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[IDEA] How to fuzz the lines and make empire more freeform

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EdFromHumanResources Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.16 22:27:00 - [1] Make it so concord wont defend your ** unless you have certain standings with the entity who's space youre in or you pay a certain amount of isk per week. If you do not have the proper standings you get a special flag but attacking those players still drops your sec standing. Standings would degrade over time so you cant just grind up and stop. Characters under a certain age would be immune You would be able to contract sec standing to other people at whatever price you saw fit There would be a several month warning of this so nobody can claim they were caught with their pants down. This would make the line between empire and lowsec less defined and cause pvp to be more widespread but still give people the ability to opt out while in high sec. And create another isk sink in Eve that there are so many threads crying about. ------------------------------------------------- Everyone hates goonswarm for one reason or another. ... And they promote *gotism -Zurrar
Herschel Yamamoto Bloodmoney Incorporated	Posted - 2009.03.17 00:35:00 - [2] No, no, no. Isk sinks aren't needed, searching standings as an integral part of combat is terrible gameplay, and CCP will never implement any system that makes the highsec-loving players, a majority of their income, stop playing the game. ----- Bloodmoney Incorporated is recruiting!
EdFromHumanResources Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.17 00:39:00 - [3] Ya but its sure fun to freak them out ------------------------------------------------- Everyone hates goonswarm for one reason or another. ... And they promote ***gotism -Zurrar
Fahtim Meidires GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.17 05:08:00 - [4] Heh. Privatize CONCORD, and make standings matter for things like response times. Pvpers would have to check up on their targets to see how well-liked they are by the local police. Kind of like an empire tax for protection.
Isaac Starstriker Amarr Celestial Ascension Tenth Legion	Posted - 2009.03.17 15:56:00 - [5] No. No support at all. High-sec is made to be safe. No if, ands or buts. --Isaac Isaac's Haul*Mart
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre Worlds End Consortium	Posted - 2009.03.17 16:58:00 - [6] Originally by: EdFromHumanResources Make it so concord wont defend your **** unless you have certain standings with the entity who's space youre in or you pay a certain amount of isk per week. If you do not have the proper standings you get a special flag but attacking those players still drops your sec standing. Standings would degrade over time so you cant just grind up and stop. Characters under a certain age would be immune You would be able to contract sec standing to other people at whatever price you saw fit There would be a several month warning of this so nobody can claim they were caught with their pants down. This would make the line between empire and lowsec less defined and cause pvp to be more widespread but still give people the ability to opt out while in high sec. And create another isk sink in Eve that there are so many threads crying about. Lay off the drugs you silly goon. Go back to delve and pew pew... less stupid ideas. =============== CEO of Clan Shadow Cadre www.shadowcadre.com ===============
Shinma Apollo	Posted - 2009.03.17 17:27:00 - [7] Supported: This problem cuts into the heart of the disparity in empire/0.0 productivity discord. 0.0 industrialists either have a time or isk drawback at establishing their own protective cartels, whereas empire is given it for free. Either 0.0 manufacturing has to be raised in productivity and efficiency, or empire productivity needs to be hampered through methods such as this.
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre Worlds End Consortium	Posted - 2009.03.17 18:05:00 - [8] Originally by: Shinma Apollo Supported: This problem cuts into the heart of the disparity in empire/0.0 productivity discord. 0.0 industrialists either have a time or isk drawback at establishing their own protective cartels, whereas empire is given it for free. Either 0.0 manufacturing has to be raised in productivity and efficiency, or empire productivity needs to be hampered through methods such as this. there's this thing called war-decs.... Also keep in mind just who builds your fancy toys too pal. =============== CEO of Clan Shadow Cadre www.shadowcadre.com ===============
EdFromLogistics	Posted - 2009.03.17 18:10:00 - [9] Originally by: Drake Draconis Originally by: Shinma Apollo Supported: This problem cuts into the heart of the disparity in empire/0.0 productivity discord. 0.0 industrialists either have a time or isk drawback at establishing their own protective cartels, whereas empire is given it for free. Either 0.0 manufacturing has to be raised in productivity and efficiency, or empire productivity needs to be hampered through methods such as this. there's this thing called war-decs.... Also keep in mind just who builds your fancy toys too pal. uh we build all our "fancy tools" in house. Also this is something outside war decs entirely. Kind of amusing to see the only complaints coming from people afraid of engaging in what this game was designed for :)
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre Worlds End Consortium	Posted - 2009.03.17 18:24:00 - [10] Originally by: EdFromLogistics Originally by: Drake Draconis Originally by: Shinma Apollo Supported: This problem cuts into the heart of the disparity in empire/0.0 productivity discord. 0.0 industrialists either have a time or isk drawback at establishing their own protective cartels, whereas empire is given it for free. Either 0.0 manufacturing has to be raised in productivity and efficiency, or empire productivity needs to be hampered through methods such as this. there's this thing called war-decs.... Also keep in mind just who builds your fancy toys too pal. uh we build all our "fancy tools" in house. Also this is something outside war decs entirely. Kind of amusing to see the only complaints coming from people afraid of engaging in what this game was designed for :) I'm not the idiot who's got the convenience of an several hundred corp backing him either. =============== CEO of Clan Shadow Cadre www.shadowcadre.com ===============
EdFromHumanResources Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.17 19:31:00 - [11] You should retype that and try again ------------------------------------------------- Everyone hates goonswarm for one reason or another. ... And they promote ***gotism -Zurrar
Efrim Black Gallente Apellon	Posted - 2009.03.17 19:40:00 - [12] Originally by: EdFromHumanResources You should retype that and try again You kind of lost any edge you had in this thread when you basically resorted to bickering to keep bumping your lame idea to the front page. Like most Goons, you're annoying, and you're just looking for another way to Grief. Go hide behind your wall of idiots and leave the real thinking to those of us with some cognitive ability in our grey matter. Go play in a wormhole.
Dianeces The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2009.03.17 19:43:00 - [13] Edited by: Dianeces on 17/03/2009 19:43:00 Originally by: Isaac Starstriker No. No support at all. High-sec is made to be safe. No if, ands or buts. --Isaac Safer~~ -dnc
EdFromHumanResources GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.17 19:48:00 - [14] Originally by: Efrim Black Originally by: EdFromHumanResources You should retype that and try again You kind of lost any edge you had in this thread when you basically resorted to bickering to keep bumping your lame idea to the front page. Like most Goons, you're annoying, and you're just looking for another way to Grief. Go hide behind your wall of idiots and leave the real thinking to those of us with some cognitive ability in our grey matter. Go play in a wormhole. So bickering caused me to lose any sort of edge by bickering and you quickly follow that statement up with that. Truly genius. But thanks for the bump :) More bumps whining are appreciated ------------------------------------------------- Everyone hates goonswarm for one reason or another. ... And they promote ***gotism -Zurrar
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre Worlds End Consortium	Posted - 2009.03.17 20:28:00 - [15] Originally by: EdFromHumanResources Originally by: Efrim Black Originally by: EdFromHumanResources You should retype that and try again You kind of lost any edge you had in this thread when you basically resorted to bickering to keep bumping your lame idea to the front page. Like most Goons, you're annoying, and you're just looking for another way to Grief. Go hide behind your wall of idiots and leave the real thinking to those of us with some cognitive ability in our grey matter. Go play in a wormhole. So bickering caused me to lose any sort of edge by bickering and you quickly follow that statement up with that. Truly genius. But thanks for the bump :) More bumps whining are appreciated Whats genius is the fact you fail to recognize that not everyone has an entire alliance with massive manufacturing capabilities at there disposal. Any credence you had... goes right out the door. But your not smart enough to figure that out... as Efrim so eloquently pointed out. =============== CEO of Clan Shadow Cadre www.shadowcadre.com ===============
Ryoken McKeon Galactic Defence Syndicate Eradication Alliance	Posted - 2009.03.17 20:58:00 - [16] Edited by: Ryoken McKeon on 17/03/2009 20:57:46 Originally by: EdFromHumanResources Originally by: Efrim Black Originally by: EdFromHumanResources You should retype that and try again You kind of lost any edge you had in this thread when you basically resorted to bickering to keep bumping your lame idea to the front page. Like most Goons, you're annoying, and you're just looking for another way to Grief. Go hide behind your wall of idiots and leave the real thinking to those of us with some cognitive ability in our grey matter. Go play in a wormhole. So bickering caused me to lose any sort of edge by bickering and you quickly follow that statement up with that. Truly genius. But thanks for the bump :) More bumps whining are appreciated Actually, any credibility you had you lost when you first started posting on EVE-O, I can't think of a time when I haven't seen your overly long name and thought "I wish he'd just stop posting."
EdFromHumanResources Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.17 20:59:00 - [17] You're* ------------------------------------------------- Everyone hates goonswarm for one reason or another. ... And they promote ***gotism -Zurrar
Isaac Starstriker Amarr Celestial Ascension Tenth Legion	Posted - 2009.03.18 02:32:00 - [18] Originally by: Dianeces Edited by: Dianeces on 17/03/2009 19:43:00 Originally by: Isaac Starstriker No. No support at all. High-sec is made to be safe. No if, ands or buts. --Isaac Safer~~ -dnc Ok true, safER not safe. But still no support. --Isaac Isaac's Haul*Mart
EdFromHumanResources Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.18 03:03:00 - [19] Originally by: Isaac Starstriker Originally by: Dianeces Edited by: Dianeces on 17/03/2009 19:43:00 Originally by: Isaac Starstriker No. No support at all. High-sec is made to be safe. No if, ands or buts. --Isaac Safer~~ -dnc Ok true, safER not safe. But still no support. --Isaac Why exactly? Because you don't like being vulnerable in what's considered a "harsh galaxy" or because you think that being in empire its the game mechanics job to protect you from pvp no matter what? ------------------------------------------------- Everyone hates goonswarm for one reason or another. ... And they promote ***gotism -Zurrar
Efrim Black Gallente Apellon	Posted - 2009.03.18 04:12:00 - [20] Edited by: Efrim Black on 18/03/2009 04:12:10 Originally by: EdFromHumanResources Why exactly? Because you don't like being vulnerable in what's considered a "harsh galaxy" or because you think that being in empire its the game mechanics job to protect you from pvp no matter what? Make it so concord wont defend your unless you have certain standings with the entity who's space youre in or you pay a certain amount of isk per week. * No... What is it with you? Are you that dumb? The flaw is your idea. Concord is not some independant mercenary group. They function as a United Nations. They do not do what they do for money, they do it to preserve at least the semblance of peace in Empire space. People are already vulnerable in High sec. If your idea was so great you'd be generating quite a bit more support. As opposed to you know, One alt, and another Goon.
EdFromHumanResources Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.18 06:15:00 - [21] Originally by: Efrim Black Edited by: Efrim Black on 18/03/2009 04:12:10 Originally by: EdFromHumanResources Why exactly? Because you don't like being vulnerable in what's considered a "harsh galaxy" or because you think that being in empire its the game mechanics job to protect you from pvp no matter what? Make it so concord wont defend your unless you have certain standings with the entity who's space youre in or you pay a certain amount of isk per week. * No... What is it with you? Are you that dumb? The flaw is your idea. Concord is not some independant mercenary group. They function as a United Nations. They do not do what they do for money, they do it to preserve at least the semblance of peace in Empire space. People are already vulnerable in High sec. If your idea was so great you'd be generating quite a bit more support. As opposed to you know, One alt, and another Goon. Now I know the UN theoretically plays an impartial 3rd party to conflicts around the world but im afraid that just isnt the case. Any institution that involves humans involves favoritism. Research the UN a bit and see why many people think it should be completely disbanded and perhaps you can try that one again. ------------------------------------------------- Everyone hates goonswarm for one reason or another. ... And they promote ***gotism -Zurrar
Isaac Starstriker Amarr Celestial Ascension Tenth Legion	Posted - 2009.03.18 07:02:00 - [22] Originally by: EdFromHumanResources Originally by: Efrim Black Edited by: Efrim Black on 18/03/2009 04:12:10 Originally by: EdFromHumanResources Why exactly? Because you don't like being vulnerable in what's considered a "harsh galaxy" or because you think that being in empire its the game mechanics job to protect you from pvp no matter what? Make it so concord wont defend your unless you have certain standings with the entity who's space youre in or you pay a certain amount of isk per week. * No... What is it with you? Are you that dumb? The flaw is your idea. Concord is not some independant mercenary group. They function as a United Nations. They do not do what they do for money, they do it to preserve at least the semblance of peace in Empire space. People are already vulnerable in High sec. If your idea was so great you'd be generating quite a bit more support. As opposed to you know, One alt, and another Goon. Now I know the UN theoretically plays an impartial 3rd party to conflicts around the world but im afraid that just isnt the case. Any institution that involves humans involves favoritism. Research the UN a bit and see why many people think it should be completely disbanded and perhaps you can try that one again. Yes, Concord is supposed to be similar to the UN. However, they have no favoritism, cannot be bribed or corrupted. They keep the peace as best they can. (Read some Eve Chronicles...) So as CCP has already written it down that they ARE an impartial 3rd party, it is so. I've lived in all sectors of space btw. High-sec has some nice things, but I prefer the lower-security areas. I don't see why people should have to grind standings with Concord to be protected. The Sec-status system works fine in this area. Your above -1 and they don't shoot. Your below and they shoot. We don't need to change this. --Isaac Isaac's Haul*Mart
EdFromHumanResources Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.03.18 07:14:00 - [23] Originally by: Isaac Starstriker Originally by: EdFromHumanResources Originally by: Efrim Black Edited by: Efrim Black on 18/03/2009 04:12:10 Originally by: EdFromHumanResources Why exactly? Because you don't like being vulnerable in what's considered a "harsh galaxy" or because you think that being in empire its the game mechanics job to protect you from pvp no matter what? Make it so concord wont defend your unless you have certain standings with the entity who's space youre in or you pay a certain amount of isk per week. * No... What is it with you? Are you that dumb? The flaw is your idea. Concord is not some independant mercenary group. They function as a United Nations. They do not do what they do for money, they do it to preserve at least the semblance of peace in Empire space. People are already vulnerable in High sec. If your idea was so great you'd be generating quite a bit more support. As opposed to you know, One alt, and another Goon. Now I know the UN theoretically plays an impartial 3rd party to conflicts around the world but im afraid that just isnt the case. Any institution that involves humans involves favoritism. Research the UN a bit and see why many people think it should be completely disbanded and perhaps you can try that one again. Yes, Concord is supposed to be similar to the UN. However, they have no favoritism, cannot be bribed or corrupted. They keep the peace as best they can. (Read some Eve Chronicles...) So as CCP has already written it down that they ARE an impartial 3rd party, it is so. I've lived in all sectors of space btw. High-sec has some nice things, but I prefer the lower-security areas. I don't see why people should have to grind standings with Concord to be protected. The Sec-status system works fine in this area. Your above -1 and they don't shoot. Your below and they shoot. We don't need to change this. --Isaac Show me someone without a price and I will show you someone who simply hasn't had their price met :) ------------------------------------------------- Everyone hates goonswarm for one reason or another. ... And they promote ***gotism -Zurrar
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N. Dara Cothrom	Posted - 2009.03.18 13:25:00 - [24] Edited by: Malcanis on 18/03/2009 13:26:15 Originally by: Isaac Starstriker No. No support at all. High-sec is made to be safe. No if, ands or buts. --Isaac No, actually, it isn't.
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre Worlds End Consortium	Posted - 2009.03.18 14:40:00 - [25] Arguing with a goon is like arguing with a ******. He's too prideful and stubborn to think straight and only cares about griefing... never mind the mechanics. Your better off ignoring this thread and letting the goons and alts of goons make an ass of themselves.....again....and again...and again....and again <trails off>. =============== CEO of Clan Shadow Cadre www.shadowcadre.com ===============
Isaac Starstriker Amarr Celestial Ascension Tenth Legion	Posted - 2009.03.18 16:23:00 - [26] Originally by: Drake Draconis Arguing with a goon is like arguing with a *****. He's too prideful and stubborn to think straight and only cares about griefing... never mind the mechanics. Your better off ignoring this thread and letting the goons and alts of goons make an ass of themselves.....again....and again...and again....and again <trails off>. Your right Drake. Dunno why I even bothered. /thread Yup, /thread --Isaac Isaac's HaulMart
Shinma Apollo	Posted - 2009.03.18 19:14:00 - [27] Getting the thread back on topic, a person in highsec can simply drop corp, or stay in an npc corp and manufacture. Imagine two manufacturing POS, one located in say, perimeter, one in Hemin (curse). I, through whatever reason, forget to fuel my POS, and it goes offline. In the first case, I risk someone suicide ganking my POS for whatever I've left in there, though with sec hit, it's unlikely anyone can finish the job. In the second, I merely have no recourse, other than to defend it. arguing that wardecs are a means around it ignore the fact that it's not a question of the attacker, but the ancillary costs borne by the producers that currently hinders 0.0 manufacturing. By increasing the risk, or in lieu of that, increasing the cost of avoiding risk, it'll at least provide more incentive for 0.0 manufacturing.
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre Worlds End Consortium	Posted - 2009.03.18 19:18:00 - [28] Originally by: Shinma Apollo Getting the thread back on topic, a person in highsec can simply drop corp, or stay in an npc corp and manufacture. Imagine two manufacturing POS, one located in say, perimeter, one in Hemin (curse). I, through whatever reason, forget to fuel my POS, and it goes offline. In the first case, I risk someone suicide ganking my POS for whatever I've left in there, though with sec hit, it's unlikely anyone can finish the job. In the second, I merely have no recourse, other than to defend it. arguing that wardecs are a means around it ignore the fact that it's not a question of the attacker, but the ancillary costs borne by the producers that currently hinders 0.0 manufacturing. By increasing the risk, or in lieu of that, increasing the cost of avoiding risk, it'll at least provide more incentive for 0.0 manufacturing. Nice point... however... in 0.0... all you need is a good solid alliance/gang and your able to gather resources not normally available in high sec. Incentive or not... all can be worked with to some degree or another. System works as intended in THAT context. =============== CEO of Clan Shadow Cadre www.shadowcadre.com ===============
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2009.03.18 19:40:00 - [29] Originally by: Shinma Apollo Getting the thread back on topic, a person in highsec can simply drop corp, or stay in an npc corp and manufacture. Imagine two manufacturing POS, one located in say, perimeter, one in Hemin (curse). I, through whatever reason, forget to fuel my POS, and it goes offline. In the first case, I risk someone suicide ganking my POS for whatever I've left in there, though with sec hit, it's unlikely anyone can finish the job. In the second, I merely have no recourse, other than to defend it. arguing that wardecs are a means around it ignore the fact that it's not a question of the attacker, but the ancillary costs borne by the producers that currently hinders 0.0 manufacturing. By increasing the risk, or in lieu of that, increasing the cost of avoiding risk, it'll at least provide more incentive for 0.0 manufacturing. In your low sec POS you can react gases, react moon minerals, moon mine and have less fuel cost (no faction charters). So you have several important advantages for a serious disadvantage (unless you place it in 0.4 systems, where you have only the disadvantages, but then the problem is your brain not the POS). Seem balanced.
Shinma Apollo	Posted - 2009.03.18 20:49:00 - [30] Originally by: Drake Draconis Originally by: Shinma Apollo Getting the thread back on topic, a person in highsec can simply drop corp, or stay in an npc corp and manufacture. Imagine two manufacturing POS, one located in say, perimeter, one in Hemin (curse). I, through whatever reason, forget to fuel my POS, and it goes offline. In the first case, I risk someone suicide ganking my POS for whatever I've left in there, though with sec hit, it's unlikely anyone can finish the job. In the second, I merely have no recourse, other than to defend it. arguing that wardecs are a means around it ignore the fact that it's not a question of the attacker, but the ancillary costs borne by the producers that currently hinders 0.0 manufacturing. By increasing the risk, or in lieu of that, increasing the cost of avoiding risk, it'll at least provide more incentive for 0.0 manufacturing. Nice point... however... in 0.0... all you need is a good solid alliance/gang and your able to gather resources not normally available in high sec. Incentive or not... all can be worked with to some degree or another. System works as intended in THAT context. You've illustrated the point. I have to pay for the defense, so much so that the defensive upkeep is well in excess of whatever benefits are accrued from being in a different security sector than the highsec POS. If my goal is simply industry, there's no economic incentive to remove production from highsec.

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