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Fei Valentyne Minmatar Republic University	Posted - 2009.06.24 11:00:00 - [31] suggestions/requests instead of selecting the characters from a drop down list, it would be cool to either have their portraits in a row next to the Reload and Skill Planner buttons at the top of the window - although, i guess there's the potential that someone is running 15 characters or more.... or perhaps in a drawer that slides out on the left side of the window - then it is just a single click to switch between them - this would allow you to include the currently training and end times under their names that Kilabie requested it'd be nice if the skill planner graph scaled to fit in the window initially and then you could zoom into it. i imagine on a laptop screen it's not easy to see the whole graph. Also, you need something there for before anyone clicks on anything - it looks a bit strange with the big empty space. how about something like this: Need an item in the Window menu that will display the main screen if it has been closed or the use cmd-w'd by accident. At the moment the only option is to quit and start again it'd be cool to be able to import battleclinic items (if they are working). i'd like to browse around, find a ship i like the look of and loadout i'm interested in, and then import it into EMS to check what skills i'd need to learn and how long it'd take. or failing that, will there be an item list or something, so i can scroll through and find the ship/items, and EMS will calculate which skills are required? anyway, these are just my thoughts from using it. it's still a great app that you've made and look forward to seeing what you can make of it. -- --- "You know the first rule of combat? Shoot them before they shoot you. "
Rottenator The Littlest Hobos Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.06.24 21:41:00 - [32] Ah ... it looks like I totally missed a very nice feature indeed. The graph indeed looks awesome. (the picture posted by Fei Valentyne helped me finding it) I never understood why there was such an empty space up there. Blame me for being stupid here (many will agree). Not sure if this is intended behaviour but when I added a skill to the skillplanner which had a prerequisite that I didn't train either it putted the prerequisite skill to 'lvl 0' on position '1' and then the rest normally. But I wonder why it puts the 'lvl 0' one in there.
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.06.25 01:41:00 - [33] First off, thank you SOO much for this response. òerror on startup, couldn't read the database file i think, unexpected format. so i trashed the ~\Library\Applications Support\Eve Mac Suite\ folder - i'd previously used build40 so i guess you have new fields in your data files. no biggie It has to do with Core Data. More details at my dev log. Short version: I'm doing a huge overhaul at the underpinnings of the program. ònew character screen ◦if EMS starts and there are no characters, the main window flashes up for a second, and then disappears. you could prompt the user to begin adding characters by bringing up the Add New Character window at that point, instead of leaving no windows showing Disapears? Hmm.. I'm not getting that. It just shows up with blank information. But, you're right, I need the new character screen to show up. ◦when a user account has multiple characters, would it be possible to select more than one in the Add New Character screen and import them all in one go? I tried shift-clicking and cmd-clicking for multiple select but neither worked. (it's just that i have 3 accounts with 2 chars each - it's a bit repetative hitting cmd-N over and over). Alright, added to my to-do list. ◦can the first character in the list be auto-selected? that way, if you have only one character, you can click Search and then Select straight away? (also, hitting the return key on that screen should trigger the select button) Also added. Should be simple. òmain window ◦i really liked the old style, but i think this new landscape version looks even better. blends in with apps like Mail and Safari much better ◦i managed to cause the app to crash, i was clicking on several of the items in the Current Skills list and it crashed trying to expand them - but i have not been able to replicate it. it might have been updating the characters as I had only just imported them all, so might just have been me trying to do too many things at once, hence why i can't repeat it ◦the queue for this character isn't showing up correctly - it only has a timeline bar for the first skill, yet it's the last one in the list that is currently being trained http://www.illitrate.co.uk/gubbins/pictures/oddskillqueue.pngPlease visit your user settings to enable images. Well aware that the training queue is not functioning. I'm actually pretty annoyed that I can't make it work right. Hopefully chaning the underlying structure as mentioned earlier will make it easier to fix it. ò òskill planner window ◦gotta say, i really really like the graph. although the bright primary colours are a little overwhelming, but i like the way they show you which skills are the next ones you're able to learn. but then, using lighter shades probably won't look any better. i'm trying to think of a more "OS X"-y way of doing the same thing... ◦i guess you're aware that it kills the app when you close the skill planner window, yes? I know it crashes when you close the main window and then the skill planner's. However, closing just the skill planner shouldn't crash anything. I'll try to test this more throughly. suggestions/requests ◦instead of selecting the characters from a drop down list, it would be cool to either have their portraits in a row next to the Reload and Skill Planner buttons at the top of the window - although, i guess there's the potential that someone is running 15 characters or more.... or perhaps in a drawer that slides out on the left side of the window - then it is just a single click to switch between them - this would allow you to include the currently training and end times under their names that Kilabie requested What do you think of having a drawer on the left side? It pops out by toggling the button in the position where the current dropdown is. The list has a small icon for the portrait along with the name. Cont....
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.06.25 01:43:00 - [34] ◦it'd be nice if the skill planner graph scaled to fit in the window initially and then you could zoom into it. i imagine on a laptop screen it's not easy to see the whole graph. Also, you need something there for before anyone clicks on anything - it looks a bit strange with the big empty space. how about something like this: http://www.illitrate.co.uk/gubbins/pictures/SkillPlanBlank2.pngPlease visit your user settings to enable images. The empty space thing is a good idea. However, scaling... Well, that's far too many mathimatical calculations. And what if someone is resizing? Do you want the resizing to scale? And what about the huge graphs such as Large Autocannon Specialization? If you scale that, nothing will be legible. Of course, it's possible to have a minimum zoom level. But still, the amount of work needed could potentially be daunting. It's something I'll have to decline for now. ◦Need an item in the Window menu that will display the main screen if it has been closed or the use cmd-w'd by accident. At the moment the only option is to quit and start again Or how about just quit the app? Ok, that's too un-Mac-like and just evil. ◦it'd be cool to be able to import battleclinic items (if they are working). i'd like to browse around, find a ship i like the look of and loadout i'm interested in, and then import it into EMS to check what skills i'd need to learn and how long it'd take. Well now, that'll require a database export. Nowhere near there. ◦or failing that, will there be an item list or something, so i can scroll through and find the ship/items, and EMS will calculate which skills are required? See above. In short, Thanks for all the suggestions and bugs. I've spent roughly 30 hours so far changing the foundation of the app and will likely spend another 20 or so more. Full explanation on my dev blog coming soon. The explanation will also give a good reason as to why the skill planner is so dysfunctional. It's what I'll be fixing immediately after I finish the foundation.
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.07.10 17:26:00 - [35] I'm finishing up the final details on my massive code rewrite. Currently, I'm trying to get the skill planner done right. However, I stumbled on a lot of conceptual questions that I was hoping to get answers from you guys. First off, nothing personal to the developer of the recent new EVE API program but his skill planner looks like a massive Excel spreadsheet. The same goes to EVEMon, for the most part. I'm not saying those details aren't important but they certainly aren't all of the time. Details on the accumulated training time and finish date for individual skills within a plan should be made available on demand, in my opinion. This could be accomplished by clicking on the table row or mousing over it. This is just my personal thought and I'd like to know how the rest of the EVE community stands on it. Is there a more preferred way you'd like to see the data? This leads me to my second point. In terms of training time and finish date, one value stays the same while the other one always changes. This is dependent on if you're currently training a skill in the plan. If you are, the training time decreases but finish date stays the same. If you aren't, the training time stays the same and finish date increases. While it does take a bit of coding to ensure accuracy, the actual calculations aren't expensive either way. However, in both skill planners I've mentioned, training finish date doesn't refresh in real time in the latter case. Is that how you guys really want it or would you prefer real time updating of everything (which I've managed to do so far throughout my app)? One thing I learned about Apple's design philosophy when I was at their WWDC a few weeks ago was how they dealt with features. Unlike Windows developers, who have the mentality to pack in as many features as possible, Apple actually goes through each feature one by one and asks, "Do we really need this feature and why?" In the end you get an app much more heavily focused on user experience and has what the user actually wants/needs. That's what I'm trying to aim for. So, if anyone has any input on the matter, I'd love to hear it.
Senyru Suru Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2009.07.10 18:44:00 - [36] Originally by: Mizuki Yori Details on the accumulated training time and finish date for individual skills within a plan should be made available on demand, in my opinion. This could be accomplished by clicking on the table row or mousing over it. I think this is a brilliant idea. flash the values up on a tooltip or something? that would be great Originally by: Mizuki Yori Is that how you guys really want it or would you prefer real time updating of everything (which I've managed to do so far throughout my app)? if it can be done easily then i think you might as well have real-time for both scenarios. i imagine the only reason the others don't is that they haven't noticed the 2nd case. it's a good idea though, because if you refresh your char and the time isn't moving, then you assume something's gone wrong. Originally by: Mizuki Yori In the end you get an app much more heavily focused on user experience and has what the user actually wants/needs. That's what I'm trying to aim for. i think this is a key point and it's very good practice. not only will you end up with an app that feels more Apple-y but also, it won't be bogged down by unnecessary features. if lots of users start shouting for it, then you know you made the wrong choice and you can include it in the next release :) -- --- one day we're all gonna die, and then we'll see who's laughing!
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.07.13 02:56:00 - [37] I'm still hoping to get any more thoughts/opinions/suggestions before I make any final commitments on the design of the skill planner. I'd really like to get something out there that people would enjoy using. For details, see my previous post.
Rottenator The Littlest Hobos Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.07.13 10:09:00 - [38] Originally by: Mizuki Yori Details on the accumulated training time and finish date for individual skills within a plan should be made available on demand, in my opinion. Personally I don't like mouseovers most of the time, I'd like to see info directly without having to do anything but opening the screen. That is a personal preference and I think you should, if not a lot of people are against make your own choice as to what you like best. Originally by: Mizuki Yori However, in both skill planners I've mentioned, training finish date doesn't refresh in real time in the latter case. Is that how you guys really want it or would you prefer real time updating of everything (which I've managed to do so far throughout my app)? If it refreshes every time I switch to it that is enough for me. It might at some point even get annoying to see a whole column refreshing every second. Secondly because I work mostly on my laptop an app in the background should consume as less resources as possible. I'm not sure if it keeps updating even then, if so I'd rather not have it. If not, then it doesn't matter to much if the costs are non-significant. Originally by: Mizuki Yori "Do we really need this feature and why?" In the end you get an app much more heavily focused on user experience and has what the user actually wants/needs. That's what I'm trying to aim for. Sounds like a good, but sometimes difficult to hold to idea, especially if you are enthusiastic about the app and want it to do ... well ... everything.
Dansel Gallente	Posted - 2009.07.13 11:48:00 - [39] Edited by: Dansel on 13/07/2009 11:51:10 For the Skillplanner, heres an idea on the on demand feature. (Imagine with graphics) -------------------- NewPlan (In training(This will be shown if the skill that is currently training is the first one in the plan)) - Time Left: 31 days 2 hours 27 seconds - Skills to be trained: 7 - Finishing Date: Januari 17:th 17:50 (12:50 EVE Standard Time) -------------------- NewPlan2 - etc etc etc - etc etc etc - etc etc etc Show this in the skill plan list, should make it pretty on demand ----------------- Yay!!
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.07.13 13:05:00 - [40] Originally by: Dansel Edited by: Dansel on 13/07/2009 11:51:10 For the Skillplanner, heres an idea on the on demand feature. (Imagine with graphics) -------------------- NewPlan (In training(This will be shown if the skill that is currently training is the first one in the plan)) - Time Left: 31 days 2 hours 27 seconds - Skills to be trained: 7 - Finishing Date: Januari 17:th 17:50 (12:50 EVE Standard Time) -------------------- NewPlan2 - etc etc etc - etc etc etc - etc etc etc Show this in the skill plan list, should make it pretty on demand It's not what I had in mind when I said I wanted data to be available "on demand" but that doesn't mean I don't like your idea. It would require me moving the skill plans list back to a drawer but I'm not against it. Thanks again for the idea.
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.07.13 13:33:00 - [41] Quote: Personally I don't like mouseovers most of the time, I'd like to see info directly without having to do anything but opening the screen. That is a personal preference and I think you should, if not a lot of people are against make your own choice as to what you like best. I don't like the idea of mouse-over, either, actually. It was one of the only things I could think of when I made this post. I'm simply trying to alleviate the problem of a spreadsheet look. For example, having a column that lists accumulated training time sounds nice, but isn't really practical. Would there be a better way of you seeing in the info directly besides a spreadsheet look? Quote: If it refreshes every time I switch to it that is enough for me. It might at some point even get annoying to see a whole column refreshing every second. Secondly because I work mostly on my laptop an app in the background should consume as less resources as possible. I'm not sure if it keeps updating even then, if so I'd rather not have it. If not, then it doesn't matter to much if the costs are non-significant. The only column I could think of that would have its entire data refresh every second would be that of a training start/finish date for a plan that doesn't contain a skill you're not training. But I don't see the need for having both of those columns. If anything, the finish date is sufficient by itself. It's already assumed that first skill start date is now or already in progress. The start date for all other skills is the finish date of the previous skill. So a vote for no constant updates. Quote: Sounds like a good, but sometimes difficult to hold to idea, especially if you are enthusiastic about the app and want it to do ... well ... everything. The skills pie chart in EVEMon would be a a feature that I think is unimportant. It's just another way of displaying the same exact data and doesn't provide any help in decision making.
Dansel Gallente	Posted - 2009.07.13 15:29:00 - [42] Actually, please give us a feature to show all times in EST... And something to see the timechange in plan if you add other implants. ----------------- Yay!!
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.07.15 07:29:00 - [43] A little progress update. When I said "Almost Done" on my dev blog, I fooled everyone, but mostly myself. It took far more time than I've estimated. I'm quite a bit closer to releasing something but I still need to debug and test it. I'll give an update on each of the requests that people have made. Quote: error on startup, couldn't read the database file i think, unexpected format... Fixed... sorta. At the moment, the app is still considered beta. There's quite a bit more updating to the core data model that will be done and almost each time it will render the old data useless. For now, I'm simply trashing the old store. In the next release it's not a problem as there's nothing besides data from an incomplete skill plan that a player can save. Quote: new character screen ...you could prompt the user to begin adding characters by bringing up the Add New Character window at that point... Done. Quote: when a user account has multiple characters, would it be possible to select more than one in the Add New Character screen and import them all in one go? ...can the first character in the list be auto-selected? that way, if you have only one character, you can click Search and then Select straight away? (also, hitting the return key on that screen should trigger the select button) Done, for the most part. The only think I couldn't figure out to work out NSResponder so that a return key causes it to trigger creating new characters. Quote: main window the queue for this character isn't showing up correctly - it only has a timeline bar for the first skill, yet it's the last one in the list that is currently being trained Possibly fixed. The order is fixed as well as the bars and sizes. The only thing I had a problem with was the blue boxes indicating the level you're training to. I've had it bug out on me once but was unable to duplicate it. Quote: skill planner window i guess you're aware that it kills the app when you close the skill planner window, yes? I'm sure it's caused annoyances to more than one person so it's now fixed. Under the 'Window' menu, you can select to open up the main window again. Quote: suggestions/requests ...or perhaps in a drawer that slides out on the left side of the window - then it is just a single click to switch between them - this would allow you to include the currently training and end times under their names that Kilabie requested Like this? To be honest, implementing this solution actually helped me quite a ton in not having to write code for handling character selection. Cocoa Bindings are just amazing. Quote: it looks a bit strange with the big empty space. Still on the backburner. Far too much work to worry about window/view and graph sizing at the moment. [quoteit'd be cool to be able to import battleclinic items (if they are working). i'd like to browse around, find a ship i like the look of and loadout i'm interested in, and then import it into EMS to check what skills i'd need to learn and how long it'd take. or failing that, will there be an item list or something, so i can scroll through and find the ship/items, and EMS will calculate which skills are required? Hopefully it's the next step as soon as I clean up any bugs and implement a couple of new things like a certificate browser.
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.07.15 07:31:00 - [44] Quote: ...I'd like to see info directly without having to do anything but opening the screen. Simple solution is to admit you're right and implement what people are familiar with. How's this? Quote: If it refreshes every time I switch to it that is enough for me. It might at some point even get annoying to see a whole column refreshing every second. Being concerned about resources, I went with your suggestion. Maybe in the future I'll revisit this. Quote: Actually, please give us a feature to show all times in EST... I started making a preference window. The only two options in there at the moment are date format (mm/dd/yyyy vs dd/mm/yyyy) and local vs GMT (EVE server's) time. If you think there is something else I should include, let me know. Quote: And something to see the timechange in plan if you add other implants. This one is going to require some thought. Some design work, some implementation work.
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.07.16 15:00:00 - [45] I'm just about fed up with Sourceforge. The most cumbersome system I've ever used, not to mention slower than cold molasses climbing uphill. Bear with me while I move everything over to Google Code. I'll update the links appropriately when I'm done.
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.07.16 17:29:00 - [46] After 60+ hours of rewriting lots of code, I've decided to post a release on my progress. As per previous post, I gave up on SourceForge and decided to move to Google Code. Much easier to work with. Here's a decent list of changes, although it doesn't do it justice to the amount of work I did doing rewriting. I'm sure there's a few bugs in there that I haven't caught so I'd encourage everyone to report them. I'll try to get some kind of reporting tool setup in the mean time. Anyways, enjoy! Downloads List
Senyru Suru Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2009.07.16 18:59:00 - [47] Originally by: Mizuki Yori Like this? That, right there, sir, is a picture full of win :) I really like that you'd instantly get a quick overview of all your characters and their current training, so you don't have to select each one, just to check if any are going to end their queue while you're at work. -- --- one day we're all gonna die, and then we'll see who's laughing!
Keiko Shizuka	Posted - 2009.07.18 02:55:00 - [48] There's something wonky with the SP amount the app reports. It claims I have 13m or so, while I have actually have quite a bit more than that. For example, the summary for Navigation reports 256000 less than what I really have. If I expand the section it lists all my separate skills properly but the summary is still wrong. I tried removing and readding my character as well, same result.
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.07.18 05:09:00 - [49] Originally by: Keiko **uka There's something wonky with the SP amount the app reports. It claims I have 13m or so, while I have actually have quite a bit more than that. For example, the summary for Navigation reports 256000 less than what I really have. If I expand the section it lists all my separate skills properly but the summary is still wrong. I tried removing and readding my character as well, same result. Can you send me the copy of your character sheet and skill queue xml file? They should be located in your ~/Library/Application Support/EVE Mac Suite/ directory. Send them to vlozko at gmail dot com. Thanks.
Keiko Shizuka	Posted - 2009.07.18 10:15:00 - [50] Originally by: Mizuki Yori Can you send me the copy of your character sheet and skill queue xml file? They should be located in your ~/Library/Application Support/EVE Mac Suite/ directory. Send them to vlozko at gmail dot com. Thanks. Done!
Maria Kalista Amarr Emerald Forest Securities	Posted - 2009.07.18 14:13:00 - [51] Your latest build (5) crashes here from time to time. I have it running in the background while I do other things like (work ) I got this from the console's crashreporter twice today: Process: EVE Mac Suite [18066] Path: /Applications/EVE Mac Suite.app/Contents/MacOS/EVE Mac Suite Identifier: com.vadim.EVEMacSuite 24 com.apple.HIToolbox 0x92fdc28c RunCurrentEventLoopInMode + 283 25 com.apple.HIToolbox 0x92fdc0a5 ReceiveNextEventCommon + 374 26 com.apple.HIToolbox 0x92fdbf19 BlockUntilNextEventMatchingListInMode + 106 27 com.apple.AppKit 0x906d9d0d _DPSNextEvent + 657 28 com.apple.AppKit 0x906d95c0 -[NSApplication nextEventMatchingMask:untilDate:inMode:dequeue:] + 128 31 com.vadim.EVEMacSuite 0x000025ea start + 54 0x1000 - 0x1dfff +com.vadim.EVEMacSuite Build 5 (.5) <5f0f17c5a91082f47be334354405bfa9> /Applications/EVE Mac Suite.app/Contents/MacOS/EVE Mac Suite 0x3d000 - 0x5cfff +com.brandonwalkin.BWToolkitFramework ??? (1.1) <d233e190496003e6dc8831a64fa06359> /Applications/EVE Mac Suite.app/Contents/Frameworks/BWToolkitFramework.framework/Versions/A/BWToolkitFramework 0x71000 - 0x84fff +org.andymatuschak.Sparkle 1.5 Beta 6 (313) <5df2b8a3560d45006b854215644de532> /Applications/EVE Mac Suite.app/Contents/Frameworks/Sparkle.framework/Versions/A/Sparkle Hope this helps. Originally by: Jacharian This sounds like a bad idea. I'm in.
Mizuki Yori Caldari Dark-Void Carpe-Diem	Posted - 2009.07.18 19:16:00 - [52] Originally by: Maria Kalista Your latest build (5) crashes here from time to time. I have it running in the background while I do other things like (work ) I got this from the console's crashreporter twice today: Process: EVE Mac Suite [18066] Path: /Applications/EVE Mac Suite.app/Contents/MacOS/EVE Mac Suite Identifier: com.vadim.EVEMacSuite 24 com.apple.HIToolbox 0x92fdc28c RunCurrentEventLoopInMode + 283 25 com.apple.HIToolbox 0x92fdc0a5 ReceiveNextEventCommon + 374 26 com.apple.HIToolbox 0x92fdbf19 BlockUntilNextEventMatchingListInMode + 106 27 com.apple.AppKit 0x906d9d0d _DPSNextEvent + 657 28 com.apple.AppKit 0x906d95c0 -[NSApplication nextEventMatchingMask:untilDate:inMode:dequeue:] + 128 31 com.vadim.EVEMacSuite 0x000025ea start + 54 0x1000 - 0x1dfff +com.vadim.EVEMacSuite Build 5 (.5) <5f0f17c5a91082f47be334354405bfa9> /Applications/EVE Mac Suite.app/Contents/MacOS/EVE Mac Suite 0x3d000 - 0x5cfff +com.brandonwalkin.BWToolkitFramework ??? (1.1) <d233e190496003e6dc8831a64fa06359> /Applications/EVE Mac Suite.app/Contents/Frameworks/BWToolkitFramework.framework/Versions/A/BWToolkitFramework 0x71000 - 0x84fff +org.andymatuschak.Sparkle 1.5 Beta 6 (313) <5df2b8a3560d45006b854215644de532> /Applications/EVE Mac Suite.app/Contents/Frameworks/Sparkle.framework/Versions/A/Sparkle Hope this helps. Not quite. If you can, could you send the entirety of the crash log to my email, or, if you have a google account, post it on my google code site as a new issue. Oh, and Keiko, I pinpointed the source of the problem. From the preliminary looks of it, it actually looks like a bug on Apple's end. My code is correct. I'm essentially trying to do a sum function on a set of objects. It's not adding them accurately. I changed it around to do the sum differently so you'll see that fix in the next release.
Maria Kalista Amarr Emerald Forest Securities	Posted - 2009.07.21 12:43:00 - [53] Just had a fresh crash and have send the crashlog to your blogs reply system. Hope that is ok, couldn't find any other email address. Originally by: Jacharian This sounds like a bad idea. I'm in.
Micovoy Lavoye Gallente Quebec's Underdog League Quebec Power	Posted - 2009.08.30 18:40:00 - [54] Mizuki have you given up development

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