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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 34 post(s) |
Valadeya uthanaras
Corp 1 Allstars PuPPet MasTers
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Posted - 2009.03.31 20:50:00 -
[301]
Originally by: CCP Chronotis
Originally by: AK Archangel
AS usual CCP wont hear his customers ......
we heard you fine and read every post. However there is a world of difference between listening to and agreeing with someone.
Yeah me love CCP , eve if they dont post often they do read thread, especially if they make decent sence, thumb up
Any comments on all the bomb overhaul idea .... I mean bomb are close range fun too .... and will be so much more fun to use in combo with black ops
Or you dont think any new bonus would be going that way? at least you could reduce the bomb price
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McKinlay
KIA Corp KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2009.03.31 20:51:00 -
[302]
Sounds like this will take any skill out of using a stealth bomber. Get within 30km, decloak, fire and hope you can warp off before anything locks you. Rinse repeat. Sounds like watering down a perfectly good ship and mechanic if you ask me.
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Pac SubCom
A.W.M
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Posted - 2009.03.31 21:04:00 -
[303]
I was able to check the bombers on Sisi. As Chronotis said, they don't have the covops cloak or 30 second timer right now, but they do have the speed bonus.
My Hound handles like a fighter jet cloaked. You're in range in no time. Torp damage is devastating. With a couple of bombers and their EW, enough damage can be brought to bear on cruisers too, bet on it. |
toshirovontetra
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Posted - 2009.03.31 21:09:00 -
[304]
This is a very BAD idea. Even though the current SB has it's drawbacks, I have found that they can be very effective. It's strength is it's ability to shoot from long range. If anything tries to get close then I dampen it and warp away (or cloak). Then come back and shoot some more. Replacing the cruise missiles with torpedoes equals a dead bomber every time because of the limited range. AND if it's only effective, (if you can call only getting one shot off at a BS before you die effective)against battleships then I'll probably just leave it in the hanger because the ops I go on tend to run into all sorts of ship types. At that point the ship just becomes an expensive kamakazi ship.
If you want to make a battleship killing torpedo boat then just create a new ship PLEASE. Otherwise leave it alone.
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Monetary Bias
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Posted - 2009.03.31 21:20:00 -
[305]
Honestly, I like CCP Chron's idea of a torp frigate. It could use a little tweaking, like giving the ship an ounce of survivability :)
However, like I've said before, I don't want to see a redesign of the current SB. Make a different ship your torpedo bomber.
In fact, buff up the hp/damage of the current SB, and go play around with another hull as your torp ship.
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Zefroth
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.03.31 21:47:00 -
[306]
I am very glad I found this post before I started my 3 month training to fly a stealth bomber with maxed skills. But now that cruise missiles won't have a bonus anymore that completely puts me off from stealth bombers....guess I'll head back to training for assault ships. Thanks CCP for ruining my dream of being a crazed cruise missile launching stealth bomber pilot. |
Mord3th
Minmatar Mashadar Holdings
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Posted - 2009.03.31 22:00:00 -
[307]
Why not make them really fun and allow them to fit citadel launchers? Then they could really be a threat to battleships. With citadel launchers, they would seem to fit the traditional role (current military) of stealth bombers (maximum damage to stationary targets). Citadel torps on a frigate sized vessel could be fun.
I have flown with the best. Can you say the same? |
Vaarun
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.03.31 22:03:00 -
[308]
Originally by: Vall Kor
Originally by: rubico1337 with the 30second cooldown on recloaking has anyone thought of maybe using sensor damps with scan res scripts? it seems like a couple of those would be able to get a BS upwards of 30 secs lock time, essentially making the recloak cooldown vs BSes moot
The bs locking you isn't the issue.....It's the drones that attack on aggression.
Or any other ship, smaller than the BS, travelling with it. You can only damp so many ships.
decrease the sig radius and we'll talk... "To bring order to chaos, one must bring chaos to its knees."
-Vaarun |
Pokerizer
White Nova Industries AAA Citizens
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Posted - 2009.03.31 22:08:00 -
[309]
Lol this is great, so basicly what ccp is saying is "we don't care what you think, but keep whining if it makes you feel better." But seriusly if your asking for input but don't use it because you're going to do it your way, WHY ASK!
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Malen Nenokal
Oedipus Complex
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Posted - 2009.03.31 22:16:00 -
[310]
I love everything listed, if the bomb launcher could be fit on the 4th high slot without losing a siege launcher, this ship would be very sexy.
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VoiceInTheDesert
Zebra Corp Circle-Of-Two
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Posted - 2009.03.31 22:23:00 -
[311]
Cloaked velocity+torp speed bonus = stealthy bomber. It works in my opinion as long as the torps can land and the bomber can recloak in time to actually survive and resposition
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Toyo Italari
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Posted - 2009.03.31 22:38:00 -
[312]
Well, the way I see it currently is:
Torps are going to happen.
Testing on Torps is already happening.
Get on SiSi and actually test, then provide intelligent feedback (as one person has already done.. Twice)
See if we can't at least wrangle out decent enough bonuses to be worthwhile.
I don't like Torps, but I can make them work. I REALLY don't like 30 second activation delay, because I can't make that work. Reduction per level of Cov Ops skill seemed like a pretty reasonable idea to me, although I'd still rather the 5 seconds we currently have.
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Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2009.03.31 23:03:00 -
[313]
Originally by: CCP Chronotis However we still believe this new direction and role is far better
Better for whom? Finish your sentence please.
Quote: than the role they currently have in spite of the success some of you have had with these. The role really made no sense overall that we would have a bomber using large missiles in an anti-frigate role.
If it made no sence for you, it's your problem. For some of us, it's last case why we still playing this (your) game after years. You repeatedly killed every and each of our ships, now we only have SB, and you killing even them. Why you just not say "Guys, sorry, but I don't care about your wishes, I just want your money, if you don't want to pay - leave and free the field for other donators"?
Quote: Focusing the ship class as anti-large ship with the addition of a covert ops cloak and high volley damage is a role that has much more utility and purpose as part of gangs that the potential the bomber has now.
You choosed a wrong hull to focus, that's what were told to you, but you apparently not listening. -- Thanks CCP for cu |
retro mike
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Posted - 2009.03.31 23:22:00 -
[314]
CCP Chronotis you have already said what we think doesnt matter. SO YOU THINKS ITS FUNNY? WHO THE HELL DO YOU THINK YOU ARE?
CCP Chronotis, We both know why you failed to fix cruise explosion velocity to Stealth Bombers after the missile nerf. You expected us bomber pilots to forget how useful they used to be.
You do not just replace a ship that already has a clearly defined role with something completely different!!! Bomber pilots have put a lot of time and training into skills and developing tactics to use this ship properly.
The solution to your dilemma is to have 2 shiptypes:
STEALTH PRECISION BOMBER : current cruise missile setup with an added bonus to cruise missile explosion velocity.
STEALTH HEAVY BOMBER : sister to the cruise bomber, it has the proposed torpedo setup. (kessie/thrasher based?)
Chronotis you have underestimated the feelings towards the proposed changes to the Bomber and I am sickened by your attitude towards the majority of pilots on this thread.
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Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2009.03.31 23:35:00 -
[315]
Originally by: retro mike
Chronotis you have underestimated the feelings towards the proposed changes to the Bomber and I am sickened by your attitude towards the majority of pilots on this thread.
In both threads (12 pages both, will this one be cut again?) -- Thanks CCP for cu |
Seraphim Io
Caldari Battlestars GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.03.31 23:37:00 -
[316]
Originally by: retro mike CCP Chronotis you have already said what we think doesnt matter. SO YOU THINKS ITS FUNNY? WHO THE HELL DO YOU THINK YOU ARE?
CCP Chronotis, We both know why you failed to fix cruise explosion velocity to Stealth Bombers after the missile nerf. You expected us bomber pilots to forget how useful they used to be.
Bold is cruise control for cool...
Anyway more to the point, just to go ahead and put this out there to jog everyones memory. CCP as a company couldn't give a damn less what we as the player base think tbh. They are going to make the changes they think are for the "best". As SB pilots we have been in this game for atleast a minute or two due to SP level involved to fly this niche ship well, so you must realize and remember this fact. CCP just doesn't care. They don't care that most do not want torps, or that most do not want a 30 second recloak delay because damn it 30 seconds is a long freaking time when it comes to pvp. I speculate that these guys do not or rather can not do any serious game play of their "own" product due to restrictions put on them. Thus they havent the foggiest on what would help or hinder any particular aspect of this game. As proof I give you the initial missile nerf, the drone nerf, the nano buff, the nano nerf, the second missile nerf, and the seemingly countless racial "balacing" they have done since I have played this game.
CCP you need to read this thread and other VERY carefully and comprehend and understand exactly what your customer base wants and more importantly does not want.
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HEPBHOE OKOH4AHUE
U.K.R.A.I.N.E United Legion
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Posted - 2009.03.31 23:51:00 -
[317]
While I was watching the both threads about stealth bombers I noticed that I really can't understand one thing - you CCP donated all your brains to medicine!?
You declared an anti-battleship role to bombers and gave them torps. Let's make some tests:
We're taking the most helpless BS in a game - Rokh in a snipe config against a gang of 3 SB's. Everybody is 'All Level V'.
- Such rokh has about 110 kilos of spherical health.
- SB with current set of bonuses on sisi giving out about 3500 of spherical damage.
- This mean that 3 bombers have to shoot 11 times to kill that BS. This is 100 seconds.
- Rokh have 50m dronebay. So we have 10 light or 5 medium drones against 3 bombers.
- Manticore fitted with 2 target painters have to fire 11 times to destroy one Hobgoblin I. This is 100 seconds.
- Manticore fitted with 2 target painters have to fire 5 times to destroy one Valkirye II. This is 50 seconds.
- 5 Hobgoblins-I will pop the manticore in 15 seconds.
- 5 Valk's II will pop the manticore in 5 seconds.
All this scrap above above means that World's Helpless Battleship Contest perma-champion named Rokh will kill each bomber at least twice whilst bombers will try to kill BS. All this scrap means that you CCP sold all your brains for cannabis.
I vote to fire everyone involved in this comedy. If they can't predict so simple consequences, they worth only washing the floor in the office.
Should I continue?
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Defeated
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Posted - 2009.03.31 23:52:00 -
[318]
Awesome stuff ahead, please do not make the mistake of giving in to the whiny bit*hes because they are the ones with loud mouths. There's a lot of support here as well to theese changes, only difference is we dont pull our hair and scream to get our way.
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Seraphim Io
Caldari Battlestars GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.03.31 23:54:00 -
[319]
Originally by: Defeated Awesome stuff ahead, please do not make the mistake of giving in to the whiny bit*hes because they are the ones with loud mouths. There's a lot of support here as well to theese changes, only difference is we dont pull our hair and scream to get our way.
......because you are dumb and you should feel bad
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Nagatok
PROGENITOR CORPORATION
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Posted - 2009.03.31 23:57:00 -
[320]
Edited by: Nagatok on 31/03/2009 23:57:47
Originally by: Defeated Awesome stuff ahead, please do not make the mistake of giving in to the whiny bit*hes because they are the ones with loud mouths. There's a lot of support here as well to theese changes, only difference is we dont pull our hair and scream to get our way.
which thread were u looking at? out of the so far 24 pages of this topic 95% OR MORE of the people have voiced their OUTRAGE at what has been done to this ship class....dont call us whiny bit*hes just because UNLIKE YOU we actually have a clue at what is going on
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Seraphim Io
Caldari Battlestars GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.04.01 00:00:00 -
[321]
Nagatok to be fair we don't know exactly how many posts are here from the tard with the alts......so clear cut numbers arent discernable from the 'real' numbers.
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HEPBHOE OKOH4AHUE
U.K.R.A.I.N.E United Legion
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Posted - 2009.04.01 00:09:00 -
[322]
I vote to leave bombers as is, except modifying explosion radius bonus for cruise missiles to 19,5% per level.
This will allow bombers to fight against frigs/cruisers/hacs/BCs back. I don't want the people who never flew this ship to design it capabilities. Because they're absolutely incompetent.
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Asasham
Caldari InNova Tech Inc Ethereal Dawn
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Posted - 2009.04.01 00:12:00 -
[323]
Nice changes, thanks for finally giving bombers a useful role in conjunction with recons and black ops. Should be a nice scout with DPS now.
I'd prefer swapping out the 5% bomb damage for a cloaked speed bonus though.
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Cerui Tarshiel
Minmatar Asset Reallocation Specialists Apoapsis Multiversal Consortium
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Posted - 2009.04.01 00:12:00 -
[324]
Edited by: Cerui Tarshiel on 01/04/2009 00:13:48 May I point out to you that this thread has quite high amount of posts and quite low amount of posters. It's not like either those that are for or against these changes are representive of the player population so stop thinking you're that. I doubt that even 5% of the active player population visits this forum part outside of major patches (for info on those).
A good example of the outrage by the good majority of the player population that worked was the threadnought that grew from the proposed changes to carriers. Those changes were apparantly locked in a chest, the dev who proposed them with it and thrown in the deepest end of the sea because I've yet to see even the tiniest hint of that again.
These ideas need work but I think the general idea (as expressed before) is quite sound.
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MrFahrenheit
Gallente The humble Crew Dara Cothrom
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Posted - 2009.04.01 00:19:00 -
[325]
Edited by: MrFahrenheit on 01/04/2009 00:34:18
Originally by: Pac SubCom Edited by: Pac SubCom on 31/03/2009 21:41:06 I was able to check the bombers on Sisi. As Chronotis said, they don't have the covops cloak or 30 second timer right now, but they do have the speed bonus.
My Hound handles like a fighter jet cloaked. You're in range in no time, giving not much time to react anyway. Torp damage is devastating. With a couple of bombers and the right setups, enough damage can be brought to bear on cruisers too, bet on it. The single bomber as part of a larger fleet (with no forethought on how to engage cruisers) will be very good against battleships.
Btw, drones do not lock you quickly enough when you cloak directly after firing. The drones don't have the time to "realize" they are under attack. But this is all before the 30 second delay.
Ive also had a play, and in their current state on Sisi they are basically the same but set for close range and given the mentioned speed boost, I like them, in fact I like them atm more than cruise boats.
When we get the cov ops cloak I think my opinion is going to change though.
Originally by: Cerui Tarshiel Edited by: Cerui Tarshiel on 01/04/2009 00:13:48 May I point out to you that this thread has quite high amount of posts and quite low amount of posters. It's not like either those that are for or against these changes are representive of the player population so stop thinking you're that. I doubt that even 5% of the active player population visits this forum part outside of major patches (for info on those).
Ok maybe were not representive of the whole population, were just the passionate few, but tbh most of the people in my corp thought I was playing an april fools joke on them when I told them of the proposed changes, no disrespect but they really did. :S But heck you dont need my whole corp posting here.. right? And im sure there is just as many who love the idea of changeing bombers.
Freedom of speech ftw btw.
[url=http://kb.eve-daisho.com/?a=pilot_detail&plt_id=40133] [/url] |
yani dumyat
Minmatar purple pot hogs Doctrine.
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Posted - 2009.04.01 00:20:00 -
[326]
Dr. Chronolove Or: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Love The Torp Bomber - Part 1 _________________________________________________________________________________
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
If there is one thing EVE has shown time-and-again is that players pile in to whatever is the safest ship to fly. Anything that will see them "get away" they do, en masse. Loaded with warp core stabs, dual-MWD ships, nano ships and so on. CCP has had to nerf them all and when they do players seek the next "safe" thing.
Good mini raven points.
I predict these will be very popular.
What's left of this mans hair is grey, he clearly saw the nerf bat in his youth so listen to him.
Prediction 1 - Popularity
3 years of being a trader has taught me to trust the Jita sales figures more than forum perceptions, the current best selling T2 frigate is the covert ops by a very long way. Some days it will sell more than double the number of units than any other T2 frig.
The reason for this popularity is the cov-ops cloak. Or in other words safety. As stated above by Imperator safety is a major draw for pod pilots and having the choice of guns instead of probes on your taxi will put a major dent in cov-ops sales.
Prediction 2 - The new torps will be used but not in the way Chronotis has stated
Virtually everyone in the game owns a cov-ops ship especially in 0.0, so once people start buying bombers instead then miners and haulers will be viable targets of opportunity as you are traveling about. If the bomber can survive light drones for long enough then we will see a lot of hulk kills.
Wolfpacks are also going to be more common for the aforementioned reason of popularity. I've seen poses with 7 or 8 cov-ops runnabouts lying in the hanger that rarely get used for probing, swap these for bombers and you have a ready made wolfpack.
Given the slim chances of finding lone battleships target painters will be the norm for wolfpacks and i can see vigil hulls being very popular as cheap support tackle. 2 rapiers and an arazu with a pack of cloaky bombers will eat there way through cruiser camps in no time.
In short torps will be used against the wide variety of targets you find when roaming and players will find a way to shoehorn enough painters and webs into the fleet to make it work.
What it won't be used for is taking down fleet battleships or soloing battleships for reasons stated many times in this thread.
I don't have the right experience to say how this will affect high sec warfare.
Prediction 4 - Done right this could herald the age of the black ops
Going out on a limb here but the idea of cloaky gangs doing hit and run raids on soft targets and being used as diversion tactics to split fleets and resources has always lacked one thing to make it work, noobs.
Currently only experienced players have the SP to fly recons and the lack of DPS makes them incapable of doing anything when they get there. Get a black ops battleship and blocade runner jumping a horde of new players in bombers about the place and suddenly you have the numbers to cause pain.
I know that this is theoretically possible now but FC's really haven't got their heads round black ops so the buff to cloaky gangs through turning bombers into 0.0 taxis might just tip the balance.
Over to CCP on this one
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Defeated
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Posted - 2009.04.01 00:30:00 -
[327]
Originally by: Nagatok Edited by: Nagatok on 31/03/2009 23:57:47
Originally by: Defeated Awesome stuff ahead, please do not make the mistake of giving in to the whiny bit*hes because they are the ones with loud mouths. There's a lot of support here as well to theese changes, only difference is we dont pull our hair and scream to get our way.
which thread were u looking at? out of the so far 24 pages of this topic 95% OR MORE of the people have voiced their OUTRAGE at what has been done to this ship class....dont call us whiny bit*hes just because UNLIKE YOU we actually have a clue at what is going on
Please keep proving what i just wrote. So now everyone who disagrees with you is clueless, and it's also an outrage in caps, because caps makes it true. Also, you didn't count, you pulled 95% out of your rectum.
But like i said, please keep raging.
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Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2009.04.01 00:40:00 -
[328]
Originally by: Defeated Please keep proving what i just wrote. So now everyone who disagrees with you is clueless, and it's also an outrage in caps, because caps makes it true. Also, you didn't count, you pulled 95% out of your rectum.
But like i said, please keep raging.
95% was exaggeration, it was merely 60%, not counting "LOL nice changes CCP indeed". Other 40% was split in agreement and cautious curiosity. -- Thanks CCP for cu |
Defeated
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Posted - 2009.04.01 00:44:00 -
[329]
Edited by: Defeated on 01/04/2009 00:45:27
Originally by: Tonto Auri
Originally by: Defeated Please keep proving what i just wrote. So now everyone who disagrees with you is clueless, and it's also an outrage in caps, because caps makes it true. Also, you didn't count, you pulled 95% out of your rectum.
But like i said, please keep raging.
95% was exaggeration, it was merely 60%, not counting "LOL nice changes CCP indeed". Other 40% was split in agreement and cautious curiosity.
Yep, but it's the "AYAYAYAY I DONT KNOW WHATS HAPPENING YET BUT IT WILL DESTROY MY WORLD AYAYAYA FIRE ALL CCP AND EXECUTE A RANDOM GIANT PANDA IN GANSU. I WROTE IT IN CAPS SO YOU MUST LISTEN CCP AYAYAYAY" people that makes the most noise, if you get what i mean :p
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Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2009.04.01 00:48:00 -
[330]
Originally by: Defeated Yep, but it's the "AYAYAYAY I DONT KNOW WHATS HAPPENING YET BUT IT WILL DESTROY MY WORLD AYAYAYA FIRE ALL CCP AND EXECUTE A RANDOM GREAT PANDA IN GANSU. I WROTE IT IN CAPS SO YOU MUST LISTEN CCP AYAYAYAY" people that makes the most noise, if you get what i mean :p
Certainly. But, excuse me, when these changes go live, it'll be one more nail in a casket of my willing to play eve. ****ed probing system, useless ship class that i'm trained for, and my Sacrilege that i'll never fly because she alone is not enough to attract me to the whole game. -- Thanks CCP for cu |
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