus being able to buy somewhere else). The long and the short of it: I'm against the thinly-veiled statement that Eve's subscription cost should go down in GBP (and only in GBP), just because of the current exchange rate. I highly doubt the OP would have made a similar post had the GBP gone up in value against the USD and EUR. Enjoy the fog. Originally by: Crumplecorn I prefer launching bathtubs of antimatter at my opponents over pointing an open DVD player at them, even if the bathtubs do miss a lot. So no.
Morsus Argent	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:37:00 - [39] Originally by: Rutger Centemus First off: Very nice way to circumvent a large part of my post, gotta hand it to you. Yes, I tend to not bother including text that isn't worth including. Watch me do it again! Originally by: Rutger Centemus Tell me, what long term? Also: a lot off companies nowadays seem to think 2 - 3 months is long term. Subscriptions for Eve should be 14 - 15 GBP / month? Agreed? See, you've ignored the whole part about the rate being competitive in the local market. ú15 would not be competitive. It would also, if you actually look at the historical exchange rate, clearly be wrong unless you're either planning to change the rate every few months (which other providers in this market don't do for a reason) or you think the pound is never going to recover against the euro and/or the USD (which is unlikely, but I'm not going to go into the economics of it). Originally by: Rutger Centemus Based on the OP I must however say I don't see any reason to implement any form of new "Eve light - subscription" just because the Pound got weaker. As was said earlier: Originally by: Schani Kratnorr If a non-vital luxury good like EVE is getting too expensive for your private economy, I suggest you consider not buying it. Indeed, and people will do that. That's one reason why having a fixed rate is beneficial for the supplier. You tend, in general, to get more people dropping out when the price is high then you do additional people subscribing when the price is low, hence you tend to get a higher income over the long term. Whether it's actually worth doing is dependent on several factors, including the size of the regional market and just how much of a PITA it is to accept payments in that currency. Originally by: Rutger Centemus The long and the short of it: I'm against the thinly-veiled statement that Eve's subscription cost should go down in GBP (and only in GBP), just because of the current exchange rate. I highly doubt the OP would have made a similar post had the GBP gone up in value against the USD and EUR. Well, duh. But people asking for things when it would benefit them is hardly unreasonable, nor does it automatically invalidate their request, particularly since any fixed rate set would be below the past and future peak - unless they got it horribly wrong, or the pound never recovers, both of which are unlikely. Like I said, if CCP has a lot of British subscribers, then it would potentially benefit them to offer a fixed subscription rate in GBP.
Rutger Centemus Joint Empire Squad	Posted - 2009.01.30 00:53:00 - [40] Originally by: Morsus Argent Yes, I tend to not bother including text that isn't worth including. Watch me do it again! Two can play that game. Originally by: "Morsus Agent" Well, duh. But people asking for things when it would benefit them is hardly unreasonable, nor does it automatically invalidate their request, particularly since any fixed rate set would be below the past and future peak - unless they got it horribly wrong, or the pound never recovers, both of which are unlikely. Like I said, if CCP has a lot of British subscribers, then it would potentially benefit them to offer a fixed subscription rate in GBP. Let me spell it out for you. It's not CCP's mistake, that your economy is considered weak and your dear Pound Stirling is worth f-all. It's not anyone elses. It's but your own. Cry me a river, build a bridge and get over it. Ah, what the heck - fine, I hereby give my full support to the request for lifetime subscriptions to Eve, costing only GBP 1,-. Limited offer, only valid until the Pound is strong enough to buy abroad again! Furthermore, might I recommend this part of the forums to you? Your style, pzazz and general friendly behavior seem to be on par with quite a few other posters overthere. You might want to apply to THE INTERNET. first. Cheerio, have fun!
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2009.01.30 01:33:00 - [41] Originally by: Major Deviant Ask the Americans how they faired when the dollar was sliding for the last three years against any other single currency. It made no difference. They paid $15 all the way through. It makes no difference what that was "worth" on the international market, their local cost didn't change. I was paying a little over ú8.40 3 years ago, and now I am paying nearly ú15. Not that I am in favour of the proposal from the OP, I'm just pointing out the flaw in your arguement. Eve-Online: The Text Adventure
Marisal	Posted - 2009.01.30 02:02:00 - [42] Originally by: Major Deviant Originally by: cpt Mark Hello, Due to the GBP becoming alot weaker recently, particularly in relation to the Euro (1 - 1.1 ratio down from 1 - 1.4) subscription for the UK now costs around 13 pounds per month. Is it possible for CCP to revise UK subscription fees to be payable in GBP too? ....... The reason I ask is that many gaming companies (such as steam) have now placed their costs in GBP to UK customers so that prices remain constant to customers. Previously all games offered by steam were sold in USD. Thanks for listening to one customer, and hopefully British people can rally behind me on this one. You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? Short memory span? Seriously though, euro and dollar paying customer had to ride the currency wave for years, enjoy. Sorry can't let this pass, if your going to point fingers at the UK government then fair do's we'll accept we used draconian measures, but you have to admit that it was your governments mismanagement of the economic crisis and not supporting the banks that they knew were in trouble leading to Icelandic bank freezing certain assets include the money that the UK had place in Icelandic banks (supporting the Icelandic economy). Our reaction was probably a little over the top but when debtors can't pay up what do you do seize assets.
Major Deviant	Posted - 2009.01.30 02:03:00 - [43] Originally by: Avon Originally by: Major Deviant Ask the Americans how they faired when the dollar was sliding for the last three years against any other single currency. It made no difference. They paid $15 all the way through. It makes no difference what that was "worth" on the international market, their local cost didn't change. I was paying a little over ú8.40 3 years ago, and now I am paying nearly ú15. Not that I am in favour of the proposal from the OP, I'm just pointing out the flaw in your arguement. My reference to the american dollar was to demostrate what the US had to go through buying something in an other currency other than their own which was constantly losing its value. They were in the same spot as the British now when they had to buy something which does not have a qouted priced in sterling. For example a person in the US subscribing to X non-US magazine/newspaper/whatever, was in the same position if not worse than the brits are now. Solution: if it hurts that much, cancel subscription or bite the bullet. And now for something completely different, 15 pounds is 5 pints at the local pub -> cut down on alcohol.
Jhagiti Tyran Mortis Angelus The Church.	Posted - 2009.01.30 02:09:00 - [44] Originally by: Major Deviant You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? Yes because UK EVE players really did get the government to seize Iceland's assets.
Major Deviant	Posted - 2009.01.30 02:36:00 - [45] Originally by: Marisal Sorry can't let this pass, if your going to point fingers at the UK government then fair do's we'll accept we used draconian measures, but you have to admit that it was your governments mismanagement of the economic crisis and not supporting the banks that they knew were in trouble leading to Icelandic bank freezing certain assets include the money that the UK had place in Icelandic banks (supporting the Icelandic economy). Our reaction was probably a little over the top but when debtors can't pay up what do you do seize assets. I will repeat myself: I am not from Iceland. Regarding your comment, draconian? I might agree with you if not for the international crisis. It was more like state bullying, "we are doing it because we can and you can not do anything about it". Why then the UK goverment did not take prior similar measures with Lehman Bros assets? Considerable larger amounts but wait... it was a US financial institution. Too big a country to pick on? If the UK had taken similar steps in a similar situation against an hypothetical EU member: a) Big slap from Brussels to UK b) Unfreezing of said assets as it is against EU legistlation which is above UK law especially in terms of bilateral member relationships (except in matters regarding constitution). Sadly EU legistaltion does not govern realations with non EU members such as Iceland. c) Huge fine form the European courts d) if UK kept singing the same tune, major diplomatic incident (recall/expulsion of ambassador or worse) and if UK stayed pigheaded e) UK kicked out of the EU f) Huge European crisis to put it lightly As for an earlier comment of mine regarding Icelanders not having the best opinion about british now, I bet you that the average Icelander would not have the slightest problem to sit down, have a beer and chat about anything you can imagine with a random brit. But pls do not mention that these were draconian measures and that they were needed. I was a political move for internal consumption. The UK goverment decided to save few cartloads of pounds and damage Britain's realation with Iceland and also cause colateral damage with many other coutries that did not like this move and also look sceptically at Britain now. So you still think was it worth it? The irony is that I favoured Labour when I was living there....Then again the torries would have done something more extreme though, likee...invasion?
Marisal	Posted - 2009.01.30 02:39:00 - [46] Originally by: Major Deviant Originally by: Avon Originally by: Major Deviant Ask the Americans how they faired when the dollar was sliding for the last three years against any other single currency. It made no difference. They paid $15 all the way through. It makes no difference what that was "worth" on the international market, their local cost didn't change. I was paying a little over ú8.40 3 years ago, and now I am paying nearly ú15. Not that I am in favour of the proposal from the OP, I'm just pointing out the flaw in your arguement. My reference to the american dollar was to demostrate what the US had to go through buying something in an other currency other than their own which was constantly losing its value. They were in the same spot as the British now when they had to buy something which does not have a qouted priced in sterling. For example a person in the US subscribing to X non-US magazine/newspaper/whatever, was in the same position if not worse than the brits are now. Solution: if it hurts that much, cancel subscription or bite the bullet. And now for something completely different, 15 pounds is 5 pints at the local pub -> cut down on alcohol. Are you friggen kidding me I can't get past the first line in that statement half the friggen world trades in USD
Khemul Zula Amarr Keisen Trade League	Posted - 2009.01.30 02:39:00 - [47] Originally by: Jhagiti Tyran Originally by: Major Deviant You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? Yes because UK EVE players really did get the government to seize Iceland's assets. Finally someone admits to it. I've been claiming exactly that for months and everyone calls me crazy! ------ I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it.
Wilson Klime Caldari Naval Shipyards	Posted - 2009.01.30 02:42:00 - [48] Every time I see a topic about this I facepalm. So what if your paying a little extra atm, buy some GTC's until the global credit crisis is over. Works out as about 11 quid a month and saves you a few quid. After the credit crisis the value of the pound will go back to the original value. Just like in the credit crisis in the early '90's. UK residents will pay around ú9/month again. Continuously whine about the 20 pence a day rise in subscription and CCP does change it to ú15/month, you will be out of pocket forever, not just for the duration of the crisis. All those pennies you are counting go bye-bye forever.
Marisal	Posted - 2009.01.30 02:44:00 - [49] Originally by: Wilson Klime Every time I see a topic about this I facepalm. So what if your paying a little extra atm, buy some GTC's until the global credit crisis is over. Works out as about 11 quid a month and saves you a few quid. After the credit crisis the value of the pound will go back to the original value. Just like in the credit crisis in the early '90's. UK residents will pay around ú9/month again. Continuously whine about the 20 pence a day rise in subscription and CCP does change it to ú15/month, you will be out of pocket forever, not just for the duration of the crisis. All those pennies you are counting go bye-bye forever. Chances are eve will be over by the time we actually climb out of this economic recession.
Wilson Klime Caldari Naval Shipyards	Posted - 2009.01.30 02:51:00 - [50] Originally by: Marisal Chances are eve will be over by the time we actually climb out of this economic recession. Eve will end in 18 months - 2 years from now?
Major Deviant	Posted - 2009.01.30 03:03:00 - [51] Originally by: Marisal Are you friggen kidding me I can't get past the first line in that statement half the friggen world trades in USD Ok, what about the other half? It doesn't exist?
Marisal	Posted - 2009.01.30 03:05:00 - [52] Originally by: Wilson Klime Originally by: Marisal Chances are eve will be over by the time we actually climb out of this economic recession. Eve will end in 18 months - 2 years from now? I salute you sir for been an optimist your what will make the market get back on track, but two years is a little two optimistic we've only just wandered into recession after a fairly large banking crisis, we've yet to see the full affects of the recession kick in there will be increasing unemployment probably for the next year with the loss of many businesses that struggle to cope with the change in pace of the economy 2 years time we may have turned the corner and be starting to see some minimal growth again but to get the economy back to a point that is an acceptable level of growth may be 4-6 years off
Marisal	Posted - 2009.01.30 03:08:00 - [53] Originally by: Major Deviant Originally by: Marisal Are you friggen kidding me I can't get past the first line in that statement half the friggen world trades in USD Ok, what about the other half? It doesn't exist? Euro, Yen, Sterling in that order, you were talking like the US was been forced to conduct trade in currencies unfavourable to its economy
Major Deviant	Posted - 2009.01.30 03:13:00 - [54] Originally by: Marisal Originally by: Major Deviant Originally by: Marisal Are you friggen kidding me I can't get past the first line in that statement half the friggen world trades in USD Ok, what about the other half? It doesn't exist? Euro, Yen, Sterling in that order, you were talking like the US was been forced to conduct trade in currencies unfavourable to its economy But you said you did not read past the first line... Maybe you should read the whole paragraph before coming to a conclusion as to what I was talking about.
Khemul Zula Amarr Keisen Trade League	Posted - 2009.01.30 03:14:00 - [55] Originally by: Major Deviant Originally by: Marisal Are you friggen kidding me I can't get past the first line in that statement half the friggen world trades in USD Ok, what about the other half? It doesn't exist? For most intents and purposes...yes.
Jhagiti Tyran Mortis Angelus The Church.	Posted - 2009.01.30 03:14:00 - [56] Originally by: Khemul Zula Originally by: Jhagiti Tyran Originally by: Major Deviant You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? Yes because UK EVE players really did get the government to seize Iceland's assets. Finally someone admits to it. I've been claiming exactly that for months and everyone calls me crazy! I asked Gordon Brown on MSN to do it.
Joss Sparq Caldari ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.30 04:00:00 - [57] As an Australian I'm quite used to paying for things in anything but my own currency when shopping online. However, I encourage CCP to support their British based consumers when it comes to purchasing CCP products (including game time) in their own currency. (God Save The Queen)
Marisal	Posted - 2009.01.30 04:04:00 - [58] Ammount of Icelandic Krona (ISK) per currency CurrencyYear CUR---2003 , 2004 , 2005 , 2006 , 2007 , 2008 USD -- 72.37 , 64.05 , 68.31 , 66.22 , 72.28 , 126.05 GBP -- 129.63 , 118.43 , 123.2 , 130.3 , 142.1 , 194.1 EUR -- 88.02 , 81.45 , 84.24 , 88.03 , 108.88 , 166.48 Between 2003 and 2008 the ammount of ISK per 1 unit of currency USD increased by 53.68ISK a 74.17% Rise in the value of the dollar against isk or a 57.41% decrease in the value of the isk against the dollar GBP increased by 64.47ISK a 49.73% Rise in the value of the pound against isk or a 66.78% decrease in the value of the isk against the pound EUR increased by 78.46ISK a 89.14% Rise in the value of the euro against the isk or a 52.87% decrease in the value of the isk against the Euro USD14.99 2003=1084.85ISK -- 2008=1889.49ISK EUR14.99 2003=1319.48ISK -- 2008=2495.6ISK So what does all this mean, well US customers have been paying less than their european counterparts. But based on exchange rate data the change in amount of ISK per EUR is greater meaning if your prices had tracked based on a fixed ISK amount then you'd be paying a greater increase in EUR than anyone that was paying in USD would have ever had. So far from all the griping in this thread that the US customers have had a hard time... they haven't neither have European customers. How ever now we come to GBP for up the top you can see I included a GBP to isk direct conversion. But GBP paying customers are most likely to have their subscription costs quated at them in Euro so we need to convert to euro's first CUR -- -- -- -- 2003 , 2004 , 2005 , 2006 , 2007 , 2008 1GBP>EUR -- -- -- 1.47 , 1.45 , 1.46 , 1.48 , 1.31 , 1.17 1GBP>EUR>ISK -- 129.7 , 118.49 , 123.27 , 130.33 , 143.07 , 194.64 You'll notice though there are minor variations the value of the GBP>EUR>ISK conversion is fairly similar to the direct GBP to ISK conversion how people from the UK arent paying a fixed value like those from the US or EUROZONE we are actually subject to the exchange rate affecting the transaction in greater real time in the US or EUROZONE, in the US or the EUROZONE the entire economy of that particular currency needs to absorb the change in exchange rate before the change in value is felt. In short if you not in a economy who's currency is the EURO or the USD your screwed by having to pay in euro's or usd's rather than directly in your currency converted to ISK and yes that does include those paying in the GBP, however if CCP had fixed the prices everyone pays in ISK originally, everyone would be paying less in our own currencies now than we would have been a year ago, infact having a fixed USD and EUR price for the game means that CCP is roughly earning 50% less per customer than it was in 2003. I think I understand now why the marketing department is screaming to get the box launch out there the player base needs to drastically expand to keep the cash thats coming in at an adequate level for reinvestment. I know its a lil long but worth the read.
Marisal	Posted - 2009.01.30 04:20:00 - [59] I can see why originally CCP didn't consider offering GBP as one of the fixed price currencies simply it was too strong against the isk at the time, they couldn't have realistically given it a similar numerical price without ppl going... wtf im not paying that much, or ppl from Euro, Us going wtf why is British price so cheap. Now as currency values are approaching very similar levels since the launch of eve, its probably the ideal time to offer a GBP fixed price while actually not been any cheaper on UK customers in the long term it would reduce the feeling of alienation and feeling of that there now paying alot more than they used to, numerically they are in value they aren't. Thats the key thing to take from it its perspective those paying in the pound are numerically paying more because of the conversion to the euro before payment, in terms of isk value they aren't paying any more while those paying in euro directly ie their currency in the wallet is euro and the USD are paying less in real world value.
Marisal	Posted - 2009.01.30 05:17:00 - [60] Edited by: Marisal on 30/01/2009 05:19:33 Originally by: Major Deviant I will repeat myself: I am not from Iceland. Regarding your comment, draconian? I might agree with you if not for the international crisis. It was more like state bullying, "we are doing it because we can and you can not do anything about it". Why then the UK goverment did not take prior similar measures with Lehman Bros assets? Considerable larger amounts but wait... it was a US financial institution. Too big a country to pick on? If the UK had taken similar steps in a similar situation against an hypothetical EU member: a) Big slap from Brussels to UK b) Unfreezing of said assets as it is against EU legistlation which is above UK law especially in terms of bilateral member relationships (except in matters regarding constitution). Sadly EU legistaltion does not govern realations with non EU members such as Iceland. c) Huge fine form the European courts d) if UK kept singing the same tune, major diplomatic incident (recall/expulsion of ambassador or worse) and if UK stayed pigheaded e) UK kicked out of the EU f) Huge European crisis to put it lightly As for an earlier comment of mine regarding Icelanders not having the best opinion about british now, I bet you that the average Icelander would not have the slightest problem to sit down, have a beer and chat about anything you can imagine with a random brit. But pls do not mention that these were draconian measures and that they were needed. I was a political move for internal consumption. The UK goverment decided to save few cartloads of pounds and damage Britain's realation with Iceland and also cause colateral damage with many other coutries that did not like this move and also look sceptically at Britain now. So you still think was it worth it? The irony is that I favoured Labour when I was living there....Then again the torries would have done something more extreme though, likee...invasion? you need to read a bit more, the reason we didn't need to take any action about lehmans brothers us because it declared bankruptcy and almost immediately it was bought up and the investments in it protected and maintained by other businesses, in short the money didn't just disappear. the Icelandic banks without prior warning froze access to international account holders which included a number of uk local governments, you'd be mighty ****ed if your bank suddenly said no you can't have your cash. Secondly the Icelandic government only made moves to secure domestic deposits nothing covering international deposits in short the the international deposits simply could have disappeared without any consequence to iceland. The uk financial authorities then FREEZE uk based assets of the Icelandic banks to prevent Icelandic banks using them to cover Icelandic domestic deposits in the increasing likelyhood that the UK government would likely have to foot on behalf of the Icelandic banks failing to pay up. Completely different situations, if Icelandic government had simply acted to secure international deposits in their banking system it could have all been avoided.
Eran Laude Gallente The Aduro Protocol	Posted - 2009.01.30 07:33:00 - [61] Originally by: Major Deviant You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? Legislation comprehension fail right there. The relevant laws needed to tackle the problem of several tens of billions of British savings being trapped in failed Icelandic banks were part of the anti-terror legislation; we never called them terrorists, but as is the case with several other Parliamentary acts, their actual role is much broader than their title, which just defines their main purpose. The legislation doesn't have to be used to specifically combat terrorism where it is relevant. Please go back and develop a greater understanding of the UK Parliament's legislation before posting that rubbish again.
Nexus Kinnon Genos Occidere	Posted - 2009.01.30 08:09:00 - [62] Edited by: Nexus Kinnon on 30/01/2009 08:09:25 It's just plain embarrassing being British with people like you spouting *******s about how other people "hate our country". You sound American, sort yourself out.
BLAIYNE Shadow Play	Posted - 2009.01.30 08:53:00 - [63] Originally by: Asuka Smith As it happens most countries have atrocious government and the populace is completely out of step with the party line. The Icelanders probably do not even hate Brown as much as some people in the UK. QFT, especially the bolded part. And I'm British.
Camilo Cienfuegos Earned In Blood	Posted - 2009.01.30 09:24:00 - [64] Quote: It's just plain embarrassing being British with people like you spouting *****s about how other people "hate our country". You sound American, sort yourself out. This. Whilst the american may know that the world hates him, the attitude would be one of "** you". We limeys also know that the world hates us, but that's ok because we hate ourselves too. There's something rather joyous about coming from one of the world's oldest imperial powers. I'm sure the Dutch can appreciate this and hell, after the Boer war it's this common realisation of our position in a modern world that keeps things civil between countries like Netherlands and the UK. History is a very heavy thing to carry around. Anyway, remember that CCP also pays for it's servers in GBP, as they are hosted in UK. I wonder what effect that is having on the cost of keeping the cluster alive...
Morsus Argent	Posted - 2009.01.30 09:46:00 - [65] Edited by: Morsus Argent on 30/01/2009 09:46:37 Originally by: Rutger Centemus ... That was a nice argument against your hallucination of what's being asked for and the reasoning behind it, but sadly it's not really relevant to anyone except the voices in your head. I'm sure they loved it though. Once again, being able to offer subscriptions in GBP would potentially benefit CCP, just as offering subscriptions in both USD and EUR does, even though varying exchange rates mean it will sometimes be cheaper in one currency than another (like it is in USD right now, even allowing for tax). Whether it's worth CCP doing it depends on numerous factors, including how many British subscribers they actually have, but, once again, it is not an unreasonable thing to ask for. Stop acting like the British are demanding to eat your babies. Mmm, babies.
simon perry	Posted - 2009.01.30 09:48:00 - [66] To be honest I canÆt be bothered to read all this thread... when scrolling down all I sore was political crap and country hating. Personally all I know is this time last year I was paying ú14 maybe just under for a three month GTC, where as now I am paying ú22 maybe just over for a two month GTC... So in my opinion our subscription does need to be reviewed because at this current time I am having to expire one of my accounts due to the outrageous prices. Baring this in mind unless CCP act how many other subscriptions are they going to lose? PREVIOUSLY û 2 X GTC = ú28 = 3 MONTHS 2009 - 2 X GTC = ú44 = 2 MONTHS So yeah IÆm behind you... Now letÆs get back to subject and leave the crap outà
Sade Onyx	Posted - 2009.01.30 09:51:00 - [67] I wonder, when CCP gets its subscription money do they then convert it into their own national currency?.. Or do they have a bank in US and a bank in EU and keep a large part of it there. If they convert all payments into their own currency then I guess their costs have gone through the roof! The servers are in the UK which means they must have some kind of system to pay in GBP, since the icelandic currency has completly crashed I would have thought that collecting the UK subscriptions in sterling then paying their server bills in the UK would be a lot more efficient. Bottom line is, in this economic situation it really would be beneficial for CCP to accept GBP subscriptions, it would lower the UK customers cost and would probably translate into more profit.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:07:00 - [68] Originally by: Shionoya Risa Edited by: Shionoya Risa on 29/01/2009 21:00:22 Originally by: Major Deviant You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? UK Market != UK Government. Disclaimer: 'UK Market' defines active subscribers of the online computer game, EVE Online, and no other parties. It's the UK consumer base that installed the UK government. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Saphirro	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:18:00 - [69] Originally by: Major Deviant You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? Short memory span? Fair enough. I'll be happy then when all the UK players pull out of financing one of the Icelandic companies any further. Maybe the UK Government should pass a bill that becomes law preventing the UK market from giving any more money to CCP. Now, which one of the two should CCP realistically concern themselves with? The UK Market cancelling their subs because it costs too much, or the the UK government banning it's people outright from paying? ____________________________________ Google - 'Rata Nrnima bunyip issler'
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:24:00 - [70] Originally by: Major Deviant Originally by: Marisal Sorry can't let this pass, if your going to point fingers at the UK government then fair do's we'll accept we used draconian measures, but you have to admit that it was your governments mismanagement of the economic crisis and not supporting the banks that they knew were in trouble leading to Icelandic bank freezing certain assets include the money that the UK had place in Icelandic banks (supporting the Icelandic economy). Our reaction was probably a little over the top but when debtors can't pay up what do you do seize assets. I will repeat myself: I am not from Iceland. Regarding your comment, draconian? I might agree with you if not for the international crisis. It was more like state bullying, "we are doing it because we can and you can not do anything about it". Why then the UK goverment did not take prior similar measures with Lehman Bros assets? Considerable larger amounts but wait... it was a US financial institution. Too big a country to pick on? If the UK had taken similar steps in a similar situation against an hypothetical EU member: a) Big slap from Brussels to UK b) Unfreezing of said assets as it is against EU legistlation which is above UK law especially in terms of bilateral member relationships (except in matters regarding constitution). Sadly EU legistaltion does not govern realations with non EU members such as Iceland. c) Huge fine form the European courts d) if UK kept singing the same tune, major diplomatic incident (recall/expulsion of ambassador or worse) and if UK stayed pigheaded e) UK kicked out of the EU f) Huge European crisis to put it lightly As for an earlier comment of mine regarding Icelanders not having the best opinion about british now, I bet you that the average Icelander would not have the slightest problem to sit down, have a beer and chat about anything you can imagine with a random brit. But pls do not mention that these were draconian measures and that they were needed. I was a political move for internal consumption. The UK goverment decided to save few cartloads of pounds and damage Britain's realation with Iceland and also cause colateral damage with many other coutries that did not like this move and also look sceptically at Britain now. So you still think was it worth it? The irony is that I favoured Labour when I was living there....Then again the torries would have done something more extreme though, likee...invasion?
Saphirro	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:30:00 - [71] Originally by: Rodj Blake Originally by: Shionoya Risa Edited by: Shionoya Risa on 29/01/2009 21:00:22 Originally by: Major Deviant You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? UK Market != UK Government. Disclaimer: 'UK Market' defines active subscribers of the online computer game, EVE Online, and no other parties. It's the UK consumer base that installed the UK government. They all voted for Labour. I read that too.
Saphirro	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:31:00 - [72] Originally by: Major Deviant You want an Icelandic Company to show goodwill to the UK market, when the UK goverment used anti-terror legistlation to seize Icelandic assets just few months ago? Short memory span? Our logs show nothing...
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:43:00 - [73] Originally by: cpt Mark Edited by: cpt Mark on 30/01/2009 10:28:58 Made a nice long post that got lost in internet, but basically the guy talking about Uk being kicked out of the EU was aload of rubbish. Also, people don't appreciate this only concerns CCP and UK customers. I have no doubt many UK customers will stop playing the game because of increased costs. Therefore, any reduction in possible profits by allowing UK members to pay in GBP will actually be less than reduction in profits due to less customers. There is also the added benefit that customers wont head off to competition, and EVE can sustain its increase in player base. I voted for EVE to win many MMORPG awards, please don't let me think this was bad. So unless CCP does as you say, eve is going to die and your over 9000 friends are all going to quit eve? It sucks for you, but there is no reason at all why they should make it cheaper for you to play. Just pay what everyone else pays, not their fault the gbp is dropping. If they start giving you special treatment, where should they stop? Why should you get it and zimbabwe not?
Alexi Borizkova Caldari New Age Solutions New Age Solutions Amalgamated	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:44:00 - [74] Originally by: Vincent Death I would just like to confirm that contrary to what other posters may say, the UK is a sinkhole of pure evil which makes Mordor look like Candy Land. We haven't forgotten about our former colonies either, so watch your back America, watch your back. We watch many, many backs.
Saphirro	Posted - 2009.01.30 10:55:00 - [75] Originally by: Furb Killer It sucks for you, but there is no reason at all why they should make it cheaper for you to play. Just pay what everyone else pays, not their fault the gbp is dropping. Just pay what everyone else pays? Isn't that kind of the point of the OP? I do very much love the head in the sand mentality. Fact is, that some, yes some, not all but some people will find EvE too expensive to keep paying for, and with unsubbed training gone too will pack the game in for good. How is that good for CCP? Of course it will be based purely on analysis, very much like unsubbed training - Is the potential benefit of squeezing more money out of a weak currency worth more to the bottom line than reducing the cost and maintaining great numbers (or even encouraging more, especially with the Box going retail in March) I don't know, neither do you. CCP probably don't either to be honest however they have two major things that concern them: Bottom line profits and PR of the game via concurrent logins records. ____________________________________ Google - 'Rata Nrnima bunyip issler'
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:01:00 - [76] Couldn't have put it better myself.
ollobrains2 Gallente New Eve Order Holdings	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:05:00 - [77] ccp have stated before in a dev blog and various postings no less that a) they operate in several currencies US$, Euros chinesse yuan icelandic currency, they are also engaged in currency hedging which would balance out the risks. They wouldnt be undertaking this massive expansion if Real life profits were in danger dont forget they are owned by various private investors who have a long term interest and as such dont expect to see things move much they are making good profit margins eve is expanding its a good time
Elena Morin'staal Minmatar Tau Online Explorator Corp New Eden Research	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:09:00 - [78] As a Brit, I'm a bit upset that the costs have risen for me to play, but its nothing major yet, my last GTC was about ú3 more. Don't get me wrong, should it go very bad and I end up paying loads, I might have to consider having a break, but at the moment its an annoyance, nothing more. And then, of course, you have to account for the fact that we had it very good - even when I started last year, a 60 day eve sub was costing me around ú17! So I'm not complaining, if it rises above a manageable level, yeah I may take a break, otherwise its not too bad. Please remember not all us brits are whining that we should get it cheaper than everyone else, most of us are nice people.
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:15:00 - [79] Elano you have not read posts and have an unstructured argument.
Lazal Nahn Amarr Nebula Rasa Vanguard Nebula Rasa	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:27:00 - [80] Correct me if I am wrong but you pay roughly the same as customers paying in Euro. You pay 13 pounds which is about 14,50Ç. So its basically the same. But as many others have said already; It's not our fault you remained isolated and voted against the Ç. It was forseeable that the Ç would become the strongest currency but still you didn't want it. We respected your decision but now you should stand by it and not whine.
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:30:00 - [81] Yes, we wanted to be different and so didn't take the Euro. Now let us exercise our right to be different and allow us to pay in our national currency. Thank you.
Lazal Nahn Amarr Nebula Rasa Vanguard Nebula Rasa	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:35:00 - [82] Oh right and after that CCP will offer it to everyone. Players from Zimbabwe, Thailand, Indonesia, Egypt etc. What a mess that would be. It really quite simple. The 2 largest currencies are the $ and the Ç in that order. Even that with a camparably very small percentage comes first the Yen and then the pound. So its reasonable to only allow the sub to be paid in the 2 largest currencies. If the pound was comparable to Ç or $ I'm sure CCP would offer you to pay in pounds.But it isnt by a large margin that is the trouble and should be understandable.
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:40:00 - [83] Originally by: Lazal Nahn Oh right and after that CCP will offer it to everyone. Players from Zimbabwe, Thailand, Indonesia, Egypt etc. What a mess that would be. It really quite simple. The 2 largest currencies are the $ and the Ç in that order. Even that with a camparably very small percentage comes first the Yen and then the pound. So its reasonable to only allow the sub to be paid in the 2 largest currencies. If the pound was comparable to Ç or $ I'm sure CCP would offer you to pay in pounds.But it isnt by a large margin that is the trouble and should be understandable. 1) The gaming industry has already adapted and offered games in GBP - CCP is behind the industry. 2)The UK is in no way comparable to all the other countries you just listed, and the GBP although weaker, is a very stable currency. 3) If you walked into a UK shop and wanted to buy something in dollars you would be ***** slapped. If there's any other irrelevant considerations please feel free to do so, but I'm sure many other European players have already posted them.
Lazal Nahn Amarr Nebula Rasa Vanguard Nebula Rasa	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:42:00 - [84] Yes its so stable that you are complaining about the unfavourable exchange rates right now.
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:44:00 - [85] No case to answer.
Elena Morin'staal Minmatar Tau Online Explorator Corp New Eden Research	Posted - 2009.01.30 11:57:00 - [86] Originally by: Lazal Nahn Correct me if I am wrong but you pay roughly the same as customers paying in Euro. You pay 13 pounds which is about 14,50Ç. So its basically the same. Yeah, it works out roughly the same. We just had a long time of favourable exchange rates. As I said, I'm certainly not complaining, just wanted to make the point that not all British people are whining and *****ing about it :)
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.30 12:08:00 - [87] firstly, this isn't a whine. secondly i accept you may not have been hit by the economic crisis like the majority of the UK population, which is fine. Just don't ***** to the rest of us about it please. Also, if you are under the belief a 1:1 ratio is 'the same' you are incredibly mistaken.
Morsus Argent	Posted - 2009.01.30 12:13:00 - [88] Originally by: Lazal Nahn Oh right and after that CCP will offer it to everyone. Players from Zimbabwe, Thailand, Indonesia, Egypt etc. What a mess that would be. Well, no. Suggesting they offer it to the 6th largest economy in the world (based on GDP, if you include the EU as a separate whole) would not mean they should also do the same for the 135th, 33rd, 22nd, 52nd, etc. largest economies. Originally by: Lazal Nahn It really quite simple. The 2 largest currencies are the $ and the Ç in that order. Even that with a camparably very small percentage comes first the Yen and then the pound. So its reasonable to only allow the sub to be paid in the 2 largest currencies. Faulty reasoning. That's an argument for allowing the sub to be paid in USD and EUR. It does not follow that they should not allow the sub to be paid in GBP. As I've said, it basically comes down to whether the number of British subscribers make it worth it to CCP in the long run. Either way, it's still not an unreasonable thing to ask for.
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.30 12:16:00 - [89] Quote: Just pay what everyone else pays? Isn't that kind of the point of the OP? If that is his point, then why is he whining so much that he wants to pay less than everyon else pays? Many people just buy GTCs in USD, also from euro countries. If you want to pay the same as everyone else pays, then do the same as everyone else does...
Ralitge boyter Minmatar	Posted - 2009.01.30 12:20:00 - [90] Edited by: Ralitge boyter on 30/01/2009 12:22:18 Edited by: Ralitge boyter on 30/01/2009 12:21:41 --Can't spell-- Edited by: Ralitge boyter on 30/01/2009 12:21:38 -- Server error -- I vaguely remember a lot of brits flying all over europe having a big mounth and throwing money around like it was nothing because back then the euro and the pound where not 1.4 = 1 but more like 2.something = 1. Not that that is a bad thing hell if it was the other way around I am sure may europeans woudl have done the same in the UK But I guess that it is not so much a problem of CCP at this point I mean they are still getting a steady stream of money in and they are happy, as soon as CCP starts seeing a big enough number of UK customers leaving or a drop off in the number of new UK subscribers then they will certainly act. Till that time I expect you to have to sit this one out and hope for better times for your currency. Oh, and no I don't hate the UK, I feel for you when I see the kind of people that traveled all over europe for a stag party... I guess that just gives you guys and girls one more reason to hope your currency recovers quickly. (then again the dutch are most likely no better they just have the euro and thus don't save anything by traveling to another country for a stag party) ------------------------------------------- Should you disagree with me, well I guess that is because I disagree with you. If you have a problem with that please feel free not to tell me.
Lord Fitz Project Amargosa	Posted - 2009.01.30 12:40:00 - [91] Originally by: cpt Mark Is it possible for CCP to revise UK subscription fees to be payable in GBP too? Also, Zimbabwe dollars. That would be good. My sub would be worth twice in my local currency (obviously not either of the above) what it was a year ago, and you're ***ing about a 1.4 - 1.1x drop ? Should they have put the cost up when the USD was falling? If we've discovered one thing about CCP and their billing department lately, more money per subscriber is worth far far far more to them than more subscribers. Quote: Server costs are also decreased as the value of the pound drops - so any loss of profits may be counter-balanced. The majority of CCP's costs will be in Iceland, China and the USA. The costs of the servers is probably tied to USD. The minimal staffing costs to maintain the servers in London, are unlikely to be anywhere near the amount that would be lost be even an insignificant GBP discount. Quote: Thanks for listening to one customer May one succeed where tens of thousands continually fail. Quote:** Well, no. Suggesting they offer it to the 6th largest economy in the world (based on GDP, if you include the EU as a separate whole) would not mean they should also do the same for the 135th, 33rd, 22nd, 52nd, etc. largest economies. It doesn't matter about the size of the economy, it matters somewhat the size of the player base in that country. Also the countries that CCP have offices in, also what extra paperwork is required to trade in another currency. Also, they have already faced significant issues with just two currencies when one gets devalued, they will lose far more customers if they have to then put the price up in that currency to make of for its falling value. The least offensive option is for them to do nothing. You blame your currency and they make the same money they made before. If they add your currency then it devalues, they make less than they did before, or they put the price up. Both are losing situations for them.
Lord Fitz Project Amargosa	Posted - 2009.01.30 12:45:00 - [92] Originally by: cpt Mark firstly, this isn't a whine. secondly i accept you may not have been hit by the economic crisis like the majority of the UK population, which is fine. Just don't ***** to the rest of us about it please. Also, if you are under the belief a 1:1 ratio is 'the same' you are incredibly mistaken. If the game becomes cheaper to play in pounds, people in other countries will simply exchange theirs for pounds and all buy their game time that way. Which means a significant drop in revenue for CCP. PLEX prices are a very good indicator of what is hitting the world, a reluctance to spend money on luxuries when they don't have to. But the increasing sub numbers mean that most people don't regard playing eve itself as something they could do without. So not seeing the threat to CCP here.....
Element 22 Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.30 12:47:00 - [93] Dear CCP, The markets of all kinds are fluctuating wildly. Being of the inquisitive nature I visited a site I believe is called reddit where I learned about many things such as police-public interaction, political policy, reasonable and positive discourse and debate, and of course libertarianism and its god Ron Paul. I have become intrigued by these libertarians strident claims that fiat monetary policy is doomed to failure and that a standard backed currency is the way to go. I guess what I'm asking is how many grams of gold should I pay per month for my subscription? Sincerely, Element 22 P.S. How should I send this gold to get past your Viking Home Guard now stationed around the border and doing customs?
Morsus Argent	Posted - 2009.01.30 12:47:00 - [94] Originally by: Lord Fitz It doesn't matter about the size of the economy, it matters somewhat the size of the player base in that country. Also the countries that CCP have offices in, also what extra paperwork is required to trade in another currency. That's why I said "...it basically comes down to whether the number of British subscribers make it worth it to CCP in the long run." Originally by: Lord Fitz The least offensive option is for them to do nothing. You blame your currency and they make the same money they made before. Higher local prices = less subscribers = less money. Not the same money. Originally by: Lord Fitz If they add your currency then it devalues, they make less than they did before, or they put the price up. Both are losing situations for them. And if the currency strengthens it's a winning situation for them. In the long-term, if they got the price right, it should be a net win, in principle.
Morsus Argent	Posted - 2009.01.30 12:49:00 - [95] Originally by: Lord Fitz If the game becomes cheaper to play in pounds, people in other countries will simply exchange theirs for pounds and all buy their game time that way. Which means a significant drop in revenue for CCP. It's cheaper in USD than it is in EUR right now. So by that logic, CCP should stop accepting payment in USD.
Eimrich Keslake	Posted - 2009.01.30 12:53:00 - [96] Okay, I think that a perfectly mature comment/request has turned into an incredibly childish "my country is better than your country" arguement and it needs to stop. As a person who was previously in the UK military and has a BA (Hons) in Politcal Science, I'm GOING to comment on this thread by simply shouting "GROW UP!" Firstly, Icelanders are p*ssed at the UK GOVERNMENT for using anti-terrorist legislation to freeze assets. Basically, Gordon Brown panicked and used the first law he could to try to stop things getting worse. This was discourteous and a little silly. Secondly, the average UK citizen has a very high opinion of Icelanders (and most people of the Scandanavian cultural ethincity), only a few small minded idiots with not grasp of politics actually dislike Iceland. If you've lost savings, then you will be angry, and you may blame the whole country, but that's subjective, it's an emotional over reaction. Thirdly, the UK has had several "run ins" with Iceland over the years. Remember the "Cod Wars", maybe not, but read about them. This will end, and we'll all be friend again. Fourthly, the UK is not "evil". Where did that idea even come from? Just because a country once had an empire and is some cases did immoral things (though very very few in proportion to the sheer size of the old British empire - think of the "Belgian Empire" - that was TINY, only a handful of countries, yet it massacred many people in the Congo) doesn't make it evil. Germany's sphere of imperial influence was tiny compared to Britains, but remember history - let's not go there. We all know that in a PURELY military sense, Britain has the manpower, military might, military harware and ability to utterly destroy several European countries without breaking a sweat. (The UK has the second largest (official) military budget on the planet and it's armed forces have more members than the populations of several countries) but talking up a war is pathetic, because this is just a case if Icelands regulatory authorities taking it's eye off the ball and the UK government overreacting. I'm sure that the majority of us wish Iceland the best and hope that it can sort it's financial problems out soon and that we can ALL work to get through this fincancial problem quickly and make the world a better place. For goodness' sake, I always thought that the online community was a shining beacon of worldwide solidarity and co-operation. In short, grow up people. Stop throwing jinogistic comments back and forth. Most UK people like Icelanders, regardless of what our mutual governments have done. We're not overly keen on our government either at the moment! I know that the Icelanders are still fond of the UK because a recent news story surfaced about Icelanders donating an entire container of warm clothing and blankets to the UK because UK elderley are less geared up to dealing with the recent cold spell. Good on you Iceland - I'd say "God bless you", but I'm an atheist. If this sounds like a political statement, well I'm sorry, but my wife says I should run for office! Now, can we please stop with the silly comments?
Element 22 Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.30 13:06:00 - [97] Might I add that both Iceland and the U.K have blood pudding as a national dish. You're practically brothers! Honestly, this isn't terribly bad jingoistic comments, I'm from the U.S. (still there matter of a fact...unless they moved my apartment while I was sleeping...) and we've had to deal with worse during the past 8 years. I kind of get it why you GBP payers are kind of ****ed, while you still have a greater conversion rate objectively you're paying more inside the country while not getting raises so subjectively it's getting much more expensive for you. But have you wondered what CCP has to do in order to process USD alone while working in Iceland? If they got GBP how would they convert it? Almost all the banks inside Iceland are shutdown or tottering, they would have to find and outside bank to process the conversion while getting through all the bureaucratic red tape.that governments naturally have for this kind of business. This alone would probably mean hiring another 3-6 people just to deal with that. And if they make this break for you then they'll have to possibly open it up to the other countries like Canada. If you really want this I suggest you start a petition of British players so CCP can see who many of you there are. If you're too small they might have to say sorry, but if you can prove that there are enough of you they might try to do that. Valve is a huge company based in a country that's still sort of financially solvent (er...yeah, let's leave it at that, it's not feasible in the long term, but for now...) while CCP is a small company inside a country where people are starving. They may not say it but I'm pretty sure they're supporting charities quitly publically or at least under the table.
Lazal Nahn Amarr Nebula Rasa Vanguard Nebula Rasa	Posted - 2009.01.30 13:20:00 - [98] Originally by: Eimrich Keslake We all know that in a PURELY military sense, Britain has the manpower, military might, military harware and ability to utterly destroy several European countries without breaking a sweat. Welcome to the 21st century. 19th century imperialists are that way ---->
Element 22 Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.30 13:23:00 - [99] Originally by: Lazal Nahn Originally by: Eimrich Keslake We all know that in a PURELY military sense, Britain has the manpower, military might, military harware and ability to utterly destroy several European countries without breaking a sweat. Welcome to the 21st century. 19th century imperialists are that way ----> Damn liberal hippies, NUKE RUSSIA!
Joss Sparq Caldari ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.30 13:24:00 - [100] Originally by: Furb Killer If they start giving you special treatment, where should they stop? Why should you get it and zimbabwe not? Zimbabwe doesn't have money, it does however have an abundance of brightly colored toilet paper.
Tallaran Kouros Caldari Arcane Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.30 13:25:00 - [101] Originally by: Eimrich Keslake As a person who was previously in the UK military and has a BA (Hons) in Politcal Science, I'm GOING to comment on this thread by simply shouting "GROW UP!" Firstly, Icelanders are pssed at the UK GOVERNMENT for using anti-terrorist legislation to freeze assets. Basically, Gordon Brown panicked and used the first law he could to try to stop things getting worse. This was discourteous and a little silly. No, it wasn't and with an alleged degree in Political Science you really should know better. People keep saying "anti terror legislation" and making some sort of unspoken comparison to the likes of the IRA, ETA, Al Qaida etc etc but that's a flawed arguement. Granted it was legislation enacted with terrorism in mind, but the specific provisions used related to anything that was a threat to the stability of the UK financial system, the UK banking system and the UK economy. Now, given that many local authorities, police services and NHS trusts had money tied up with the icelandic banks then yes, i'd say the risk that these assets would be sized and used to compensate Icelandic savers (going against the assurances previously given by the Icelandic Government) certainly do constitute a threat to the stability of the UK economy and financial situation. I supported the asset freeze for that reason and continue to support it - it was the right decision in the circumstances. But this isn't about the asset freeze, it's about people - yet again - winging. Our economy is *ed because of poor political and economic decisions. When the good times rolled we all enjoyed them - I personally had a fantastic time in NL a few years ago when it was almost 2 Euro to the Pound, but the good times are over. The onus isn't on CCP to sort out our economic problems - in a recession goods from overseas cost more and what's happening shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone. Drink a couple less pints each month, cook at room rather than having that take away, just suck it up and deal with it. Quote:** I'm sure that the majority of us wish Iceland the best and hope that it can sort it's financial problems out soon and that we can ALL work to get through this fincancial problem quickly and make the world a better place. This.
Dwain Chambers Big S Triangle	Posted - 2009.01.30 13:38:00 - [102] Originally by: Lord Fitz Should they have put the cost up when the USD was falling? They did: they re-structured GTC's and removed ghost training. Basically a price increase by any other name. The UK is the 2nd largest consumer country of Eve-online (according to the chart at the bottom of this page) with a similair number of subscribers coming from the UK as come from the eurozone. So to argue that providing billing in GBP is as logical as providing billing in Zimbabwean dollars is plainly ridiculous... the UK is CCP's second largest market and as many customers have GBP as their national currency as have the Euro... this is according to CCP's own figures. Of course it makes sense for CCP to only implement billing in GBP if it makes them money (or prevents them losing it) however how to tell if this is the case is a very inexact science, waiting to see if people quit isn't a great strategy... it's too late by then. People in the UK are evidently unhappy about the cost of Eve (witness the number of times threads similair to this one have been made in the last few weeks). So to keep the good will of the players I would suggest that it would make sense for CCP to bill in GBP (just like WoW and Steam have started doing, for example). In short pricing in GBP stops CCP's second largest market falling victim to sudden, massive price fluctuations due to the whims of the global money markets (additionally this works both ways, see the way so many were buying GTCs from US websites when the dollar was relatively weak, this would be reduced if the sub cost didn't already involve a foreign currency transaction as many banks charge for this service). I would also suggest that billing in Rubles, CAD & AUD may be a good idea.
Eimrich Keslake	Posted - 2009.01.30 13:58:00 - [103] Originally by: Element 22 Originally by: Lazal Nahn Originally by: Eimrich Keslake We all know that in a PURELY military sense, Britain has the manpower, military might, military harware and ability to utterly destroy several European countries without breaking a sweat. Welcome to the 21st century. 19th century imperialists are that way ----> Damn liberal hippies, NUKE RUSSIA! Okay - I wasn't being 19th century,or even boasting about the UKs might - I was stating a verifiable fact, that's all. I despise imperialism and jingoism. In fact, at the moment I pretty much despise most of humanity. Post modern selfish creatures, I'd like to gather up a few tens of thousands of the best, brightest and most mature and go start a new civilisation somewhere. Just call me Klaatu.
Squably Minmatar Invenio Inceptum	Posted - 2009.01.30 14:00:00 - [104] Originally by: Major Deviant Seriously though, euro and dollar paying customer had to ride the currency wave for years, enjoy. THIS! Welcome to the real world. /thread
ry ry	Posted - 2009.01.30 14:02:00 - [105] Edited by: ry ry on 30/01/2009 14:03:19 the difference really isn't that much anyway. if you can't afford your sub in euros, i think the money you'd spend on a GBP sub would be better spent on food and shoes for your hungry, barefoot children.
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.30 14:10:00 - [106] Edited by: cpt Mark on 30/01/2009 14:11:20 Also, my bank charges me to pay for items in dollars or euros. Many banks do this. It would be far more efficient if CCP gathered all UK payments in GBP and converted them in a batch (at a lower conversion rate)- or even used them to pay for their server costs in London. Better prices, hardly any hit to revenue. Also, some people have been saying the GBP payment would be less. If you converted your Euro to pounds and paid with pounds, you would be paying exactly the same amount in terms of Euros. If you do not understand this concept please don't post it anymore. .... P.S Iceland is considering joining the European Union.
Gladtobe Edd	Posted - 2009.01.30 16:00:00 - [107] totally... i get charged an extra pound each month on top of my subscription!! Does that mean ccp could charge more if they charged us in pounds or that they could effectively reduce the cost to us? Their choice i guess also the pound's artificially low compared to the euro atm since it's based on a smaller (riskier) economy... euro will catch up in time so ccp won't be losing out in the long run
Flicky G Centrafuge	Posted - 2009.01.30 16:32:00 - [108] Originally by: Avon Originally by: Major Deviant Ask the Americans how they faired when the dollar was sliding for the last three years against any other single currency. It made no difference. They paid $15 all the way through. It makes no difference what that was "worth" on the international market, their local cost didn't change. I was paying a little over ú8.40 3 years ago, and now I am paying nearly ú15. The point here, for those who missed it..... is that, when my non eve-playing friends ask me how much it costs and I can say 'less than two pints of beer'... they will be much more inclined to at least try it out..... Subs have nearly double recently, and people generally have less money atm.... so it will be considerably harder for CCP to attract new players in the UK market. And as we all know, new players is the life blood of any MMO. (the comments 'if you can't afford it don't buy it' show just how dumb some people are, in terms of perpetuating the eve community) And so we're clear - no one likes Gordon Brown or the idea of abusing anti-terror legislation (the same outcome should have been available via more appropriate legislation) F
Saphirro	Posted - 2009.01.30 16:36:00 - [109] Originally by: Lazal Nahn Oh right and after that CCP will offer it to everyone. Players from Zimbabwe, Thailand, Indonesia, Egypt etc. What a mess that would be. Exactly how many subscribers from each of those countries are there for Eve, and without cheating and looking it up - what is the name of currency they use? ____________________________________ Google - 'Rata Nrnima bunyip issler'
Saphirro	Posted - 2009.01.30 16:52:00 - [110] Originally by: Furb Killer If that is his point, then why is he whining so much that he wants to pay less than everyon else pays? Probably because there is no exact value on paying the same as everyone else pays - it's relative. The fact that it costs rather a lot of Pound Sterling to pay for the game in the midst a national and global economic crisis as opposed to two linked currencies is not really a whine and a desire to pay less than anyone else. I'm not totally sure I agree with the argument he put forward, however CCP would likely be thinking about the logistics of this on an ongoing basis to determine whether it's likely to hit their bottom line. The UK playerbase deciding that the game is too costly, as more and more jobs go will affect CCP negatively. The key for any business is which is best? Potential long term profit of a lesser period value vs short term profit of a greater period value. Whichever provides the highest potential and assured value is the way they would likely go. Whine or not (and of course my opinion is: Not) - it's still a valid question and can provide a good debate from mature persons. Looking at the EULA and TOS, you're kind of lucky they don't offer 5, 10 year or lifetime subscriptions and then simply close the servers down after a year or two and make off with your cash. ____________________________________ Google - 'Rata Nrnima bunyip issler'
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.30 17:24:00 - [111] Quote: Subs have nearly double recently, and people generally have less money atm.... so it will be considerably harder for CCP to attract new players in the UK market. And as we all know, new players is the life blood of any MMO. (the comments 'if you can't afford it don't buy it' show just how dumb some people are, in terms of perpetuating the eve community) Did you try the same story at your local computer store when you wanted to get the same stuff for half the money? What did they tell you?
Jobby Minmatar UNITED STAR SYNDICATE	Posted - 2009.01.30 17:25:00 - [112] Posting in another one of these threads.
Scoper's Alt	Posted - 2009.01.30 17:27:00 - [113] Edited by: Scoper''s Alt on 30/01/2009 17:37:07 Originally by: Tallaran Kouros Firstly, Icelanders are pssed at the UK GOVERNMENT for using anti-terrorist legislation to freeze assets. Basically, Gordon Brown panicked and used the first law he could to try to stop things getting worse. This was discourteous and a little silly. People keep saying "anti terror legislation" and making some sort of unspoken comparison to the likes of the IRA, ETA, Al Qaida etc etc but that's a flawed arguement. Granted it was legislation enacted with terrorism in mind, but the specific provisions used related to anything that was a threat to the stability of the UK financial system, the UK banking system and the UK economy. lols The reason why Iceland were justifiably ***ed off is that they were branded terrorists.... as in - the bankruptcy of their own nation was a cunning plan to shaft the UK. Which of course it was not. Public support for the anti-terrorist legislation, which has far eaching powers - the likes we have never seen and go a long way to erroding the Magna Carte (sp?) - was ONLY gaind by claiming that the laws would protect us from similar attrosoties as the 9/11 masacre. Your view that it is justified that these laws are in place with the "specific" objective of protecting the economy from instability, is idiotic. Whilst your opinion may reflect the fact of the matter - it doesn't make it any better. In the same vein, any financial institution which de-stabilises the economy by being too greedy - as we have seen in the last 9 months - should also be branded terrorists. Acutally, this is called capitalism. Yes, there should be laws in place to protect us from these kind of incidents and yes, the asset freeze was the right thing (done in the wrong way) .... but our allys should not be branded terrorists in the process. Not least because it puts them in the same box as the IRA, ETA, Al Qaida etc etc.... it is totally unacceptable to do this. Scoper
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2009.01.30 17:35:00 - [114] Originally by: Furb Killer Quote: Subs have nearly double recently, and people generally have less money atm.... so it will be considerably harder for CCP to attract new players in the UK market. And as we all know, new players is the life blood of any MMO. (the comments 'if you can't afford it don't buy it' show just how dumb some people are, in terms of perpetuating the eve community) Did you try the same story at your local computer store when you wanted to get the same stuff for half the money? What did they tell you? You are missing the point. A ú500 laptop may become easier or harder to afford depending on the economic climate, but it will still be ú500. It won't suddenly cost ú713 because of fluctuations of the international currency markets. If the cost is fixed, then it is easy to budget for. If I lived in the US I would know I would have to pay $15 each month. If I paid in euros I'd have to find Ç15 each month. However, paying in a currency other than one that Eve is billed in means that your monthly cost in your local currency is variable, and that makes things more difficult. If I knew that Eve cost, for example, ú12 per month, every month, then I could make a descision as to it's affordability and budget accordingly. It isn't about paying more or less relative to other currencies, because that already happens between $ and Ç payments, it is about paying a predictable fixed price.
Flicky G Centrafuge	Posted - 2009.01.30 17:40:00 - [115] Originally by: Furb Killer Quote: Subs have nearly double recently, and people generally have less money atm.... so it will be considerably harder for CCP to attract new players in the UK market. And as we all know, new players is the life blood of any MMO. (the comments 'if you can't afford it don't buy it' show just how dumb some people are, in terms of perpetuating the eve community) Did you try the same story at your local computer store when you wanted to get the same stuff for half the money? What did they tell you? Poor analogy - must try harder..... computer prices naturally drop over a 12 month period by at least 50%. Try again? o/ F
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.30 18:26:00 - [116] Avon got a point, you dont even come near having a point. Wtf has the price dropping over time to do with the current price? I can also come to the local store and ask them to buy it for half the price since it will be half the price anyway in 12 months. What do you think they will do then? To make it a better analogy: Now assume you are buying the same stuff at ebay from a non-UK store. Do you think they give a crap about the pound becoming weaker? You still got to pay the same as everyone else.
Eran Laude Gallente The Aduro Protocol	Posted - 2009.01.30 19:35:00 - [117] Originally by: Eimrich Keslake Originally by: Element 22 Originally by: Lazal Nahn Originally by: Eimrich Keslake We all know that in a PURELY military sense, Britain has the manpower, military might, military harware and ability to utterly destroy several European countries without breaking a sweat. Welcome to the 21st century. 19th century imperialists are that way ----> Damn liberal hippies, NUKE RUSSIA! Okay - I wasn't being 19th century,or even boasting about the UKs might - I was stating a verifiable fact, that's all. I despise imperialism and jingoism. In fact, at the moment I pretty much despise most of humanity. Post modern selfish creatures, I'd like to gather up a few tens of thousands of the best, brightest and most mature and go start a new civilisation somewhere. Just call me Klaatu. Verifiable fact? Our conventional armed forces have shrunk year after year for the past three decades, we have one ready and able [and tiny] aircraft carrier [Ocean is in refit, so one of the two Invincibles still active was redeployed as a heli. carrier until it's refit is done and the other is on deployment with 9 harriers maximum . . .] and two year delays on the already-miles-off supercarriers, jeeps that get blown to hell, rifles that jam worse than pretty much any others in NATO, body armour that is more of a hindrance than a help, downsizing the destroyer fleet from 12 to 6, frigates that were all designed for the Cold War, morale that is at a serious low, a stalemate in the only war we've been fighting [ now in it's eighth year ], and the potential downsizing of our SSN fleet from 10 to 4 [albeit of the best sub class built to date], oh, and to boot, the Eurofighter swallowed up more time and money than could ever have been foreseen just to keep us up to date with other nations, despite the fact that the F35 is a similarly powerful warplane and took a lot less time and effort to develop. When you consider that every major military program we've developed or have joined over the past few years has been late, abandoned and/or overbudget, as well as usually downsized from the initial order placed, our conventional forces simply aren't good enough any more. Ruling out any possibility of a nuclear strike due to the incredible political and global consequences, and we have less military capacity than France, despite spending more on defence. It is true that Britain is one of only three countries [USA and France are the others] that could launch a full invasion of another nation anywhere in the world with it's current hardware and manpower, but most of that hardware will be gone and replaced with half-arsed, half-baked stuff within 20 years - stuff like the Daring destroyers which, although good, represent the halving of our effective destroyer fleet for the sake of the Labour government wasting money on other things. Ex-armed forces or not, they are not up to scratch and either need more integration with other armed forces or more investment at home [or both] to bring them back to anything like the level we had in the mid-1970s, and there is no political will to do that with people losing their jobs, homes and lives all around them. Defence is never a national priority unless we are directly threatened on British soil, which we are not.
Jernau Riggs	Posted - 2009.01.30 19:45:00 - [118] I would like to say that when other eu countries joined the euro all your currencies were rated at a certain level against what value they though the euro would be. i.e. 70% etc hence individules got a 30% uplift in their salaries, meaning if you were paid 100 lira you then got paid 130 euros Uk people never got that, we were paid ú100 before and we got got paid ú100 after, but now the currencies and very close and we have not had the advantage of the pay rise. On a good note the UK economy is by far the strongest in europe and within a year or so we will be miles ahead again
Northern Fall Minmatar Guild Navy	Posted - 2009.01.30 20:05:00 - [119] Originally by: Khemul Zula Also, British people are evil anyways, so supporting their currency would be a bad thing for CCP to do. Runs down to london servers with scissors snip Fnar Fnar Fnar
Les Grossman	Posted - 2009.01.30 20:31:00 - [120] Originally by: Jernau Riggs I would like to say that when other eu countries joined the euro all your currencies were rated at a certain level against what value they though the euro would be. i.e. 70% etc hence individules got a 30% uplift in their salaries, meaning if you were paid 100 lira you then got paid 130 euros Uk people never got that, we were paid ú100 before and we got got paid ú100 after, but now the currencies and very close and we have not had the advantage of the pay rise. I hope you realize when you are going to transfer to euro eventually, you'll be paying a hefty amount of pounds per euro, this 1:1 is just a prelude of what lies ahead. Quote: On a good note the UK economy is by far the strongest in europe and within a year or so we will be miles ahead again :D Say it 3 times and click your heels, maybe it'll be true!
Ohhh Matron	Posted - 2009.01.30 21:21:00 - [121] Its swings and roundabouts. As a UK based player when times were good I was running two accounts no problem. Now times arent so good I just cut back to one account. Fair enough. When exchange rates go back in the ú favour I'll reactivate...maybe. By the way if you are paying your subs by credit card them maybe look at getting a Nationwide credit card? It gives the best exchange rates and has no charges for this. As others have said...suck it up! Fixed rate isnt that great an idea, ask all those folks still stuck on 6% mortgage deals! I'll take variable thanks!
Pon Icus Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2009.01.30 21:55:00 - [122] 6% on a fixed 30-year mortgage is actually pretty good. Specially now, considering the debacle of sub-prime and adjustable rate mortgages. Just try to get a 6% mortgage these days and see how hard it is considering the tight credit markets. The USD has been weak for years, its nice that it's finally strengthening a little. The USD - Brazilian Real exchange rate of the past three months has given me an affordable honeymoon. :)
Jernau Riggs	Posted - 2009.01.30 22:04:00 - [123] Quote: On a good note the UK economy is by far the strongest in europe and within a year or so we will be miles ahead again :D Say it 3 times and click your heels, maybe it'll be true! seriously i'm not english but i live here and for anyone that thinks the uk's economy does not completly **** all over every other eu economy is living in dream land. The reason the pound had dropped so much is because they had to spent billions buying up bank shares and as no one has any confidence in the banking system at the moment the pound is suffering. However as they managed to buy up large shares of these banks for a fraction of what they are worth, in a couple of years when thinks go back to normal the uk econmy will be stronger than ever. on the main issue wow costs ú8.99 per month, yea fair enough it is crap ff11 costs ú8.99 per month i gave up looking, most mmorpg's don't make it easy to find that out
Virtuous	Posted - 2009.01.30 22:48:00 - [124] It would be nice if subscribers were given the option to choose which currency (EU or USD) they want to pay in, that'd solve alot a problems for consumers.
Cmdr Sy Appetite 4 Destruction The Firm.	Posted - 2009.01.30 23:32:00 - [125] Originally by: Virtuous It would be nice if subscribers were given the option to choose which currency (EU or USD) they want to pay in, that'd solve alot a problems for consumers. Then they would constantly rotate into the cheapest option. Nice for subscribers, not so nice for the company. Besides, I would not take EUR/GBP parity for granted. It could break in either direction from here.
Ohhh Matron	Posted - 2009.01.31 00:32:00 - [126] Edited by: Ohhh Matron on 31/01/2009 00:33:24 Originally by: Pon Icus 6% on a fixed 30-year mortgage is actually pretty good. Specially now, considering the debacle of sub-prime and adjustable rate mortgages. Just try to get a 6% mortgage these days and see how hard it is considering the tight credit markets. Yeah but I'm now on 3.5% and all my mates on the fixed are on 6%+. Not good when youve lost your job too! Glad you had a good honeymoon too! Congratulations.
DownTwisTeD	Posted - 2009.01.31 00:47:00 - [127] that's what the Brits get for selling out the Commonwealth to join the eu.. only 60 yrs ago you where all at each other throats..
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.01.31 09:35:00 - [128] Well hopefully CCP has seen this by now and read the first page of posts, and other useful ones - but not the flame. Thanks for listening CCP!
Tallaran Kouros Caldari Arcane Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.31 10:59:00 - [129] Originally by: Scoper's Alt Edited by: Scoper''s Alt on 30/01/2009 17:37:07 Originally by: Tallaran Kouros Firstly, Icelanders are pssed at the UK GOVERNMENT for using anti-terrorist legislation to freeze assets. Basically, Gordon Brown panicked and used the first law he could to try to stop things getting worse. This was discourteous and a little silly. People keep saying "anti terror legislation" and making some sort of unspoken comparison to the likes of the IRA, ETA, Al Qaida etc etc but that's a flawed arguement. Granted it was legislation enacted with terrorism in mind, but the specific provisions used related to anything that was a threat to the stability of the UK financial system, the UK banking system and the UK economy. lols The reason why Iceland were justifiably *ed off is that they were branded terrorists.... as in - the bankruptcy of their own nation was a cunning plan to shaft the UK. Which of course it was not. Who branded them terrorists? Me? I didn't. The media? I don't remember this. Quote:** Public support for the anti-terrorist legislation, which has far eaching powers - the likes we have never seen and go a long way to erroding the Magna Carte (sp?) - was ONLY gaind by claiming that the laws would protect us from similar attrosoties as the 9/11 masacre. Your view that it is justified that these laws are in place with the "specific" objective of protecting the economy from instability, is idiotic. Whilst your opinion may reflect the fact of the matter - it doesn't make it any better. That's not what i'm claiming. I never said that these laws were in place with the the specific objective of protecting the economy, I said the specific section of this law had powers to protect the economy and financial sector from anything that threatened it's stability. Quote: In the same vein, any financial institution which de-stabilises the economy by being too greedy - as we have seen in the last 9 months - should also be branded terrorists. No, because nobody is branding the icelandic banks as terrorists. Quote: Yes, there should be laws in place to protect us from these kind of incidents and yes, the asset freeze was the right thing (done in the wrong way) .... but our allys should not be branded terrorists in the process. Again, nobody is calling them terrorists. Quote: Not least because it puts them in the same box as the IRA, ETA, Al Qaida etc etc.... it is totally unacceptable to do this. And I agree wholeheartedly, but nobody is cal... echo :)
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2009.01.31 11:09:00 - [130] Quote: The reason the pound had dropped so much is because they had to spent billions buying up bank shares and as no one has any confidence in the banking system at the moment the pound is suffering. However as they managed to buy up large shares of these banks for a fraction of what they are worth, in a couple of years when thinks go back to normal the uk econmy will be stronger than ever. So how would this be any different than the rest of the world is doing? Every european country is buying their own banks. --------------------------------------------- Originally by: Neth'Rae Military experts are calling this a troll.
Tallaran Kouros Caldari Arcane Alliance	Posted - 2009.01.31 11:15:00 - [131] Originally by: Furb Killer Quote: The reason the pound had dropped so much is because they had to spent billions buying up bank shares and as no one has any confidence in the banking system at the moment the pound is suffering. However as they managed to buy up large shares of these banks for a fraction of what they are worth, in a couple of years when thinks go back to normal the uk econmy will be stronger than ever. So how would this be any different than the rest of the world is doing? Every european country is buying their own banks. Not really, and those that are aren't quite doing it on the same scale as the UK. Offhand, I can't think of any country in the EU outside of the Benelux and Germany that has had to bail out a bank. I'm sure there are some, but it's not quite been on the same scale.
RoCkEt X Caldari The Order of Chivalry Nex Eternus	Posted - 2009.02.01 10:10:00 - [132] US Currency is to be changed from Dollars and Cents to Donuts and Bagels. i'd like to see how CCP deals with this one ^^ and yeah, eve has become insanely expensive in the UK, not good. needs a price gank tbh.
Jagerwolf	Posted - 2009.02.01 11:09:00 - [133] Quote: The reason the pound had dropped so much is because they had to spent billions buying up bank shares and as no one has any confidence in the banking system at the moment the pound is suffering. However as they managed to buy up large shares of these banks for a fraction of what they are worth, in a couple of years when thinks go back to normal the uk econmy will be stronger than ever. Abracadabra and the debt is gone
quickshot89 Caldari White Star Ltd Mjolnir Alliance	Posted - 2009.02.01 11:41:00 - [134] you know, you could do what i do, and get a job, if your 18+ then its only 4 hours work per 2 month to pay for eve, i dont mind paying that bit extra atm for eve until the ecconemy sorts itself out. so to help speed that along, our government needs to change
cpt Mark	Posted - 2009.02.01 12:00:00 - [135] Originally by: quickshot89 you know, you could do what i do, and get a job, if your 18+ then its only 4 hours work per 2 month to pay for eve, i dont mind paying that bit extra atm for eve until the ecconemy sorts itself out. so to help speed that along, our government needs to change 1) Unemployment is rising dramatically 2) Have you heard of opportunity cost?
Adaris Gallente E X I U S	Posted - 2009.02.01 14:49:00 - [136] Originally by: cpt Mark Hello, Is it possible for CCP to revise ... subscription fees At the risk of sounding like I don't understand your valid and well placed argument, I think you should pay exactly what we all pay. 15 Euro. Or its equivalent in Pounds. Or Dollars. Or Yen. Its not a case of keeping players in the game from Britain. Its a case of if Britain is getting it for cheaper, then I might start paying in GBP instead of Euro. And ccp loses more money. And by I mean alot of people. Same cost. Same product. Just different exchange rates. Thanks ******* I speak on behalf of every corporation.
Morsus Argent	Posted - 2009.02.01 15:13:00 - [137] Originally by: Adaris Its not a case of keeping players in the game from Britain. Its a case of if Britain is getting it for cheaper, then I might start paying in GBP instead of Euro. And ccp loses more money. And by I mean alot of people. Same cost. Same product. Just different exchange rates. This is already the case for USD and Euros. 14.95 USD != 14.95 EUR. That doesn't mean CCP should stop taking payment in USD though.
TigerXtrm BIG Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2009.02.01 15:34:00 - [138] Originally by: cpt Mark Edited by: cpt Mark on 30/01/2009 19:15:31 Edited by: cpt Mark on 30/01/2009 11:11:11 Hello, Due to the GBP becoming alot weaker recently, particularly in relation to the Euro (1 - 1.1 ratio down from 1 - 1.4) subscription for the UK now costs around 13 pounds per month. Is it possible for CCP to revise UK subscription fees to be payable in GBP too? ....... The reason I ask is that many gaming companies (such as steam) have now placed their costs in GBP to UK customers so that prices remain constant to customers. Previously all games offered by steam were sold in USD. Thanks for listening to one customer, and hopefully British people can rally behind me on this one. ...... Benefits UK customers do not stop paying because they can't afford it Encourages new customers to play, while staying competitive with other MMORPG Ensures a happy consumer base - and keeping up-to date with the rest of the gaming industry Creates a positive press for CCP - as British customers feel CCP are acting positively towards them. (Much like with steam offering games in GBP) CCP increases its international competitiveness in terms of the UK. Server costs are also decreased as the value of the pound drops - so any loss of profits may be counter-balanced. UK players are charged by their bank to convert GBP into Euros in order to pay. If CCP charged in GBP they could use this money to fund their server costs, and convert extra revenues in batches for a better conversion rate. Therefore either increasing profits, or making it cheaper for UK customers (who thereby don't have to pay conversion expenses) Negatives CCP may take less profits for a period of around 5-6 months. However, this is indeterminable as more UK people may subscribe to the game, and less quit EVE. Other players may feel Britain should have to pay the same in Euros as they do. Which is in relative terms - more expensive and believe Britain must pay for America's mistakes. Negotiation Perhaps allow the subscription fee to be paid in GBP, but increase the cost slightly to what it would have used to be. eg/ cost in September may be 9GBP, now could charge 10 GBP, instead of 14 Euros which is around 12-13 GBP. *figures hypothetical and may not reflect actually amounts. Some of the points made above have been raised by other players, who I wish to thank gratefully for their input. The benefits clearly outweigh the negatives on this occasion. Or you could buy a timecard in Dollars to begin with and be done for the cheapest solution of them all.
Claudia Voltaire	Posted - 2009.02.01 15:49:00 - [139] Not knowing the in's and out's of ccp's operating costs in the uk, reguarding costings on their server operation, one wonders if their collected dollars are buying more for less. You have to say if their is a revolving cost involved, they will be Either way though, with the crisis only going to get worse before it gets better anytime soon, if their are other mmo's willing to bill in local currency, new user increases will be likely to stunt in those effected areas. People tightening their costs, warcraft or whatever at 8-9 pounds a month, eve at 15. Double sided realy, new user drop offs, but on the other hand ccp are taking in more from their existing users as we fuel them with the strongest currency. The only issue id have is my opening paragraph reguarding uk opperating costs, getting the best of both worlds realy doesn't sit prety.
Kur'Dekaija Atomic Heroes Chain of Chaos	Posted - 2009.02.01 16:02:00 - [140] such boo boo heads, try paying subscription with an icelandic VISA.. I win :P

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