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Adriano Contra
Caldari
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2009.02.20 15:07:00 -
[1]
Ok, i saw thread, that Gallente ships is useless against Sleepers becouse Sleepers eat drones at breakfest.
Ok, i saw also posts, that Ammar ships are useless against Sleepers becouse Sleepers suck Ammar ship capacitors dry and then eat them for dinner.
So, i wonder, how will do generic Caldari Raven, CNR or Golem (not talking even about smaller missile boats) do against Sleepers?
Are cruise missiles/torpedos usefull or useless against the new enemy?
___________________________
What if our sun, against all predictions, goes nova tomorrow?
The only reasonable solution must be to repeatly panic, just in case you know. |
Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.02.20 15:09:00 -
[2]
I would think they are just as useful as other ships. Cap less weapons is a bonus tho. And caldari can actually passive tank.
I think Nighthawks can become popular in w-space gangs.
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Ezekiel Sulastin
Gallente
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2009.02.20 15:11:00 -
[3]
... and Drakes ...
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zzzz ... zzzz ... zzzz |
Adriano Contra
Caldari
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2009.02.20 15:15:00 -
[4]
Maybe Sleepers use some nasty defence against missiles, like imp defenders or smartbombs? I hear, they are very clever for an NPCs.
___________________________
What if our sun, against all predictions, goes nova tomorrow?
The only reasonable solution must be to repeatly panic, just in case you know. |
Spartan dax
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Posted - 2009.02.20 15:25:00 -
[5]
They also need tackling apparantly or they warp off. Not exactly a Ravens or NH's strong suit. Plus Ravens and CNR's have huge sig radius's, they'll go down fast under fire.
Balanced gangs FTW.
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LadyLubU2
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.02.20 15:25:00 -
[6]
So am i the only thinking why Caldari only should get a advantage like this? They already have a ship lineup that pwns missions like no tomorrow, and now they gonna have a big advantage in w space?
**** anyone?
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achoura
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Posted - 2009.02.20 15:29:00 -
[7]
You want to kill sleepers you have to be pvping, plain and simple. They do everything an organised pvp gang does with the added benefit of never making mistakes, so many pve pilots are going to die to these things it's laughable and if you don't believe me hop on sisi and try for yourselves 
***The EVE servers and their patches*** |
Adriano Contra
Caldari
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2009.02.20 15:34:00 -
[8]
Ok, mixed force of Ravens/Drakes and Scorpions/Falcons + some other ships will be just fine then...
___________________________
What if our sun, against all predictions, goes nova tomorrow?
The only reasonable solution must be to repeatly panic, just in case you know. |
Trader20
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Posted - 2009.02.20 15:35:00 -
[9]
Cal ships will have to deal with defenders. So it's obvious that Mim have the advantage in wspace.
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Spartan dax
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Posted - 2009.02.20 15:36:00 -
[10]
1: You're wrong
2: STFU with the whine
3: I'm taking Amarr ships into W-space, they'll be fine. Better even I'm sure.
4: Tacklers VS NPC's? Say it ain't so!
Sleepers will require balanced gangs for the most part. Caldari does well in gangs. Nerf Caldari?
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Terminus Vindictus
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Posted - 2009.02.20 16:25:00 -
[11]
The bigger question may be related to future modifications as they relate to mission-running specifically. CCP has alluded to the fact that NPC AI will be overhauled across the board, including for missions, and I think they may have said at some point missions will have a chance to spawn a random Sleeper rat(s) to mess with you. That will have some profound effects on mission loadouts because even hisec missioning will feel a bit like losec missioning (I'm OK with that as a means to gently prod people into losec - if you're going to fly a PvP setup in hisec for missions, might as well fly those missions in losec and earn the higher rewards...).
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Spartan dax
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Posted - 2009.02.20 16:49:00 -
[12]
 Originally by: Terminus Vindictus
The bigger question may be related to future modifications as they relate to mission-running specifically.
CCP has alluded to the fact that NPC AI will be overhauled across the board, including for missions, and I think they may have said at some point missions will have a chance to spawn a random Sleeper rat(s) to mess with you.
That will have some profound effects on mission loadouts because even hisec missioning will feel a bit like losec missioning (
I'm OK with that as a means to gently prod people into losec - if you're going to fly a PvP setup in hisec for missions, might as well fly those missions in losec and earn the higher rewards...).
Geez, think of your fellow forum reader before you post.
(And you're welcome)
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Sylen Dir
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Posted - 2009.02.20 16:57:00 -
[13]
Caldari = best ships for something?
What a surpires...
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Wannabehero
Absolutely No Retreat
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Posted - 2009.02.20 17:01:00 -
[14]
Bring some logistics and all should be fine.
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Don't harsh my mellow |
Spartan dax
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Posted - 2009.02.20 17:12:00 -
[15]
I hear the Minmatar have tied the Gallenteans as the best Whinemakers in Eve lately, C/D?
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Terminus Vindictus
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Posted - 2009.02.20 17:20:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Spartan dax
Geez, think of your fellow forum reader before you post.
So... 4 lines of text is now considered tl;dr?!? Must be a generational thing... LOL
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Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2009.02.20 17:20:00 -
[17]
From the limited exposure we have had with the Sleepers so far, it seems that all the races will have a hard time taking them on.
The most reliable way appears to be ECM while nuking them from medium/long range. Will depend heavily on how different the various Sleepers are.
CCP has stated that they are aiming for the Sleepers to require teamwork to bring down, with losses on 'our' side. Easily done as they can tweak the mass allowance of the wormholes as well as the individual spawns.
Will be interesting and, dare I say it, fun to lose a ship to an NPC once again. All the current rats are auto-killed now - just a grind for me and I'd wager most others.
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Spartan dax
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Posted - 2009.02.20 17:22:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Terminus Vindictus
Originally by: Spartan dax
Geez, think of your fellow forum reader before you post.
So... 4 lines of text is now considered tl;dr?!? Must be a generational thing... LOL
Indeed, old people needs glasses you know. Be kind to your elders.
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Adriano Contra
Caldari
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2009.02.20 17:47:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Hirana Yoshida
The most reliable way appears to be ECM while nuking them from medium/long range. Will depend heavily on how different the various Sleepers are.
So - Falcon only gang would be godlike?
___________________________
What if our sun, against all predictions, goes nova tomorrow?
The only reasonable solution must be to repeatly panic, just in case you know. |
Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2009.02.20 18:31:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Spartan dax
3: I'm taking Amarr ships into W-space, they'll be fine. Better even I'm sure.
Apparently Sleeper guns have the added effect of sucking cap. So not a case of one or two ships having a neut on...they ALL have neuts/nos on.
The cruddy thing is Amarr are uniquely vulnerable to all types of EW compared to the other races. Yes EW can hurt other races too but they have options Amarr largely lack. So everything the Sleepers throw at them hurts...not so for other races.
CCP said this is partly to account for the advantage Amarr have in ammo (which is they do not need any reloads if using T1 crystals). Of course T2 crystals and faction are consumable like other ammo but the option exists to use T1 which is an advantage (and a considerable one) when out in W-Space where re-supply is very difficult.
Personally I'd FAR rather T1 ammo was consumable than have my ships Nossed into uselessness but maybe that is just me.
Definitely though you'll need a gang. Logistics cruisers will be very useful I think. Especially a dual-logistics setup that feed each other cap.
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"Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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Cade Morrigan
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.02.20 19:03:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Adriano Contra
Originally by: Hirana Yoshida
The most reliable way appears to be ECM while nuking them from medium/long range. Will depend heavily on how different the various Sleepers are.
So - Falcon only gang would be godlike?
But wouldnt you want to output some dps too?! :D
--
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FlyinS
Caldari
Planetary Industry and Trade Organization
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Posted - 2009.02.20 19:49:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Apparently Sleeper guns have the added effect of sucking cap. So not a case of one or two ships having a neut on...they ALL have neuts/nos on.
Ouch. That's going to hurt the active tank in a harsh way.
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achoura
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Posted - 2009.02.20 19:50:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Wannabehero
Bring some logistics and all should be fine.
5 isk if you can guess what sleepers do when logistics lands on gid
***The EVE servers and their patches*** |
Haradgrim
Tyrell Corp
INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2009.02.20 20:04:00 -
[24]
So drakes with ecm drones........
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Originally by: CCP Oveur
Just donGÇÿt forget the reach-around.
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Imperator Jora'h
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Posted - 2009.02.20 20:05:00 -
[25]
Originally by: achoura
Originally by: Wannabehero
Bring some logistics and all should be fine.
5 isk if you can guess what sleepers do when logistics lands on gid
Which is why I think a pair of Logistics is necessary. Tank the ever-loving hell out of them, transfer cap between the two for free cap and rep each other as needed. Hopefully (will take some testing) that will be enough for the Logistics ships to live and then frees up your mates to kill the Sleepers.
In theory. 
--------------------------------------------------
"Of course," said my grandfather, pulling a gun from his belt as he stepped from the Time Machine, "there's no paradox if I shoot you!"
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Karl Luckner
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Posted - 2009.02.20 21:34:00 -
[26]
Quote:
Apparently Sleeper guns have the added effect of sucking cap. So not a case of one or two ships having a neut on...they ALL have neuts/nos on.
Finally something useful to put in those 2 free highslots of a Raven. 
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LadyLubU2
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.02.21 00:11:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: achoura
Originally by: Wannabehero
Bring some logistics and all should be fine.
5 isk if you can guess what sleepers do when logistics lands on gid
Which is why I think a pair of Logistics is necessary. Tank the ever-loving hell out of them, transfer cap between the two for free cap and rep each other as needed. Hopefully (will take some testing) that will be enough for the Logistics ships to live and then frees up your mates to kill the Sleepers.
In theory.
So in other words, amarr and cadari logistics will be the only way because of the cap trasfer bonus?
Really ccp, way to ****ing go...
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Vladimir Norkoff
Income Redistribution Service
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Posted - 2009.02.21 00:27:00 -
[28]
Originally by: LadyLubU2
Really ccp, way to ****ing go...
Aaaieeee!!! The sky is falling! The sky is falling!!!111
Taxman VI: Voided Ledger
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Dreadpilot Roberts
R.U.S.T.
Minor Threat.
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Posted - 2009.02.21 00:27:00 -
[29]
Originally by: LadyLubU2
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: achoura
Originally by: Wannabehero
Bring some logistics and all should be fine.
5 isk if you can guess what sleepers do when logistics lands on gid
Which is why I think a pair of Logistics is necessary. Tank the ever-loving hell out of them, transfer cap between the two for free cap and rep each other as needed. Hopefully (will take some testing) that will be enough for the Logistics ships to live and then frees up your mates to kill the Sleepers.
In theory.
So in other words, amarr and cadari logistics will be the only way because of the cap trasfer bonus?
Really ccp, way to ****ing go...
U know Guardian gets a bonus to cap transfer as well right ? 
I'm sorry, did I say u could speak ? |
Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
Black Legion.
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Posted - 2009.02.21 00:29:00 -
[30]
On a related note.. we were having a war a couple of weeks ago, and my sec status was going dangerously low for someone that likes to travel through highsec, so I ran som missions. Well, missions, in a full Amarr Navy-fitted Paladin, while at war, isn't that ideal, but hell I couldn't be arsed fitting a cheap substitute version, so..
..I parked my alt, in a Falcon, in the missions. After a few of them, I thought; Hmm, the alt has bit low sec too, maybe I should just tag the bs to get him some sec tics as well? So, I let him jam some random bs just for fun. Guess what, it works. So I started to jam all annoying ships in Guristas missions and I wasn't jammed back. Muwaahaha, take that biatches! Ehm, sorry..
..so, back to topic - sleepers have counters to all our racial standard PvE weapons. They neut. They target drones. They are very fast (try solo in your torp Raven with no TP please). So, using a mix of dampeners, web, perhaps even jam and warp scramblers (!) seems like perfectly viable. Maybe even TD them, who knows, if neut is tied to their gun you might get less neut? Same time, passive fit. Use sentry drones and scoop/redeploy? Use logistic teams and/or command ships with links?
Seems quite sensible to me. An all-rounded PvP fleet to fight off the NPC's. Finally PvE might get interesting.
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