Originally by: Ephemeron

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I'm open to the idea of losing t3 ship skills with ship destruction.

It puts fear into people. Fear forces accountability. The smart will adapt and prosper, the weak shall perish. After all, t3 stuff is an addition to the game - an optional alternative. Nobody is forced to use it. Unlike t2, it should not become mandatory.

Tho I don't have much faith in the current CCP design team people to make good decisions, there's not enough info to criticize anything. Frankly, I'd feel a lot better if current game designers were rotated or moved to some other tasks. They ****ed up enough already

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Originally by: Ephemeron

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Quote:

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I'm expecting one with a smart pilot (not in web range and such) to solo 2 tech 1 battleships. If not then **** it, I'll fly a stabber into wormhole space.

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That might have been possible if CCP didn't take speed out of equation. It's hard to believe that so many people in positions of power fail to realize that speed is one of fundamental parts of combat. Trying to pretend that speed should not matter is setting yourself up for failure. They dragged us all down with them. When will we get game designer with common sense?

sorry for ranting, it just makes me angry to see such blatant incompetence.

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Originally by: Ephemeron

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Edited by: Ephemeron on 08/02/2009 09:09:29

Originally by: MotherMoon

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when did that take speed out? have you been watching the allaince tourny? Have you actually tried PvPing in TQ?

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I pvp enough on TQ to notice that nanohacs and speed fits have been nearly wiped out.

You'd have to be blind not to notice ships going twice as slow. There are no more setups that increase speed effectively. Speed is no longer a thing for consideration. There's your standard MWD or AB, maybe a couple nanofibers - but there's no variety in setups, it's pointless to try boost speed more at expensive of tank, gank, tackle, EW. Amount of possible ship tactics and ship setups have been reduced. The fun factor in PvP reduced. The edge blunted

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I guess I'm jaded, but so far CCP has a pretty consistent track record for delivering disappointing mediocre ships.

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If CCP didn't have a track record of taking existing cool ships and turning them into disapponting mediocre ships, I wouldn't be as jaded.

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Originally by: Ephemeron

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Originally by: MotherMoon

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if all ships go half as slow, then there is no different in PvP now then there was before.

but webs have been nerfed meaning speed is even more important.

And then you factor in how an AB tanks missile better than a MWD.

Almost all turrets took a tracking hit to scale down with speed changes.

All speed changes we're made to make speed mean more, an interceptor is now harder to hit and can catch targets more easily than before.

the vaga is now much more useful.
think before you post.

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That kind of logic is what seems to create so much trouble in the world. From government to financial sectors, and even down to lowly game design. Every statement you made is false, but I guess it's not a lie if you really believe it. I'm tired of trying to argue same thing. I could try, but if you believe that, I doubt I can use logic to convince you otherwise.

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Originally by: Jalif

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Only thing I see happening:
Skillpointloss or not
It will give a lot of time/isk to fly just in 1 of those ships.

Which tells me only 1 more thing:

MORE SHIPS JUST TO KILL 1 ****ING SHIP! = BLOBING

I prefere that there will be more player skill involved to every single ship then instead just t3 which will get blobbed while pvp-ing. Its just going to be another carebare ship where jsut a handfull of people will use it in pvp. And not to forget it will be probably be pre-nerfed so they are useless like ****.

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Originally by: Jalif

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Originally by: MotherMoon

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Originally by: Jalif

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Only thing I see happening:
Skillpointloss or not
It will give a lot of time/isk to fly just in 1 of those ships.

Which tells me only 1 more thing:

MORE SHIPS JUST TO KILL 1 ****ING SHIP! = BLOBING

I prefere that there will be more player skill involved to every single ship then instead just t3 which will get blobbed while pvp-ing. Its just going to be another carebare ship where jsut a handfull of people will use it in pvp. And not to forget it will be probably be pre-nerfed so they are useless like ****.

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how you blob when the number of ships allowed into wormhole space is capped at mass?

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How are you going to construct t3? In non-wormhole space. Where will they eventually end up? In non-wormhole space. Well, just wormhole space is dangeraus and nobody will bring shiny ships there. Its just probably going to be recons like falcons and pilgrims. Whats the point of a t3 ship if it will be permajammed by a falcon?

Meh.. maybe I am just saying stuff a bit to early, I just hope this won't be ****ed up and that I get rewarded for smart playing instead of bringing numbers & having SP.

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Originally by: Seibicoe

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This is rly cool cuz with ships getting XP to level up skills newer players can catch up to vets jus dont fly to pvp whit the ship and its cool. CCP jus need to make the FW battlegrounds better so we can get rewards to like and then we can level up and pvp to earn some epic stuffs we can use cccp are being very clever whit making it like this as wow is the bestest selling game and if atari wants some monies the boxed eve must sell lots off coppies.

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Originally by: Pottsey

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Nyphur said "If it's a maximum of 5 days that's alright I suppose. I was kind of hoping the ship itself would be the one with the skill, not the player. I'll wait for the devblog for more details."
The only thing that worries me is some of the older pilots have nothing left to train. I was hoping T3 would give us goals and training perhaps as much as 6months worth of training. But if the skills are mostly rank 1 we are talking under 1 month of training.

What I don't like is those who have invested more into the skills lose more. It might be worth keeping your skills at lvl 4 just so you don't lose that lvl 5. I dont see why someone with a lvl 5 skill should lose 5 days of skills while someone with a lvl 4 skill would lose much less. The better you are the more you lose. Surely the better the pilot is the less he would lose.

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Originally by: Pottsey

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MotherMoon said " under a month? fool there are 25 pieces."
The way I understand it is, a skill per subsection not a skill per piece. There are 5 sections with one skill per section. The one skill applies to all pieces in that section. In which case you can perhaps max out T3 in perhaps 2 months or just under. 1 month for the 5 section skills and 1 month for the main ship skill.

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Originally by: Bellum Eternus

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Originally by: MotherMoon

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I love how if you eject you dont' lose skill points.

AWESOME.

dude, get out of ship and I won't take your sp!

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Yes, interesting piracy opportunities indeed.

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Originally by: vvizard NOR

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Originally by: Javius Rong

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well IMO this breaks some of the basic foundations of the game, such that skill points do not get lost if you have clone... This does not seem like a good idea and could tank the whole T3 introduction...

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Have you considered the fact that CCP probably dont want every guy and his cat flying a T3 ship? Much like T2 ships when they where still expensive. If the risk is to high for you, simply dont fly them. It's simple.

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Originally by: James Lyrus

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Originally by: MotherMoon

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Originally by: vvizard NOR

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Originally by: Javius Rong

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well IMO this breaks some of the basic foundations of the game, such that skill points do not get lost if you have clone... This does not seem like a good idea and could tank the whole T3 introduction...

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Have you considered the fact that CCP probably dont want every guy and his cat flying a T3 ship? Much like T2 ships when they where still expensive. If the risk is to high for you, simply dont fly them. It's simple.

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I'm hoping they will be cheaper isk wise and just have skill risk

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That I'd take. What I don't want is to have them insanely expensive (because everyone in eve is rich, right?) _and_ burn time whenever you lose one.

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Originally by: Bellum Eternus

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Originally by: Cailais

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Originally by: Grath Telkin

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In case you missed the clarification today:

There are a total of 6 skills to fly t3 ships, 1 to fly the ship, and 5 devoted to the subsystems. The subsystem skills are all RANK 1 skills.

Upon the loss of your ship, you lose one level of one of the sub system skills, so at MOST, you lose 5 days of training off the ship. To be clear, you lose NO OTHER SKILLS.

I think you can turn panic mode off.

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Pretty much what was expected then. Seeing as it sounds as if you only lose the subsystem skills (i.e improving the performance of the ship, rather than just flying one) then the loss isnt anywhere near what the drama bombs were predicting.

Best the hard core whiner so called "pvp'ers" make some pretty rapid U turns I think eh?


C.

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I'l definitely be flying them. If they don't horribly suck that is.

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Originally by: ResearchBunny Beatrix

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Originally by: MotherMoon

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where the hell is the dev blog with it coming out for testing in under 20 hours?

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Quiet, they're still trying to make sure it doesn't nuke boot.ini again.

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Originally by: Lord WarATron

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Originally by: ResearchBunny Beatrix

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Originally by: MotherMoon

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where the hell is the dev blog with it coming out for testing in under 20 hours?

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Quiet, they're still trying to make sure it doesn't nuke boot.ini again.

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I guess loosing SP is nothing compared to loosing boot.ini

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Originally by: Atius Tirawa

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Edited by: Atius Tirawa on 09/02/2009 10:56:05
forget it. . .srsly. . .worst idea ever

T3 ships are gonna be for mission runners I guess. . .

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Originally by: bff Jill

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You can always use more skill points, even if you max out every skill for a certain profession in the game, you can start training another one. Once you get those skills all trained up you have another option, another thing you can do. Nobody has every skill trained, as its been said that's impossible as CCP always adds skills faster than you can train them.

your skill points are a continuing journey~, what training path will you take?~

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Originally by: bff Jill

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Originally by: bff Jill

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Originally by: MotherMoon

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Originally by: Atius Tirawa

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Edited by: Atius Tirawa on 09/02/2009 10:56:05
forget it. . .srsly. . .worst idea ever

T3 ships are gonna be for mission runners I guess. . .

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just eject.

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and leave all your poor crew behind, how horrible

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Originally by: Navtiqes

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Originally by: bff Jill

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] dieing once in a t3 cruiser and deleveling from 5 ro 4 is the same as mining 1.2billion isk in a hulk.

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Originally by: Sheriff Jones

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This inspired me:

Once, there was this noob who,
wouldn't fly tech 3 ships 'cause he thought that it was pointless,
but when, they finally made him,
he, popped... and lost his skillpoints so precious.

He couldn't quite explain it,
they'd always just beeeeeen, theeeeeere.

Mmm mmm mmm mm mmm mmm mmm mm.

*runs*

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Originally by: Nyx STeeLGamers

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I completely condemn and fully spilt in the face of this idea of losing sp when you lose tech 3 ships. i mean, WTF! Were you devs on dope when you came up with this idea. Stop bloody regulating eve so much that it becomes less fun to play. A game should be fun to play. Losing sp is not fun. The sp loss when medical clone isnt up to date is bad enough. WTF!

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Originally by: Karii Ildarian

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CCP is just prepping all you guys for the next bold step:

10% Skill loss for being podded


This will truly make EVE a harsh universe and I eagerly await the implementation.

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Originally by: Deva Blackfire

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Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 10/02/2009 22:34:20

Originally by: Kahega Amielden

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Always B till i max everything (that includes drone specs 5 etc). And going B way will also benefit A ship types (engineering, tanking, weapon, drone skill etc). Wheras going A wont help you with anything except A (t3 skills only for t3 ships).

Only exception in B is "specific ship skill" like HAC, Recon etc.

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So then clearly training specific ship skills is totally useless then, right? No one trains <racial> frig/cruiser/BS above I unless they need it as a prereq unless they have every single cap skill, fitting skill, and gunnery/support skill at V, right?

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Can you read? I bolded out part which you probably missed (no idea how, my post was pretty short).

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Originally by: Flinchey

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Originally by: MotherMoon

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I disagree, I only max out tech 2 ship skills as they re more expensive to fly.

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enjoy your lack of flying ships to the best of their abilities. not to mention you need T1 ship skills to V to use the T2 counterpart??

Originally by: MotherMoon

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Battlecruisers 4 is just fine for me.

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enjoy not being able to use a command ship..

Originally by: MotherMoon

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as is medium guns 4

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and not being able to use T2 medium guns. or T2 Large guns eventually if desired.
(in effect, enjoy your sh**ty DPS, tracking speed, and range.)

Originally by: MotherMoon

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an shield skills to 4

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oh and your terrible tank. and lack of using t2 modules too probably

Originally by: MotherMoon

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and so on and so on.

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and so on and so forth.

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