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Tor Gungnir
Agenda Industries
5
   |
Posted - 2012.04.30 16:36:00 -
[1] - Quote
Because I just can't seem to hit those damn little Frigates with my turrets, no matter what I try. But since you apparently need a Battle Cruiser or bigger for Lv3's... what's a Cruiser to do? |
Lyron-Baktos
Selective Pressure
Rote Kapelle
141
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 16:41:00 -
[2] - Quote
I believe I was doing level 2 missions in my Omen, which is a cruiser. Post your ship/fit so we can see if that is the issue.
On holiday. -áIn some other world.
Where the music of the radio was a labyrinth of sonorous colours.
To a bright centre of absolute convicton where the dripping patchouli was more than scent,
It was a sun-á |
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
455
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 16:42:00 -
[3] - Quote
No, L2s should be fine in a cruiser. It is, however, a lesson in managing transversal. Medium turrets do have trouble hitting small targets. Usually you're best off kiting and picking them off at range as much as possible.
Alternatively, you can use a destroyer. For the most part they'll be able to handle whatever L2s throw at you.
What's your ship/fit? |
Tor Gungnir
Agenda Industries
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 16:45:00 -
[4] - Quote
It is a Stabber.
4xDual 180mm Auto Cannons
2xRapid Light Missile Launchers
Mid:
Capacitor Recharger
Capacitor Battery
Cruiser-sized Afterburner
Low:
Damage Control
400mm Plates
Medium Armor Repairer II
Rigs:
None.... |
Fronkfurter McSheebleton
Squirrel Horde
Habitat Against Humanity
85
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 16:57:00 -
[5] - Quote
Honestly, cruisers are the best hull size for L1/2 missions. Battlecruisers are better than T1 cruisers of course, but T2/T3 cruisers just eat through these. (You'll do that on occasion to get standings up)
Destroyers work nicely too, once you've got the skills to fly them well.
On your fit, drop the 400mm plate, it's useless. Drop the capacitor battery as well, and put a tracking computer there. With a tracking script in, it'll help with the frigates. You can put a capacitor power relay in the newly-freed lowslot if you like, to keep it stable. Also, a lone energized adaptive nano membrane would give better armor resists than a lone DCU, leading to a higher amount of sustained dps you can tank.
Also be sure to pick the right ammo against whatever you're shooting.
edit: Just noticed you have no rigs, either. Fix that...medium capacitor control circuits are relatively cheap and would help your fit a ton.
Triple rep Myrms are like what you'd get if youit strapped a beehive to Robocop.-Kale Eledar |
Rezig Huruta
AD ASTRA Interstellar
7
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 17:29:00 -
[6] - Quote
I'm doing t2s with 650mm artillery cannons in a stabber. I have a tracking enhancer but, also, you can burn away from them to make them line up (if they get too close), to bring the transversal down to a manageable level.
On your overview, make sure you have the transversal data showing. Compare that to your tracking.
I'm nuking them from 35 KM away, though if they get close, you burn away and keep missiles on them, plus the one drone you can field.
With the bonuses I have, as well as tracking enhancers, the tracking speed of them is slightly better than 0.032. |
Tor Gungnir
Agenda Industries
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 17:32:00 -
[7] - Quote
Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:
On your fit, drop the 400mm plate, it's useless. .
How come? It is 1.000 extra Armor. Rather good if you ask me.
As for the Damage Control; I like the Hull resistances it gives. Doesn't make damage to the hull as instantly devastating. |
Lyron-Baktos
Selective Pressure
Rote Kapelle
142
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 17:45:00 -
[8] - Quote
Tor Gungnir wrote:Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:
On your fit, drop the 400mm plate, it's useless. .
How come? It is 1.000 extra Armor. Rather good if you ask me. As for the Damage Control; I like the Hull resistances it gives. Doesn't make damage to the hull as instantly devastating.
It's useless as you don't need the protection it provides when you can use something better that you can use.
On holiday. -áIn some other world.
Where the music of the radio was a labyrinth of sonorous colours.
To a bright centre of absolute convicton where the dripping patchouli was more than scent,
It was a sun-á |
Rezig Huruta
AD ASTRA Interstellar
7
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 17:52:00 -
[9] - Quote
If you are getting armor breached on your mission, you might need to reconsider your tactics.
Instead of the armor, you can increase your tracking and damage. If you don't find yourself regularly blasted down to low armor, there's really no problem.
Remember, if things go south, you can warp away. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
62
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 18:46:00 -
[10] - Quote
Tor Gungnir wrote:Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:
On your fit, drop the 400mm plate, it's useless. .
How come? It is 1.000 extra Armor. Rather good if you ask me.
it is dead weight. it makes you slower, less agile, and doesn't improve your repping or dps.
for level 2s I used a shield tanked rupture, plus it has a nice drone bay. Drones are very good for taking out frigs. |
Tor Gungnir
Agenda Industries
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 19:54:00 -
[11] - Quote
I see. Thanks for the input, guys. |
drdxie
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
81
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 20:02:00 -
[12] - Quote
Just get a BC :) save you some headaches, just remember to fit a web if you going AC's. the web will even help your drones kill quicker |
Flakey Foont
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
110
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 20:16:00 -
[13] - Quote
Use mission specific armor hardeners. Use eve-survival.org to see what you need. Plate is not needed in PVE as a rule. |
Tor Gungnir
Agenda Industries
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 21:12:00 -
[14] - Quote
Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:Honestly, cruisers are the best hull size for L1/2 missions. Battlecruisers are better than T1 cruisers of course, but T2/T3 cruisers just eat through these. (You'll do that on occasion to get standings up)
Destroyers work nicely too, once you've got the skills to fly them well.
On your fit, drop the 400mm plate, it's useless. Drop the capacitor battery as well, and put a tracking computer there. With a tracking script in, it'll help with the frigates. You can put a capacitor power relay in the newly-freed lowslot if you like, to keep it stable. Also, a lone energized adaptive nano membrane would give better armor resists than a lone DCU, leading to a higher amount of sustained dps you can tank.
Also be sure to pick the right ammo against whatever you're shooting.
edit: Just noticed you have no rigs, either. Fix that...medium capacitor control circuits are relatively cheap and would help your fit a ton.
I made the changes suggested and it still gets creamed in LV2 missions because the Frigates just won't die. Countless millions down the drain on a worthless ship.
*sigh*
Should just forget this turret nonsense and get myself a Drake or something like 99% of players do. |
Fronkfurter McSheebleton
Squirrel Horde
Habitat Against Humanity
86
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 21:45:00 -
[15] - Quote
Tor Gungnir wrote:Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:Honestly, cruisers are the best hull size for L1/2 missions. Battlecruisers are better than T1 cruisers of course, but T2/T3 cruisers just eat through these. (You'll do that on occasion to get standings up)
Destroyers work nicely too, once you've got the skills to fly them well.
On your fit, drop the 400mm plate, it's useless. Drop the capacitor battery as well, and put a tracking computer there. With a tracking script in, it'll help with the frigates. You can put a capacitor power relay in the newly-freed lowslot if you like, to keep it stable. Also, a lone energized adaptive nano membrane would give better armor resists than a lone DCU, leading to a higher amount of sustained dps you can tank.
Also be sure to pick the right ammo against whatever you're shooting.
edit: Just noticed you have no rigs, either. Fix that...medium capacitor control circuits are relatively cheap and would help your fit a ton. I made the changes suggested and it still gets creamed in LV2 missions because the Frigates just won't die. Countless millions down the drain on a worthless ship. *sigh* Should just forget this turret nonsense and get myself a Caracal/Drake or something like everyone else.
Interesting...
Burn away from them and shoot while they're coming straight at you. A MWD might work better for this, but you should still outrun them with the AB. You could also try a stasis web to hold them still(ish) while you shoot.
Missile ships have their own problems, btw. : /
Triple rep Myrms are like what you'd get if youit strapped a beehive to Robocop.-Kale Eledar |
Tor Gungnir
Agenda Industries
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 21:49:00 -
[16] - Quote
I'm just gonna stick to my Rifter or something. Surprisingly it does a lot better at Lv2 missions. Cruisers seem cursed in that they carry guns for Lv3 missions without the ability to tank those through. |
Lyron-Baktos
Selective Pressure
Rote Kapelle
143
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 21:58:00 -
[17] - Quote
you never answered my questions regarding your Trajectory Analysis skill or if you were fighting in your optimal range. A cruiser should not die in Level 2's unless something is wrong.
Is it all the missions or a certain one?
On holiday. -áIn some other world.
Where the music of the radio was a labyrinth of sonorous colours.
To a bright centre of absolute convicton where the dripping patchouli was more than scent,
It was a sun-á |
Rezig Huruta
AD ASTRA Interstellar
8
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 22:02:00 -
[18] - Quote
You're not trying to orbit them are you?
The dual 180s have tracking of 0.139... if you're not orbiting them, you should be creaming them.
Are you using the correct ammo? Make sure to add the velocity to the overview so you can see how fast they are traversing. |
Tor Gungnir
Agenda Industries
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 22:02:00 -
[19] - Quote
Lyron-Baktos wrote:you never answered my questions regarding your Trajectory Analysis skill or if you were fighting in your optimal range. A cruiser should not die in Level 2's unless something is wrong.
Is it all the missions or a certain one?
Lv4.
Fighting within optimal range. Keep missing salvo after salvo. Even with a Tracking Computer active. |
Nerath Naaris
Pink Winged Unicorns for Peace Love and Anarchy
98
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 22:04:00 -
[20] - Quote
Did you actually lose your cruiser? Because I am not aware that the rats in L2s scram you, so you should be able to warp out any time.
Anyway, if you have trouble with tracking, try fitting small guns, that can-¦t be worse than a Rifter. I think that your main problem might simply be a serious lack of skills.
Forum-unbanned since 2011.10.20. |
Tor Gungnir
Agenda Industries
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 22:05:00 -
[21] - Quote
Nerath Naaris wrote:Did you actually lose your cruiser? Because I am not aware that the rats in L2s scram you, so you should be able to warp out any time.
Anyway, if you have trouble with tracking, try fitting small guns, that can-¦t be worse than a Rifter. I think that your main problem might simply be a serious lack of skills.
Did not lose it, but since I can't fly missions with it..... |
Rezig Huruta
AD ASTRA Interstellar
8
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 22:08:00 -
[22] - Quote
If you're minmatar, the Thrasher is quite deadly. Treat it like a bigger rifter and you'll whoop 'em with small guns.
If you're fighting Angel cartel and using EM, that's not good. Use Fusion for short range. |
Fronkfurter McSheebleton
Squirrel Horde
Habitat Against Humanity
86
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 22:09:00 -
[23] - Quote
Tor Gungnir wrote:
Lv4.
Fighting within optimal range. Keep missing salvo after salvo. Even with a Tracking Computer active..
This is your problem. Autocannons fight in falloff...staying within optimal range usually doesn't work out well. Get farther away from them. About halfway into your falloff should work well enough.
You can even add a range script to the tracking computer and burn out even farther.
Triple rep Myrms are like what you'd get if youit strapped a beehive to Robocop.-Kale Eledar |
Nerath Naaris
Pink Winged Unicorns for Peace Love and Anarchy
98
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 22:17:00 -
[24] - Quote
Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:Tor Gungnir wrote:
Lv4.
Fighting within optimal range. Keep missing salvo after salvo. Even with a Tracking Computer active..
This is your problem. Autocannons fight in falloff...staying within optimal range usually doesn't work out well. Get farther away from them. About halfway into your falloff should work well enough. You can even add a range script to the tracking computer and burn out even farther.
Also, it-¦s Motion Prediction which improves your tracking by 5% per level.
Trajectory Analysis improves falloff by 5% per level (which is quite important as well, especially for Minmatar, though).
Forum-unbanned since 2011.10.20. |
Lyron-Baktos
Selective Pressure
Rote Kapelle
143
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 22:28:00 -
[25] - Quote
Nerath Naaris wrote:Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote:Tor Gungnir wrote:
Lv4.
Fighting within optimal range. Keep missing salvo after salvo. Even with a Tracking Computer active..
This is your problem. Autocannons fight in falloff...staying within optimal range usually doesn't work out well. Get farther away from them. About halfway into your falloff should work well enough. You can even add a range script to the tracking computer and burn out even farther. Also, it-¦s Motion Prediction which improves your tracking by 5% per level. Trajectory Analysis improves falloff by 5% per level (which is quite important as well, especially for Minmatar, though).
thanks for correcting me 
On holiday. -áIn some other world.
Where the music of the radio was a labyrinth of sonorous colours.
To a bright centre of absolute convicton where the dripping patchouli was more than scent,
It was a sun-á |
Tor Gungnir
Agenda Industries
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 22:44:00 -
[26] - Quote
So "Falloff" is what you should gun for. Then why the heck is it called "Optimal Range?".
This game never ceases to confuse me. |
drdxie
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
81
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 22:48:00 -
[27] - Quote
Tor Gungnir wrote:So "Falloff" is what you should gun for. Then why the heck is it called "Optimal Range?".
This game never ceases to confuse me.
maybe this will help you understand what you in for.
|
Tor Gungnir
Agenda Industries
5
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 23:00:00 -
[28] - Quote
drdxie wrote:Tor Gungnir wrote:So "Falloff" is what you should gun for. Then why the heck is it called "Optimal Range?".
This game never ceases to confuse me. maybe this will help you understand what you in for.
Inflammable means flammable?
What a country! |
Fronkfurter McSheebleton
Squirrel Horde
Habitat Against Humanity
87
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 23:26:00 -
[29] - Quote
Tor Gungnir wrote:So "Falloff" is what you should gun for. Then why the heck is it called "Optimal Range?".
This game never ceases to confuse me.
All turrets have optimal range and falloff. Inside optimal, you have the maximum potential for damage. Once you get into falloff, your chance to hit starts going down, effectively reducing your dps at that range. At the very end of your falloff, you're doing approximately 50% of your dps, and at 2x falloff you're doing next to nothing.
About 1/3 to 1/2 into falloff is where autocannons are usually happy fighting.
Other turrets aren't all falloff. For example, hybrid turrets have a decent amount of both optimal and falloff. Railguns are more optimal than falloff, blasters the opposite. Laser turrets are almost all optimal range.
This should help explain it a bit...the graph is the biggest large-size guns of each type with max skils, but without any ship bonuses or modules applied, using short range ammo. (short range/high damage ammo is what you should use primarily)
Where the lines are flat is optimal range, and where it begins falling off is falloff. (hence the name)
http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a362/mutant_corn/Eve/346f3503.png (apologies for the mouse-writing...snipping tool can't add text >_< )
As it stands, autocannons in particular don't look so hot. However, let's add three tracking enhancers to each type and see what happens:
http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a362/mutant_corn/Eve/aa7f7a51.png
You can see how the different weapon types have different ways of projecting their damage. Lasers don't benefit much from range-enhancing mods as much as projectiles do, since those mods add on twice as much falloff as they do optimal range.
Your projectiles also have the advantage of being able to change their damage type to match the target. Lasers and Hybrids are locked to EM/TH and KIN/TH, respectively.
Triple rep Myrms are like what you'd get if youit strapped a beehive to Robocop.-Kale Eledar |
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
121
|
Posted - 2012.04.30 23:56:00 -
[30] - Quote
In a stabber I found it easy when permarunning my AB and orbiting targets to actually ruin my own tracking even when fighting in falloff. As others have mentioned, fighting with a bit more range and having the frigs follow you works wonders. |
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