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Kir'ian
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2009.03.27 20:33:00 -
[1]
Yep. I think travel is *too fast*... especially with WTZ (warp to zero).
Sure, I'll get flamed for that, but I'd like the world to be just a bit bigger then it is. "Twenty four jumps to Jita... No problem." Excuse me? I know we're like gods, but the world should be bigger then that.
Proposal...
Remove WTZ.
Add auto-pilot activation of either a micro warpdrive or afterburner.
Add auto-pilot activation of a cloaking device if appropriate.
Add the need to compute warp trajectories to a destination in each system... i.e. prevent most warping through the sun/planets/moons by the autopilot having to compute obstacles and selecting intermediate warp destinations in system (all client side computations).
In my not so humble opinion, because I'm always right, implementations of these suggestions would add a lot of immersion, realism, and give those pesky PVPrs something more to drool for.
Yes... I'm a carebear... Yes... I want more "realism"... Yes... I use dots a lot... /carebearstare!
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Kir'ian
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2009.03.27 20:43:00 -
[2]
Oh... One more thing...
Prevent bookmarks anywhere within 30k of a "known" object unless its in deadspace. i.e. to mark a wreck or can in a mission.
/carebearstare  |
Santiago Fahahrri
Galactic Geographic
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Posted - 2009.03.27 21:50:00 -
[3]
This won't work. You'd have to prevent bookmarks within 110k of gates.
With your 30k limit people would immediately begin the mass-production of bookmarks say... 40k "behind" the gate and start "warping to 40" on the bookmarks in order to hit the gates at zero.
~ Santiago Fahahrri
Galactic Geographic |
David Grogan
Gallente
Final Conflict UK
Ethereal Dawn
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Posted - 2009.03.27 21:55:00 -
[4]
blah blah blah more pirates winging that they want instant kills....not like they already have it too easy already. ye gank miners ye gank haulers ye gank noobs and ye sometimes get lucky and gank the odd experienced player.... what more do ye want... if it were any easier people would stop playing eve cos it would be pointless... cos miners and haulers would quit.... no new ships get built.... no new noob would bother play beyond the 14 day trial
SIG: if my message has spelling errors its cos i fail at typing properly :P |
Marcus Gideon
Gallente
Limited Liability Corp
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Posted - 2009.03.27 21:58:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Marcus Gideon on 27/03/2009 21:59:58
Hmm... I'm pretty sure this is a VIDEO GAME. If you want "realistic space travel"... go join NASA.
Wasn't Warp to 0 implemented, because the databases were overflowing with WTZ bookmarks. Every single player was instructed by every other player, to make a set of bookmarks for all the directions they usually come from. There were so many... the servers cried.
As for trying to avoid the same fate by preventing bookmarks on celestial objects... aside from screwing with the whole point of bookmarks in general... I'll just fly 100km past the gate, kick out a Jet Can, and bookmark that. Same thing in the end.
Leave WTZ... if you want realism, warp to 100km yourself. If you want cloaking, fly your CovOps yourself.
All your tweaks seem to be for AutoPilot, which doesn't WTZ anyways.
BTW... this wouldn't give PvPers "something to drool over", it'll make them all want to hurt you for delaying their bloodshed.
---
Players aren't interested in Variety, they only want THE BEST. |
Zaraki KenpachiSan
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Posted - 2009.03.27 22:01:00 -
[6]
Warp to zero was introduced to reduce lag: thousand people getting/copying/moving bookmars was a pain in the ass.
I agree with you that space seems to be more little, but removing wtz is not the solution, wtz is a fix actually.
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swordmaster125
Ascent of Ages
Sc0rched Earth
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Posted - 2009.03.28 12:26:00 -
[7]
siiigh.... it takes forever to get anywhere even when im at my comp (24 jumps from ass ends of empire in a battleship hull isnt fun, i did it 3 times in 1 day)
wtz is ftw.
if you want big sit at your machine and smoke a blunt and autopilot in circles >.>
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Sky Lunartakker
FSK23
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Posted - 2009.03.29 10:49:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Sky Lunartakker on 29/03/2009 10:50:39
I also miss that good old warping to 15km, haved hoped that time ccp would bring some skills like "warp-precision" or something like that.
It was a time, where speed was more important - and I liked to fly to the gates. Sometimes with a little smak-talk while racig with max. speed.
Warp to 0km was really just against these millions of bookmarks knocking down server speed extremely.
Would be awesome if there where gates like Freelancer, if a planet or a moon is between source and destination - or a warning if you navigate through such things. That would mean: warping from safespots and so on -> the warp speed without these little "correction-gates" is much more slowlier. With a skill "Warp Mannuevering" that can be increased.
THAT WOULD LOOK PHANTASTIC!
The like the point with "more realism". Of course, Sci-Fi is NEVER realistic. But the way to keep some things like this higher (good flight sims in example) would just bring/obtain a quality in that level, which is important to the depth of the game.
Eve is complex. Eve is big. Eve is pretty. And EVE is not an arcade-game, thats what jump gate is. I hope CCP will keep EVE as an epic Space Sim - but some more physically realism might bring it to mythos (maybe as the longest existing MMORPG ever).
And these physical stuff might also look great.
Your points with your auto-pilot options are great, Kir'ian!
cheers
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Eliza Farcaster
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Posted - 2009.03.29 11:03:00 -
[9]
Warp to zero was a stupid fix for the problem. Why not just have pull ships out of warp 15km from the gate, no matter where your bookmark is?
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Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2009.03.29 11:26:00 -
[10]
If you think travel is too fast why not just use the auto-pilot, that will slow you down to an absurd degree.
We all pay good money for the privilege to login onto the Eve servers, I consider WTZ among other things a reward for actually playing the game.
Those "pesky PvP'ers" (aka. empire griefers/pirates) you refer to comprise at most 1% of the empire population (null-sec has bubble ability so not an issue). It is easy enough to catch things that are meant to be caught (hint: not inties), just requires specialised ships which is a good thing
A measure that benefits a minority while hurting the majority certainly would give Eve more realism (ie. modern politics), but we play the game to escape from reality and have fun .. forced time sinks would remove the fun.
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Imertu Solientai
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.03.29 11:26:00 -
[11]
 Originally by: Eliza Farcaster
Warp to zero was a stupid fix for the problem. Why not just have pull ships out of warp 15km from the gate, no matter where your bookmark is?
Exactly my idea. Gates should act like warp disruptor bubbles which stop any warp which lands within 15km of the gate. Suddenly that 24 jump run to jita that might take an hour or two in a freighter takes 12 hours. You get local market hubs springing up. You get more variation in prices between regions, and people finally stop going to jita for all their shopping. It would spread people out around empire, and hopefully finally add a sense of the vastness of space.
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Khalia Nestune
Suddenly Ninjas
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
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Posted - 2009.03.29 11:43:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Kir'ian
"Twenty four jumps to Jita... No problem." Excuse me? I know we're like gods, but the world should be bigger then that.
Are you crazy? The time it takes to babysit 24 jumps - or to double the time by using autopilot - is already a huge disincentive to lots of travel. Travel is the most time-consuming part of the game which doesn't return any direct value. Making it harder.... is just silly.
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Khalia Nestune
Suddenly Ninjas
Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service
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Posted - 2009.03.29 11:45:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Eliza Farcaster
Warp to zero was a stupid fix for the problem. Why not just have pull ships out of warp 15km from the gate, no matter where your bookmark is?
I would imagine any clever space-going society would invent the technology to let them go -exactly- where they wanted, not with some limit of "within 15km". It makes perfect sense to make your ship go precisely where you want to be.
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Clansworth
Good Rock Materials
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Posted - 2009.03.29 11:51:00 -
[14]
I do agree that WTZ has made the galaxy too small. It has made moving of goods too easy, and reduced the value of transport. It has lead to the exaggeration of the galaxy wide market (Jita). However, removing WTZ would lead to bookmarks... restricting bookmarks would just cause confusion and frankly wouldn't pass my common sense rule anyways. What I would like to see is random warp results, anywhere from 10-20km error (error reduced by a skill perhaps) from your desired destination.
Along with this, I believe cargo mass should be added to ship mass. Industrial and Freighter type ships would probably have to have their hull mass reduced a bit to compensate, but i believe this would be a great change. A heavily loaded freighter should take longer to align/accel for warp than an empty one. Yes, this would cause some database load, doing the mass calcs everytime cargo is added or removed, but that's what the shiny new RAMSAN is for...
System Influence |
Mr LaboratoryRat
Confederation of DuckTape Lovers
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Posted - 2009.03.29 11:53:00 -
[15]
u damn high sec carebear....... do u even know what bubbles are? ow wait u dont..... get your ass to 0.0 and u will know it soon enough
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8Z 6
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Posted - 2009.03.29 13:48:00 -
[16]
this will never happen which is fortunate because in all the history of bad ideas this is the absolute worst. welcome to the guinness book of world records.
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Anton Cyldragen
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Posted - 2009.03.29 14:48:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Imertu Solientai
Originally by: Eliza Farcaster
Warp to zero was a stupid fix for the problem. Why not just have pull ships out of warp 15km from the gate, no matter where your bookmark is?
Exactly my idea. Gates should act like warp disruptor bubbles which stop any warp which lands within 15km of the gate. Suddenly that 24 jump run to jita that might take an hour or two in a freighter takes 12 hours. You get local market hubs springing up. You get more variation in prices between regions, and people finally stop going to jita for all their shopping. It would spread people out around empire, and hopefully finally add a sense of the vastness of space.
this
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Kir'ian
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2009.03.30 15:24:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Kir''ian on 30/03/2009 15:25:24
Originally by: Kir'ian
Add the need to compute warp trajectories to a destination in each system... i.e. prevent most warping through the sun/planets/moons by the autopilot having to compute obstacles and selecting intermediate warp destinations in system (all client side computations).
I *think* this would prevent the bookmarks. You couldn't use a bookmark placed at any distance behind a stargate and then try to land *on* the stargate using it. You ship would try to plot a course through the system that would not *intersect* the stargate and might finally give up and make a course that takes you to the gate, 15k off and *then* to the bookmark... at 500mps (or whatever). Tada! No use for bookmarks. They don't help... you *must* travel that 15k... Yeppers... Life just got dangerous again. Yeppers... Kewl beans awesome! And I'm a carebear. Hmm.
/carebearstare |
Kir'ian
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2009.03.30 15:32:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Kir''ian on 30/03/2009 15:35:44
My reason behind this is that I've played quite a few games whose worlds have been trivialized because they got small after additions of travel shortcuts. The greatest of all MMOs *ever*, Everquest!, was so destroyed by expansions that made travel across it's world trivial. Sure, it let our small guild join together quickly for a raid. Sure, I was quite often the primary method of travel for our guild (Yay Droods!). Sure, it was really great. Sure... no one took the boat anymore, so there was no need to actually make taking the boat interesting.
Why not just make a nice little graphic menu, icons even, for what system we want to be in... heck... which station we want to deposit all our ship and cargo in. Travelling is for Roleplayers! BAH! =P
Oh! And so the gatecamping PVPrs don't lose out, we can give them a nice little filter to randomly "catch" any "travelers" by pulling the traveler from their "route" and plopping them in an arena like and pounding the bejeebus out of them with our ten battleships against their ibis! AWESOME STUFF!!! =D
ROFLMFFAO!
/carebearstare |
Xianbei
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Posted - 2009.03.31 20:19:00 -
[20]
"Yep. I think travel is *too fast*... especially with WTZ (warp to zero)."
dont forget this is a game and much of it is already tedious
make it more tedious and people will stop playing
my 2c
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Tykkis
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Posted - 2009.03.31 23:12:00 -
[21]
I totally agree, the universe is too small.
If i could redo it, i would...
-Remove all jumps that are 2 times longer than the usual distance between two stars
-remove all but 2 jumps between 2 regions
-Add jumps between systems inside constellation but remove some jumps between two constellations. only 3 routes to other constellations from each constellation.
-divide empire into 4 areas separated by 2-4 system wide lowsec area for FW and piracy. no safe route from amarr to minmatar or from gallente to caldari.
-introduce jumping from gate to target system planet or station (no more GATecamp Online). target planet jump area is random spot at 100km*100km*100km asteroid field which kinda hard to camp but at sametime target can't mwd/ab back to gate either. So you jump to an area where there are resources, grinders... Allow players to join target system local chat allready at previous system jumpgate to get some intel of camps.
==> no more system like jita, distances would begin to affect module and mineral prizes, people would begin use hauler services, world would seem huge like it is, people would hesitate to travel from empire to empire
Forgive me... lol i was bored
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