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IceAero
Amarr Shadow Company
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Posted - 2009.03.28 16:01:00 -
[31]
We've been doing class 5 WH's almost every night for a week, with 6 battleships for the anomalies, and even radar sites. Hacking sites are a little harder and it's nice to have 7 BSs instead.
It's really not that hard, just don't be stupid with your fittings :)
The 'hardest' thing lately is needing salvage V to salvage large wrecks.
We haven't come across a class 6 yet.
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Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.03.28 16:34:00 -
[32]
How are folks so sure about what class wormhole system they are in if all these factors are mixed up? How do you know you're in a class 5 system and not a class 3 with core sites?
Originally by: Jalum Krayal
Unknown Class 1 Class 2 Class 3
Dangerous Class 4 Class 5
Deadly Class 6
So we really cannot assume too much based on the classification.
It sounds like this is 100% verified and that the anomalies are independently generated and organized.
Players have reported seeing Core sites in Unknown systems and frontier sites in Deadly systems. I assume that means you cannot assume the difficulty ratings of sites based on the general classification of the wormhole.
Variables that go into the overall classification might include special events within (i.e. black hole, pulsar, etc) and total system sites. Perhaps an Unknown system just has a "tendency" to have perimeter anomalies but that there's a chance to have either frontier or core sites.
These are categories of difficulty but they can spawn through the different classes of w-systems based on undetermined variables?
Perimeter Anomaly - camp - ambush point
Perimeter Anomaly - checkpoint - hangar
Frontier Anomaly - outpost - fortification
Frontier Anomaly - command - barracks
Core Anomaly - garrison - stronghold
Core Anomaly - bastion - citadel ___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
Jalum Krayal
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Posted - 2009.03.28 17:34:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Nyota Sol How are folks so sure about what class wormhole system they are in if all these factors are mixed up? How do you know you're in a class 5 system and not a class 3 with core sites?
Assuming Entity's classification map is accurate, I was just going off the "Show Info" of the particular wormholes. I've spent a week in a Class 5 wormhole whose entrance WH said "dangerous unknown".
I've also cleared Class 3 WHs on a different character and remember seeing Outposts and Strongholds, FWIW.
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Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.03.28 18:05:00 -
[34]
Edited by: Nyota Sol on 28/03/2009 18:12:49
Originally by: Jalum Krayal
Originally by: Nyota Sol How are folks so sure about what class wormhole system they are in if all these factors are mixed up? How do you know you're in a class 5 system and not a class 3 with core sites?
Assuming Entity's classification map is accurate, I was just going off the "Show Info" of the particular wormholes. I've spent a week in a Class 5 wormhole whose entrance WH said "dangerous unknown".
I've also cleared Class 3 WHs on a different character and remember seeing Outposts and Strongholds, FWIW.
I dont assume anybody's database/map is accurate if they cant explain how they determined the class of a w-system in replicable ways. Perhaps entity has access to a CCP data dump where the class is indicated. I don't know. Hence why i'm asking where folks are getting class determinations.
If we're trying to discuss, as a community, the difficulty ratings and differences of various stuff in w-space and all we have are classifications based on assumptions, then we're likely confusing things more than helping.
Perhaps for now folks should just refer to perimeter, frontier and core sites rather than "class." Perhaps focusing on the WHs rather than on the classes of the w-systems is problematic. Perhaps any given WH can connect to a range of difficulty. What's labeled a "class 3 WH" by Entity perhaps might connect to w-systems with an assortment of anomalies (perimeter, frontier, core). It seems to me that none of us know EXACTLY what constitutes the parameters of a class 3 w-system.
I'm really curious how this works and whether there's some "total system difficulty index" or just a set of probabilities.
I am on the test server but cant find a single WH after 25 systems. ___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
Nyota Sol
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Posted - 2009.03.28 22:48:00 -
[35]
ive been told that the database dump from singularity has the classes for various w-systems, so that's probably why entity's data and others' is so comprehensive.
at this point i would request folks saying they had core anomalies in a class 1 or 2 w-system post screenshots because these rumors imply a system that's far more complicated than meets the eye. ___________________________________________
Lost in Space - Apocrypha Exploration Resources |
Kivak Wolf
Caldari Mars Industrial Shade Underworld
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Posted - 2009.03.31 00:49:00 -
[36]
Frontier Anomaly - outpost - fortification
These are in a class 3, however, regular NOT dangerous space. I live in a system like this.
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-Kivak Wolf- Creator of the Opaxse POS Designer |
Bellum Eternus
Gallente Death of Virtue
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Posted - 2009.03.31 04:16:00 -
[37]
My crew and I have been running Class 5 sites with 4-5 BS max, quite easily. Every type of site. If you guys are using more, you're either doing it wrong, or the w-space system you're in is hitting you with some severe tanking penalties. And believe me, there are some like that out there. We've come across a few.
The Tier6 stuff you can get away with about a dozen BS pretty readily.
Bellum Eternus Inveniam viam aut faciam.
Death of Virtue is Recruiting
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KasperIce
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Posted - 2009.05.15 16:46:00 -
[38]
well heres my 2 cents on 1.2.3's done em all solo in a drake, no problems
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Turiel Demon
Minmatar Shadow Reapers
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Posted - 2009.05.15 17:09:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Turiel Demon on 15/05/2009 17:10:01
Originally by: VB Sarge
Class 1 - generally easily solo able by a HAC or BC Class 2 - somewhat solo able by a HAC or BC Class 3 - minimum suggested gang of 2x HAC/BC and 1x Logistics, alternatively 2x tanked BS Class 4 - 5-8 man remote rep BS with 1x ecm support Class 5 - 15 man remote rep BS fleet with ecm support Class 6 - 25 man remote rep BS fleet with ecm support
Correction:
Class 1 - generally easily solo able by a HAC or BC Class 2 - somewhat solo able by a HAC or BC Class 3 - Barely solo able in CS/SC, teams of 2-3 recomended Class 4 - 3-6 people, RR bs, logistics, CS all viable. Class 5 - 4-7 people RR bs, 1 armor tanked ECM scorp recommended, Class 6 - 7 people minimum, all ships must have 50K+ effective armor hitpoints, 1 or 2 armor tanked ECM scorps minimum, Damnation with all 3 armor gang-mods mandatory.
Of course,even C6 have easy sites, heck even the hardest ladar site - the Instrumental Core Reservoir - can be done with just 4 RR bs, the above is for combat, radar and magnetometric sites.
Also, it has come to my attention that I'm really in need of a proper signature. |
Petyr Baelich
Taggart Transdimensional Virtue of Selfishness
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Posted - 2009.05.15 20:41:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Turiel Demon Edited by: Turiel Demon on 15/05/2009 17:10:01 Correction:
Class 1 - generally easily solo able by a HAC or BC Class 2 - somewhat solo able by a HAC or BC Class 3 - Barely solo able in CS/SC, teams of 2-3 recomended Class 4 - 3-6 people, RR bs, logistics, CS all viable. Class 5 - 4-7 people RR bs, 1 armor tanked ECM scorp recommended, Class 6 - 7 people minimum, all ships must have 50K+ effective armor hitpoints, 1 or 2 armor tanked ECM scorps minimum, Damnation with all 3 armor gang-mods mandatory.
Of course,even C6 have easy sites, heck even the hardest ladar site - the Instrumental Core Reservoir - can be done with just 4 RR bs, the above is for combat, radar and magnetometric sites.
Confirming this. Also, don't forget remote energy transfers on your RR BSs. Even-numbered pairs of ships work best as you can have an energy transfer "buddy" and focus your RRs on whomever is primaried by the sleepers while your entire fleet is cap stable without cap boosters.
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Dodgy Past
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Posted - 2009.05.16 11:16:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Durindana
Originally by: sightceer I ran one yesterday, the spawns triggered before we had cleared the field of the previous spawn (not sure of the triggers yet). We had 16 Sleeper BS's, 20 Cruisers and 40 Frigs, most on the field at the same time. Coordinating the logistics was enough of a problem, trying to coordinate EW and TD's would be well beyond most FC's ability under those circumstances. There is a lot going on in these sites, just watching the sleepers to see which one is remote repping your current target so you can jam him is tough.
lulz **** I <3 the sleepers. It's like CCP sat around and thought "how can we get those bastard players to actually have to use all these crazy ships we came up with?"
I suspect they did, Class 3s are great places to get used to small gang tactics.
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Vash The'Stampede
Sicarii.
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Posted - 2009.05.17 12:25:00 -
[42]
Originally by: KasperIce well heres my 2 cents on 1.2.3's done em all solo in a drake, no problems
wanted to confirm I solo up to class 3 in a passive drake as well
how ever its slow and boring so i recently switched to using a Proteus to speed it up
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Coriik Mastchoff
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Posted - 2009.05.17 14:37:00 -
[43]
Edited by: Coriik Mastchoff on 17/05/2009 14:37:59
Originally by: Vash The'Stampede
Originally by: KasperIce well heres my 2 cents on 1.2.3's done em all solo in a drake, no problems
wanted to confirm I solo up to class 3 in a passive drake as well
how ever its slow and boring so i recently switched to using a Proteus to speed it up
I solo them in a Dominix slowly, so you definitely don't need a gang.
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Dar Qsyde
Caldari Darqsyde Exploration Limited
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Posted - 2009.05.18 05:25:00 -
[44]
I can fairly easily solo Anomalies in a class 3 (Pulsar) in a Drake...tend to end up feeding the Sleepers lots of drones...but still relatively easy, similar to the harder L4 missions. I suspect I could probably solo thru any Mag/Radar sites we get, but I haven't had to/had a chance to yet.
Of course it helps that I have a complete T2 fitting on the Drake, and don't have to worry about packing a Salvager or Probe Launcher, since we live in the system. -Director-DARQ
"You don't know the power..." |
Larofeticus
Tenacious Tendencies
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Posted - 2009.05.18 07:09:00 -
[45]
The "class" (1-6) of a system sets exactly which kinds of anomalies will spawn.
However, the class only probablistically determines what kinds of anomalies spawn.
The difficulty of sites has alot more to do with what type of sleepers spawn than their ship class.
Perimeter sites spawn basic sleepers. Can do it all with a hac, even when you see some BS.
Frontier sites spawn intermediate sleepers. If you are careful not to kill the trigger of the first spawn, you can easily ninja any radar or mag site without risk. It takes some time though because the trigger usually webs you. I use a domi.
Core sites spawn advanced sleepers, and these are the ones you need a RR fleet with ewar and gang coordination to handle.
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Haram Haram
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Posted - 2009.05.18 09:45:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Larofeticus
Frontier sites spawn intermediate sleepers. If you are careful not to kill the trigger of the first spawn, you can easily ninja any radar or mag site without risk. It takes some time though because the trigger usually webs you. I use a domi.
Ehh you can tank a Unsecured Frontier Enclave Relay in a Domi? (i.e. 3 x Sleeples Keeper BS?) can you post you fitting?
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2009.05.18 10:46:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Turiel Demon
Of course,even C6 have easy sites, heck even the hardest ladar site - the Instrumental Core Reservoir - can be done with just 4 RR bs, the above is for combat, radar and magnetometric sites.
I would not class belts and clouds as "sites". All belts and clouds can be soloed in a BS. I know, because I've done it many times, in all but the negative resistance "bonus" systems. Mind you, it's not very efficient as you're working against their tanks with just the dps from one bs. It only starts going "like PvE should" when you've got two or more ships putting out at least 1500-2000dps combined. (Still talking only about belts and clouds, have yet to see class 5&6 actual sites being treated like I would want them to be treated, with 6000+ output dps + 2x scorps countering rat rr.
Sigh.
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Zhu Wei
Caldari Dreams of Desolation
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Posted - 2009.05.18 12:35:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Flinchey Edited by: Flinchey on 26/03/2009 10:41:44 and no, class 6 is not solable by 25man rr bs... they get melted one by one, i've seen it.
do you see what is wrong with this?
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2009.05.18 14:40:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Zhu Wei
Originally by: Flinchey Edited by: Flinchey on 26/03/2009 10:41:44 and no, class 6 is not solable by 25man rr bs... they get melted one by one, i've seen it.
do you see what is wrong with this?
I see what is right and correct about it.
The day even the toughest sites are guide'ified so any numpty fleet can chain them from dusk 'til dawn, that's the day w-space will be have been officially ruined by the makers of said guides.
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Zhu Wei
Caldari Dreams of Desolation
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Posted - 2009.05.18 14:42:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Qui Shon
Originally by: Zhu Wei
Originally by: Flinchey Edited by: Flinchey on 26/03/2009 10:41:44 and no, class 6 is not solable by 25man rr bs... they get melted one by one, i've seen it.
do you see what is wrong with this?
I see what is right and correct about it.
The day even the toughest sites are guide'ified so any numpty fleet can chain them from dusk 'til dawn, that's the day w-space will be have been officially ruined by the makers of said guides.
Oh noes! You misunderstand. You cannot solo with 25 man squads, it's not solo then is it :P
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2009.05.18 14:56:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Zhu Wei
Oh noes! You misunderstand. You cannot solo with 25 man squads, it's not solo then is it :P
Ohh, that's what you meant
Yeah, silly use of the word indeed. I was more thinking of the silly claim about 25 rr bs failing at sleeper sites.
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Ace Secunda
Aperture Harmonics APEX Conglomerate
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Posted - 2009.05.21 17:25:00 -
[52]
Just too start, If anyone is looking for T3 kill-mails there are a bunch of players flying them around Solitude and the linking 0.0 area, some of them are outlaws too and really easily baited. There is a pair of guys flying a Proteus and Legion most nights with just a ceptor to tackle for them.
We have been living in a class 3 wormhole for a while now, we have everything we need inside it and we only really leave to buy stuff and run the WH's surrounding us. There is a huge amount of money to be taken from wormholes if you have enough people involved using the right setups. A full class three with around 10 anomalies and 5 Sites can bring you around 2 billion total between 4 people and would take around three hours in an evening to complete, thats 500 million each for 3 hours in an evening, a one month plex and a new PvP HAC in one night. You will not find good WH's like this every night but its safe to say you will every other night but this means you can do 1 night of 'Sleeper Bashing' and then another taking out the local low/null sec sites or PvP'ing the locals.
'If I can't blow it up It don't exsist'
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zzttzzt
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Posted - 2009.05.21 20:09:00 -
[53]
Edited by: zzttzzt on 21/05/2009 20:10:14 I've been able to do everything up to class 3 anomalies and ninja "frontier" mag/radar sites in a Domi, solo. You just need to know the triggers for the "Frontier" sites and also warp in/out a few times
Here's the fitting.
Highs
Core Probe Launcher Improved Cloak II Small Tractor Beam I Salvager II Large Remote Armor Repairer II Drone Link Augmenter I
Mids:
Cap Recharger II Two Omnidirectional Tracking Link I Analyzer II and/or Codebreaker II Target Painter II
Lows:
Large Armor Repairer II Two 1600mm Rolled Tungsten plates Three Amarr Navy Energized Adaptive Nanomembranes Damage Control II
Rigs: Three Capacitor Control Circuit I
Drones: Garde IIs and Bouncer IIs Mix of medium and light drones to kill frigates
As long as you are smart with your drones, you can literally stay in W-space for weeks without coming back to k-space. This is good because you don't have to come back until you find a nice, safe, wormhole leading to high security space. There's no ammo to worry about like missile ships (eg Drakes).
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ZenSun
Total Mayhem. Cry Havoc.
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Posted - 2009.05.25 14:46:00 -
[54]
25 man lol...
we did a class 6 with 3x apocs (2x trimarks, 1x enery locus, mega pulse with scorch) 3x guardians energy xfering eachother and 1x damnation.
Guardian = x > y > z > x (> indicates which ship reps who) Damnation = good armor bonuses Apocs = with fairly good tank you still pump out excellent dps, you run with no local reps or RR, the guardians do it all with you on watchlist.
It is also worth having a webbing damnation with some sort of dps toward the frigates, as they were a pain in the ass... |
Disfigured Thief
Gallente Timetravel Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.05.26 21:02:00 -
[55]
Edited by: Disfigured Thief on 26/05/2009 21:03:00
Originally by: VB Sarge In here, I would like to see if we as a collective whole can't come to some general agreement and catalog the "difficulty" of Wormholes based on Class levels.
Example: (keep in mind I have very little experience in wormholes over Class 3 difficulty, these are just general examples of some preliminary findings)
Class 1 - generally easily solo able by a HAC or BC Class 2 - somewhat solo able by a HAC or BC Class 3 - minimum suggested gang of 2x HAC/BC and 1x Logistics, alternatively 2x tanked BS Class 4 - 5-8 man remote rep BS with 1x ecm support Class 5 - 15 man remote rep BS fleet with ecm support Class 6 - 25 man remote rep BS fleet with ecm support
While this will be a heavily debated topic I imagine, I am confident that we will be able to come out with at least a rough idea on what it will take to successfully enter and exit a wormhole.
If this is met with ire on the premise of "destroying the discovery factor for the general eve community" well, that sucks.
-Sarge
Ok no wheres the big questions can a 2x max skillz carriers spiderTankin each other clear class4's because right now in my paladin i solo class 3's
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Petyr Baelich
Taggart Transdimensional Virtue of Selfishness
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Posted - 2009.05.26 21:18:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Disfigured Thief Ok no wheres the big questions can a 2x max skillz carriers spiderTankin each other clear class4's because right now in my paladin i solo class 3's
If they both warp to the signature together, probably not. Each cap spawns 6 sleeper BS, and each sleeper BS does roughly 700-800 DPS, so 12 would be around 9-10k in addition to the normal spawns. However, if a standard BS fleet warps in, kills all but the last sleeper, and then one carrier warps in - killing all but 1 of the 6 BSs that spawn, and then the other carrier warps in... then something like that would work.
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Stylom
Absolutely No Retreat Blade.
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Posted - 2009.05.28 11:07:00 -
[57]
You can handle all Class 5 & 6 CAs with the following: 3 Logsitics, 2 BC and 2 BS
Obvioulsy you need decent skilled pilots and sensible buffer tank set-ups + you can speed things up alot by adding an extra ship or going for T2 BS but the above does work safetly
Click here for ANR recruitment details |
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